Contributors to this thread:
Have you had any experience with this outfitter?? Thanks for your infput!!
My dad and I made our 4th trip to Quebec last year. First with Safari Nordik. We had a great trip. When we got there we were told the caribou were not going strong and that we would be moved as soon as possible. WE got into a camp being used as a staging camp until hunters could be moved. When we arrived hunters were going out to another camp. The following day more hunters were leaving camp. After one full day of hunting we were told to pack in the morning as we would be moving as well. The next morning we were overrun with animals and never had to move. Many hunters complained about having to be moved but Safari was really trying to get everyone onto animals. There was plenty of food although it wasn't 5star. The guides we had did pressure you to shoot quickly but all you had to do was say no and that was that. Overall I would go back in a second. It sure beat going with someone who did not have the ability to move you or were not willing. I have been in those type camps before as well.
good luck
I went with them in 2003 and had a blast.
Slightly off topic.....I seen their booth at Harrisburg this year and they were offering gauranteed hunts. I thought I heard outfitters were no longer allowed to advertise gauranteed hunts in Quebec.
John
it is on their website too.
In 2003, Safari Nordik proudly introduced the first fully guaranteed opportunity hunt in the Caribou Outfitting Industry. As shown on the success ratio table, the Safari Nordik logistics’ team had no changes to make in their methods in order to guarantee the opportunity to harvest at least 1 Adult Bull Caribou since our ratio table is the genuine portrait of each of our hunting seasons.
All these years of success were achieved without resulting to unacceptable tactics such as hunting from planes or helicopters and have always respected the Fair Chase principle. Every Caribou was harvested sportingly in one of our Safari Camps while respecting the ethics by which Safari Nordik and hunters live by. Safari Nordik doesn’t sell you a camp; it sells you a caribou hunt. We assign camps to hunters according to how the migration is happening on the day you arrive in Kuujjuaq. Our many hunting sites spread over 250 miles from east to west and 125 miles from South to North cover approximately 15 000 square miles. In using this method, we have had to move less than 3% of our hunters
Why does Safari Nordik guarantee their hunts? Because WE can back up our harvest statistics!
As most hunters know, Caribou Outfitters in Quebec, like most Outfitters, run very good operations of which they can be proud. On the other hand, there are a few that pretend they’ve had a success ratio of 95% or more over many years, even though this is COMPLETELY FALSE! Instead of pointing fingers at who may or may not be lying, we decided to back our advertised success rate with the best written guarantee on the market! Again, what did we change in the Safari Nordik Package in order to be able to guarantee our hunts? The answer is simple: NOTHING! It is still the same good hunt with the same method of fair chase.
All this in the best Caribou hunting grounds in North America and with an incredible group of dedicated guides and staff whom have been with us for an average of 15 years! With Safari Nordik, whatever camp you are in, you should be able to harvest 2 mature Bull Caribou sportingly, making that trip of a lifetime a hunt to remember!
If you do a search on guaranteed hunts they are all over out there. either a bunch of renegades who are breaking the law or there is no law. gotta be one of the two
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=guaranteed+caribou+hunting&btnG=Search
They did have a guarantee when we went but you must put it in perspective. They will only offer a guarantee for bow hunters in August. After that they will only offer the guarantee to rifle hunters. The guarantee does not state you will kill a mature bull. The guarantee is that they will get you within 150 yards of a mature bull. I will say what they consider a mature bull and what I consider a mature bull are two entirely different things. If you are put within 150 yards and turn down the shot (we're talking rifle) your guarantee has been fulfilled. Again, we had what I would consider a good trip but ask questions and know what you can accept and what you can't. If you want only a small number of hunters in camp you may not get that here but they will get you into animals.
Good luck
Good operation, would go back in a heartbeat.
I also hunted with Safari Nordik last year. Super Hunt and a great time. The guides were awsome and no pressure to take a small bulls that was in range or close to the lake. We ended up with 16 hunters taking 32 bulls. We ended up hunting the last of September and about 40% of the Caribou killed still had velvet, I thought they would all be stripped clean by then. I would book again with them in a heart beat. We were treated great, the food and people were top shelf. When I was looking for guides I also liked Mirage outfitters, but booked with Safari Nordik because of two friends that hunted with them two years before us and also had a great experience. Good luck with your decision and take plenty of photos.
I will say that I narrowed my final 3 down to Jack Hume, Safari Nordik, and Tuttulik. I went to the Eastern Sports and Outdoors Show to talk to the outfitters/reps themselves. I had communicated extensively via email and phone with all 3. The only thing I can say is when I met the SN rep face to face, the story I had gotten via email changed. I wanted to do their self-guided package which when I asked about the 32 camps, I was told there was only 1 self-guided camp but I would be moved towards the end if it wasn't in caribou. Anyhow there were other things that didn't jive so I didn't book with them.
I think one thing that is bothering me about quite a few of the Quebec Outfitters is that guaranteed hunts are supposedly outlawed by the outfitter assoc. yet they are still offering them. I saw one at a show in NC that was offering guarantees on B&C score and white-caped/maned bulls just 2 and a half weeks ago.
