Contributors to this thread:
For guys that do a lot of hiking/training with your packs, what are loading it with? What give the most realistic feel when training?
I use a 50lb sack of corn. Walk up and down the back, sodded side, and the front, rip-rap side, of a nearby reservoir.
Camping gear with a Rock or two in the mix.
Sand in a dry bag is what I've been using. Seems to work well.
Mine has "tube" style compartments. I use magazines/books and jugs filled with water. This makes it easy to adjust the amount of weight in the pack, and I can also adjust where the heaviest portion of the load rides in the pack.
40 lb. bag of softener salt
50 lbs of cheap kitty litter.
Its best to train with a heavier load then u plan on hiking out on a hunt I usually pack something I cant unload when its gets tough hiking concrete blocks /bricks or bags of concrete. These annoying loads make it a lot easier when u strap a elk on and climb out of a hole !!!The harder u train the easier the pack out !!! The Pack out is the most enjoyable time for me , it will test your mind and body !!!
Great pic Louis!
"The Pack out is the most enjoyable time for me"
Agreed, nothing better
50 lbs of softener salt plus 20 lbs of weights. Obviously critical to do hill work, but be sure to do a lot of sidehilling to strengthen and condition the ankles. The other day I added a new twist....my daughter and I ran a half marathon, then I strapped on the pack for 35 minutes of hill work.....slept great that night !
Mark
45# firefighter type pack test vest with removable lead weights. you can easily adjust the load by taking weights out of the pockets or adding them. I use this to hike up and down a ski hill.
That trick photography vmakes it look steep...too steep. I'm going to have to park on a flat spot and kill the elk there.
I would disagree with Louis on the very heavy weight.
I used to do that for 25+ years and sure, when you train with 80#, your 50# pack feels like a feather. The problem is you only have so many miles in you with those 80# packs and even though I'm a big dude capable on toting that kind of weight, it has damaged my hips, knees, ankles and joints.
I now use a pack about 40-50# to train and feel that I still get the same benefit without the wear and tear, YMMV. I like the 40# bags of softener salt from the grocery store.
Beendare u getting old on us !!! My logic is train for the worst conditions possible I also will train on limited water and calorie intake ,,, yes many don't agree with this but it works for me !!! Ive been caught out with limited supplies while hunting im ok with this , if u train in perfect conditions food water etc . Once your body /mind hits a hard spot it might let u down !!! What works for one guy isn't going to work for another !!! Try shooting yr bow with a pack on !!!
That climb by city was made a lot easier due to the grizz on his ass!
I use two 40-lb bags of corn. Then I feed it to the critters in the backyard after session.
Rats.... I thought somebody found a way to actually train a pack.....
I carry a little female gymnast
Does she go in the pack rear end first like a rodeo clown going into a barrel.
Agree with Beendare. I once worked out before the season with 130lbs in my pack for weeks. The trip in with 70lbs was a breeze. However I paid the price after I got home.Lower back pain was, well a pain. I do have degenerative issues with my spine and anyone with similar problems would be well served to be careful about pushing it.
City, Yeah, I'm going to be 57....but I'm a firm believer my coming years would have been made more pleasant by my advice- thus I pass it along to the young guys.
Sounds like I'm pussing out, right? With all of the "Extreme athletes" out there, The Cam Hanes that jog miles with a heavy pack on- and if you don't- you aren't worthy. Its Hard NOT to be influenced by this.
What we don't see is these guys when they are older. Look at a guy I used to play basketball with- Dave Dalby, all pro center for the Raiders- he could hardly walk- in his 50's. I don't wish any ill to the Cams of the world but I can tell you for 100% certainty [as an older guy with older friends]
CONDITIONING IS GOOD.....BEATING YOURSELF UP ISN'T.
Listen to beendare guys!! You will wear out your joints etc.
I completely agree with you Beendare. Moderate weight in as realistic terrain as you can get. What challenges you now may be damaging your back. I'm saying this from experience. Work hard but be careful guys.
