WapitiBob's Link
( link to Randy's thread: http://tinyurl.com/b4vjkkz )
excerpts from the thread:
////
Big Fin Administrator
MOGA, RMEF, and Randy Newberg
Well, since the last four days of my life have been made very difficult by a few fringe elements in the Montana Outfitter and Guides Association (MOGA), I am going to post what has been going on. Makes me wonder if all the MOGA members know a few of their leaders are willing to use their organization to engage in their personal battles. Seems MOGA is trying to split the hunting community and forcing RMEF to chose between guided hunters and non-guided hunters. Seems have me as one of the twenty-four board members of RMEF is more than MOGA can stand. A few on the MOGA board are upset with my representation of our audience when testifying at the legislature, and the shrinking grip they have on the legislature. Appears desperate times call for desperate measures. Below is an email that was sent to every RMEF board member and RMEF management. Also was sent to the state outfitter associations across the west, with WYOGA being the only other association who has joined MOGA.
This effort by MOGA prompted other emails and phone calls followed where outfitters informed RMEF of action if RMEF went forward with my nomination. Those threats covered the spectrum of pulling donations, not attending banquets, dropping memberships, etc.
This effort, an effort most would classify as extortion, seems to be the way the fringe operates these days. Personal agendas of a few within an organization allows them to go so far as to use RMEF and the RMEF mission as a tool of leverage to try take another whack at me and the viewers/readers I am asked to represent.
The good news is that RMEF has asked me to keep my position and continue advocating as I have in the past. They are not about to let any group hold them hostage. RMEF will not be drawn into attempts by a few disgruntled outfitters who want to split the hunting world.
I have told RMEF that I have not yet finalized what I will do. The goal, mission, and work of RMEF is far more important than my board position. Since this MOGA effort has now been spread across much of Montana, with my CPA clients and landowner friends being told of the MOGA plan with peculiar frequency, I don't have many options other than to speak out and start pushing back.
This has been going on since Wednesday. I have waited to post until now, though by Friday, I was getting calls from landowners and clients, asking what the hell was going on. I waited for RMEF to digest what this was about and what was being asked of them. It became very obvious, very early, that MOGA had "stepped in it" by trying to extort RMEF. The reply of RMEF and their board makes me even more proud that they would ask me to be part of the Board of Directors.
For those of you who are as disgusted with the effort by MOGA, I hope you will give RMEF your support for not being held hostage by this group of fringe operators who have now gained control over the MOGA board of directors.
Looks like MOGA has taken the gloves off in their desperate and continuing effort to control the hunting of 180,000 hunters in Montana and the 195,000 members of RMEF. I am now taking my gloves off and rolling up my sleeves. Things are going to get real interesting, real fast.
If you are as tired of these continue attempts by MOGA to split the hunting community and drive a deeper wedge between hunters and landowners, I hope you will take action. Share this thread on as many websites as you can. Post a link on your Facebook page.
It is time to stomp out this craziness. Hopefully the many good guys within MOGA will read this and will ask some questions of how their organization was drawn into such a mess by a few in leadership positions.
Please let RMEF know how you feel about their decision. In today's world, when extortive tactics seem to be effective, RMEF stood tall and is supporting my nomination, thereby supporting the bigger goal of a united hunter community; thereby rejecting efforts of those who put personal agendas above the important work of conservation, habitat, and access, and most importantly, refusing to be held hostage. .....
The email referenced above:
Quote:
From: MOGA [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2013 10:28 AM
To: montana outfitters and guides assoc.
Subject: RMEF Board Appointments
Individual Outfitters from several states have expressed concern over the possible appointment of Randy Newberg to the Board of Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation. Randy is a TV show host and has consistently projected a “do-it-on –your own” theme. However, Randy is affiliated with, and often represents one or more organizations that some perceive to be anti-outfitting/landowner often presenting the western Outfitting Industry in a negative light.
Montana based Outfitters, many of whom provide significant donations to RMEF that sustain the organization, are questioning the wisdom in this appointment. They have indicated they may withdraw donations to RMEF if the appointment goes through. It is our understanding that the appointment is not final and will not be until later this month.
Many have called our office asking how they make their views known to the leadership of RMEF. In response to that request I am providing the following email addresses. Please direct your individual comments to these leaders of RMEF. .....
///////
///////
In 2012, Rob was President-elect of MOGA, and I think he became President as of 01/01/2013. Rob is also on the Board of Directors of MT-SFW. I have met with Rob many times, on many issues.
