Summit Treestands
Socrates and the Community Forum
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Contributors to this thread:
K Cummings 13-Apr-18
Your fav poster 13-Apr-18
Spike Bull 13-Apr-18
JTV 13-Apr-18
KSflatlander 13-Apr-18
JTV 13-Apr-18
Spike Bull 13-Apr-18
K Cummings 13-Apr-18
Jimbo 13-Apr-18
JTV 13-Apr-18
KSflatlander 13-Apr-18
Trax 13-Apr-18
K Cummings 13-Apr-18
KSflatlander 13-Apr-18
Bentstick81 13-Apr-18
Bentstick81 13-Apr-18
K Cummings 13-Apr-18
JTV 13-Apr-18
Salagi 13-Apr-18
Trax 13-Apr-18
KSflatlander 13-Apr-18
Spike Bull 13-Apr-18
sleepyhunter 13-Apr-18
sleepyhunter 13-Apr-18
Will 13-Apr-18
Mike in CT 13-Apr-18
Seapig@work 13-Apr-18
Owl 13-Apr-18
Grey Ghost 13-Apr-18
K Cummings 13-Apr-18
K Cummings 13-Apr-18
bigswivle 13-Apr-18
KSflatlander 13-Apr-18
TD 13-Apr-18
Grey Ghost 13-Apr-18
Your fav poster 13-Apr-18
Bentstick81 13-Apr-18
From: K Cummings
13-Apr-18
Whenever I happen to be in the dollar store, I always like to check out the book section for some interesting reading. You never know what you might find. Last time I was there, I picked up a book on Socrates and while reading it, I came across the following quote:

"When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.” -Socrates

As soon as I saw this, I immediately thought of the CF, and what many of our conversations devolve into.

Something to think about.

KPC

13-Apr-18
Excellent quote and an even better point.

13-Apr-18
Gee, KPC, it seems you have a new best friend lately!?!

From: JTV
13-Apr-18

JTV's Link
Spike, those dweebs have to stick together .. again as the pissant sits high on his perch .... what a maroon .....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8GGpYFmkYI

From: KSflatlander
13-Apr-18
Spike and JTV...maybe you two should look in the mirror. I rarely see a post without you two following each other. Enough already...K Cummings has a point and you made it for him immediately. What is wrong with debate and agreeing to disagree...or compromise for that matter. The CF is a reflection of congress. Everyone is slandering so much they can never find common ground...we are all bowhunters for goodness sake. We do have things in common. Why always do you two attack if someone has a different point of view?

From: JTV
13-Apr-18
that what this place is for, debate and arguing someone who has an asinine point, such as yourself, PutZ, the holier than thou KPC/GG and a few others.... hell, at least I admit I'm not perfect and an ass and I'm only better than those I am better than, unlike the few who believe they are better than ALL... ... ... what about you ?? ... I'll bet you have one of the "Coexist" bumper stickers dont ya.. come on admit it ... Heck, I know Ive had a good day when I piss off a liberal or two ...

13-Apr-18
Excuse me!!!!! I have been subjected to attacks at the level of cyber-stalking by at least two people here and my gentle barb at KPC is just that! It hardly registers as slandering!! Your chastisement is uncalled for and begs the question about who you are. I have no foreknowledge of what JTV may or may not do, though I do occasionally enjoy his unsolicited support, and the reverse is true as well.

So what?

So you can stick your Mommy scolding in your pipe.....

PutZ doesnt count as a person here so......if you are unfamiliar with his 2 years of being a total ass here then you should do some research.

From: K Cummings
13-Apr-18
"Why always do you two attack if someone has a different point of view?"

Socrates had a theory about that (see above), but to a certain extent I think there is a different phenomenon at play here also.

It's akin to what I refer to as the "all in-all the time" concept, and the ability (or inability in some cases) of some to evaluate a specific opinion, independent from the person holding it.

We see it play out here all the time. A good example are the "never-Trumpers" and the "always-Trumpers" and how each side reacts to anyone straying from their respective reservation.

KPC

From: Jimbo
13-Apr-18
KPC, you are right on the mark. And, as KSf pointed out, it didn't take long to confirm it. It'll never change. The CF has become the ultimate echo chamber for a relatively small group.

From: JTV
13-Apr-18
look who the heck comes on ^^ and proves the fact of those who stick together... the liberal crowd and the lofty perchers ... they follow each other like dogs sniffin' the others behind ...

From: KSflatlander
13-Apr-18
I don't have a COEXIST sticker on my truck but to be honest I don't disagree with the message. I also don't have a Trump sticker on my truck either. Actually I don't have any stickers on my truck if you must know.