The first time I hunted with Safari Nordik, 1998, I was so impressed I became an agent. I have been up with them a total of 5 times, this year will be my 6th. You can be rest assured that SF will put you on to caribou. Beware of any outfitter whom talks size of antlers as NOONE can predict that and it would be foolish to expect they could. In regards to 'mane color', whomever led you to believe color correlates to size is exploiting your caribou knowledge.
WOW guys thanks, I know its a ways off but I have to save Ive spoke with John via email and have book a 1:1 platnum package for 2011, I like the fact they take you from any major US airport and from there they will do EVERYTHING, also Iam going the first of Aug, John spent 2 weeks emailing me back and forth and I saw his business on Keith Warren outdorrs, I now we all like and dislike people but I like how Keith honors our troops and I was impressed with SN and their hunts. Ive never killed a bou and will not even put tape to the antlers, any bou will be a trophy but Iam not rich and have to plan a bit for this hunt. Ive watched BOU BOUNDS posts for years and say it means something that he says they are good!! Thanks so much!!
This has been a great thread. We are looking for an outfitter for 2010 and have it narrowed down to about 3. We are trying to find a place that will put us on some caribou and be able to accomidate our group of 10-14 hunters. This is just the info we are looking for.
Tradbow -
Not me I have never hunted with them. I'm sure you'll have a great trip though.
5 of us hunted with safari Nordic about 14 years ago and had a great hunt and we bagged 10 bulls. We had to hunt real hard and walk 10 to 15 miles a day. we didn't see alot of bulls but we bagged some real big ones.
IMHO the three best outfitters for this are Jack Hume, Safari Nordik and Tutullik. I doubt that you could go wrong with any of them.
None of them can guarentee you a caribou, but that's not whay you are going. But I do believe that all three of them will work their hearts out to get you to the point where it's all up to you.
Let's face it, it is in their financial interest to have a hppy clientel. You come home happy when you have a caribou.
LBB
I believe what is illegal is to guarantee the hunter will kill an animal. What many outfitters guarantee is the opportunity. Is it legal spin? I believe they might be crossing the line if they guarantee an animal. I did some Googling and found the below site. I think the language translation is a little off. I read this as targeting "guaranteed kills". Maybe someone that knows the Quebec law can chime in and clear things up???
Also while Googling, I found where it is illegal in Alaska to offer guaranteed kills.
http://www.macadventures.com/PDFs/hunting/HuntQuebec.pdf
"It is illegal, in Northern Quebec, to send hunters in an area and just make them shoot on animals. On the other hand it is perfectly legal to send the hunters in an area that you control.
From Safari Nordik's site:
http://www.safarinordik.com/en/guarantee.htm
Caribou Guaranteed Hunt
In 2003, Safari Nordik proudly introduced the first fully guaranteed opportunity hunt in the Caribou Outfitting Industry. As shown on the success ratio table, the Safari Nordik logistics’ team had no changes to make in their methods in order to guarantee the opportunity to harvest at least 1 Adult Bull Caribou since our ratio table is the genuine portrait of each of our hunting seasons.
All these years of success were achieved without resulting to unacceptable tactics such as hunting from planes or helicopters and have always respected the Fair Chase principle. Every Caribou was harvested sportingly in one of our Safari Camps while respecting the ethics by which Safari Nordik and hunters live by. Safari Nordik doesn’t sell you a camp; it sells you a caribou hunt. We assign camps to hunters according to how the migration is happening on the day you arrive in Kuujjuaq. Our many hunting sites spread over 250 miles from east to west and 125 miles from South to North cover approximately 15 000 square miles. In using this method, we have had to move less than 3% of our hunters
Why does Safari Nordik guarantee their hunts?
Because WE can back up our harvest statistics!
As most hunters know, Caribou Outfitters in Quebec, like most Outfitters, run very good operations of which they can be proud. On the other hand, there are a few that pretend they’ve had a success ratio of 95% or more over many years, even though this is COMPLETELY FALSE! Instead of pointing fingers at who may or may not be lying, we decided to back our advertised success rate with the best written guarantee on the market! Again, what did we change in the Safari Nordik Package in order to be able to guarantee our hunts? The answer is simple: NOTHING! It is still the same good hunt with the same method of fair chase. All this in the best Caribou hunting grounds in North America and with an incredible group of dedicated guides and staff whom have been with us for an average of 15 years! With Safari Nordik, whatever camp you are in, you should be able to harvest 2 mature Bull Caribou sportingly, making that trip of a lifetime a hunt to remember!
On Safari Nordiks website, their guarantee in the first paragraph is for "opportunity" The title above the second paragraph ask's, "Why does Safari Nordik Guarantee Their Hunts?" The last sentence says you should be able to harvest 2 mature Bull Caribou sportingly,......
Collectly, does that lead the reader believe this a guaranteed kill? For me, probably not. For the unfamiliar, maybe.