MOGA and SFW have become almost two of the same in their testimony on bills, or their absence when most all the other hunting groups are testifying against bills. Not sure if that is coincidence or intentional
Randy Newberg has been in many skirmishes with SFW as they try to dismantle the wildlife management models. Both here in Montana and with SFW in other states. SFW loves to take their shots at RMEF, whenever the opportunity is provided.
Most recently, SFW testified in favor of a bill for testing and slaughtering elk in the Montana units around Yellowstone National Park and for lowered elk numbers in those units that are already way below historic levels. I testified against that bill, while SFW supported it. The hearing on that bill was the week before this MOGA email went out.
/////////
This is the type of nonsense being emailed to RMEF:
Quote:
From: XXXX and XXXXX YYYYYYY
Date: February 13, 2013 8:56:18 PM MST
To: "[email protected]"
Subject: Mr. Newberg
I have been made aware of the upcoming appointment of Randy Newberg to the RMEF Board of Directors. I am a Montana landowner, cattleman and owner of an outfitting business that operates in Eastern Montana. Through reading Mr. Newberg's "Hunttalk" forums I have been very aware of his agendas against landowners as well as outfitters. He leads the charge against private property rights and frowns upon outfitters because he feels that it is wrong that they "make a profit off of publicly owned game animals", when in all reality he is doing nothing different with his TV program, On Your Own Adventures.
In the past, I have donated hunts to the RMEF chapter in Billings, MT. I truly enjoyed those hunts as well as the people that I met while doing them, and I felt that the funds were going to a very good organization with outstanding intentions. I don't feel that Mr. Newberg's agendas are the same as those of RMEF and would not represent your organization like it should be represented. I can truthfully say that if he was appointed to your board, my hunt donations, or any other donations would be stopped, strictly for the fact of what he stands for.
Thank you. ////////
If you are an RMEF member you might give them a note in support of Randy.
I have watched his show for years and I have never seen anti Outfitter or anti Landowner sentiment. It's not surprising to see SFW in the mix.
Bob
Greed---sad.....Why not DIY when ya can?
Randy is the Real deal that is for sure.
Thanks for the heads-up W-Bob.
Good luck, Robb
I have been hiking, backpacking, hunting in the Bighorn Mtns for 35 years, yet if I want to hunt in the wilderness area, I need to hire an outfitter. An oil rig roughneck out of Gillette with one year of residency and zero knowledge of the backcountry or the skills necessary can hunt there on his own. Hmmmm.
Quote:
From: Laurie Marcovitz [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2013 11:13 AM
To: XXXXXXXXXXXXX
Cc: Gilliland, Sy; Pollard, Terry
Subject: FW: RMEF Board Appointments
YYYYYYY:
Hi! Below is an email I received from MOGA. This email is extremely important and needs your attention. This is in regards to the possible appointment of Randy Newberg to the Board of RMEF. I have been asked by Sy and Terry to forward this to you along with other WYOGA members who are also heavily involved with RMEF. The email explains in detail why he should not be appointed and also who to contact with your comments.
If you have any questions, please contact Sy at 307.259.4168 or Terry at 307.367.6539.
Thanks,
Laurie A. Marcovitz - Administrator
Wyoming Outfitters and Guides Association
PO Box 2650
Casper, WY. 82602
307-265-2376
307-265-2523 FAX
///////
I sent emails to both MT and WY associations
Randy has proven to be an upstanding representative of the hunting community and I believe he'd be a GREAT representative for the DIY hunter on RMEF's Board. I'm glad the RMEF is holding firm.
MOGA and WYOGA sounds like they need to have their diapers changed......
Bob, I saw this from Randy on his FB page,but thank you so much for sharing here. Also, I apologize if I was out of line on the NM forum recently.
Here is a post that somes this up I took off randys site
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RMEF just gained a family membership. Dropped them years ago when their focus changed. I started paying attention when they took a stand on auction tags, now they have both my money and my support.
Landowner/Sportsmen relations have declined in direct proportion to the rise of private land outfitting. Many outfitters profit by controlling or limiting our access to our wildlife. Outfitters' arrogance and sense of entitlement has been apparent for quite some time.
Sportsmen funded the recovery of wildlife over the last century. Once wildlife populations recovered, Outfitters showed up to make a profit while steadily disenfranchising the public. Yes they donate hunts etc to RMEF and other organizations but they also got pretty good advertising out of the deal.
