I was asking what will it be that he sacrifices to appease the gun grabbers. I was stating his own words on how he wants to tax us. You go ahead and keep worshipping your draft dodging idol. I will be deligent and hope he fails in his stupidity....
"some were to legal buyers who should never ever own a firearm"
Legal buyers who in your opinion shouldn't have the right guaranteed by the 2nd amendment.
That comment told me everything I need to know about you....Was it Fienstein who had a permit but wanted to take everyone else's guns? Thus my comment that you are a gun grabber at heart.....
POTUS is just posturing to quiet his haters. He's not going to do anything to lose his voter base. Notice he wrote a "memo" to AG Sessions, a do nothing guy. Not an "Executive Order" like the worthless Obummer. He's waiting for the furor to die down and claim he is doing "something". It will be Congress to do something and he will veto if it's against the Constitution. He plans to wait after this year election and see what his future holds. He might be impeached if the House turn libturd but still no guarantee he'll be convicted by the Senate. Lots of libturd Senators for re-election this year. Hoping for the best so pray as you never did before...fervently.
I would like to know what gun law/laws could be put in place to prevent gun violence? So, if they ban everything but single shot shotguns will that do the trick?
Oh wait! Criminals don't abide by the law do they? Only law abiding citizens will comply, not that hard to figure out. I understand the how people get emotional and want to do something but banning any g type guns wont solve the problem
Lets enforce the current laws first. Cruz should not have been permitted to own firearms because of his mental illness. FBI should have prevented the shooting because of the tips that were received. Wouldn't surprise me if LWL FBI Agents didn't take action to make Trump look bad and to have the tools to push their anti-gun agenda.
Its now political. Make the bump stocks Class III, never should have been approved in the first place for unrestricted sale?
I wouldn't make any concessions until CHL holders can carry in gun free zones. This is a must to stop the school shootings that are being used as the poster child for taking all our guns away. Just taking the AR15's is not going to stop the shootings, they'll want them all.
Background checks are a red herring. They are undoubtedly going to be tightened, which will just mean that those intent on doing evil will find other ways to get weapons, either by stealing or by buying stuff in a back alley. If one is intent on committing mass murder, buying a stolen gun is nothing more serious than a parking ticket.
Having the wrong dialogue as usual. Its not the choice of weapon to protect ones self that is protected by 2nd Amendment it the reaffirmation of a God given right to protect yourself, with equal or greater force than is being applied to you.
You don't bring a knife or bow to gun fight. If criminals have bump stocks, AR-15, whatever can't always rely on Police or govt agents to defend us. Actually the concept of self-defense also includes protecting yourself from miss use of a govt agent (e.g. political gain and control by elites). So the elites and extreme lefties will not get it by definition as they are probably the aggressors in removing God given rights of self-defense. Plus any other right as reaffirmed in the constitution and given to us by God, our maker, etc. not the govt.
He was looking into the regulation of the devices after the Vegas thing, Thanks KPC.
"After the deadly mass murder in Las Vegas, Nevada, on October 1, 2017, I asked my Administration to fully review how the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives regulates bump fire stocks and similar devices."
Yesterday....
"White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said Trump would not rule out other options as well, such as raising the minimum age for rifle buyers or banning the AR-15-style “assault rifles” used in a number of high-profile mass shootings, including last week’s shooting in Florida.""
So back to the question that I started the thread with....
What is Trump going to ban or regulate for the Chillern?
Imagine that Trump is playing it smart when the media and Dems are trying to box him into a corner for political gain. Let's see what happens before crying chicken little.
As far as bump stocks they should be gone since it is only going to be grief for the majority of gun owners.
Raising the age limit to buy an AR? The Sandy Hook shooter killed his mom and stole the gun from the cabinet. What’s going to happen, God forbid, the next shooter uses a Rem 1100, Mossberg 835, or any other pump or semi auto shotgun? Will we allow the media and anti 2A folks deem these assault shotguns?
Thoroughly disgusted....society has collectively lost its ****ing mind.
I just hate the fact that people consider this stuff rational when their team/hero is in charge. I think the age limit is the most likely feel good measure Trump would sign....
You can have your own opinion on these bump stocks, but there is only one Constitutional law we should be citing. I would defer to the relevant Supreme Court decisions on the matter (Miller and Heller). That is the law of the land regardless of the hand wringing here and political theater playing out on TV.
The Court has previously ruled that the 2nd Amendment protects 'ordinary military equipment... common in use for the time' and that 'dangerous and unusual' weapons may be prohibited. If it were ever to go that far, I would think that these dopey bump stock things do NOT qualify as ordinary military equipment nor are they common in use for the time. And they would probably be considered dangerous and unusual weapons. I just don't see how they pass Constitutional muster.
