whisker biscuit or fall away
Equipment
I wanted to hear from anyone that has changed from a biscuit to a fall away. Are you satisfied with the change? Does it make a noticeable difference in your arrow groups? I'm sure this has been covered before, but I was just wondering. Thanks guys.
no contact is better than contact.
Interesting thread for sure. I bought a new bow last season and wanted to stick with a wb just because its simple. Guy who owned bow shop talked me into the drop away because of no contact with the arrow. I always take 2 bow out west in case something happens to one.
Im shocked folks sill use this crude rest called a WB , Todays dropawys are on the money why not take advantage of a no contact rest
The WB is a great rest for a child's bow
I have yet to find a disadvantage with the WB. I have been using it since 1995 flawlessly .I also have used others, I'm here to stay and never under estimate a 63 # childs bow carcus.
The wb is a great rest for young and old. The old adage in regard to keeping it simple rings true.
I have used a number of drop aways and have had failures. It is a matter of when, not if. Hopefully yours will be at the range and not during the opportunity of a lifetime.
those that love this WB what bows are u shooting ?
I've seen Murphy's Law in action when it comes to fall-away rests. Cost my brother a great antelope. I was 5 feet behind the action and watched the whole calamity transpire.
He still believes in them..I do not.
WB all the way IMO. I shoot recurves so I don't have to worry about all that stuff. :)
Interesting that some guys who slam mechanical broadheads use fall-away rests.
I still can't shoot better than my WB can perform.
It is, though, loud on calm days.
I can't get good flight from four-fletched arrows, like when shooting Bullheads.
I still use a prong rest. The WB works fine. I have a couple but I shoot what I like because I like it . Not scientific but true.
Spike bull said it rite. ant to carcus there are a lot of use old (HUNTER) that are kid's
I switched from a qad to a wb this year. So far zero complaints and it's so much more user friendly. I see zero difference in arrow flight. City hunter I have it on a pse DNA.
I have shot lots of different fall aways and prong rests and shoot regularly and accurately out to 70 yards. Nothing has outperformed a whisker biscuit rest for me.
Shot a biscuit for ten years, killed over 50 deer with one on my bow.(Mathews) I switched to a drop away two years ago and although I killed several deer with one on my bow, it had 2 failures(one of which cost me a 150" deer) never a failure with a biscuit. I went back to a biscuit and only lost 2 fps. and actually shoot it more accurately. I shoot a 3 blade VAP(175 grains). I do like keeping things simple and the QAD and other rest have to much that can go wrong. Try repairing one in the field if something goes wrong, I keep an extra biscuit(complete rest)in my pack. If something goes wrong I can put it on my bow in about 30 seconds, eye it up and be shooting very accurately again in minutes. Ohh and all this with one set of allen wrenches. I will never go back to a drop away.
quote: "I still can't shoot better than my WB can perform."
FEW can.
I went from WB to QAD two years ago. I cant say that I notice a real difference on shooting, but my fletching likes the QAD better as it doesn't get rippled. I have had WB failure- let it go a few years and once in a while arrow would start falling into bristles, would get a flyer. I needed to replace which was very easy. For me, a total toss up, keeping the QAD for now.
I went from WB to QAD two years ago. I cant say that I notice a real difference on shooting, but my fletching likes the QAD better as it doesn't get rippled. I have had WB failure- let it go a few years and once in a while arrow would start falling into bristles, would get a flyer. I needed to replace which was very easy. For me, a total toss up, keeping the QAD for now.
I shot the WB exclusively for many seasons. Rest was bullet proof and very dependable. But... the rest is very noisy with carbon arrows. I spooked numerous big game animals over the years to include a trophy boar hog and multiple white-tail bucks when they heard the arrow slide across the bristles while drawing the bow. I was able to arrow quite a few big game animals too so it wasn't on every encounter this would occur. But after the last instance this occurred, I took the plunge and went with the Code Red Drop-a-way and after two seasons using it, I am sold on its durability, dependability, smoothness, accuracy, and its absolutely silent when the bow is drawn. FWIW
The WB is noisey with some carbon arrows which have a camo finish. Shoot a non camo shaft and all you will hear is silence followed by your arrow hitting home.
Another bonus I have found is no more re fletching. I've been using turbo nocks since 1995, can't wear them out.
I went from finger type rest to Whisker Biscuits about 10-12 years ago. I started hearing the praises of drop aways and researched which ones to try. Initially I really liked them so I switched out all my biscuits for the drop away. As I bought new bows they got the drop aways. Although there were a couple of different models they were all the same brand. A couple years went by and I was days from the start of hunt and things went haywire. Ultimately it was the rest. Luckily a friend had a biscuit to lend all I was able to get it dialed in quick. I had a second one fail just after selling a bow. It was a different model. That one locked up. It was also was the end of me using drop aways. The company stood behind their products and send new rests but switched all my setups back to biscuits. Plan to put them on my new bows too. I like the new higher models. Their tougher builds and additional adjustments are a plus.