Mac Minard has personified this arrogance. His ever-changing and inventive statements during I-161 boggled the mind. He was quoted in 2 different publications claiming outfitters leased less than 2 millions acres in one instance and between 2 and 3 million in another. In fact he had been quoted the year before in the Montana Sporting Journal saying outfitters leased 6.2 million acres( the actual number).
His behavior during signature gathering efforts included following and harassing some of our young female signature gatherers bringing one to tears. Outfitters got so bad we pulled our signature gatherers away from this function out of concern for their safety. MOGA's handouts actually changed both the language and the intent of the initiative and were filled with not just inaccuracies but outright lies which they refused to correct for quite some time.
During a debate with MWF sponsored by the local paper in Choteau shortly before the election Mac Minard, when questioned about the fact Block Management was going broke due to declining sales and declining prices of Outfitter Sponsored Licenses, claimed Block Management had so much money FWP had taken $20 million out of the Block Management account calling it a "slush fund". When questioned he quickly claimed he got the info from an FWP employee. When she was asked about it, she made it clear Minard had invented the "fact" In fact every penny from the hunting access account was spent on some type of access.
Outfitters including Minard called large sporting good companies when their employees signed the petition to complain in much the same manner. I even had an outfitter steal several pages of signatures out of my file box at a meeting. They stupidly turned them in to the Elections Board with the complaint I wasn't watching them closely enough. The judge in the lawsuit they filed against us was upset about that stunt and laughed their case out of court.
Outfitters still haven't recognized the fact that I-161 passed in 70 of 100 legislative districts mainly because of the intense dislike of outfitters by not just sportsmen but the general public as well.
Outfitters are so arrogant right now they are currently pushing a bill to deregulate their industry and stop reporting to not just FWP but also the Board of Outfitters. HB 274 just passed the house. Besides trying to eliminate reporting, they completely gutted the basic requirements for outfitters like knowledge of firearms, knowledge of the area where they operate, written permission from public or private landowners where they plan to operate. They also have the gall to try and drop the requirement to report how many acres they lease for hunting. We finally got a few minimal requirements for reporting back in the bill. Hopefully we can kill it in the senate.
Thank you RMEF for recognizing the importance and contributions of the average sportsmen to the conservation movement in America and the damage many outfitters have done to public hunting. Thanks Randy for standing up for the little guy and opposing MOGA's continuing efforts to privatize our wildlife
Well, there ya have it.
Good luck, Robb
110% support for Randy and guys like him.
I know Randy (Big Fin) well enough. Just received an email from him yesterday that I need to reply to. He is one hell of a good guy and if I ever have any questions on details of policies or legailty of an issue legalities etc he is my go to. After knowing him for a number of years I can say this: If I'm not sure about where I stand on an issue... or maybe just don't have time to find out the details before forming an opinion on something.... I just look to see what position Randy takes and I make that mine. I trust his judgement unquestionably.
To paint an image of him as an anti outfitter is not accurate at all. And I don't think he would suggest that any of you become outfitter bashers either. 0utfitting in itself is not the issue although intracately involved. A more accurate statment would be that is is pro-public. If that offends anyone they can quit reading right now.
Remember.... I'm a Montana 0utfitter. So how can he and I be on the same side of the fence? First of all I do not and have never belonged to M0GA. Why? Simple... because they do nothing for public land outfiitters. Instead they use dues to represent outfitters on legal matters and to lobby for their goals but all of the goals and legal battles are ones brought about by private land outfitters. I think they do public land outfitters as much harm as good.
To me an outfitter provides clients with things like horses, mules, tents etc to access and survive in remote or rough country, and the knowledge of a big chunk of elk country so they can hunt it effectively.... things they truly don't have the time knowledge or equipment to do on their own. A legitimate service. Some just don't have the desire to do things on their own.
But I assure you lots of people not only have the desire but also the ability to hunt all of the private, or at least the landlocked public land on their own. The outfitters who Randy is dealing with are the ones who own nothing but a key to a gate and not only lease up all of the private land but at the same time land lock even more public land. They take away opportunities from the tax paying citizens. Kind of the opposite of Robin Hood. These are the ones who used the 0utfitter Sponsored (guaranteed) licenses to make sure they could sign leases and be sure hunters could all hunt. This results in lease costs non-commercial hunters would never pay and license costs many blue collar DIY hunters just couldn't afford.