It did not take legislation to make bump stocks legal, only approval from the Obama ATF. The Trump ATF can now make them illegal within a day. But of course no politician can then get the credit for "doing something".
I've never trusted Trump to protect our 2A or hunting rights. He's often expressed a dislike for hunting. You may also recall he caved to anti-hunting pressure on the elephant hunting trophy import ban issue months ago, claiming he'd make a final decision on it in a week. I haven't heard a thing about it, and Obama's ban remains.
"The eight-year assault on your Second Amendment freedoms has come to a crashing end," Trump told the annual National Rifle Association convention, part of a drumbeat of events designed to herald his 100th day in office on Saturday. "You have a true friend and champion in the White House."
Now its the Democrats fault we don't have gun control....
"Just like they don't want to solve the DACA problem, why didn't the Democrats pass gun control legislation when they had both the House & Senate during the Obama Administration," Trump said on Twitter. "Because they didn't want to, and now they just talk!"
What will come out of the kid talk today? Will our gun grabber in Chief do like the Democrats and just talk or does he have a plan for us?
This whole bump fire argument is bullsh*t anyway. You can auto-fire a semi-auto from your hip by holding a belt loop. What's next then, make pants with belt loops illegal? Then we'll ALL look like gangbangers!
“I sold firearms for over 20 years... unfortunately, some were to legal buyers who should never ever own a firearm ... but because the law said it was OK, I did so..”
So you admit to selling guns to people that shouldn’t have them. Do you ever wonder if that transaction resulted in deaths? I’m guessing no because most likely, you lack moral clarity and a conscience.
"During dinner with television commentator Geraldo Rivera at Trump’s Mar-a-Lago Club in Palm Beach, the president listened with interest as Rivera suggested raising the minimum age at which a person could buy a semiautomatic weapon from 18 to 21."
"......most likely, you lack moral clarity and a conscience."
Paul Zeiden, the self admitted liar and fraud lecturing us about moral clarity and conscience while playing on the internet while he's AT WORK (supposedly) teaching at Briar Cliff Manor high school.......TOO FUNNY!
So you screw the taxpayers as well as lie......nice....
Ronnie did it so its OK? I hope it will accomplish nothing but am not confident that is the case. I wish Ruthie would step down since that is the one thing Trump did right.
I dont see anyone saying kids getting killed is not a problem. I do see folks saying, me included, passing laws that will do absolutely nothing to prevent crimes is pointless.
How many people are killed by drunk drivers? Do we ban vehicles or put tighter restrictions on who can buy a vehicle? The truth is criminals don't abide by the law and to think otherwise is naive.
Drunk driver kill far more people that guns but I know you won't see alcohol banned. They tried that and the same thing happened that would happen if you banned guns.
Ol' Sleepy here was like Atheist and was banned a quite a few times before he became a born again republican. He said earlier we should ban bump stocks and I posted what GOA had to stay about his democrap leaning stupidity. Now he is trying to troll me with Atheist like accusations that any simpleton liberal would use....Its for the Chillern...
Wrong. I'm saying banning bump stocks is a small almost insignificant issue. I don't see any use for them. I would never buy one. I support Trump trying to help get these shootings to stop. Something has to be done. I don't believe the AR 15's are going anywhere, in fact I think it is impossible to remove them from the USA which is what the left wants. There here to stay.
G-string you're a liar. You called me out on another thread about the bump stocks. You copied my statement then commented on it. I'm just returning the favor. It's been a pleasure.
Wait a minute... raising the age limit to buy this rifle might be a genius move! Because if that is the level of thought and responsibility required, you would ALSO have to raise the age to vote and the age to enlist by the same amount. Ha!
Looks like Trump may drive up gun sales, still don't think he will top 0bama. Bump stocks flew off the shelves and websites crashed when Trump initially went all gun grabber.......
Reason.com " Virtually all plans to ban "mentally ill" people from owning guns define the term in such a way that a quarter or more of the population would be included. Such policies are also rife with due-process concerns, which are even more troubling when it comes to anything smacking of preventive detention, including the "gun violence restraining orders" that are gaining popularity among conservatives at National Review and elsewhere."
Someone will need to... because the Supreme Court ruled in Heller that "nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill". I just want that benchmark to also apply to the right to vote. If you are too mentally ill to keep and bear arms, you are also too mentally ill to vote.
I think there needs to be some meaningful change in both directions. I think from a gun law perspective, I’d like to see gun ownership handles more like car ownership. That includes demonstrating proficiency. I also am coming around to the idea of insurance for gun owners. I think these two measures will help ensure serious, responsible gun owners are making purchases. I keep hearing we need to “strengthen background checks” but I have no clue the details of how you do that and am not necessarily on board with turning over more details of my private life to the government.