Trophy taker Smackdown Pro.
I like the concept and simplicity of the WB but couldn't get good arrow flight out of it. Tried several times to no avail. Drop away now and very consistent
Rip cord only. You put butter and jam on your biscuit and eat it
I always get a kick out of the "no contact" crowd. Since when? Some contact is obviously needed to send your arrows in the proper direction to begin with. It's called guidance. And the fact that thousand upon thousands of hunters are able to guide all manner of broadheads accurately to unlimited ranges through a WB is testament to the fact that there are no accuracy issues with them.
As far as noise goes, mine is dead silent, maybe they need a break in? I don't know. I've had the same insert in my bow for over 12 years and thousands upon thousands of shots. I've been through prob 5-6 strings but that same WB keeps slaying animals. Sure it's burned into a slightly oblong hole but when fixed blades fly perfectly out to my maximum distance I have no complaints. It's to the point where I wonder how many bows , strings and animals can I use it on?
My last 3d shot I shoot a 282 out of 300.. I shoot a wb. I also shoot a strothers rust xt.. Ed
Stand on your head, and shoot your drop away, then shoot the WB. See which one you like best ;^) As a hunting rest in "dynamic" situations..I think it's pretty hard to beat the WB.
If you shoot perfect technique, no torque on the release, butter smooth on every shot, then the "no contact" idea is great...but personally, my arrow could use some "guidance" on those imperfect releases.
I shoot an Elite Pure, bare bow with fingers...so it's perfect for me...K I S S !
After all...it's just a stick and a string...right?
I can't see using a rest that your fletching hits. I do know that the WB design worked well on little kids bows in Saturday leagues at the local shop in the 80's so the arrow wouldn't fall off.
Jeff, I hunt on my feet, sometimes on my ass, but never on my head. :) (ok, a few times on my face)
I've shot 10k+ arrows and 6 animals with my current QAD rest on over 170 hunting days - 90% of which have been western hunts on the move and in the back country. I have absolute confidence in my rest and have never had so much as a glitch.
Oh, and it has zero effect on my shots whether they be 5 yards or 80.
Elkhunter-ny. It also worked fine for Jim Despart when he shot and posted a 300 60X.
One should never consider their limitations to be everyone else's.
Tuning got real easy for me once I discovered fall aways, it got even easier when I discovered dual static yoke bows(AKA bowtech overdrive binary), I think the APA dual cams have static yokes as well
My QAD froze on a freezing rain hunt - never any issue in "normal" weather - but made me think about switching as well..
SteveBNY, I shot with Jim at the Atlantic City shoot a few times, don't recall him using a WB when he won it. At the Vegas shoot this year there were 17 guys in the MFSU shoot off, don't recall any WB's being used. In the final between Reo Wilde and Mike Schloesser neither used a WB. I know that Mike has shot a 900 on the Vegas face with his equipment. I guess the WB is fine for shooting the blue and white 300 round. You are certainly correct about considering a persons limitations.
wade94z, to answer your question, I switched to a fall-away after many successful years shooting a WB. The benefits of the WB are it's simplicity, rugged design, full capture concept, and low cost. The downsides are less tolerance of shooting form errors when shooting FBBH, slight loss of speed, wear to vanes, and more draw noise with some arrow shaft types. Even though I prefer a fall-away for longer-range shooting, still I'd have no reservations using a WB for hunting, if mostly close-range shots under 40 yards were expected.
I shoot a Qad ultra on my bow and really like it , I personally think a fall away is the better option for shooting any kind of distance but my wife only shoots out to 30 yards so a whisker biscuit suits her just fine
I think about the same as I did of mechanical heads before we made our first broadheads pre VPA. I absolutely loved them and killed several deer with them, so with dramatic results like on their commercials. Then I had two within a few days where the mechanics failed with terrible results. Now my main concern is having a head that stays together. Same with the rest I loved them until they quit working. Thankfully it was not at the moment of truth during the hunt i had thousands of dollars tied up in. If the WB ever failed me I'd feel the same way about them. So far so good though.
One thing I learned though.... No matter which one you choose, you may want to have a back up rest set up for your rig so you can swap them out and get tuned quick. I do it with my buscuits too. Neither is completely fool proof or indestructable. A complete duplicate backup bow rig is good too.
I heard from some one the WB we built so monkeys can shoot a bow.