Then... after creating private game sanctuaries the landwners lobby for more cow tags because the over abundance of elk is destroying their fence and pasture. The result is a cow massacre outside their fence, bow and rifle, which ruins the quality of the hunting for everyone else... while many of the bulls hole up out of reach of the public. Total political B.S. at the expense of the people. I understand the validity of many private land outfitters. I understand that much of the public cannot be trusted to respect private land when they are granted access. I also understand that livestock profits aren't always enough for a rancher to make ends meet. As an American I also respect the rights of any private landowner. But when they start running the show for their benefit and get involved in politics that affect the public and their hunting opportunites it's time to take a good hard look at things.
My point is that while Randy is spot on with his views... M0GA des N0T represent all outfitters. Fact is most public land outfitters I know don't belong to the organization. It serves us no purpose. This a point that is worth mentioning since this thread was created.
I support the RMEF. I do have some concerns over their hesitation in the past when it comes to wolf issues. They rode the fence because while many of their wealthy donors and sponsors support their aquisition of land... they aren't exactly in favor of killing wolves. Right now I think we need to make sure wolves are not relisted as endangered more than we need another 100,000 acres of habitat. Time for moral decisions to over ride financial ones. But... they are all financial ones now aren't they? That's a whole other subject.
Go figure the WY0GA would show their opposition.... the same bunch of guys who effectively landlocked all of Wyoming's wilderness from hunters only for no good reason.
Randy would be a great addtion to the RMEF board. Enough for now.
I don't have a dog in the fight really, but I think the outfitters who don't approve of MOGA's tactics need to distance themselves if they want hunters' support.
Keep up the good work Randy. OYOA is the best hunting show on TV.
A search on the M0GA website says there are only 127 elk outfitters in all MT regions. 8 more for 135 if you search mule deer outfitters. Not really that many. Alot of guys join just because they think it looks good to potential clients so you really can't judge all M0GA members either.
Guys like BigDan who hunt where the problems are sure have a good point.
But there are good outfitters out there who do not support M0GA!!!!!
It's good to see so much support for someone who's trying to do the right thing.
This pretty much sums it up. I'd avoid SFW like the plague.........
I remember when the talks were about guaranteed licenses and eliminating them. Just before that it was about the archery permits in the Breaks. My comments to M0GA were "How about separating private land licenses from public land ones so we can somewhat distance a big group of outfitters from the user conflicts occuring on the east side"
In a way the comment was a slap in the face joke. M0GA is made up of a pile of private land outfitters so you could hear the crickets chirping after that proposal. Hell no they weren't interested in parting company with us real outfitters.
That would mean that if a guy wanted to hunt the Breaks, or anywhere on public land he had great odds of drawing a tag. But if he wanted to book a private land hunt he had to draw a more limited permit. They already have public and private land use separated. The big thing there is that it makes it a gamble for an outfitter to sign a big money lease at the end of the hunting season when next years clients may not draw a tag to hunt. Screws up their whole system. At the same time if the rancher himself is doing the outfitting then he has no big lease and lives life a little more like the outfitters we all imagine.... pickup truck with the body flapping in the wind instead of a limo. I don't think you or I mind those guys as much.
Makes me puke when I see the land pimps Dan pictures dressed up like us for brochure photo shoots. We work more for our clients before they arrive than those guys do all season. Makes me want to drag one of them around the mountains until he begs for mercy. Probably can't even set up a wall tent let alone find a bull.
To get back to the point of the thread.. those are the guys who threaten the RMEF with no more donations if Randy becomes a board member. Hell... what does the donation even cost them? Real outfitters can't afford to give away hunts so they really don't have much to threaten the RMEF with. 0ur hunts aren't always what the big wigs at the banquets want to bid on anyway.
I wish Randy the best of luck. It warms my heart to know those dirtbags are worried about him. :-)
It looks like the MGOA and WYGOA are out of line for sure.
standswithaknife,
I think you are way off base with your tunnel vision of the real world. I would hope you re-read Mule Powers' post above to get a much clearer picture in your mind.
As if outfitter's and ranchers aren't working men? Hell most of them don't have time and money to go to all the meetings or serve on the boards either. We are always complaining about the greenies not having jobs and going to all the meeting in droves, and making the resource industry look like we don't care.
Maybe you need to try and work with the rancher and outfitter. I'm sure they are doing more to protect your hunting rights by far than you are giving them credit for.
If most lands are not public lands that they can hunt and most tags are not for residents, they scream bloody murder. Outfitters and landowners are the haves and these guys are the have nots,according to them. Be glad you don't live in Texas. You would be S O L.
Be very thankful to have what you have. Millions up on millions of acres of public lands to hunt and in most western states you can get an elk license regularly and once in a while get a premium bull tag.