I am pretty sure the Harrisburg booth advertised that you'll get a guaranteed trophy. I don't recall the word "opportunity" being in there anywhere.
Just an observation..........John
literally of course they can't guarantee an animal. what they guarantee you is the right to return at a discount/free if you don't have the opportunity as they define it.
been with them three times. Go again if the chance comes.
thanks guys sounds like they work hard for you and that is important.
Tradbow-If you are really looking for a one of a kind hunt for a "Bou", let me know. I think I can set you up with an hunt and an experience you will never forget. Not only will you have a great time but you can count on some great humor!! If interested let me know and I will see if Bou'bound will be available:)
I would suggest not only talking with the actual outfitter before booking a trip but also take the time to visit some of the sites on the web that provide outfitter reviews. There is a good one on this site and another good one supplied by the hunting report. Many of the outfitters are listed under the following site which is also well worth viewing. http://www.huntinfo.com/reviews/outfitter_reviews.php3It is equally important to know what you want. Although an outfitter may offer a gauranteed hunt take a look at what he really offers and choose one who suits your needs. Some outfitters provide a quality service without overcrowding camps while others don't care so much about the service provided and would rather base their reputation off their kill rate at the expense of offering a quality service. At JHA we try and combine both. We only book 25% of our camps and when ever possible we only put 6 hunters into each camp. I can tell you that very few clients who choose to hunt with us would be rewarded a free hunt according to Safari Nordik's hunt gaurantee. It is worth what it's worth! 99% of our clients see caribou while hunting with us. I think it just makes sence that if any of our clients don't see any bulls worth harvesting while hunting with us that I find a way to make amends with them without having a contract full of small print. That doesn't mean that I didn't do my job of locating that hunter in the best possible camp availabale but it does mean that I am willing to do what I can to offer that unfortunate hunter a more affordable 2nd chance should he not see any caribou. I don't believe it is my place to start telling our hunters which caribou to shoot and I don't even want to put that kind of pressure on our hunters. That just isn't what hunting is supposed to be about. In order to maintain the highest repeat business in the industry it has always been very important that our clients not only have an oportunity at harvesting a caribou but more importantly that we have a reputation of always being up front, honest and fair with them and that they have a great time while hunting with us and that they would want to return with us. Take a look at many of the reviews...Call many refferences...Check out the outfitter's reputation and find out if the actual outfitter will be on location should any problems arrive? I won't claim to be the oldest outfitter in the business as i am one of the youngest without a doubt but I have been around far longer than most outfitters and I have been around long enough to see many of my competitors come and go over the years. I am the only outfitter who actually grew up in this business and who represents a 2nd generation of outfitting. I have over 25 years experience, I am an experienced bush pilot with 20 years experience flying, an avid hunter and an archer,furthermore I am the only outfitter invited to P&Y's convention and I boast the highest repeat business in the industry. Nobody in Quebec has a higher ratio of spare camps to camps booked and nobody covers more territory while offering access to both the Leaf River and Goerge River herds. Outfitting is truly my passion and I feel that the above qualities are worth far more than any gaurantee that is available on the market today. I don't often take the time to comment on these forums but I am a sponsor on this bowsite and I am tired of sitting back while playing 2nd fiddle to others. I felt like it was time I had my say. I don't play 2nd fiddle to anyone in Quebec and certainly don't plan on doing so any time soon. I believe we have what it takes to offer our hunters the best caribou hunt available in Quebec "bar none".
Richard Hume
Richard,
PM sent.....John
Richard
You should post more as your integrity and knowledge is well regarded.
What is your understanding of the perception that guaranteed hunts and the advertising of success rates is not longer legal. we still see it and i for one can't understand how it could be manadated that a business not be allowed to share success history or not be allowed to offer a business feature if they chose to do so.
are these things allowed or not.
The Federation for Quebec Outfitters and Tourism Quebec had announced at our annual convention that they would no longer tolerate anyone offering a "gauranteed kill" or "gauranteed hunt" as per say. You can advertise your success rate as long as you use the actual success rate and not one that is exagerated as so many outfitters had done in the past. The Quebec Government says they will now verify the success rates published by outfitters and in order to remain a member of "Quebec Caribou Country" and bear its logo you must obey these rules. Furthermore Tourism Quebec announced that they would no longer fund those outfitters who offered a gauranteed hunt. It would seem that the Federation has decided that offering a gauranteed oportunity would be tolerated so in response to your question: It is my opinion that they (the Federation) doesn't know themselves what to allow and what not to allow. It is like chasing a bouncing football! I think the bigger issue at stake is that if for some reason an outfitter had a terrible season with over 50% of their clients unable to have an oportunity to harvest a caribou not all outfitters would be in a position to honor their gaurantee and it was also my understanding that this was the reasoning for the Federation wanting to ban the gauranteed hunt. It looks like they may have changed their mind....You can only imagine the image it would portray on Quebec if one or more outfitters offering gauranteed hunts were not able to honor their so called gaurantee. I think the general idea was to clean up our image. Well, that was my initial take on it!