There is a difference in community discussion and disrespectful name calling. Communication requires listening too. It seems like you all just come her to post your opinion, wait for an opposing view, then pounce but never trying to understand a different point of view. I don't have any issue with an occasional respective jab but it's like some here on the CF thrive on hatred and conflict. It's the straight out hatred for fellow bowhunters with a different opinion I can't stand. It's exhausting... I come here because I want to hear other bowhunters points-of-view because I want to understand others prospective. I think it makes you a better person to hear all sides...Fox news, MSNBC, CNN, NPR, etc.

Spike and JTV...why do you come to the CF? I'm honestly curious why you like the CF. No BS. What do you get out of this?

From: Trax
13-Apr-18
How about a quote from Bert and Ernie, that would likely be along the same lines.

I call Obama an America hating race pimp because he is an America hating race pimp. I call it as I see it, I do not ask anyone else to agree with me. There are reasons I see Obama as an America hating race pimp. I call a duck a duck, and a fool a fool. I call a conservative a conservative, and a liberal a liberal. The "new" liberal mantra is to eliminate labels, do not characterize anyone or anything. If you are dumb enough to follow the lead of liberalism and its socialist masters then you have earned the title of blind and dumb sheep. You're going to eat what you're fed, don't be offended if I whiz on your oats.

From: K Cummings
13-Apr-18
"KPC, you are right on the mark. And, as KSf pointed out, it didn't take long to confirm it. It'll never change. The CF has become the ultimate echo chamber for a relatively small group."

While it might appear that way, I don't think that's actually the case. There are quite a few independent thinkers here (on both sides of the political spectrum), they just aren't as noticeable over the name calling, chest pumping, and vulgar outbursts of the few that you speak of.

This thread does seem to support Socrates' premise however.

KPC

From: KSflatlander
13-Apr-18
How enlightening. If you're dumb enough to think your perspective is the only one and that you always right (a.k.a. call it as you see it) then you only learn hard lessons. You don't consider other peoples lessons/perspectives and learn from then. The stove is never hot until you touch it yourself. Maybe you should just stop for a minute and consider it from their experience that the stove is hot. I'm not saying assimilate and always agree...just consider and ponder it for a bit. That's all.

From: Bentstick81
13-Apr-18
I like some that come on here, wonder why people call a person a dumba$$, LYING FRAUD, when that is exactly what he is. Call them like you see them. Then the same few that are whining about the people, who is calling out the LYING FRAUD, argues with another guy on a different thread, ALL DAY LONG, and that's OK. Comical! 8^)))

From: Bentstick81
13-Apr-18
Oh, and don't worry atheist. I will still be all over you, and your dumba$$ LIES. 8^)))

From: K Cummings
13-Apr-18
"I call Obama an America hating race pimp because he is an America hating race pimp."

I think you might have missed the point Trax. You are welcome to have that opinion (one which I tend to agree with), and make your case as to why you think it's true. And the people who disagree with you can make their case as to why they think it's not true. Nothing wrong with that. That's what a debate is.

However, if I just come on here and call you an "dipshit," a "dweeb," a "pissant" or a "maroon," without making any attempt to refute your opinion, I have indeed lost the debate.

KPC

From: JTV
13-Apr-18
and once again, KPC proves my point... back on his perch looking down and crappin' over those he deems lesser than him... which is every one in his mind ... ....

From: Salagi
13-Apr-18
" It'll never change."

Jimbo I'm going to respectfully disagree. It can change and would if we will do our part to make it happen. I've been on here longer than most I believe. I have watched the degree of debate go down like a ship at sea the last few years. We used to have the liberal element that could (and would), make their points in a reasonable fashion. Granted the points weren't right much of the time (OK, almost all the time), but they were coherent, civil and well written. We had the conservative faction that could (and would) respond in an equally civil fashion even while ripping the liberal points to shreds. There was little name calling, and most of it was done in fun. Posts were seldom vulgar in nature of the response. Not a lot of minds were changed then either, but we had respect for each other. Some of us even met for a live debate between our leading conservative (who was from Tennessee), and our main liberal our of California. Neither one is with us today, one got disgusted at the treatment he was receiving towards the end, and the other sadly passed away not too long after the debate,

We had a lot of fun back then, shared a lot of good information, and even gave each other things to think about and an insight into the other's way of thinking. I am saddened by the actions and words of some on here (all sides), and yet glad there are some that hold themselves above the pettiness of others. Socrates made a good point with the quote Kevin shared and this topic reminded me of a phrase we used to hear on here quite a bit which most of you won't remember: "What would Tennbow say?"