Beendare 57 I thought u were in yr 30s no not at all to each there own ! We are like a old car lift the hood and u will find numerous items broke yet it still runs !!! My joints are done from 33plus yrs in construction!!!and years in the Gym !!! and lymes !!!!!! all my pack outs are on foot no horses no mules and usually im alone . It takes a bit of effort to move a dead elk over 3 miles back to the rig alone !!! I did have a friend from az once 21 yrs old we killed a bull 2.8 miles GPS to the rig it took us over 8hrs to do one load pure torture every step he aint never hunting elk again in WY he said !!!! With a heavy pack I really don't fell im beating myself up if anything its usually the cardio that I need to improve !!!
Water. Or sand bag weight balls (slam balls)
Does this count? Taken in PA this morning. 5 miles with about #100. Piece of cake.
I'm certainly no expert like the guys who've opined on this thread. But, 40 to 60 pound packs on my morning walks and then nothing on my evening 3,000 foot climbs has worked for me over the past 25 years.
I might not be able to keep up with the young studs on Bowsite, but as I recall, I didn't have to try too hard to keep up with Louis on our deer hunt last summer.
"I watch a hot girl run past on the road most days. I always feel a little better after that."
"I carry a little female gymnast"
Lou, I believe you might be an old pervert, we could hunt together!!!
A man who use to log with mules said the hardest pulling mules he ever had only pulled small light trees for the first year he used them. When he finally got into some huge timber they would give it all they had...it was in their minds if they hooked to it they were suppose to pull it and they didn't believe there was anything they couldn't pull. Maybe lighter loads are less discouraging and when you pack heavy for the hunt you want think about it.
I agree Bob, seems Lou is getting a bit soft in his older age, that poor fella... Luckily those Goats on Kodiak give themselves up to NR...
Lucky those goats on Kodiak give themselves up to NR !!!!Nick u lived in AK what 6 months talking like u are MR Alaska :>
He is indeed a soft old man. Only thing he has going for him is that the goats won't think there is any danger or harm possible from either him or his hunting partner. They likely won't pay any attention to them and he'll be able to stroll right up and kill one.
80lb bag of quickcrete... Smallish and fits close to the back so less twisting and less chance of injury...
I ruck train like the Army SF. Start out with a basic load hiking and wear around until I get used to it. Then add 10 more pounds or so and continue hiking until you get used to that weight. Add more weight until you're comfortable carrying the heaviest weight possible.
The only method I have tried this year is to load up my pack with all of the stuff I will use plus more while I have been scouting for my sheep tag here in Colorado. Since my first trip out I have lost the big spotter and tripod and working my legs more to get a feel for the area. This was my 4th trip up the mountain and the lightest so far with more food than I can eat and got my Kifaru down to a little over 35 lbs without water. I added two bladders and 4 Nalgene bottles. Water was not as scares as what everyone had told me. Actually found a spring within a quarter mile of spike camp and another further down on the last trip. I will not carry all of the water next trip in. It rained for a solid four hours last night so not much glassing last night. Time on the mountain with a pack on your back is the best training you can get. Every trip you take you become more acclimated to the altitude. This was my best trip yet and I could feel how I was getting less tired than every trip before. Bob.
I started out with 20 lbs. a couple of weeks ago. Did my normal 1,000 ft. climb with no problem.
I bumped it up to 35-40 lbs. and I cant walk very far on fairly flat terrain without having to rest my neck. My legs are fine so is there something wrong with my pack adjustment?
Yes there is something wrong with your pack adjustment. You should be able to wear your load for at least an hour without rest, depending on what shape you're in. Your neck should never burn out. There should be no particular part of your body that is more tired than the others if your pack works right.
Bob, yes indeed, I think that would work out just fine. This morning I was hiking down the mountain carrying my pack after an easy 3.5 mile trek, and a very fit twenty-something young lady jogged right past me in her little red running shorts.
Suddenly I had a bit more spring in my step! Getting closer to elk hunting shape, I think!
BTW, when things get tough, I still ask myself, "What would Bob Do?" In that case, I know you'd have watched her run off too......
"This morning I was hiking down the mountain carrying my pack after an easy 3.5 mile trek, and a very fit twenty-something young lady jogged right past me in her little red running shorts. "
"I still ask myself, "What would Bob Do?" In that case, I know you'd have watched her run off too...... "
At least you guys still remember why those cute girls are/were fun! LOL!
I think I saw that same gal on the Lazy Mountain trail the other day.