Richard Hume
Well I can tell you there are still the offers of guaranteed kill and guaranteed opportunity. To me a guaranteed opportunity at a caribou is to be in in northern Quebec from mid August to mid September. You all offer a guaranteed opportunity! It is a guaranteed opportunity because a caribou may come by you. It's a better opportunity than you'd see in North Carolina! Like I said earlier I was at a show in NC where a caribou outfitter in northern Quebec was guaranteeing B&C scores and white manes.
Simply put, I believe that the reasoning behind Safari Nordik's guarantee in regard to opportunity stems from the fact that over their many years in the industry they realized that they would RARELY need to reward a free hunt as they DO put their hunters onto caribou anyway. As a matter of fact, I've been told, that after the first two years of this written guarantee, only THREE hunters received a free hunt! In regards to the hundreds they outfit annually, thats an impeccable record for putting hunters onto caribou. The reason for those three hunters misfortune was weather making for unsafe flying conditions, and that is beyond any outfitters control.
Thanks Richard -
That makes sense. There is a big difference between not being allowed to promote your success rates and having to be honest with your claims of success rates. I get the later. Never did believe the former was a rule.
Tradbow,
What Richard said is the gospel truth! I am a perfect example of how a customer is treated by JHA when things just don't work out to expectation. Our group hunted with JHA in 2004, and was unsuccessful under some unique conditions. Richard made good on his promise as he said above "to make amends" to ensure what the customer should expect is what the customer receives in service. When we returned the following year, Richard went above and beyond what we felt would have been a reasonable offer to us as the customer. Guarantees are only as good as the person giving them. When you do business with JHA you don't need a guarantee. Richard & Amanda are trustworthy enough that they will stand behind the service they are selling to you.
Here is the link to my review of that trip. It isn't sugar coated, and you will see it is the lowest number of stars (3) of any JHA has on this site. That should tell you something when that trip wasn't rated high, yet I've returned twice since that year and had excellent trips.
I don't see anything wrong with stating a gauranteed OPPORTUNITY and the outfitter willing to doing what the can to back that up or make amends if no opportunity. That is the business risk they take for advertising such. If you don't want the risk, don't make that statement.
I think they are entering grey area in marketing and sportsmanship when they gaurantee a KILL on free range animals. I feel that opens up too many pandora's boxes.
John
I know this is a Safari Nordik thread, but I have hunted the past few years with Ungava Adventures and have found them outstanding. Same deal as Safari Nordik (in and out of Kujjuuaq). The camps are first rate, and the guides really know their stuff. Have never been pressured to shoot.
They will certainly move people onto the animals if the migration isnt in your area.
I knew quite of few guys in the "industry" that had used them which is why I chose them. that being said, I have spent plenty of time in the Kuujjuaq airport chatting with the Safari Nordik guys and they all have great things to say. I actually think Safari and Ungava share some territory and camps in the northern areas.
IMO cant go wrong either way.
While we're talking about SN, do any of you know what is meant in thier platinum package when they say MEAT PROCESS and SPECIAL AIRLINE PACKAGING FOR TROPHIES?????
I hunted with Safari Nordik last yest year and never had a shot opportunity. I am strictly an archer and I can tell you that I wouldn't have had an opportunity even If I would have brought a rifle. The migration was extremely slow.
I hunted in Mid-September which is not a guaranteed opportunity and they still did the right thing and offered me a free hunt this fall. The only thing I have to pay for is my license.
I am sure that all of the caribou outfitters are reputable and I will give a positive comment to Safari Nordik. They have truly tried to make things right with me.
Just my 2 cents.
Do you have to pay for your flight to Montreal as well?
Hey Banker, Being an agent for SN I can assure you that it is your responsibility to get to Montreal, Still is an incredible offer. If you have any further questions about SN do not hesitate to ask.
Never been, BUT let me offer my 2 cents:
I heard they "went public" (that is, sold stock to the public, became a publicly owned company) this past year.
My first reaction---"oh boy, here we go, anything for a buck, gotta make your earnings estimates"
My second reaction--(after Tuttulik)--"OK, that means the Canadian Govt. ("Their" SEC) is looking over thier financials, and if they crash, SOMEONE IS GOING TO JAIL."
Given what happened with Tuttulik, I can see some advantage in a publicly held outfitter.
3 moves in 1 week may sound like a lot, and again, I have NEVER hunted caribou, but as a guy who looks at financials a lot for a living, I'd give SN a 2nd look.
"My second reaction--(after Tuttulik)--"OK, that means the Canadian Govt. ("Their" SEC) is looking over thier financials, and if they crash, SOMEONE IS GOING TO JAIL."
Given what happened with Tuttulik, I can see some advantage in a publicly held outfitter. "
Just like holding stock in Enron or WorldCom?
Not to say it isn't a reputable operation, but I don't think being publicly held provides more comfort to the customer.
