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I came upon a blood trail on opener. Followed it back to a trail with corn and pellet cake feed on it. Guys had been baiting for pictures and then hunted it! Contacted warden and he confiscated bull. The guys hunting partner shot a bull in another area immediately on opening morning also. That guy has a long rap sheet also so pretty certain that bull was fishy also.
Good luck and keep your eyes open!
what state , can u even bait for pictures ,, states should either allow baiting /feeding or complete no baiting / feeding having a gray area allows trouble !!
It's in MT. The guys were from out of state. No you can't bait for pics.
Proof that not all hunters are equal. These buffoons break the law and don't know how to care for meat. Hope it costs them dearly.
Isnt illegal to use a trail camera "at all" when your actually hunting in MT.?
It's illegal to use them if any hunting season is on in that area.You don't even have to be a hunter.
How do you know they don't know how to care for meat?
The law for the cameras is very vague in Montana. It mostly is up to the warden if the law is being broke or not. I had this question last year and talked to one of the top officials in the fish wildlife and parks. The regulation reads "It is illegal for a person to possess or use in the field any electronic or camera device whose purpose is to scout the location of game animals or relay the information on a game animal’s location or movement during any Commission-adopted hunting season."
The grey area in this reg is whether you are using it to scout the location of the game animals or for photography purposes. The official told me that if you are not a hunter and/or do not currently possess a hunting license, the intent could be considered for photography purposes and not the locating of animals. In this case, a quick call to him would clear up any confusion if the game warden had any problems with the device. I told him I was a hunter but wanted to use my cameras for elk pictures during the early part of the antelope hunting season. He said no problem as long as you are not hunting the antelope. Besides, there are no antelope where my cameras were.
This situation is completely different however, as there were different intentions that these hunters had with the feed and cameras.
Vague???? really
Seems pretty clear to me when they are legal to use
page 13 , Montana hunting regs "Motion-Tracking Devices and/or Camera Devices"
"It is illegal for a person to possess or use in the field any electronic or camera device whose purpose is to scout the location of game animals or relay the information on a game animal’s location or movement during any Commission-adopted hunting season."
Says person not hunter. That pretty much covers anyone
I feel most masterbaiters are from Jersey.
Good job! Crap like this will stop only when we hunters make it clear such behavior is unacceptable and will not be tolerated...even if that means turning someone you know in for a violation.
haha masterbaiter...
Great job arrowslinger. A pat on the back and a firm handshake to you sir. Contact backcountry hunters and anglers out of missoula. I think they have a reward for turning in illegal ohv use and maybe would like to do a story in backcountry journal on the topic.
Did this happen to be in southeast Montana??
I also want to say good job,Arrowslinger.It's fortunate that you were there or this would have gone undiscovered.It makes one wonder if they've done this before.I'd also like to know the general area.
As I stated in my previous post, I talked to Michael Korn, Assistant Chief of Enforcement, and he told me that the law in the regulations was not intended to prevent individuals from using game cameras during any commission adopted hunting season, only to prevent the use for hunters to gain an advantage in taking game during the hunting season. I told him I was a hunter and used the cameras during the commisioned antelope season to take pictures of elk and he told me that as long as I was not using them for hunting the antelope, I was fine and to call him if any warden had any problems. Vague may have been the wrong word here but very open for multiple interpretations would maybe be better if the Assistant chief of Enforcement told me I was ok even if the regulations sounded like I was breaking the law. As JimB interpreted it above to say "It's illegal to use them if any hunting season is on in that area." When the rule states "during any Commission-adopted hunting season" It does not say in the area of the commissioned hunt. This rule could be interpreted to exclude camera use almost every month of the calender year, as there is a Commission-adopted hunting season going on almost every month of the year.
We could also interperatate it down to the words "whose purpose is to scout the location of game animals" and if your cameras are set to take pictures of birds, skunks or even wolverines, then are you breaking the law? It sounds like it is open to different interpretations to me which is why I checked with the officers of the fish and game to make sure I was not breaking the law.
