I am 28 years old and have 7 pts to wyoming. I planned, and more than likely plan on applying this year for a tag. For the last month I have turned evey rock over, bought maps, called connections, reached out to hunters and I am getting a mix array of units to apply to. One person says best unit ever and next person says don't make a 7 year with of points mistake.
I am going to look at all the units I have been guided to research. What balance do you consider most important?? balance between number tags available and number of elk?. What do you think are some of the more important factors to look into? Public land access? Private land access? How big the unit is? Success rate? Number of elk? Number of tags? Number of hunters (including elk ?Deer combined) Terrain?
What if you had to put only two or three things to consider on a unit, what what would they be?
I always tell people don't burn your points if you don't know the first thing about elk hunting. Go hunt somewhere else first and get an education. Plus then you'll appreciate a great hunt when you go on one.
I don't care about the size of the unit. The number of tags isn't that big of a deal to me either because for the most part I find people to look for easy opportunities. I just plan on outhunting those fast food guys.
I have killed my share of bulls. So for me I look at the success rate on BIG bulls. Bull to cow ratio. Obviously land access is a no brainer. No sense in applying for a tag with no public land unless you plan to pay for a guide or access which requires a different kind of research.
Back to question #1.
First question- Have you hunted elk before? If not, keep your points and pull a tag/buy a license somewhere to get some field experience. Apply for a general tag in Wyo, second choice and you will have fun.
It is a balance act on priorities and stats. No unit has it all. EX- In a few of WYO's highly rated units. But if you are NR DIY, most of the unit is off limits because of wilderness rule. Also dig deeper. Numbers can lie. I can think of places with a decent amount of public land, but much of it is land locked. (WYO and MT come to mind). All of a sudden, %'s mean little.
With the internet, most statistics are not secret.
As an example, my very first elk hunt was in 1998 in the Gila NF. I had allowed for a whole 4.5 days of hunting. (Two days of drive time either side of hunt). Hiked in 7.5 miles solo. As you can guess, I made so many mistakes in one of the better places to hunt. (I could fill a couple of chapters!) In spite of my ineptitude, I still came close to killing.(It would have killed me to get one out too!) Looking back, I wasted my inexperience on one of the best units anyone can draw. I have never had the quality of elk on a hunt since. Never have I been to a place like it since 2000. Draw odds are now cr@p and my experiences are now memories.
I will assume you have hunted elk before. If I were in your shoes, I would start off with all units on your radar. #2 list all of the items noted in your original post. (Access, null/cow ratio, etc) Now apply grades to all of those parameters. See which units have the best overall grades and work from there.
If you haven't hunted elk, put a season or two under your belt and implement above.
Look at the units he noted. You will see very high success ratios on bulls. (IE Numbers lie) Problem is, WYO stats are not broken down enough. If the data broke down public vs private land. (Or private/landlocked public vs accessible public), things might not be as rosey.
Same can be said for units in NW WYO. Some very high % of bulls taken per tag holders. But you need to look at % of resident vs non resident in those units. With the high amount of wilderness, most NR bulls are taken guided in those units. (Not to say no res bulls are not take on guided hunts, but generally most residents are on their own) EX 60. It is a general tag, yet no NR is killing anything in that unit without a guide. (Other than a squirrel or a fish)
Example - I personally know a guy who burned 18 CO points to hunt perhaps the best unit in the state. Huge unit, 77% public land, only 8 licenses issued during archery season, big bulls all over. He hadn't hunted elk very much and had never killed one before that hunt. He still hasn't killed one, even after hunting three weeks in that unit.
In 2013 I hunted elk for the very first time in a general area in Wyoming and had a good hunt, saw some elk, heard a lot of bugles, but never really came that close to shooting a bull. I learned a little and had a blast.
This past year I hit the lottery and drew a GREAT New Mexico tag after I struck out in the Wyoming draw. I still really had no elk experience. It was the most incredible 8 days of hunting I could ever imagine and I saw more big bulls than I probably will in the rest of my life, but in the end, my inexperience prevailed, and I ate my tag. Had I had a few more elk hunts under my belt I think things would have worked out differently and I'd have come home with one of those monsters in the back of my truck.
On the flip side, I gained as much experience in that one hunt as I would have in 10 OTC or general hunts. But, the big difference, is that I didn't have to burn any points to do so with New Mexico's random draw. Had I burned many years' worth of points on that hunt and came home empty handed, I'd have cried myself to sleep even more than I do now.
Good luck! And, seriously consider doing a hunt or two before you burn those points! I wish I was in your shoes!
I would recommend as everyone else to get some experience first before using points.
Of course it can be done with his help but after you get some personal experience you will be better able to wisely use the points you will never get back.
Get a cow tag in the unit you want this year, than decide the next if you want to draw. Hunting an area multiple times greatly increased your chances.
