Broadhead question
Equipment
I've been shooting Muzzy MX 4s for several years and have had great luck with them taking an elk, pronghorn, 3 black bears and about 15 whitetail bucks and does. All, except for the elk have been pass throughs. I am pleased with them except for one thing, they don't seem to cause a great blood trail.
Where I whitetail hunt is pretty thick and all of my deer have died but I've had to find several the next morning because of lack of a good blood trail. Usually, that isn't a big deal but in WV our season is starting in Sept. Instead of the middle of Oct., so now I have temperature to deal with as well as increasing numbers of coyotes so I'd prefer to find deer in the evening instead of the next day. During the early season I don't hunt the mornings because I want to be low-impact around the fields.
So my question is: I hear a lot about slick tricks for elk, how about deer and what type of blood trail do they usually leave considering a well placed lung shot?
Thanks
That head will make as good of a blood trail as any. Quantity of blood on the ground is 1. A function of shot placement and 2. A function of the size of the hole. Given proper 1, you broad head is more than fine with 2. Anybody who says differently is all wet.
I agree, the sharper the cut in a vessel or organ the less rough edges for platelets to adhere to and start the coagulation cascade of stopping blood loss. I used to hunt with the old bear broadheads and then the original Snuffers, however with faster bows and smaller graphite arrows I could never get them to the accuracy that I want. For any broadhead to work right it has to be delivered to the right spot. We all try for a heart shot but in real life that dosen't happen all the time especially from a tree stand and most shots are thru the lung. If you are lucky and hit the heart or the main pulmonary artery or vein most broadheads will leave a heavy blood trail especially with a pass through shot. What I'm wondering about is a pass through on lung tissue with no heart or major pulmonary arteries or veins or even the aorta.
Now back to my original question how are slick tricks, especially the cut on impact blades in creating a blood trail?
I've heard lots of knocks on Muzzy heads, but being dull is not one of them.
I think they are plenty sharp, I'm just wondering about something with more overall cutting surface.
Their blades are not really that sharp out of the package but I have seen good blood from them none the less.
Blood trails are a product of what was hit and what the angle was and how sharp the blades were and wether the arrow exited or not.
If you are not getting good trails from tree stand shots with pass throughs you are likely hitting them too far back.
Been beaten to death, but yeah...gotta be shaving sharp...and, of course, well placed. I'm a trad guy and use Zwickey 2 blade Deltas. Tough to sharpen, but tough on critters too. From the box to the arrow takes me about 1 Brewers game :^). I do the TruAngle file, medium stone, hard Arkansas stone, leather strap thing...and can shave hair when done...fortunately, MLB plays 162 games :^).
In regard to leaving em overnight, and finding em in the morning...in my hood, the yotes have no trouble "tracking" in the dark, so that's not an option....
Sharp is sharp....after that there are just varying degrees of dullness!
EF, excellent post!
I agree completely and have also used your example of shaving nicks in some of my posts on the same subject.
I think they were good examples for the further reason of showing the effect of even the slightest dulling from use. Way back in my youth, I got so tired of the nicks occurring most often when I was shaving carefully for a date, that I switched to putting a new blade in the razor mid-week, instead of on Saturday, so I could get a couple shaves on the fresh edge before the shave that was most important to me.
The edges can still shave a human face smoothly and comfortably even when slightly less sharp than they are capable of being, and slightly less productive of causing blood on the ground.
The other factor that hasn't been mentioned is edge retention. For hunting, the sharpness that the blade has when cutting air is less important than the sharpness it retains after cutting through a thick coat of hair and a thick animal hide.
Edge angles, steel quality, and blade thickness all become factors, as does any intentional trade-off by the manufacturer in sacrificing some blade strength for reduced restriction to penetration, for example.
I think we have a generally greatly improved variety of choices in BH's now than we did fifty+ years ago when I started bowhunting.
My personal favorites have at times included Muzzy both regular and Phantoms, and others back through the years, but I have come back to the NAP Thunderheads now as being the best combo for my needs as an older bowhunter shooting reduced draw weight and no longer hunting anything larger than whitetails.
Lost of factors to consider in choosing the best fit for each hunter's needs.
One constant in the deliberation should be that the blades should be as sharp as we can get them.
