surfactant questions?
Whitetail Deer
I have a 40 gallon Fimco sprayer for my UTV. I did some spraying 2 weeks ago, and found there were some plants that seemed to be unaff3ected by the 2% solution. I also sprayed some mature buckthorn that seems to not be wilting at all. So, my question is what can I use to increase the effectiveness of my glysophate? I have heard ammonium sulfate, can I use that and will it harm my sprayer? Thanks in advance...Mike
PM nutritionist, I'm sure he has the answer. BTW, I always use liquid dish soap in my gly mix. Seems to work well.
Same here Dawn Dish soap. After mixing my glysophate with water. I add 1/2oz dish soap per gallon of mix. It makes suds, that why I add it last. I then drive to the local and that mixes the soap up.
The soap helps the pants take up more of the mix. I would not be surprised if the soap doubles the pant up take.
If been working for me for years.
Ed
It's likely that you are trying to kill plants that glyphosate isn't very effective on like sedges. Brush like buckthorn uses a different concentration. Most brands come with a surfactant and additional won't really improve performance. It works by allowing the liquid to cover the plant better and stick to it.
Put your dish soap (or AMS) in before you add the glyphosate..... It makes a difference
Mike
Most store bought glysophate(round up) contains surfactant. Problem is it often doesn't say how much. AMS just conditions your water and shouldn't harm your pump. AMS ties up water molecules that would otherwise tie up your roundup. You can just add more roundup but ams is cheaper. Regardless it's important to have a spray program and not just spray once a year. Letting weeds mature makes them harder to kill. Kill them early and often. You can even add 6-8 oz per acre of 24d for an extra kick.
The car washes that contain wax work great. anti freeze is great, and oils, the work the best, you can buy dorment oil. vok, an even tractor supply has permithren that is oil based and makes a great sticker. In a pinch I use laundry soap and vinegar and cheap cola, sugar .
X-2 Pat.
If you can get Round-Up Pro it's in there. Try your local farm supply or a sod farm.
I have been very happy with the results of using AMS. Make sure you use sprayable not soluable. Again that is sprayable or sprayer grade. I used the latter the first time and at least now I have a great understanding of how every inch of my boomless sprayer works.
I used that for my blue berries , and grapes.
Definitely get yourself a 50-lb bag of the Spray Grade Ammonium Sulfate. It will dramatically increase the efficacy of your glypho mix.
ok, oil is a sticker, not a surfactant, otherwise good info here
"Put your dish soap (or AMS) in before you add the glyphosate..... It makes a difference"
Ok what Mike said above is not the way I do it.
Can Mike or anyone tell me why you have to mix the soap or ams before putting in the glyphosate? I never done it that way or know about doing it that way. I always mixed the R-Up and water and then added the soap because of the suds that would be come out of the opening if I add it first.
ED
A surfactant ties up water molecules that tie up roundup. If you add roundup first the water molecules tie it up then your surfactant is rendered useless. Surfactant is a water treatment. Treat your water then add gly. The bag of ams above is realitively cheap and treats several hundred gallons, there's a reason the professionals use it and not Dawn.
For tag alders and buckthorn, it was recommended to me to use Garlon4 with diesel in a 5 (diesel) - 1 (Garlon4) mix. I did that this year and it worked great.
With Gly, I use liquid AMS. It is only like 2 ounces per 4 gallons of water/Gly.
Liquid or dry ammonium sulfate or My 4-15-12 seed starter or 9-4-9 plant foods. Why does this work so well?
the liquid humics change the pH of the water slightly. It also acts as "sticker/spreader, it also acts a bit like surfactant and also has "tank cleaner benefits"
Besides that, the humics in the blends, loosen the soil and a little known fact, that humics help make the dry fertilizers you put down become more "time release."
Where can I get spray able Ammonium Sulfate? They don't carry it at tractor supply and the hardware store looked at me like I had 3 heads!
Pretty much any feed store should have it.
Rural King has it if there is one by you. 55# bags or they have it online but the shipping will kill you.
AMS is basically a water conditioner, to keep the minerals in your water from reacting with the roundup and will greatly increase the efficacy of the glyphosate. I use AMS in every tank of glyphosate. Add the AMS BEFORE you add the RoundUp!
Non-ionic surfactants are to break the surface tension of the water so that your droplets will have more contact with the leaves. For those of you using dish soap, look into buying a gallon of non-ionic surfactant like R-11 or Spreader 90. It is better than dish soap, has a higher amount of active ingredient and is not foamy like dish soap, and it is not any more expensive... I use non-ionic surfactant in almost every tank of anything I spray. there are a few exceptions, such as when I am trying to get a product into the soil or if the label says not to in certain circumstances...
There are other adjuvants available, such as crop oils, MSO, etc. Check the label for your herbicide before using these, as they will sometimes end up causing damage to plants you are trying to save. There are other waer conditioners out there too, but knowing which one to choose depends on the water that you are using and the chemical you are using.
I usually fill my sprayer with soft water from my house, but still use liquid AMS in my tank mixes, unless, as glacier stated, they say not to. Do you think this is overkill?
Also, they make anti-foaming products you can put in the take to knock the foam down. It works well.