To really make a difference, help the industry fight the wolf movement that is rapidly taking down our wildlife numbers and the opportunity to hunt.
Get the picture? Not alot of common ground or brotherly love between me and a fat cat ranch outfitter. We have a few in the Root too.
I'm sure a couple of them are cringing reading this. Comments are always welcome. Anyone who wants to privatize hunting in any way should be hung at sundown with the option to move to a communist country.
I'm all for DIY hunters! What kind of dick wouldn't be? Can I say that? I'll be glad to edit.
I'll shut up and let someone else post now.
Never been called a fat cat rancher. Thats a new one.LOL I think even Noah wouldn't agree with that. Not really cringing more like laughing. I guess maybe they ought to get the gallows built! Can we make it sunrise instead of sundown? Just a better time of the day. Or maybe just move to Alberta. HAHA
As far as the NMCOG throwing in with them, that ain't gonna happen. I can't speak for the SFW NM chapter as far as I know we, NMCOG doesn't have any ties to them, and I resent the very negative inference against the NMCOG.
As for "...eerily similar" you and I both know you are openly against outfitters and landowners, so you continue to bash us at every opportunity such as this.
Again as with standwithaknife it might do well to maybe get a more middle of the road mindset against outfitters and landowners. Many outfitters are public land service providers or at least the ones who depend on the lottery drawing system to get tags. Private landowners and ranchers provide a huge share of the habitat needed for the wildlife health and welfare and in a big share of areas in western states and actually help propogate for bigger numbers out on the public land. Lets try and work together not against each other!
Oh and I don't have a problem with Randy Newberg being on the board of directors of the RMEF. I think he is a great promoter of the hunting industry.
I do have a problem with all of the naysayer mudslingers on this post however.
In effect, when those vouchers are granted, public folks lose license availability.
Explain how this has not negatively impacted the public hunter.
Next, explain how these folks don't have a vested interest in reducing or eliminating public hunting licenses.
I don't need to get into this debate, but I do think the comments were directed in the right direction. I NEVER said these folks didn't work, I said that they have a vested interest in these areas, as they affect the livelihood. Please understand the difference.
I do understand and it is only natural when one's livelihood is at stake, one fights for it as best he can.
Here in NM we have very similar problems, greedy outfitters, greedy landowners and probably not quite as much private land/public access problems as you do.
Many of us in the outfitting industry are working hard to turn around these inequities and make it fair for everyone. Again and again money and greed for more is the root of all evil! It is not only individuals but State Agencies as well, and one only has to look to Utah for an example and how their tag giveaway is dividing our industry, i.e. SFW. I suppose that organization started out as a good grass roots organization, but boy it damn sure has alienated segments of the industry against each other.
Right now in the state of New Mexico the anti's are whipping our butts with all kinds of issues that directly affect us all, from gun rights to animal rights, and now to banning trapping is the newest to hit the scene today. Our liberal NM legislators (majority) are taking us down the tubes. As sportsmen we need to work and stick together more now than ever.
Best of luck Randy
It is my opinion and of many others that the back door was held wide open by the Cattle Growers and NM Guides & Outfitters associations for the SFW to step into NM politics and the NM G&F commission, the SFW are now embedded like a tick! primarily because of those two orgs. The SFW came into NM saying they were a grass roots type organization and are for the people of NM and not associated with Utah, we found out quick their intentions were to put on some perfume and get into bed with the groups that have been running NM for many many years, their plan has worked to a tee and it is the same plan they have used in other states.
NM has many similarities to what is going on in Montana and maybe even worse on some issues. I do echo many of your sentiments on the frivolous anti lawsuits and California mentality that is engulfing our state and we must work together to combat them, unfortunately you and a few other NM LO's and Guides are a minority in your respective groups. When it comes to the NM Cattle Growers and NM Outfitter & Guide Associations I personally have not seen them work with anyone who doesn't see things 100% their way, their tactics against other groups have been "you are anti LO and outfitter" which is exactly what they are saying up north in Montana.
Edit; Stoney, I imagine you will resent my thoughts of the above mentioned groups but just so you know I am not implying that you have anything to do with the SFW.
What is going on in Montana will eventually effect NM, I applaud Randy for sticking up for the DIY public hunter.
Randy: Advocating for corner hopping will only increase tensions and animosity between respectable land owners and responsible sportsman. That results in less hunting access not more.