I'm with SDHTR. I say shot placement #1 for both blood and rapid death.
Most bloody and rapid death I've witnessed first hand was heart shot with our little 150 2 blade on a doe I shot in 2013. No giant gash from hitting at a hard angle. No X. No star. Just a slit in the right spot and it was a bloodbath like nothing I've seen.
Surprising you got your best trail on a heart shot Rayzor. My experience and best trails have been on solid double lungers or shots that take out the arteries on top of the heart. Heart hits that shut down the pump station seemed to spray out less blood. Anything razor sharp through the goodies has left a good trail though none the less.
I don't see what possible difference in blood trail there would be between an MX-4 and a ST. Both short four blade heads, both known for being quite sharp.
Blood trail is about what gets cut and where, high chest hits sometimes don't bleed much until the cavity fills. Bigger/more arteries cut, more blood.
Agree with the heart shot. Connecting arteries on top will spray. Or only one chamber compromised it will still pump. But you take it out completely and blood trails can be sparse.
My bloodtrails improved tremendously when I started shooting farther forward on whitetails.
Ever since i stopped shooting the short heads....i got better blood trails.
I don't think the heart just stops dead on a heart shot- at least not in my experience. I shot an elk that had just finished being locked up with another bull right though the heart and blood was pulsing at least 5' out each side of that bull like a squirt gun....he spotted me at about the 3 second mark, turned to run and did that sideways run into the ground. He made it all of about 30'.
This was the first blood I found from a buck I shot last year. The blood was 5 yards from impact. The deer went 30 yards. The shot center punched the lungs. I dont think the broad head made a difference in the outcome. When I say that it could have been just about any broad head. The shot was put where it needed to be. The broad head was a COC head. A VPA to be exact, it was scary sharp.
I dont sharpen heads every day but on a 2 week hunt I will touch them up atleast a couple times throughout the hunt to make sure they are sharp.
I've had some marginal blood trails from Magnus Stingers, especially heart shots more than lung shots.
My best blood trail was a butt shot (femoral).
Rage have given me great blood trails and fair blood trails, and last year I saw an amazing blood trail from one on a double-lunged mule deer.
Shoot quality, that's sharp, and it all comes down to location, location, location.
X2 writer, accidental hip shot on a whitetail buck with a sharp slick trick and he only went 60 yards with a great blood trail. I think he bled out completely internally with that artery shot.
Its always about shot placement regardless of the broadhead. This blood trail is from a 4 blade stinger buzzcut
I've had the worse experiences with blood trails on heart shot deer,,, I like high in the lungs and just listen for them to fall within 40yds..
you know why Thunderheads have been around so long? They work , tried true and tested.
So far I've killed a whitetail buck and a #120 boar hog with a slick trick standard.
I am amazed at the amount of blood on the ground from the slick tricks.
I shot another highly touted head for years that killed animals just as quickly but there just wasnt the blood trail like with the slick tricks.
Have a great Hunt.
Kevin
I use slicktrick mags with one bow and I went back to thunderhead 125's with another bow and both heads I like to remove the blades, clamp them in a simmons clamp and go over the factory edge with a ceramic rod just to polish the edge a bit and I'm very happy with the blood.
not to single out those two heads even when I tried mechanicals I still would open them and touch up each edge,,, the only heads I'm 100% satisfied with the sharpness is original german made silver flames and I don't even own any.
I agree with Writer... ... Lots of good heads listed here....... I shoot a Ram Cat 125 grain, because it is scary accurate out of my Hoyt Carbon Spyder 34,,,,,,,
It has been a real killer,
VPA broadheads are some of the best and the non vented can easily be sharpened with a 3 sided jewel stick. I mean so sharp if you look at them your eyes will be bleed. I shoot the 175 grainers out of all my trad bows and my compound as well. Shawn
All I know is that when EF Hutton talks - people should listen... Save that post and refer to it often. As much as I love my VPA BH's because I can sharpen them any time I wish - with ease... It wasn't until I really perfected it to be just so scary shaving hair-popping sharp - that I saw a huge difference in blood letting... Night and day, and the rubber band test is about as perfect a test you can get...
A well placed VPA 100 grain vented head left this behind...the rest of the blood trail was just as awesome! When I found this, I had to take a pic!
