Meat in Cooler Water?
General Topic
So with my antelope/pronghorn this last week, I hurried gutted, skinned and 1/4ered in the field. Once meat was picked free and any little hairs, I placed it into coolers with ice. Tipped the cool with water spout open so water would drain and the meat could cool. It got the meat nice and cool.
Tonight I trimmed up the back straps and tenderloins. As I did, I noticed on the very out edge a 1/16 to 1/8 inch layer that was brownish in color. I am assuming from water washing out the color.
Is this common?
I trimmed it off, but questioned if I really needed to trim off? What do you think? What do you do? It felt like I was wasting meat, but also know that if it hung in a cooler that would have dried out and been trimmed as well...
Should I have put the meat in plastic to keep it dry then covered with ice?
I do what you did and the browning meat is fine. Just a little dry is all.
Quite common and hurts nothing, just trim it off. Now here are a couple tips you might store for future use. Here in the "sunny South" we often have to store meat in coolers. I use frozen liter bottles of water in stead of ice and it works quite well. But...if you want to try something, try this: Mix 1/2 cup of Adolph's Meat Tenderizer with two quarts of your favorite marinade. Pour over meat, (I use either a butt or a shoulder.) and cover with ice cubes. Tilt cooler and leave drain open. Refresh ice as needed and leave, in shade, for 18-24 hours. Then, trim and cook as you normally would. I usually re-season, wrap in bacon and smoke. Try it. I think you will be surprised.
It is illegal to bring whole deer from another state back into MN so last fall I had to keep two deer cool that I shot and cut up in MO. It was warm so I was putting ice in the cooler constantly. On the way home the meat was totally submerged in water. It didn't look good but I packaged it up anyways. It was fine and tasted great. Only have a couple packages left.
We de-bone and bag all of our meat. I just don't want the water to touch it.
I use frozen 1/2 and 1 gal jugs of water to keep things cool. Also, putting ice in an extra bag will minimize water collecting in the bottom of a cooler. Once meat is initialy cool, putting in a plastic bag for transport will not hurt anything. Other than it having less "curb appeal", the water soaked brown skin on the outside is harmless.
I've always been told to NOT submerge the meat in water?
Submerging meat in cold water for even a day or so, will not hurt it one bit. However, de-boning and putting in bag or using frozen bottles is better in terms of appearance and trimming.
I use the frozen bottles as well, it's way easier than dealing with a cooler full of bloody water. Also, leaving meat in water can accelerate bacteria growth.
Go to the store a couple weeks before the hunt and buy a couple cases of bottled water. Put them in your freezer at least 2 weeks before you go.
Pack these in the best cooler you have and fill in with cubed ice. Tape shut and keep out of direct sunlight cover with sleeping bag or something to help insulate if extremely hot.
After a week the outside bottles may be mostly melted but all of the internal bottles will still be frozen. Use these to layer in between quarters or boned out meat. Will last for at least a day on the way home.
If you plan on re using bottles make sure to take off the label. Blood gets behind it and makes a stinky mess.
I was on a caribou hunt and all the meat sat in the lake to keep it cool throughout the week. I wasn't sure about doing it but it worked great.
I've never had any issues. I try to drain the water and add ice to the extent feasible, but sitting in 32-degree air or 32-degree water or on 32-degree ice...no difference.
I think our longest was 8 days. Buddy killed on Day 4, I killed on day 10, we got home on day 12. His elk was in a cooler with ice which we refreshed about 4 times before we got home. He reported that the meat was just fine.
I'm from Mississippi. our bow season is extremely hot and humid in october. most days in the 90's. I don't have a walk in cooler, we quarter and drop the meat in an ice chest full of cold ice water, leave the drain open and refill the cooler with ice daily, or when needed. i do this for 5-7 days on every deer that i shoot. so does everyone else down here. my deer meat is never nothing short of perfect.
i could probably buy a really nice walk in cooler for what i have spent on ice.....