On the flip side, I think the NFA needs gutted and they need to make a whole host of firearms legal. Bans on certain firearm types and certain gun features (short barrels, gun length, bump stocks, etc) are outdated and meaningless. I think you can couple most of the deregulation with the proficiency and insurance piece. You want to own a suppressor or an automatic weapon? Great, but you’ll need to demonstrate a certain proficiency and you’ll need to have a certain level of insurance for it.
Bowbender, there are also plenty of restrictions placed on Constitutional rights. Nowhere does the constitution say anything about background checks or age limits to gun purchase nor does it say anything about the types of guns that one can legally purchase.
Some folks just don't get it...criminals do not abide by the law!
My 13 year old daughter gets it...she has a mind of her own, believe me. She told me the other day..." daddy, why pass more gun laws when the thugs wont care what the law says anyway?" The only thing more gun laws will do is restrict law abiding citizens...not that hard to figure out.
HDE, a CC permit is not a requirement for owning a gun. Neither is hunter education. And I would venture that most violent crimes are not committed by CCP holders. If you’re willing to jump through the hoops to get one, there’s a good chance you are a law abiding citizen and responsible gun owner. I think that similar rigor should be put in place for general gun ownership. If you want to own a bolt action .243 (ie, most of the gun owners, like you said) it won’t require the same competency or insurance as it would if you want to buy a SCAR-17.
I would venture to bet I own more semiautomatic rifles than just about anyone on this board. I’m tired of seeing them legally end up in the wrong hands. I also don’t know what flag would come back on any kind of background check that would deny these individuals the ability to purchase these weapons. That’s why I don’t understand “stronger background checks” - I don’t know what that means or how it would stop these tragedies from happening.
I do think that requiring competency and insurance will deter the wrong individuals from legally purchasing firearms.
"I do think that requiring competency and insurance will deter the wrong individuals from legally purchasing firearms."
Which citizens of this Country are the "wrong individuals" you want to deter with your suggestion?
I do think that if you gave guns to more Poor law abiding citizens in crime ridden neighborhoods you would see less crime. However gun laws like you suggest make them defenseless victims just waiting for a random bullet from gang bangers....
“And you would be wrong. Two words. Vegas Shooter.”
Really? Where did he get his certification from? Before he purchased his firearms, he showed proof of insurance?
The citizens that are the “wrong individuals” are the ones that legally purchase forearms and then use them shortly after to commit mass murder. Will the requirements I laid out stop every incident? No. But thinking back on the latest mass shootings I bet this could have prevented a lot of them.
Look, this thing is only trending in one direction. If we as the gun owning public don’t do more to prevent these incidents, we’re going to lose our right in its entirety as it relates to owning certain firearms.
We can’t even afford to buy teachers pencils and erasers, now we want to give them all Glocks? Without training?
"As gun-control advocates celebrated the 20th anniversary of the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act, they touted the success of the law, saying that 1 million felons were kept from purchasing guns, and more than 2 million firearm sales were blocked.
Lott explains that these 2 million "initial denials" are usually mishaps "because they have a similar name to a felon" a lot like what Americans might deal with if their name is similar to someone else's who is on the "no fly" list."
20 years = 2 million
2016 = 2.1 million gun sales
"There is no real scientific evidence among criminologists and economists that background checks actually reduce crime,"
Read Full Article Here John Lott: Background Checks Fail to Curb Gun Crime | Newsmax.com
I think we should have competency tests for voting then too. An ignorant voter who doesn't even know who their current elected officials are should not be allowed to vote. And if someone has mental issues they definitely shouldn't be allowed to vote. This would also include people who are self admitted documented liars like Paul Zeiden of Briarcliff Manor high school.
JTV, what would have come back on a background check that would have prevented Nikolas Cruz, Devin Patrick Kelley, or Omar Mateen from purchasing firearms?
"What do you think the result would be?" Police and swat team would report Paul Zeidan, Teacher From Briarcliff Manor High School, so scared, that he had pi$$ed his pants. Exactly what the result would be. 8^)
There has never been a time when the opposing party and losers were so verbal in assaulting the president and president that the people elected./ Even Obama was treated with a modicum of respect for the office . It is a disgrace not to Trump and Pence but to those that are degrading the presidency and the people that voted for the president. Its a terrible thing to see the left and some on the right splitting this country even further than racist Obama did.
We're going to be ok on this round of gun control. Trump is going to put armed security in all schools, arm the teachers, and we're going to loose bump stocks. He needs to include all CHL holders allowed on school property though. This will stop school shootings, the fountain of youth for the LWL's gun control. They're wanting to remove all guns and Trump is putting guns in they're homeland for teaching our children the LWL doctrine. Remember Bill Ayers, professor of elementary school teaching theory, teaching teachers how and what to teach our children. Now Trump is putting guns in Bill Ayers' class rooms to protect the children. God does have a sense of humor sometimes.