I use the same as Midwest.
I use two 40-lb bags of corn. Then I feed it to the critters in the backyard after session.
"Suddenly I had a bit more spring in my step!"
I thought that was a factory option with the new parts..... =D
BTW, I was thinking "female gymnast, what a great idea!" but a person would likely have rent one and that could add up fast..... but after a little research I see they have eastern european sites set up where you can buy one pretty cheap.... kinda the Harbor Freight of mail order girl friends, and most seem to be gymnasts!.... was thinkin' I can talk Coach into it if she can keep house too......
Edit: the words just hit me.... keep house.... nevermind... back to quickcrete in a plastic bag....
LOL! Dogs love to chase cars.....lots of things that are fun to chase..... but Lord help em if they actually catch one.....
Push mowing my lawn with 50 lb pack. Takes about an hour and 20 minutes. It's a killer.
I hike about 8 miles a day starting July 1st. Just pack a camel back for the entire month. Pack training is very, very hard on your hips and knees. The hiking will toughen up those joints and your feet. Remember easier to loose 20 pounds than to leave it.
I use a rubber water bladder that holds 20 liters (5 gallons) and dump it after a 2,000 to 3,000 foot ascent. The bladder can be found for less than $20 (Midway USA has them for $13) by searching the internet for "Swiss Water Bag".
50 lbs of mortar mix. 100 oz water bladder and eventually two 8 lb dumbbells in side pockets. no big hills here so just do the small ones over and over and over....
BOB no need to train so hard for that elk hunt !! I was on CL and this add popped up saying Meat Packer experienced !!! strong knees!! good with mouth calls !! I figured since u and Dan have helped me out so much I hired um for the hunt !!!!Looks like a tough mountain man !!!!!
Dang City!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't know how I m gonna get that "sight picture" outta my head now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :(
oh my....
Have to admit, knowing that was behind you.... make you forget all about the load on your back..... likely walk faster that if it was the red shorts girl in front of you....
I'm digging my eyeballs out right now.....
City, i didn't need to see that !!
Would much rather just try to invision what Jaq was watching run by 11
I got that as a XMAS card lol its like a train wreck u cannot help but look at it Daisy dukes !!!!
OK- to bring this back on topic....................... When I trained for my elk hunt back in 2011 I started working out almost a year in advance. I started pack training and like some have suggested, started with a heavy daypack and moved up to my big pack frame. in about 5 to 10 lb increments.
Used 40 lb softener salt(as suggested on here) in my (big) internal frame pack. I worked up to 80 lbs over the course of 6 months. That was about the heaviest I could go w/out feeling unsafe on uneven terrain and stay below the injury threshold(traumatic and overuse type injury).
The last few months, I would do 2-3 pack workouts a week alternating heavy(slower) workouts and lighter/faster workouts. I would not do more than one 70-80 lb hike per week, though.
At the same time, I was also doing strengthening exercises for the core, quads, hamstrings and calves.
Thing is, some folks can handle alot more on their backs than others. Depends on body type, strength, body size, orthopedic issues, past injuries etc...........what is good for a larger framed lineman or linebacker type is not good for a lighter, smaller framed distance runner type. Also, what is good for someone with no orthopedic issues is not necessarily good for someone dealing with bad knees, back or past injuries. I would actually consider myself kind of in between, as far as body type- I am 6'2" and was a shade over 200 lbs at the time.
So I guess what I am saying is you have to take a lot of factors into consideration and see what works for you. Not just do something because Joe Schmo does it and it works great for him. ;-)
Y'all saying that's big Dan...he wearing more than one pic i saw of him.
Louis...I think that is a picture of your goat guide "Roy" in his younger years!!! Am I not right Bob????
Back on topic: I try not to over do it with weight while training. In fact most of the time I just run with 30-35 lbs in my pack right up until the hunt. I will do a couple runs with 50+, but that's about it. If I trained with 50+, I'd wreck my back and knees for sure.
Kota- I would not run with external weight or a pack on my back. There is a big difference between hiking and running with a pack. When hiking you have one foot/leg in contact with the ground at all times. With running or jogging that is NOT the case and the forces of your foot "landing" on the ground are FAR greater. Several hundred times your bodyweight. With a heavy pack, that just magnifies it. Much greater risk of injury jogging or running with a pack compared to walking or hiking.