I usually put something in the bottom like frozen water bottles just to keep the meat a few inches off the bottom, and keep the plug out so it will drain. Then you can keep pouring ice over the top and the meat doesn't have to sit in water.
tip # 13 fill died air space inside the cooler with newspaper or anything , it will help your ice last a bit longer
I always find it funny that people worry about getting meat wet. I have watched several different butchers wash the game down and then leave it to dry. I always wash the meat and don't ever worry about the water in the cooler. I have had meat in cooler water for up to 10 days with no ill effects. They always get trimmed up anyways. I would rather have a clean cold wet animal in a cooler full of ice and water, than a dirty one hanging in the breeze.
I used to soak my boned out meat in a cooler of water to get off hair and blood before I cut and wrapped it up. It did the same coloration thing to my meat so I stopped doing it and just rinsed off hair and blood and cut and wrapped. In warm temperatures I would not hesitate to keep the meat cool in water to prevent spoilage.
You can make POLAR TUBES from 2" PVC conduit. Measure your cooler and cut the PVC 3"-4" shorter than your cooler length. Glue on one endcap. Add 1 cup Kosher salt, then fill to just 2" shy of the top of the conduit (to allow for expansion when they freeze). Glue on another endcap. Shake up to dissolve the salt, then freeze. They stay frozen longer, they are reusable, they are cheap to make, and they will not "wash out" your meat. Make as many as you need, and you can layer them throughout your cooler.
Let's be clear we are talking ice water and it's not an issue as long as your container started clean. It has to be ice water though and not just water.
The water will discolor the meat but it's not an issue.
I wonder who started the rumor " don't put meat in cold water "
I do it - washes out more blood, keeps it colder than just having ice near it IMO
Having the meat in ice water doesn't hurt a damn thing. If you are draining off the water, you're just going to spend more on ice to replace it.
This will solve all your problems...
If the water is ice cold it will not harm the meat. If it sits in water long enough it washes the blood out so it loses some of the red color. Ascetically it may lose some appeal. But the meat is fine.
Sometimes I'll make a salt brine/ice slush and soak the meat an hour or so to cool it icy cold to it's core. Then drain and wipe it down real well. An hour or three won't discolor it. If it's hot out and it's been a while before getting it to the ice this helps a lot. It takes a lot longer than you think to cool down the center mass of meat in ice (which is an insulator to a degree) and this works great, large contact surface with the slush and the salt releases the cold of the ice faster (think ice cream maker...)
I have a stainless rack I put in the bottom of the cooler to hold the meat a couple inches off the bottom. The water bottle idea would work as well, anything to hold the meat up off the bottom. Also keeps the meat from clogging up the drain hole. I like to layer a sprinkle of sea salt (Hawaiian rock salt) as I lay the meat in. I think that helps retard any bacteria to a degree as I'm going to be ageing it a week or ten days. I put a plastic sheet over the top of it all so as the ice melts it doesn't trickle down though the meat but goes to the sides and runs down. Drain it a couple or 3 times a day. Add ice to keep it topped off as needed.
I don't like to leave the drain hole open. Cold air sinks. You're losing your coldest air out the hole all day if you leave it open. I had some meat sour on me once and it was at the very bottom of the cooler when I was leaving the drain open. Outsmarted myself again....
Found it: Got this from a true, Cajun guide down in LA. It works. Place boned hindquarters, 1-3, in a cooler large enough to hold 2, half-gallon milk jugs with frozen water. Place 3-4 12-oz bottles of frozen water spread among meat. Cover completely with ice cubes. Very liberally, sprinkle ice with 1/2 Tony Chachere Cajun Seasoning and 1/2-High Mountain venison seasoning. Allow 1-2 days with lid tightly sealed, drain closed. Remove, shake off excess and trim as needed. Wrap completely in bacon and place on grill, off direct heat (about 200-225), until internal temp is 155-160. That usually about when bacon begins to crisp. I did this a few years ago and it was fantastic. The only thing I would add is this. I collect hickory nuts when they fall, soak them and use them for smoke on the grill.