Jim is a close friend of mine and he does shoot a drop-away and may have shot a biscuit a bit for a while. I know he does not have an issue with the biscuit and I believe he thinks it is just a personal preference. He only shoots a drop away now. He keeps telling me to go with a drop away but I like the biscuit as I feel it is far more reliable and can be replaced in the field way easier than a drop away. Both are great rests and it is up to the shooter to shoot what they feel is best for their hunting style. Shawn
"I heard from some one the WB we built so monkeys can shoot a bow"
Dan, I consider myself much more evolved...at the very least, Neanderthal !
Wow bigdan, that was really funny...
NASA is yet to use a WB - they have always used drop aways to launch rockets into space.
...or not.
Which drop-away rest did Fred Bear, Ben Pearson, Chuck Adams and Tom Miranda all use?
Oh, wait...at least Miranda is one of the monkeys who uses a Whisker Biscuit. Guess Fred, Ben and Chuck are below monkeys, huh?
Just how techno will we let bows get, and still consider them "bows."
The question was asked "What do you use your bow for?" It is a hunting bow. And I do use the WB. I tried one of the earlier drop away rest several years ago and wasn't really all that impressed with it and was concerned about all the moving parts. The WB has always performed really well. I guess I got caught up in all the hype and claims about the fall away rest. I'm not trying to "fix something that isn't broke" so to speak, but if it's dependable and will make my equipment more accurate and myself a more lethal hunter or if I could shoot golf ball size groups at 60 yards, I'm willing to check it out. With that said. If it will help anyone else I've never had the biscuit fail. Depending on how much you shoot if you replace the insert every year or two it probably won't. I personally use Beman shafts and the finish they use even on the camo Hunter Pros I have no problems with noise. I also use the Blazer vanes they hold up really well. (I was using them with the fall away rest too.) As for the comments about it being a child's rest.....that was cute. Not sure if monkeys were the reason for the Biscuit, but it may be the reason they have spell check at the bottom of the page.
Thanks again for all your helpful post.
Wade - now your post really is funny!!
WB, 13 year old bow, XX78s, fixed blade Thunderheads. I just compensate my inability to shoot 100 yards and buy the newest "stuff" every year with a "killer" mentality. Since the WB is easy enough for child monkeys to shoot I have more time to learn how to hunt. :-)
WB for over a decade in all sorts of whether conditions, no noise and no failures...performed flawlessly. I now use the Trophy Ridge fall away just because I was curious...it works great also. No discernible difference in my groups. I would say you cant go wrong with the WB weather you are a human or a monkey!! And I might add if you have never tried one why are you commenting in this post?? Read original question!!
WB provides me the best failsafe platform with no appreciable decrease in effective range.I like that.
WB on a Hoyt Charger = Deadly combination
I have shot biscuits for years. Every year or two I get the urge to try the latest and greatest. This year I put on the limbdriver pro v. I have been struggling to get the bow broadhead tuned. Tonight I put the biscuit back on and is back to perfect tune. In fact drove a slick trick down the center of an arrow. Hate it when that happens but it reinforced I made the right decision.
Who'd a thunk we could possibly have so many monkeys with enough brains to get online, to get on Bowsite?
...and they're the ones with the best writing skills, too!
So, Big Dan, where does my buddy who still is shooting a flipper-style rest rank in the evolutionary chain? Opossum?
Well, twice the opossum has had the top buck during a Pope & Young measuring period. :-)
Et tu, fall-away shooters?
Personal preference is the bottom line of course.
WB: Pros - Little chance of failure. Simple with total arrow containment. Much easier on the pocket book.
Cons - Imagine it in a freezing rain situation as mentioned above - like shooting through a brick. Will affect arrow flight as it goes through the WB, especially when the vanes goes through. ANY problems with form or torquing will be very apparent, especially at longer distances. Noise on drawing with some arrows and possible noise as the fletching goes through the WB. Eats feathers if you use those.
Fall away: Pros - If set up properly, little impact on arrow flight caused by torquing bow - gives better flight, especially at longer ranges. Many new versions are extremely sturdy with little failure. Full containment of arrow and quiet on the better rests listed above.
Cons - More expensive. Being mechanical, there is a possibility of failure in the field. Must be good quality and set up right or it can cause more trouble than it fixes.
The bottom line for me is that the WB is great if you are shooting close distances like from a blind or tree stand, have great form and/or are on a tight budget. The drop away is better for longer shots or to help with slight problems with form and/or vane contact. I use a drop away and have never had an issue with failure.
NOTE - each needs to be set up properly to truly get a good evaluation! Unfortunately, too often they are not and then one or the other gets a bad review.
I had a WB on my son's bow. He could not even take the shot on an elk, because right before drawing, I noticed his WB was almost solid with ice. It had snowed and turned to freezing rain. I had to tap him on his shoulder to stop him from drawing. he tried to tap it enough to break up ice, and elk was gone.................