Rut...I worded that REALLY poorly. By "run" I just meant that is what I go with. I don't run ANYWHERE with a pack on. :) In fact, I don't run anywhere without a pack on. :) Sorry for the confusion and poorly worded post.
I do a hybrid of what I've read. There are some good hills where I live, so i start walking, then walking faster, then start carrying weight, then the serious pack goes on and a 5-gallon water bladder. Why water? So I can dump half of it at the top. Agree that half the battle is getting cardio vascular in shape without hammering the joints. I can almost guarantee all the 'special forces training' proponents are young bucks without the high mileage they will someday acquire. Kind of like riding a bike - you gotta spin. It is much easier to get muscles and lungs into shape than tendons and ligaments. I don't think you need more than the weight you will be carrying most of the time as long as you take it uphill for sustained periods and hard. Oh and this year I'm going backpacking ahead of time so I should have a real good idea what a realistic load feels like before I hit the trail with my bow.
Kota- OK, guess we were just using different terminology. But I have heard of guys literally running with a pack on to train.(I mean WORK OUT! ;-)
williamtell- I learned a valuable lesson 20+ years ago. Hiked the grand canyon with a buddy. Started on the Bright Angel trail at daybreak and hiked down to the bottom and back in one day(19 miles). We trained for that hike for months. Did alot of mtn biking and stairclimber(machine). What we did not do enough of was actual hiking (up AND downhill) with a pack. By the time we got back to the rim later in the day, our legs were TOAST. We couldn;t walk right for days. We had no idea how much pounding our legs were going to get going downhill! It's amazing what hiking downhill several thousand feet for 9.5 miles will do to your legs.
From then on, when training I will work the downhills as much, if not more than the uphills(concentrating on footing and controlling the decent). That is one reason I would not consider using water as weight, and I would not dump weight once I got to the top. I want to work the downhills in a controlled manner and work those muscles that help stabilize the hips, knees and ankles. You don;t get that on a stairmaster machine and/or dumping weight for downhill training.
Just something to think about.
Dam Cityhunter that looks like a nightmare!!!!! Widow
O ya I use weight plates wrapped in a blanket to train with the pack is 40lbs I am incapable of putting a 80lb pack on my back and if I did that would be the last time I would be walking I'm shure. Widow
Don't use a bag of cement unless it is inside of a waterproof garbage bag which is tied off...... if you get caught in a rain storm, you'll ruin the cement.....and it will weigh a LOT more than when you started with it....salt will be affected too, if not in a waterproof bag.....
Corn works well.
Carrying heavy loads in training and during season hasn't caught up with me yet (knocking on wood as I type), however, I don't train with heavy weight very often now.
I feel 40-65lb loads during training will get you ready for just about anything....THE ROUTE YOU TAKE WITH THAT WEIGHT IS PROBABLY MORE IMPORTANT.
Example: A guy packing 90lbs on flat ground for 4 miles would not get close to the same workout as a guy doing hill climbs with 45lbs for the same distance.
As Beendare mentioned before, you only have so many miles on your body and I'm hoping to do this for a long time.
So train hard, but train SMART too!
Just remember that plantar fasciitis can ruin this years hunt and next years. Yearlong fitness is the best mountain medicine. Period.
Every year the hills get higher and steeper and the weight feels heavier. If you are a flat lander GET IN SHAPE. Nothing is as good as hiking the hills but do your best to work out before your hunt.
I go in a week early and get to stay till the snow flys so I usually work my way into into it. Working on 30 years of humping the hills.
Very good advice there, Aron! :)
only 2nd hill workout of the year last night. Can't run right now due to an injured knee. Cant take the pounding of running. The hiking on grass is a lot easier on it.
55 lbs of repeats for an hour on our little 150 yard long hill last night. Soaked my brand new Kuiu Merino top pretty good.
Now to finally get some weight off. 10 to 15 more lbs in the next 7 weeks.
Will do this workout 2 to 3 times per week until the season, gradually upping the time to about an hour and a half(get bored with more) and 75 lbs.
Aron sayeth sooth [as ever ;-) ]
