VA Bans use of Urine scent attractants
Whitetail Deer
Well, I didnt see where anyone else had posted it ,using the current search function, so I figured I would. I can't believe it, but VA actually banned the use of urine based scents saying its supposed to help prevent EHD. ...oh but synthetics are OK. (people who banned it probably just started a synthetic scent company). So if attractants are bringing deer together how is synthetic supposed to be any less dangerous?
Yes we got hammered by EHD last year and the report says the main county I hunt in was the 2nd hardest hit with a 47% reduction in deer harvest but how the heck does banning urine help that? Wonder how much fact that decision was based on.
Wonder how many tickets will be written and deer will be confiscated this year.
People should capture each other, get a drink,and blame it on the other guy.
No more of that silly scent game.. I just left a bar with a bottle of doe-in-heat lure in my pocket.
How will they know which deer to prosecute for too much manufacturer's supply getting into the black market to the deer.
This could pose atremebdous problem when compared to hemmerhagic crypto form whirling disease in western slope cut-throat trout.
So, there you have it in. Nutshell, so go to it. Yqhooo
does not stop one from using their own urine which works fine.
Oh boy, I was feeling too well last night when I typed my response to this thread.
Honestly, though it does seem to address the situation head-on!
Add my proposal to Bou'bound's idea of using one's own urine, and it appears that the situation is resolved.
Synthetic , Rayzor, will not contain the prion secretion that carries the disease. Those who want to continue to use deer urine should consider becoming thoroughly informed before continuing its use.It may also reduce forthcoming negative responses!
Just use your own. It works better, it's a heck of a lot cheaper, you CANNOT for get it, and best of all it comes with it's own multi-purpose applicator!
Good thing they stopped this practice before it became an industry giant. Not like urine has been used for what, the past 40 or so years!
Lets hope the Fed's don't dip their greedy little paws into this and start regulating scent suppliers because a 4oz bottle of deer pee will cost $100!
IMO, The suppliers need to get together and straighten this out w/in themselves so the customer isn't paying for some politician's ridiculous policy.
So how will they enforce this? Is there going to be a game warden behind every tree? Stop every hunter at a check point and search and frisk? Maybe you'll have to swear an oath when you get a deer license? Oh ya, ethics! What a frigging joke.
I believe Vermont banned urine based scents and lures about 2 months ago. CWD can transmitted through bodily excretions, saliva, urine, feces. Areas where cervids have urinated have been shown to have active agents that cause CWD. Because urine based scents are made from commercially raised deer, there is the potential for widespread CWD there. Symptoms for CWD can take years to show themselves and manifest. It is a precautionary measure to stop the spread of CWD. NYS really dodged a bullet a few years ago with it. Not trying to portray a doom and gloom scenario, but it could very well happen.
AZ banned it 2 years ago. I want to see the tester the G&F officers have to carry to see if it is synthetic or not.
It may be against the law (technicaly), but I doubt they will keep you from peeing in the woods and there is no better scent attractant.
so, don't sweat it, urinate it.
So, midge flies and following an estrous does will kill you within 48 hours...learn somethin' new every day.
"Well, I didnt see where anyone else had posted it "
Maybe, next time check the State Forums.
Bogunshuutze was all over this about a month ago.
;^)
Smart move. Most deer urines are from cervid farms.
I just had been trying to connect the EHD and urine thing. Rarely here much about CWD here. Several dies from EHD though. It was first reported the urine ban was in response to EHD.
oh well, will save me some $.
tonyo6302...thought about that about the time I posted. Tried the "search" function with no success. Should have known better.
Thanks Rayzor, this is the first I've heard that CWD can be spread through urine. Seems like nobody is gonna escape this disease by the time it's over. CWD was just confirmed in a captive deer in Central Texas. Now we are waiting on the response from TPWD. Gonna really start a chitstorm here I imagine because of all the deer breeders and high fence guys on one side and the " non-believers " on the other.
I feel like there are gonna be lots of captive deer slaughtered here before long.
It's embarrassing that many of Virginia's hunters don't know the difference between EHD and CWD.
One is like the flu and one is more like Ebola.
I can see it now...
In order to fool the wardens, hunters in VA will be using the whizzinator filled with Tinks #69 and peeing in their mock scrapes, LOL!
"It's embarrassing that many of Virginia's hunters don't know the difference between EHD and CWD."
elkstabber, I believe you have misinterpreted Rayzor.
He never stated which is worse, EHD or CWD. He did state that CWD cases are few here in the Old Dominion. That is true.
Everything he posted is factual.
CWD is NOT caused by "active agents" in urine where deer have urinated. Where did that shining light of thought come from????
CWD CAN be carried by excretement and urine, and can be held in an active state in the soil for years.
There has never been a proven case of urine transmitting the disease prions to healthy deer in the wild. The only time it has happened was in a research facility in Co where the ground was saturated from infected animals and healthy deer were placed in the small pens for lengthy periods of time.
D Tala,
The VA DGIF agrees with you somewhat, but are erring on the side of caution.
what are they going to do about the deer peeing in the woods, hundreds of thousands of them peeing multiple times a day. that's millions of pee spots put on the ground every day. is one bottle of tinks going to be the one billionth pee spot this decade that puts it over the edge. what about guys like me that collect urine from deer they kill to use as lure is that illegal now too?