Publicly held almost always means more stability. Better capitalization and more interest in keeping it alive. Versus a guy who walks away with deposits and says well if I just stop now and go out of business I am ahead for a few years.
Went last year with 8 other bow hunters. We took 17 bull. We did the unguided hunt and had a great time. Would highly recommend them. Only complaint was the meat handling. Subpar for me. Next time I will donate the meat.
Just like holding stock in Enron or WorldCom?
I was thinking Tyco and HealthSouth.
Actually, though, the CEO at Enron had to die to avoid jail time.
My understanding of the "garantee" Nicholas and company at Safari are offering does not lay any claim to the hunter killing an animal - the garantee extends to providing the hunter with the opportunity to take one at prescribed distances and in a certain time-frame based upon the weapon the hunter choses to hunt with. Another thing Safari does is base the success on each individual hunter, not on the total number of animals taken in relation to the number of hunters. Many of the outfitters' claims of 95% success rates are calculated by the number of hunters in camp - 10 hunters equals 20 tags. 10 tags might be filled by 5 hunters and 5 others get nothing, it is still calculated as 100% success, which is very misleading. A great deal of effort, energy, and money is invested by Safari to ensure each hunter gets the chance they paid for. Say what you want, when the chips are down and the choice is go home with an animal or go home eatin' tag stew, I would happily share a crammed cabin for a couple days to make sure my hunt was a success - it would appear that there are at least 1200 people that share that sentiment - that is the approximate number of customers Safari catered to this year.
I've heard Safari Nordik has had to cancel their remaining hunts due to a major lack of caribou at most of their camps. Is this truth or just a rumor? I know my furthest camps north such as Coursolles (which is just bellow the 57th, have now been closed for 2 weeks because we had little or no caribou up there as they all went south. Just wondering how Safari Nordik is doing up there this year. Haven't seen any pictures or comments from the 2008 season and you would think there would be plenty with having 1200 clients up there. Anyone got the scoop on what our friends to the north of the 57th are up to?
Richard Hume
The camps with guys I know appear to be doing well the last week or so - good numbers and size.
How's it going Brent? I had heard that Safari Nordik was canceling hunts or closing down camps but that may be just another rumor going around Schefferville? Which camps seem to be doing the best up that way? I was hoping you'd be back to visit us again. I really enjoyed your last visit. Doug tries to play the guitar and some times even sings us a toon but it just isn't quite the same! You've got some talent going on there! I was expecting to see you on Canadian Idol. I think you would have cleaned up.
Richard
things seems to be changing for the better for safari nordic.the news as of the last couple days is that caribou is starting to show in the camps on south side of the leif river.whereas last wk.the most productive camps were the four they had on the north side.
Had a friend just return on the 10th from hunting with Safari Nordik, he said it was SLOOOOOOW. He saw 18 Caribou the whole trip. He said on the last day he borrowed a rifle and shot 2 bulls. Felt really lucky that he even saw some the last day. His funnest time was shooting Ptarmigan.
Just returned and the hunting was slow. I hunted with Ungava. 16 out of 18 were shot and all with rifles. Only saw 3 extremely nice bulls. Great camp, great cook, and great guides. I almost booked with JHA but went with Ungava instead. Can't say for sure exactly why as both are great outfitters. Maybee next time it will be JHA. Who knows? It will take me a while to round up that kind of money again but well worth it!
They did close some of their camps due to lack of caribou. A mutual friend was up guiding they called him at the last minute he go vacation left home and guided for 1 week then they sent him home. I would have been a little upset.
Just returned from Mirage, had a great time, lots of caribou everybody in camp tagged out. Meet some people in Montreal that hunted with Safari Nordik and they were not happy, not alot of caribou. A couple of guys said they did not even see a caribou.
i just returned from a caribou hunt with safari nordik, it was suppose to be an archery hunt, we never saw a bull within 150 yards, and the bulls we did see were few and far between. my son and i booked our at the dallas safari club show. john mannes was the rep that we dealt with. we gave him an open date for our hunt since we shoot recurves and need to be there during the migration. he picked our dates and we signed up.there was not anything like the number of animals that safari nordik represented. the thing that should have tiped us off to the shady operation that safari nordik runs was after we paid our deposit.we bought a platinum package which is all inclusive. our dposit was paid with a credit card. they put half of the payment on a canadian bank and charged us for a money exchange rate. we never got a refund for this. next we had to argue with their sales director, named armando , over our pre paid room at the hilton in montreal on our return from the hunt. it is included in the platinum package. on our initial meeting in montreal armando tried to charge us a meat processing fee of $100 each. again this was included in our package. if anyone is going to canada to bowhunt caribou, it is not like the tv show or the way safari nordik represents the hunt. we will never book a hunt with safari nordik or any of their sister companies.
US hunters we need to put a stop to this bull these quebec outfitters are getting away with , the only way is to protest them at our hunting shows ,also inform as many other hunters about the facts ....