The only thing that will stop an evil person with a gun, is good men and women with guns.
ISIS is posting websites calling for their supporters, and Cruz was one of the supporters of ISIS and Resist. The LWL's answer is to take away all guns, starting with my rifle. LWL's want to disarm the American people right in the middle of a terror war.
"JTV, what would have come back on a background check that would have prevented Nikolas Cruz, Devin Patrick Kelley, or Omar Mateen from purchasing firearms?"
Facts don't matter it's for the chillern.....
Trump wants to raise the age and have you see a shrink to get permission to buy a gun and trumpettes support him.
Doesn't matter all the failures and warning signs with cruz it's those evil guns that are the problem.
The next Democrat will finish gun owners off when banning bump stocks doesn't work.
I think seeing a shrink to get a gun is a terrible idea. Never once did I say anything remotely close to that. I said making gun ownership closer to car ownership is a solution I could support. You don’t need to see a shrink to buy a car. You do, however, need to prove competency in operating one. You also need to purchase insurance commensurate with the type of vehicle you are driving. And your car needs to be registered. I prefer all of those solutions to bans. Furthermore, I think implementing those solutions can negate the NFA and, in fact, allow us to do away with existing restrictions on owning and purchasing certain types of firearms and firearm accessories.
Then answer the question BEG asked you jtv. Common sense? Posting the think progress story on the background check "loophole" means you want longer waiting periods before law abiding folks get permission to buy guns....
" You do, however, need to prove competency in operating one. You also need to purchase insurance commensurate with the type of vehicle you are driving."
Awesome...So the inherent right to self defense is predicated on your ability to pay another government agency to exercise that right.
Proficiency tests and insurance for guns it nonsense and just filling someone else's pockets with money. There were over 43,000 people killed in automobiles in January so there goes your proficiency out the window. I also think about the video's I have seen of police in New York empty their magazines while injuring 9 people walking up the street and not hitting the old man they were shooting at. Or the two cops shooting until they had to change magazines at a guy getting out of his van and he escaped to the woods. Now he was shooting back so that could have a bearing. All city people so I think the best solution is to ban firearms for city people and democrats.
My dad would have been jailed. He gave me my first rifle when I was five years old and I still have it. A 22 single shot that I was killing squirrels with before I was old enough to go to school.
Firearm registration, license to operate, and insurance, (in similitude to vehicle registration, licensing, and insurance) is a huge mistake and the very idea should be purged with prejudice. Communist and State Socialist countries allowed the civilian population to have motorized vehicle transportation, but no way to firearms, and just how much freedom did they really have?
The push for absolute control over firearm ownership needs to just become a wet dream for liberals and progressives...
Better get it soon, too... while the Court is in our favor. Thank goodness for Trump winning and then picking Gorsuch!!! Justice Thomas is chomping at the bit to continue the legacy of his friend Antonin Scalia.
Just because I got my Judge and want at least one more doesn't mean I have to blindly defend him. Besides, you and some others have that well covered with your twisting into knots.....
The state here in Oregon has already laid gun laws on us that are way above anything being proposed. I cannot even give a gun to my wife/ Son, daughter,. ect. I cannot legally sell any of my guns but have to take them to a licensed gun dealer and the buyer has to go through the check system. There are still no real wait times on gun checks though and I can go to the store , buy a rifle and take possession in a few minutes/ That is the problem with the check system/ They do no real check at all./ Oh I'm not advocating, simply saying what you get under a Democrat Government for starters. God bless, Steve
The Justice Department moved forward on Saturday with plans to ban bump stock devices and make them illegal to own or sell. The move comes after President Trump signed an executive ...
First they came for the Bump Stocks, and I did not speak out— Because I didn't own a Bump Stock.
Then they came for the Black Rifles, and I did not speak out— Because I didn't own a Black Rifle.
Then they banned young adults from self-defense, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a young adult.
Then they came for mine—and there was no one left to speak for me.
Trump has really helped the Democrats with their gun control agenda and many of his Repuglican supporters not only remained silent but many, even here, defended his actions......
The one thing Donald Trump has done and will forever do, is Bri g people together for debates. His detractors say he’s unstable. His followers are praying for his guidance. What and which group do you thinks gonna win that one? So far it’s been the ones praying for him.
He’s no idiot. He’s seen what it takes to navigate politics now. And he knows that by giving everyone a bone, at least they participate. He still has nominees that have t even been voted on to be approved yet. Our legislative branch is bogged down with the politics of politicians. Not the work it was intended for. How do you get the incompetent to contribute. You throw them a bone.
Like him or hate him, there is no denying his intents and actions. He a pot stirred and a mobilizer. I’ll take it. God Bless men