BTW Many meat suppliers are now "wet aging" their meat.
Although I bone mine off, I have never had any problems with the meat in melting ice for a day or two.
It really helps clean the meat off of pine needles and little dirt ect.
Sure, keep the drain plug open and all is well.
Good luck, Robb
Where does the USDA say meat shouldn't be in water? Kind of hard to avoid since meat is already about 75% water.
It's not the water that's a problem, but the temperature of it. Warm water will breed bacteria. Hell, you brine/soak meat in cold water prior to cooking right. LOL
Not sure what EF & archery mean. If you have water WITH ICE STILL IN IT the water is 32-degrees. No different than sitting in 32-degree air or on 32-degree ice. As midwest points out, meat is already "wet" - it's composed of water.
I concur you don't want it sitting in warm water, but neither do you want it sitting in warm air. There are still germs in 32-degree water and there are germs on your 32-degree meat that's on ice. It won't keep that way forever, so you need to get it processed and into the freezer as soon as feasible. But sitting water isn't an issue.
The only concern I could see would be that water could spread a mess. Say for instance you remove a tenderloin that contacts bladder or stomach contents. It's tainted (perhaps should be tossed) but you put it in the cooler. If the entire cooler is ice, when butcher (or you) take meat out to process and notice that piece smells rank it can be tossed. If the meat is icewater, that mess has been spread throughout the cooler, which could pose a problem.
Like I said wet aging is a technique used by many meat suppliers now.
I wonder what a meat processor, by trade, thinks about this topic who cuts up hundreds of [elk] a year that are dropped off in all forms of nastiness...?
Actually, it is a matter of common sense. Unfortunately, many meat processors lack that as well as a habit of cleanliness. If I got my meat processed, I wouldn't want it in water, either. Especially if it was laying on their cooler floor. Do what suits you.
Maybe ButcherBoy will see this and give us some insight. I think most will wash it off, but then wipe it down.
I can only imagine what comes through their doors.....
I was a meat cutter and here is my insight. Meat browns naturally and it is totally normal. In regards to water, when defrosting you always want to use cold water as warm water promotes bacteria growth quickly. Cold water is fine but should be replenished when it gets warm.
Below zero temps. is the only temp that KILLS bacteria...some even grows in those below zero temps. but the ones we are concerned about do not. Below freezing temps. do not stop bacteria growth....meat will decompose FASTER in water regardless of the temp. When aging meat we are letting the meat "break down/decompose" to a extent.
In some countries, meat tenderizing is done by repeated thawing and freezing. In others,it is done by allowing meat "season" to the point it just about falls apart. Meat is hung at temps above 40-degrees for several days. Tenderizing or aging is nothing more than the bacterial breakdown of tissue. Once again, all that is really required is a little common sense. Would I throw a deer in a lake and allow it to remain there a couple days? No. I have before but I would not do it again. The reason being, dang turtles ate most of it. When I bring deer home, field dressed, which is all the time, the first thing I do is wash them out with the hose. Clean them and cools them down. Besides, I have no turtles in my hose.
Meat in water may be perfectly safe to eat and taste ok but it's just gross. Unless it is a last ditch effort to prevent spoilage I'll take my meat dry please.
" Besides, I have no turtles in my hose. "
That. Is. Awesome. Best qoute of the year. Thanks BW and get well soon Sir!!!!
Water introduces bacteria. Had a guy who was a butcher for 50 years tell me he hated when guys rinsed out a deer, even if gut shot. He said it did more damge to the meat then it did good. Once the meat is quartered or de-boned it should not really hurt it though. Shawn
"Tenderizing or aging is nothing more than the bacterial breakdown of tissue. Once again, all that is really required is a little common sense."
Wrong. Tenderizing is the process inwhich already present enzymes break down muscle tissue. Enzyme and bacterial reactions cause flavor change. Hell, even meat processors know that...
First year of college i think I got some turtles in my hose........ that might have even been the technical name for it.....
enzymes and bacteria are two totally separate things if I recall.