A cousin of mine also just returned from a hunt with Safari Nordik. They also had a very poor hunt. 14 guys in camp and I think they killed 10 cows and a few small bulls, maybe one or two decent bulls, almost all with rifles. I did not get alot of details or then what I have said. I was told they would NEVER do it again.
guys....some of you are missing the point with caribou hunting and their migrations. both in the us and in Canada. caribou migrations are not predictable. they choose one route one year and change it the next. where I hunted caribou in 93 today its' rare to see a caribou.
yeah..right....all canadian outfitters and guides are trying to rip everyone off. especially the caribou guides and outfitters who have complete control over where the caribou are and aren't.
Sorry, but I missed the part where I said they were RIPPED OFF. Looks like you read a little to much into my post. They said the hunt was not what they expected and they did not want to spend their hard earn dollars to do it again. I think if I was put in a camp with 14 hunters, with an outfit that guarantess their success rates I would be a little annoyed when you don't see the bulls. Oh yeah the guides told them Bulls are scarce right now, shoot the first one you see, reguardless of size. I wonder if that has anything to do with their guarantee? Still not sure how that means they are against all Canadian outfitters and guides?
we are not missing the point at all. when you pay $6900.00 for a hunt you expect the representative to live up to all the promises that he tells you. in our case we let our rep, john mannes, with safari nordik pick the dates that would be the most favorable for recurve hunting. if the anamals are not there why not contact us and say maybe we should reschedule our hunt. keith warren was suppose to be in our camp for a tv shoot, but he did not show. maybe the same courtesy should be shown to the paying customers.
people need to study the animals they are hunting and understand what they are dealing with from a nature perspective as opposed to thinking booking agents, contracts, prior history, and outfitters can affect the natural tendacies and cycles of animals. these animals have eons of evolution driving them and unlike old faithful and the return of the swallows to san juan capistrano it is not predictable naturally.
if you can't deal with it hunt resident animals like deer, bear, elk, and antelope where at least you know they are somewhere in the neighborhood.
if a booking agent promised you the whitetails rut like mad on his farm in iowa in september would you pack your rattling antlers and head out there or would you apply your knowledge of whitetails and say it does not sound right. If an elk outfitter told you to come in january and he would guarantee they would be bugling like a national geographic documentary would you book then?
if a caribou outfitter guaranteed that you would see bulls in bow range in a given camp in a given week you would believe him in the aqbolute ...............WHY??? Only because you don't know enough about caribou i suppose.
wake up people caribou are UNPREDICTABLE! deal with it or stay south of the border.
I can't believe I'm going to agree with Bou'bound on a public forum (hope nobody I know reads this). He said in an earlier post to plan on not seeing any animals and then if you do it just gets better. That's a good point. My first hunt we never saw a caribou. I was hunting with dad. Every morning it was raining. We ate breakfast and headed out hunting. We went to a different area every day and saw as much country as we could while everyone else stayed in camp and cried and complained. To this day that was one of the best trips I have had with dad and we have been back 3 additional times and saw 50,000-70,000 animals last year and killed a near B&C bull.
Trips are as good as YOU want them to be.
Good luck
given the fact darrell is agreeing with me i retract my comments on the basis they must be wrong then. LOL
1st off "City Hunter", I don't particularly agree with your comment about protesting Quebec outfitters at the shows. I would reccomend that you stand in front of my booth and try that! I think we are talking about a small percentage of Quebec outfitters and you need to give that whole issue a break. Just my two cents worth and I might be stick'en my neck where it doesn't need to be but I do agree that there are too many hunters that arrive thinking that they got ripped off if they don't see trophy bulls at less than 100 yards or if they don't see lots of caribou. You have to keep things in perspective, you are given the choice which weapon to use and much like myself most of you on this site choose to hunt with a bow then "so be it" but it most certainly isn't the outfitters fault if you don't have a bull come within 30 yards of you. It isn't even the outfitters fault if you don't have a bull come within 150 yards of you or if you don't see a bull at all! I have 27 camps and only operate 5, to the best of my knowledge I have more camps per hunter than any of my competitors and cover as much area or more than any one else in the north and I only use my best 5 camps each week but even by doing so there are times that I can't manage to put all my hunters into a productive camp even with my best of intentions. Thes animals migrate!I believe that is why this "SPORT" is called hunting and not killing and if you can't afford to take the risk of being involved in such a sport then you shouldn't book the hunt in the first place. On the other hand if an outfitter charges you for services that he does not supply or if he goes to the point of offering a gauranteed caribou hunt and charges you more money than a "regular caribou hunt" because of this gaurantee then by all means he should live up to his gaurantee. I most certainly agree that some outfitters an'd/or booking agents make it sound like everyone is going to see hundreds if not thousands of caribou and that is not only misleading but I believe it is misrepresentation as it just isn't going to be the case for everyone. After over 25 years in this business that much I am able to gaurantee! Although I had one of the best seasons that I can remember with everyone seeing caribou up until this week, I just pulled the plug on my late season "trophy hunt" and I am offering those hunters the choice of a full refund or the option to reschedule their hunt to 2009/2010. In all fairness to these hunters I sold this hunt for more money than my regular hunts because I only book 2 camps and the odds are very high that these hunters would actually see many bulls to choose from. Anyhow the odds didn't play in our favor and I don't actually have 2 camps at the moment with plenty of caribou to choose from. Because of the way this hunt was sold, "even though all my hunters know that we didn't offer any gaurantees" I didn't feel it would be fair to take their money for the kind of hunt they were paying for. They were sold a hunt where I, myself lead them to believe that they would have trophy caribou to choose from and quite frankly at the time that I sold the hunt I honestly thought that would be the case but unfortunately that isn't the case at the moment. Anyhow long story short don't put us all in the same basket. We aren't all bad apples. And I think this also proves that some "Quebec Outfitters" do still have your money in their bank account should your hunt not take place! One more reason why we most certainly aren't all bad apples. My opinion can be taken for what ever it is worth. But it is my opinion.