If he had tried to shoot that elk, there is no telling where that arrow would have gone. I got rid of the WB after that.
Now imagine that amount of ice on a rest that needs to flip out of the way.
Apauls X 2
Moral of the story...if you're out in any kind of bad weather, keep checking and cleaning your equipment.
..and that's one reason my buddy sticks with his flipper-style rest.
APauls x 3. Can't imagine a fallaway rest that has frozen.
Since the fallaway is normally down, when you draw you would know very quickly if it is frozen down. If it breaks free, then you are probably good to go. Can't tell that with a WB.
On the other hand, if you have a fallaway that you can keep up and do so, then you are screwed!
I had a trophy taker pronghorn freeze up on me during an Iowa deer hunt and it really spooked me but a buddy convinced me to try a QAD, so i switched and i have had no issues but i am still concerned about the potential in a rest that has so many moving parts and when on hunts in the middle of nowhere i think i may be better off with a spare biscut in the pack with little tuning needed. I have been kicking around a wb for year but haven't been able to get past the potential for issues if one makes a mistake in his form so I'm still wrestling with it...any feedback on this welcome. I did take a wb and put it in my -40 commercial deep freeze for a week and when i pulled it out the whiskers were perfectly capable of being shot thru and not froze together. i suppose i need to submerge it in water and place it in the freezer next.
Recently read an article on the WB verses drop away rests and they had 4 very good shooters each shoot groups from 20,40 and 60 yards. 3 out of the 4 shooters shot the biscuit more accurately at every distance. These guys were all hunters and industry guys. Shoot what ya have the most confidence in. Shawn
I'm pretty well versed on keeping my biscuit from icing up.My arrow,vanes and cams a little less......
I would shoot a biscuit if it was twice the price of a fall away....glad they don't know what they are really worth to me.
Never had a wb ice up on me and for noise you can run a cotton ball thru it and that will quite it right up. The cotton that sticks the the brushes will quite it.
Great tip, Teeton.
No Steve, you guys can't be killing all those great whitetails, grizzlies, etc, with a monkey/kid's rest! :-)
I shot a WB for ten years and never had a problem. Great rest for hunting and I have never experienced trouble with it freezing and I have been in cold, rain and snow with it. That being said last year I changed to a QAD on my Hoyt and am very happy with the switch. I have tried 4-5 other drop away's and always went back to the WB. Only time will tell how the QAD works out.
I shoot a Trap Door drop away. It "cocks" up and falls on the inertia of the bow being fired.
I have shot this for about 10 years with zero problems.
When I started shooting it, my groups got a whole lot tighter.
I have a friend that has shot one for about 16 years with zero problems.
I have never shot a WB, but it seems like the shooter had better have GREAT form. Since the arrow will be in contact with the bow longer; any torque or bow arm inconsistancy will be exaggerated.
This year, I went to the "dark side" ( ha ha) and bought a compound at 65 years of age. Because there was a left handed one, I got 300.00 off, on a new 2014 Hoyt Carbon Spyder 34 incher........
They also sold me a WB, but said if I do not like it, they would put on a QAD, that they suggested.....
Once I had it tuned, I was satisfied with it. I am not into the speed deal, but I can tell, you I do a lot of spot and stalk, and like the arrow containment....
It shoots very well, I am shooting FMJ arrows, with a 125 grain Ram Cat, and have good flight and practice out to 70 yards, so I can make the 30 yard shot,,,,,,
The bow is set at 58 pounds, that was the sweet spot for me.........
I used a WB for over 10 years on several different bows. Never any problems other then I was never satisfied with my long range groups ( over 45 yards). I don't care for any drop away design that connects to the bows cables because of timing issues. I started using a vaportrail limbdriver on two of my target bows.I have been much more satisfied with group size as well as simplicity of setup.
Try to find a Tiger Tuff fall away rest. Sure it's an old design but there are less moving parts and it's easier to set up. I've been using this rest since Chuck put it on the market about 20+ years ago.
I thought the WB was for beginners....until I used one. I took off my Smack Down Pro and I'm really impressed with the WB. Some people worry about what others see on their bow and want to show off their fancy, high priced, gadgets rather than shoot something that flat out works.
I used a biscuit for years. Never had a problem. Threads on bowsite convinced a drop away would be an improvement....no contact and all that....
Put a qad on and nothing much changed. If anything I shot the biscuit a little better. Think I'm gonna put it back on. The way I see it, no advantage was gained with the addition of moving parts, so I'm getting rid of it.
Whisker biscuit is 99% idiot proof. Contact is not the limiting accuracy factor of any archer. Bar none.
Silicone spray is a buscuits best friend. Esp in cold wet weather. I have both on different bows and if I'm way back in and had to choose the buscuit will get the nod. But I'm comfortable and confident with both.