Tonyo - This is from Rayzor's first line: "VA actually banned the use of urine based scents saying its supposed to help prevent EHD".
That's the misinformation I'm talking about. The ban on deer urine was intended to prevent the spread of CWD. This is what El Dente, 6 Points, and DTala were responding to. The connection is between urine and CWD.
You don't have to worry about enforcement if you don't break the law. If you can't kill a deer here in Va. without urine you should consider improving your hunting skills......just saying....
I used deer urine in the distant past. Can't say it ever helped me kill a deer, but I only used it sporadically, so maybe I didn't give it a chance. I have had excellent success with making mock scrapes with my urine and getting bucks to take them over, but again, never killed a deer over said scrape. Most bucks in my area work their scrapes while I'm sleeping I guess.
elkstabber. Saying you can't believe how many Virginia Hunters don't know the difference is, frankly, BS......or as someone else said, a misinterpretation on your part. I'm fully aware, and have been for sometime, the difference between EHD and CWD, as I assume most Virginia deer hunters also do. I may not have all the details on CWD. It really hasn't impacted much or at all here and in the areas I hunt in other states but I have the general jist of it being a brain disorder that affects the nevous system and such. Like I wrote, it was originally said the urine based scents were banned in repsonse to EHD. That is what was being reported. Not my misunderstanding of what was reported. Apparently it was miscommunicated to those on the news and such that were doing the reporting. Also, as I wrote, that was what I couldn't connect. Urine and EHD. Hence my comment on midge and estrous does. I'm very familiar with EHD. I've personally found over 20 deer that died from it in the three outbreaks that impacted my previous leases and the current farm I help manage. Midge flies carries the virus that casues a very high fever. That high fever will cause brain damage, shut down vital organs and and ultimately result death. Same as it will in humans (high fever that is).
"If you can't kill a deer here in Va. without urine you should consider improving your hunting skills......just saying.... "
Unfortunately, Bowsage, my 58 year old prostate gland will not allow me to hunt without urine . . . . just say'n . . .
;^)
Drink extra coffee Tonyo, that'll get the bucks going!
Rayzor - living in Virginia I've heard several hunters say that the ban was due to EHD. You're not the first. You said "it was originally said the urine based scents were banned in repsonse to EHD" in the middle of your last post. Who reported that BS? The "reporter" has confused a bunch of hunters in VA.
Here are the basics: EHD (aka "bluetongue") comes through in waves, always has and always will. It's caused by biting midges (flies) and tends to be localized in severity. We've all had outbreaks of EHD in VA. Deer numbers will bounce back quickly after an outbreak.
CWD has never been in VA until the last couple of years. It can only be transmitted from an infected deer and seems to be coming from infected deer in WV. When CWD expands into a new area it kills and never stops killing. CWD is most similar to Mad Cow Disease but it appears not to hurt humans. CWD is 100 times more serious than EHD.
The DGIF banned the use of urine because they were concerned that the urine could come from an infected deer in another state.
Here are better details from the QDMA: https://www.qdma.com/articles/ehd-and-cwd-whats-the-difference
My point is that we hunters should know more about the animals we hunt than a news reporter.
"You don't have to worry about enforcement if you don't break the law. If you can't kill a deer here in Va. without urine you should consider improving your hunting skills......just saying...."
just saying what?
I have a crushing retort, Bou, but I gotta go pee . . . . . .
CWD is 100 times more serious than EHD
and EHD kills 1000 times more deer than CWD does...every year...
hmmm, hunters still use urine....go figure.
give me a break,,,, VA, well that does not surprise me.......
Really Dtala, where are all these dead deer..... I have a hunting house in SD, live in Wis, please tell me where are all the thousands of dead deer, please tell me where you live, I need an education.....
Blue Tongue and EHD are not the same disease. It was stated above that they were the same, not true. They are however similar.
Bou'bound, "just sayin' is an expression used after expressing an opinion,for the sensitive type as to indicate a non personal attack.
They need to ban deer farms or else make sure they have 3 sets of cyclone fences Round them spaced eight feet between them so wildlife can't get no where's beer these animals.
No Deer Farms in Virginia. No High Fence operations in Virginia.
Ya can't legally beer animals in Virginia either. ;^)
Not quite sure how one would conclude I need a lesson in the difference of these two things.
Oh well.
The banning of ungulate urine products is not just to reduce a deer and possible human disease concern, but now also an unprecedented agricultural issue.
The future of CWD control is not going to be pleasant, for anybody. Did anyone notice in the recent Texas CWD positive confirmation that the rancher notes the disease may have been transferred to the facility through the importation of feed?
Recent laboratory research is showing CWD can be absorbed by living plants. Field testing for the presence of CWD in agricultural plants will be proceeding soon.
What happens if/when CWD is found in agricultural produce?
Massive international agricultural product embargoes.
Agricultural organizations and of course the Deer farming associations all already posturing for possible recourse in the case of product embargoes. The directive appears to be for the promotion of complete wild ungulates extermination in CWD infection areas as a means to protect trade prospects. The deer farmers are ready to step in with "certified CWD free" free ranging livestock....
Hitchcock would have loved this....
one would be better served to not use it anyway - my humble opinion and 32 years experience...