Richard Hume
Amen.
so richard's point once again proves two things.
1) he is the best and has integrity
2) being the best does not mean you will see even as much as a patch of caribou hide in your camp your week.
if a guy with 25 camps does not feel he can put guys on caribou in any 2 of them on a given week then that says a lot more about the animals than the outfitter.
Just the communication factor alone, puts JHA above the rest..........IMHO!
I would not protest ALL quebec outfitters.........just the one that stole from you!
The fact that he is honest with his clients, keeps them informed and let's them decide...............and the fact that he is the owner/operator is a huge "plus".
From what I have seen, he is one the the few outfitters in QUebec that does NOT make promises he cannot keep, tell you what he thinks you want to hear and "blow smoke up your butt"! ;-)
Kudos to Mr. Hume!
I can only speak for myself, but I was not saying that all outfitters from Quebec are bad. Just that some seem to advertise what they cannot produce or control. If you sell a guaranteed hunt, to the tune of seeing thousands of Caribou, you should be prepared to hear complaints from your clients. It seems that every outfitter and experienced hunter knows that does not happen all the time. Uninformed or inexperienced hunters, could feel that they trusted what the outfitter was telling them to be true. When it does not turn out to be what they were expecting or told to expect. They should be able to express some regret or disgust with the way the hunt transired. The people I know who went are not complainers and were not expecting a CAN hunt of sorts. They are hunters and wanted a hunt. What they got was a very over crowded camp and almost no bull caribou. Even though the outfitter guaranteed them a chance at a mature bull for each hunter. Blame also needs to be put on the hunters for not doing their research into what kind of an outfitter they have chosen and what kind of expectations are realistic.
For myself I am going on my first Bou hunt next year. I tried to book with JHA, but they were full for the dates and type of hunt(2x1 guided) that we wanted. We booked with Team-Caribou after looking at Safari Nordik and some others. I think we did our homework and will have a quality experience whether we see Bulls or not.
nobody can guarantee an animal let alone a mature bull on any hunt where the time is fixed. if they want they can "guarantee" that if something does or does not happen on that trip they will do X, Y, or Z in return.
big difference.
I went on 4 guaranteed lion hunts and got one on my 4th trip. the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th trips were at reduced prices since the prior hunt did not provide me the opportunity to harvest a mature animial.
I hope everyone reading realizes you are speaking only for yourself as you are making no sense and surely not paying attention; reread the caribou kid entry and try real hard to understand! No one from Safari Nordik told any one that they would see thousands of caribou, their policy states that you will be guaranteed a shot opportunity at a mature bull, from your entry that guarantee was fulfilled. As for the crowded camp,would you rather be in a crowded camp seeing caribou or in a 'cozy' little camp seeing nothing. Please post when you get back from your hunt next year as we ALL KNOW you will be put on thousands of caribou, for days on end, and surely will harvest 2 bulls for the record book. Good Luck!
On-the-ground, I am sorry that I am not such a Caribou hunting guru as you. I was saying what my cousin was told and unless you are a mind reader or psychic, you have no way of knowing what that was! You must have also missed the part of my post where I stated that I would have a great trip no matter what, well at least as long as I don't have to share a camp with someone as smug as you. I think that you have just driven me off of the Caribou section for good and that really stinks. People like you just make it tough for everyone else.
one thing i never understood is how a comment from a faceless stranger over the internet can "drive someone away". like our opinions really matter here or something?
this is entertainment fellas. nothing more nothing less. it's not like your mom or wife called you a loser or something. it's not like your boss said your project was crappy. some nobody (could even be me) who you will never meet or never know and has no relevance in your life makes a comment someone does not agree with and people take their IP address, modem, and go play elsewhere.
why? and who cares?
cariboukid please be for real . You will be in my USA and whats wrong with informing AMERICAN hunters the problems with quebec outfitters ,I never used your name sorry if you took it to heart , What would you do in this case , JACK
city hunter-- I think caribou kid is more "for real" than you can ever imagine.Look at his past record and posts. IMHO probably the best there is in Quebec. Have had several friends go with him and you would not believe the awesome stories they tell. Not about the caribou but about his integrity.I think he is several steps above the others up there. Do your homework!