Water never touches any of my red meat. I never soak meat in water.
Caribou we shot in AK was in garbage bags submerged in the lake during the daytime (70ish degree days) and then put in game bags and hung in a tree overnight (40ish degree nights). Plastic bags & game bags were rinsed and dried between usages. It took some effort but the meat was perfect after 6 days when the plane came to get us.
Just to put in my most humble opinion, as the owner of a processing plant that processes over 600 elk and deer every season we hate to see meat come in that is soaking in bloody cooler water. A couple of reasons why. 1. the bacteria spreads through any meat surface , even in the cracks . 2 All of the green matter also gets spread throughout the meat ( 90 % of wild game has gut matter on it ). After we put the meat in our cooler the bacteria growth is slowed down, but it is still growing. We put the loose meat in large vacuum bags, which adds to the cost of the processing, but will extend the life of the meat. Keep your meat clean and dry for the best results, use bottled ice as the best choice.
At least no one has a stong opinion about this......which is refreshing on BS..........
Oldtimer is right and taught me pretty much everything I know about processing meat. Domestic and Wild game. Cooler with ice in it is ok but it will melt and spread all that dirt, hair, and stomach matter everywhere. If thats the only way you have to keep it cool then go for it but, be very strict about draining the water off and make sure your meat is not soaking in the water. The ideal way to keep it cool in a cooler is to first cool the meat out overnight hanging in a tree or game pole then place in your cooler with frozen water bottles or frozen 1/2 gallon milk jugs or any plastic container with frozen water in it.
Once you get dirt or stomach matter on the meat it is best to leave it on unless you have access to a lot of fresh water right then when the meat is still wet. Once the meat starts to dry on the outside it will make a mess if you try to wash it off later. Just cut it off when processing. Washing it in the field without having enough water will just spread all that junk into every nook and cranny and then you will have even more to trim off.
I used to take pictures of the best and worst wild game every year just to teach hunters about proper meat care but most don't really seem to care i guess. I have really high standards when processing meat and clean it up really nice. My price might be higher than most but I also take pride in the finished product. That extra care when processing matters.
Feel free to ask me, oldtimer, or HDE about proper meat care. We are all involved in the family business one way or another.
I used to know an old farmer that put his deer meat in 55 gallon drums filled with a brine of vinegar, salt, and water. He would leave the meat for a week or two depending on outside temperature. When it was colorless he would package and freeze it, claiming it was the tenderest meat ever
We always debone and take great care to keep hair and dirt off the meat. Can't remember the last time any gut juice got on the meat, even taking out the tenders. Used to have access to a walk in cooler but no more. Right now any aging has to be in a cooler with ice. We try to minimize contact with water, but it's going to happen. Haven' noticed much difference unless we let is sit in the water for extended times.
Just this last few days though much of that will change as I have a line on a "crawl in" cooler and can ditch the ice chest for ageing. Much prefer dry aged where the outside gets a "skin" on it.
But again, I can imagine what you guys see. A pretty famous hunter once brought into camp some meat he had deboned (the guy is a pure stone killer with a bow)......as he's unloading it out of the bags my buddy told him that was pretty ingenious..... he asked what do you mean? Buddy says when you combine the salad with the meat like that it just takes another step out of getting dinner ready......
To each his own. Heck, I know a man who has been married four times. All his wives died. He said he would only marry ugly, wealthy women who were not in the best health. Said nobody would try to steal them and he didn't have to put up with them very long. Seems as though he was happy as a hog in slop. Rich from inheritances, too. I think he soaked his meat in water from time to time.
If you're putting meat in the cooler with dirt, excess hair, and guts all over it, having some melted ice water in there is not the problem.
Bowriter , that's funny !
Good tips here. I really like the frozen gallon jug idea. I like to put ice in the chest cavity of a deer I shoot when it's warm to help get the body heat out. I never worried about the water touching the meat but it is messy when it starts to melt. The jugs should eliminate a lot of that.