I would also recommend you go hunt CO, NM, MT, or WY leftover before burning your points. Even though you have your dad's experience, you will be so much better of an elk hunter yourself after hunting elk even for one year.
Trust me, this isn't going to be something you want to do just once anyways. Set yourself up for the best experience you can have with that 7 yr investment.
If I were you, I'd consider paying the higher price for the special elk tag, put in for a unit you won't draw that takes max points, draw a general tag as your 2nd choice, collect an 8th point, and hunt a general unit and have a great hunt, setting yourself up for a successful hunt in the unit of your choice when you use your points next year.
You could hunt the unit of your future choice with a cow tag, but IMO, hunting cows with a bow will not give you the same education as hunting bulls with a bow will. Although you'll know your unit better if you hunt it with a cow, you can learn the unit by scouting. What you need to do is learn the nuances of interacting with bull elk. Every encounter you have will go a long ways towards making your next hunt successful.
Don't ignore units that have a type 1 tag but no type 9 tag. If there's 250 type 1 tags given out, you will not see 250 bowhunters in the unit during archery season like you will in 38 because most of them are gun hunters. Personally, I'd rather see zero other hunters in a good unit than run into hunters in a great unit.
Don't rule out southern Wyoming and I'm not just talking about Wyoming Range. There are many units in Southern Wyoming that look like just sage flats from Google Earth, but have tons of elk on them. There are several units that don't have general tags that are trophy units and you won't see a spec of national forest in their boundries. Look to hunt private or BLM land.
He learned what wildwilderness suggested, that his dad wasn't carrying the bow.
Seriously, unless you have some life event looming that will prevent you from hunting elk in the future (foreign job opportunity, marrying a woman with 8 kids, etc..), spend a couple seasons learning how to set up a shot and SHOOT elk before you cash in those points. Your experience won't be like a Primos video on a DIY hunt.
"If you were me..."
If me... those 7 points would be burning a hole in my pocket just like they are yours! But then I've been known to sit in front of a microwave with a hotdog in it screaming "come on! COME ON!!"
OK... some really great info above. Having your Dad with you that has some experience will be a great help. If he's killed 3 public land DIY elk he'll have an idea on how to go about it. That's 3 more than a lot of folks who have a good number years of "experience" under their belt.
And in all honesty, especially a hunt with your Dad... putting anything off till tomorrow is a risk tomorrow may not work out. But nothing says you two can't get in a practice run somewhere OTC before burning the points and then you can BOTH carry bows.
Good luck on what you decide.
According to a foolish magazine zero general tags were issued to nonresidents as a second choice last year.
According to a foolish magazine zero general tags were issued to nonresidents as a second choice last year.
I've killed two elk myself and have failed to get 3 other people elk on 4 different hunts that I devoted to getting my partners an elk.
With app season looming and plans to hunt with 2 or 3 different friends/family, I had to have the conversation this week with them that even though I'll be going on 2 or 3 different elk hunts this year, I will need to spend some time alone. It's hard to understand till you've been through it, just like most things in life.
One more thing, I see you mention that you'll be happy with a "mature elk." And I'm sure you would be. Who wouldn't be on their first elk hunt?
But let me tell you from experience how time changes goals. Again I'll say, this isn't something you're going to want to do just once.
Those points are an opportunity at a "trophy elk," not just a "mature elk."
Trust me, trophy hunts don't come along every year. Get the newness out of it and save those points for a trophy hunt because 3 or 4 years from now, you may very well regret spending your points in the early part of your elk hunting career.
I took the advice, went to Colorado on three DIY bowhunts and killed three raghorn bulls before I ever attempted to draw a trophy unit in any state.
If i had it to do over again, I wouldn't change a thing.
I talked to guys who had never been in the unit and they complained of not seeing any bulls and were trying to figure out where to go. Now I know the unit good and I know places to go to get into bulls just about every day. If your a bow hunter you know what you need to do to kill game, if your new to a unit you might spend all your time hiking and trying to figure things out. Not saying experience doesn't help but I do think knowing the unit helps a ton. Good luck................................................
idyllwildArcher said...........Good Advice.......
One more thing, I see you mention that you'll be happy with a "mature elk." And I'm sure you would be. Who wouldn't be on their first elk hunt?
But let me tell you from experience how time changes goals. Again I'll say, this isn't something you're going to want to do just once.
Those points are an opportunity at a "trophy elk," not just a "mature elk."
Trust me, trophy hunts don't come along every year. Get the newness out of it and save those points for a trophy hunt because 3 or 4 years from now, you may very well regret spending your points in the early part of your elk hunting career.
You might just want to get a couple cow tags or antelope tags and hunt the unit you're wanting to elk hunt in. I know I wish I had my points back and could do it over again.
In carpentry terms, measure twice, cut once. (IE Research & Research- Cash in LE points once)