1st time bou hunter i am new to this site and just wanted to say my brother and i had a hunt booked with safari nordik are 1st hunting trip ever for sep 13 to the 19 on the 17 i got a call telling me that there were no caribou in the area they told me we could still come on or date but if we did it would complete there obligation to there guarantee but they would try to get us a shot or we could change are date to OCT. or rebook 4 next year well we moved are date out to OCT 6 to 12 i called them today and was told the HUNTING not the killing was getting better so my brother and i hope to have some good luck and i want to say nobody with safari nordik that i talked to at the show in harrisburg or bloomsburg PA or the agent i booked with told me i would see thousands or even hundreds of caribou i dont want to upset anyone but it is called booking a HUNT not booking a KILL good luck to everyone HUNTTING whatever you go HUNTTING for and i will let you all know how we make out Ken
lake trout you and cariboukid are missing the point , Yes jack has great stats,,,, What us americans are upset about is the fiasco , that happens up north with hunting on native lands ,this is were the problem lies ,,,
I think it is a shame that hunting success by some is completely dependent on killing something.
city hunter is right and even richard hume had to do a dangerous and costly dance last year due to natives playing games with barricades, boycots, and embargos. he worked it out because he had options and integrity, but that issue was another example of inuits causing problems for hunters on the tundra.
Kurtnozke, Thanks for the compliment but I don't consider myself a 'Caribou Guru', I have only been on the tundra 6 times. The real Guru is Caribou-Kid, you are well advised to read all he contributes and absorb it. Yes,It is a very good idea for you to 'look and listen' for awhile, learn as much as you can and quit your snivvling. Then when you get back from your hunt you can contribute what you have personally experienced,instead of bashing an outfitter on the basis of hear-say and second hand dribble as you have been doing of late. Kmreddog once again attests to the integrity of Safari Nordik. If you have learned one thing from this thread and or the caribou site site in general it is that no outfitter can please all of his hunters all of the time, but he must please most of his hunters most of the time or he would not be in business!
There's bad outfitters here in the good old USA too. Mike
Left on Oct. 6th with SN got back on the 13th. Very few caribou and tough hunting. Weather was ridiculously warm, 55 to 60 degrees , sunny and no wind. 9 guys in camp all tagged out, 3 bowhunters also. SN was moving guys around alot, they really do their best to get you on caribou.
I recently (this week)sent my downpayment to hunt with SN next Aug/Sep. I have never hunted Caribou and am going with my dad, brother, son and a few friends. I have hunted whitetail, muleys, elk, and numerous sheep and exotics in TX, NM, CO and MEX and this trip is a dream for me. I tuned in here to see what the big boys say about all this. I know "they" make hunting caribou look easy on tv but know that it is still hunting. Looking forward to reading your posts and learning more about "chasin' 'bou"
Big
Best of luck. I too am going next year on my first Bou hunt with Jack Hume. SN is a great organization that takes care of their customers. I researched a lot and SN was on the top of my list but I went with JH because a friend of mine went years ago with his father.
Tons of info here. Sounds like it is not as easy as it looks. Little bulls are easy.
Are you going with a Bow?
I think we will have one bow in the bunch rest are rifle. My dad is 69 and he is so pumped, worse than a kid at christmas. My son is a taxidermist/outfitter/guide in San Angelo Texas and he is lining all this up. From the sounds of it the hunting up there was pretty tough this year. From the pics it looked like the better bulls came late.
PLEASE DO NOT HUNT IN QUEBEC! NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE FOR THE 168 HUNTERS WHO WERE ROBBED OF THEIR MONEY AND THEIR DREAM IN 2008.
NJ,
Just because you they lost out on their trip does not mean the government should step in and make it all better. The Quebec governement never guaranteed anything.
There are no guarantees in a hunt. A hunt is just that, a hunt! Some guarantee that they will give you the opportunity to shoot an animal, but they won't guarantee that you'll shoot it. If you miss, your guarantee is over with.
This whole thing is a bad mess, but I have done about 10 guided hunts and I know as soon as I send that check it is gone and then I hope to get a hunt out of it.
That's what everyone does, but it doesn't always turn out bad. People are going to just start buying trip insurance so they don't loose out in case something happens. The cost is not much. people should look into doing that instead of bashing all Quebec outfitters. You can't bad mark everyone because of one.
Does any one know of a good insurance company that offers trip insurance that would cover such an event? I know that it is offered through SCI for members but I don't think it would apply to the Tutulik case. Anyone know for sure? I'm considering getting bonded but if the cost is less to simply offer an insurance to my clients then that would be another option.
Richard
Richard,
I will look into it for you. Maybe tomorrow. 11-18
If you have sent your downpayment can you still get trip insurance?
HUNTED WITH THEM IN 2005 AND GOT BOTH MY BULLS. GREAT OPERATION WHEN I WAS THERE!
