Do you shoot or not?
Not even a question, NO
Wasn't that long ago the same was being said about a 101yd shot. Apparently, any shot is acceptable in many people's minds.
The question just seems like u r picking a fight.
My more thorough answer would be: Nope, i wait till he turns cuz he is obviously peeking back and will likely offer a perfect shot in a couple steps.
BUT ...
Suppose the bull has been wounded ... He's in thick trees, presenting this shot. A "Wait-til-he-turns" approach won't work due to thick brush, and you want to put a second (or third) arrow in him -- not a first.
Where, then, do you aim?
OK. How did the arrow pass through the very narrow, curved opening in the pelvis? Or did it go through the pelvis? If it missed the pelvis, you didn't hit near the A-hole. If you did, there is nothing but bone up that high.
It's different from a frontal shot because of the distance to the vitals and the fact that a large bone structure (the pelvis) is very close above where you would have to aim.
I can't imagine any responsible bowhunter taking that shot. But then again, I could say the same about a 100 yard shot.
The answer is no! That is why you do not take the shot. Respect the animal and don't just launch an arrow because you can hit it.
I have, however, helped pack out a bull that was taken with that shot with a relatively light arrow out of a recurve and can tell you with 100% confidence the vitals were hit and the bull was dead in seconds.
I can also tell you I would have 100% more confidence in killing an elk with that shot inside 20 yards than I would a broadside elk at 101 yards.
Why? N-Idaho +2.
Also, any left/right deviation will require arrow to penetrate thicker muscles before you even start having to penetrate intestines/stomach matter. (further jeopardizing the likelihood your arrow will reach the vitals.) Additionally the likelihood of an exit wound is very much up in the air.
Some folks seem to try and justify letting an arrow go at any cost/risk. There is absolutely nothing wrong with not releasing an arrow on every encounter. You owe it to the animal you pursue. Sometimes things don't go your way. That is why they call it hunting and not shooting.
I know you were just trying to stir the pot Nick. Elk season can't get here soon enough.
Not stirring the pot...legitimate question.
Would the precision it takes to put an arrow where it needs to go on this shot at less than 20 yards be any more difficult than it would require to make a 50 yard plus shot at a broadside animal?
Plenty of guys on here have no problem with the latter.
My reasoning: Skirting the inside of the thigh through what one may call the hamstring area and into the chest is possible. But I see that shot most likely presenting with an alarmed elk stiff legging away from you.
Scenario : he comes in figures something is wrong and about faces. A tense critter that flinches at the shot combined with the thick hide and powerful muscles could limit penetration significantly.
An unalarmed animal, with his front end sightly lower than his hind relative to the shooter would present a better target. But not a good archery target imo. Trying to get through the pelvic opening would be tough and require nearly an absolute relative plane from the shooter.
I have recovered broadside hip shot elk, but that muscle eats a lot of energy and getting into the chest from behind him may not always happen.
Personally I don't care for strong quartered away shots. Unless you get the heart, aorta, or vena cava they often are liver and one lung. And most of us know how far that elk can go.
Though with a flat arrow inside 20 yards it almost looks like if ya took him right through the bag you'd end up through liver and in heart...
There's no shot here one can take with 100% certainty that the vitals will be struck. Throwing a good shot is much different than taking a bad shot on purpose.
Broad heads often kill by causing massive blood loss.
During the rut, where is most of the blood flowing and what organ is vital?
I may see a shot
At least with a broadside shot your largest kill area now includes heart or most likely both lungs which is impossible from the front or rear of the animal and is as far as I know not only the largest kill zone on an animal but also one of the surest spots to kill an animal quickly.
Hitting one lung with a frontal is completely different than hitting one lung broadside. The bundle of arteries above the heart the arrow went through to get to that lung is what puts the animal down so fast. Same reason an arrow put through the "V", forward of the front leg puts them down within sight. Not to mention, on a frontal the arrow would be going through that lung lengthwise, cutting much more tissue than an arrow going through the rear lobe or the bottom of a single lung broadside.
I doubt I'd take that rear shot but I wouldn't take a 50 yard broadside shot either. Thing is, I wouldn't fault a guy with more shooting skill than me taking a 50 yard shot or a guy with more experience and knowledge of where to aim taking a rear shot.
Most guys who adamently stated that was absolutely no shot to take can't even give a reason as to why not other than a couple with theories. A couple guys admitted to taking the shot at least once and the results were dead animals within sight. Like I stated earlier, I was hunting with a guy who shot one right next to the anus (I have the pic somewhere) and it died running.
I just watched a video where a well known, respected elk hunter completely missed a broadside elk at 53 yards because he judged it for 45. I bet no one faults him for taking that shot since it was broadside and he just misjudged the distance. He could have just as well wounded it but we tell him we're sorry he missed and "better luck next time". But had he shot an elk up the ass at 10 yards and watched it die within seconds, the internet bashing would have been relentless!
The reason I asked the question is to see if there were bowhunters out there who had actual experience with the shot. (thank you Fulldraw and WV M) There are some old timers out there who had to learn where to shoot before there were books, internet, bowhunter ed class, and "experts" to tell them where to aim. I know of at least one very well respected Bowsiter who said the rear shot is one of his very favorites.
I wouldn't take the shot because of my own ignorance of the shot, not because of some arbitrary bowhunting ethics rule. I, also, wouldn't take a 50 yard broadside shot because I don't have that kind of shooting confidence on a live animal at that distance. Give me a frontal inside 20 yards, though, and that bull is dead! Several years ago, I would have never taken that shot, either, if not for some education from those with more experience than me.
Maybe the rear shot is a bad shot to take...I don't know but don't hang a guy just for asking. :-)
I'll admit Bowsite has opened my eyes to some different shots. I never once considered a frontal before BB and his posts. I've now taken the frontal shot 3 times, with deadly results 3 times. I've also passed the frontal shots on multiple occasions due to one reason or another since I even started looking for the shot.
I don't know that I see why the butt shot couldn't be taken. . . Looks to me like right above the testicles would work. But I wouldn't be comfortable with it. I've never paid very close attention to how and where the ball sockets and pelvis is located exactly, so I'd be hesitant to take that shot for that reason.
I'm not sure the stomach with grass bag would prove a big hindrance. . .In my experience with the frontal shot, the arrow blows right through that.
And midwest if you miss that little bundle of arteries which I agree will put anything down in sight, you still only hit one lung. Even going length wise in circles or if the arrow does a U-turn it will not kill the animal nearly as fast as hitting both lungs. And even on a frontal shot you still need to penetrate quite a ways before you actually encounter the vitals, though not nearly as much as a rear shot, were as a broadside shot the arrow will hit lungs after only going a few inches.
I do agree with you on a frontal shot, if you hit exactly where your aiming. If you hit the heart or arteries then yes its a dead animal and probably it goes down in sight. I guess Im just thinking of what happens if you dont hit perfectly. To me a broadside shot just gives you more chances to mess up and still kill the animal quickly.
So, those are my reasons, i didnt mean to hang anyone. I say no shot at all.
Best of luck hunting!
Have a great season.
Midwest when does your bow season start? Oct 1 here in Iowa.
Best of luck.
It's a shot that usually isn't necessary because an animal feeding away from you will most often turn to one side or the other and offer a quartering away shot. There's a big difference in options between calling a bull head on to you at close range vs stalking a feeding elk at the same range.
IMO, the guys experienced enough to take the shot responsibly won't because they know they'll get a better shot with patience.