From: Trax
13-Apr-18
I do get where you are coming from KPC. I always consider other alternatives and view points, they offer so much info to use to refute them. If all somebody has is to attack the one they are debating with you are correct and Socrates wins the day. I will not apologize for calling a liberal a liberal, or a sheep a sheep, or a dancing bear a dancing bear.

From: KSflatlander
13-Apr-18
I completely agree Salagi and will apologize from disrespectfulness or condescension I have thrown about to JTV or Spike or anyone else. Frustration is no excuse for disrespect.

13-Apr-18
I remember those days, Salagi.

I miss the adventures wherein everybody added a line or two ("And then....") to a continuing story! We were a more cohesive group, even though we still had a holier-than-thou or two. The dialog was much more civil and the threads much more educational. Many have called for a return to civility at different times but oftentimes the responses match the original comments.

I cannot blame a guy for calling somebody a dumbass whn he himself suffered that same attack from the dumbass in question just last week.

I also cannot abide a guy like PutZ who, after two years of over 40 false registrations during which he has been nothing but an intentional shat stirrer decides to use his real name and wants to all upper crusty!!!! Every one of those personas got fair treatment from me until I figured out it was just another Sybilarity, at which point I treated him as he deserves.

From: sleepyhunter
13-Apr-18

From: sleepyhunter
13-Apr-18

KPC walking into the Dollar General

From: Will
13-Apr-18
Salagi - that sounds pretty darn good. Really cool the liberal and conservative guys were able to have that debate - that had to be awesome!

Love that initial Socrates quote. A good thing to keep in mind for sure. Point blank, I do find the opinions of others here helpful. It makes me seek out info and review ideas that I may not have otherwise. Even if I try to seek out ideas different from my own, other folks will always come up with different angles or corridors of thought to consider. That's awesome!

I'm a newbie to the CF, historically I've focused my (excessive) bowsite time on the state forums and now and then the main hunting page. But, despite suspecting I should duck and cover for my fairly left of center ;) social view of the world, I've found my brief time on here helpful.

13-Apr-18
I have to say when I think back on the beginning.....it's quite civil today. The late 90's were the wild west.

From: Mike in CT
13-Apr-18
I have no problem with completely dismembering a contrary viewpoint.......with a fact-based and completely impersonal counterpoint.

When you personalize a debate it's no longer a debate, it's a shouting match and it's a matter of which side can drown out the other; right vs wrong, fact vs fiction become irrelevant and learning opportunities are squandered.

For any who would counter that diametrically opposed parties are unlikely to change one another's views I'd offer that you're missing the point completely; you articulate in a fact-based, dispassionate manner YOUR views for all those "on the fence"; that's the crowd that's still persuadable and the one most likely to change a position when the debate is reasoned and well posited.

From: Seapig@work
13-Apr-18
Seems like this place had a nickname back then...

Bowfight?

hehehe

From: Owl
13-Apr-18
I rarely disagree with Kevin. This is no exception.

From: Grey Ghost
13-Apr-18

Grey Ghost's Link
Kevin,

I couldn't agree more with you on this topic....even though there is no actual evidence that Socrates ever said your original quote.

;-)

Matt

From: K Cummings
13-Apr-18
Interestingly enough Owl, even though the topic wasn't about what I thought, it was about what Socrates thought, some chose to ignore that and attack me instead...which in turn lends credence to Socrates' opinion.

KPC

From: K Cummings
13-Apr-18
Matt:

You might be right but you'll have to take that up with Plato.

Maybe that's why the book was only a buck.

:)

KPC

From: bigswivle
13-Apr-18
I wonder if Socrates was a liberal?

From: KSflatlander
13-Apr-18
Since his knowledge has transcended time I would say it was likely he was a liberal...lol. Just a joke guys come on.

From: TD
13-Apr-18
Ahhhh...... So Crates.......

From: Grey Ghost
13-Apr-18

Grey Ghost's Link
"Maybe that's why the book was only a buck."

Hey, a good quote is a good quote, whoever came up with it.

It was asked earlier if Socrates was a liberal. I found that question interesting, so I Googled up this link. It's purely philosophical conjecture, and most here won't read it all, but I think you and a few others may enjoy it.

Matt

13-Apr-18
Most of what is known about Socrates is from written texts by his number one student Plato. And Plato adored him and his every word. Was he a liberal or conservative? Hard to say. He was permissive w homosexuality and liberal social issues (he was against long prison terms, torture and debtors prisons). yet he wanted the city states of Greece to over rule laws from the democratic governing body that tried to rule all of Greece. But again everything is interpreted through the writings of Plato so it’s not clear.

From: Bentstick81
13-Apr-18
There you have it. Explained by the CF's biggest LIAR. It must be true.8^)))

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