Now as stated above, these fellows were indeed using the cameras in an illegal way and I have no sympathy for them.
Yes it is SE MT. They shot the last 2 bulls in SE MT. Ha
Great catch! Looks like they sucked at prepping their meat too, what a waste...
We've backpacked elk quarters out with the hide on to keep the meat clean.
Delicious meat!
Explains why there were not any Elk up in the long Pines...... The majority are still on private...
Question? And I have no idea what the answer is. I am asking.
How many elk per year do you think are poached like this or other means in any state that has elk
And what do you think the arrest rate is per actual violation
It depends on how much of a violation of the law you consider poaching. If you look at the definition of poaching as taking an animal without a tag or taking an animal illegally then the numbers will be a lot different. In montana and maybe other states, it is illegal to have anything electronic attached to your bow. This makes lighted nocks illegal. I know there are many people using lighted nocks or who attach cameras to there bows and so this would mean anyone using the nocks or attaching a camera to bow while taking game are poaching. So it all depends on how big of a rule needs to be broken to consider it poaching. Baiting is illegal and so if elk urine is used to bait an animal, is that also poaching. Elk urine can be just as much of a lure as grain or corn.
"Elk urine can be just as much of a lure as grain or corn"
Ya Right....
10orbetter
You think all Texans are outlaws ? We can't read and follow the game laws of other states ? Or just what did you mean ?
Dry creek,
Huge percentage of Midwest NR poaching is done by guys from S and SE USA. Very rarely from other areas although it does happen. Texas, Louisiana and SC are the most common ones I see in the area I live.
R. Hale, I do not doubt your observation, but it is still painting with a broad brush. We have our share of outlaw hunters, as we call them, but that doesn't warrant a comment like 10orbetter made IMO.
I could say all Yankees are pricks, but it wouldn't be true, would it ?
KInda easy to back up that statement, Richard, when you consider 30 out of 30 of the poachers convicted in Kansas' Operation Cimarron were from Texas or Louisiana.
About another 30 weren't formerly charged because of statute of limitations issues or other reasons. All of them were from Texas and Louisiana, too.
That said I got more hot, "Hope they hammer 'em," e-mails from Texas than any state when I was covering the case in federal court.
Dry - not all Yankees are pricks...some of us have very nice wives. :-)
An awful lot of them are shot in CO over salt or mineral blocks placed for "cattle". Doing it in NF is prosecutable if someone turns the slobs in, and there have been recent convictions of outfitters for just that.
On outfitted private land, nearly impossible unless one of the outfitted hunters reports it and provides evidence. Even then it's iffy because of the relationship between the game wardens and ranchers.
Great job, Arrowslinger. Many guys would not have wanted to get involved, and would have just carried-on with their hunt.
I really do not see the broad brush comment being valid, more so when only a simple question was ask. If it is ever answered the most likely answer will be TX or LA. When an incredibly high % of poaching by NR's comes from a specific area, it is worth note in my opinion. I would guess over 80% of NR poaching in the Midwest originates from TX and LA. Actually appears to be much higher but I do not want to overstate it.
You can call us what you want, but until we are convicted in court of it is simply baseless opinion.
I personally have had a few experiences with poachers from both states. Also had another who was preparing to trespass and offered to lease my farm. He said " I will not even hunt it, I just need a place to park my truck." He was equipped with an assortment of lights as well as rifles. This was in Nov, prior to the firearms season being open.
Just for the record I have no issue with baiting if it is legal. ND allows it in some places and if it's legal I don't care one bit. But when the laws say no then I have an issue. If you hunt hard and legally then I have no issue regardless where your license plate says your from.
Headed out for a week to see if I can break my elk curse. Have a good hunt guys.
Not all Texans are poachers...most of them drive like idiots on I-25 though! :)
No one said all Texans are poachers, but many poachers are Texans, no question about it.
Lack of reading comprehension skills could be part of the issue causing violations. Must be that Texas school system at fault.
LOL! Yeah, and all Bowsiters are "know-it-alls"! ;-)
Not true, Rut Nut,
We're all whiny "know-it-alls!;-)