Watching Randy's show is like a breath of fresh air for me. I will not do an outfitted/guided hunt, so it's fun to watch him and think "I could do that." I'm glad he is sticking up for us! Thanks Randy.
And your point is what? Trespassing is an unfortunate occurrence in every state in the nation. Corner hopping or not, I fail to see the relevance of this to fighting for legal access.
If a guy crosses at a corner pin, I fail to see what that is hurting anyone. If someone abuses it, prosecute them.
Or, we could just stick our heads in the sand and say EVERYTHING should be illegal so we don't have any of that nasty trespassin'.
If I had deep pockets I'd go corner hop and take it all the way to the Supreme Court. I'd win like the guy in WY did.
"Most Montanan's don't have a problem with crossing at the pin and in fact many outfitters will show you were to cross. "
I'm going to call absolute BS on this one. Many outfitters will post the public land as private and intimidate people to run them off.
I still don't understand how WY can limit my access to Federal lands, and I'm a durn attorney. If I draw WY this week, this will be an issue for my buddy and I
Bake
You could take your own case pro bono?
That truly is one of the stupidest laws ever.
JLS: many private landowners and outfitters do allow for corner hopping though you are blinded by your own interest. Lumping all private owners and outfitters into one gready category is the real BS. Creating an us against them attitude will only further strangle relations with landowners and hunters. We all can't afford a helicopter to access our favorite piece of public land. Time would be better spent to improve the dialouge with landowners intead of the advisarial role many have chosen today.
If you want to discuss actions on Randy's part that may have lead to the MOGA email, including corner crossing, that's fine and encouraged.
Kind of a fine line between the two but I don't want this to become a pissing match about corner crossing.
": "If someone abuses it, prosecute them."JLS: Define the protocal for access between corner hopping vs. tresspassing." Do you believe trespassing should be a felony? How about prior notice to the landowner? What about liability if someone is injured crossing the fence? Should we compensate the landowner for an corner easement to access public lands? Should we clearly define those access points so that they can be adequately policed? Right now corner hopping cannot be distinguished differently than tresspassing and why the Montana legislature shot down the bill."
The legislature shot down the bill in the interests of protecting the landlocked public land. WY had a case go to their Supreme Court and the defendant won.
Trepassing should not be a felony, don't be ridiculous.
There is no liability to a landowner when the person is hunting and it is not a commercial endeavor.
I don't care if you define the access points or not. Make people find them, it makes no difference to me.
No, a landowner should not be compensated for what should be a legal easement. Mark my words, this will end up in court and the whole "trespassing over airspace" argument will be dead forever.
"JLS: many private landowners and outfitters do allow for corner hopping though you are blinded by your own interest. Lumping all private owners and outfitters into one gready category is the real BS. Creating an us against them attitude will only further strangle relations with landowners and hunters. We all can't afford a helicopter to access our favorite piece of public land. Time would be better spent to improve the dialouge with landowners intead of the advisarial role many have chosen today.":
The outfitters of MT have painted themselves into the corner where they are at today. I don't agree with I-161, but it shows that you can only crap on people for so long before they get sick of it.
I am not blinded by my own interest, I have SEEN this for myself. I have seen public land posted. I have SEEN outfitters and landowners try to intimidate hunters. I am not saying all. But, don't make it sound like MT landowners and outfitters just roll out the welcome mat.
I know some very good landowners and very good outfitters. There are also plenty who will go to all means necessary to block up whatever they think is rightfully theirs. I submit the ex-senator Keith Bales to you as one example.
The Montana legislature does not give two chits about the average Joe sportsman. They have shown time and again that they are there to represent the outfitters and stockgrowers who would like to privatize wildlife and keep it away from the public.
You tell me, if this legislature cares so much about private property rights, why would they introduce a bill that would require county commissioner approval on all conservation easements?
Sorry, I hit post before I saw your request.
MOGA and WYOGA have given themselves a huge black eye with this and have shown the entire world what their priorities really are.
Seminole, Unfortunately you are implying the same adversarial attitude with your statement, you don't mention the LO/OF improving their relations with the public at all, you imply the same old one way street and it needs to work both ways.
You are right, I don't belong to or support SFW and as for the NMCOG holding the backdoor open to let Robert Espinoza, Jr. the director of NMSFW (the tick) on the NM Game Commission is a stretch at best. First of all I don't know any directors on the NMCOG who are supporters of NMSFW. Your people also bitched about rancher Bidegan being put on the NM Game Commission. The only thing I know for sure, the present Game Commission is so, so much better than most of the old Gov. Richardson appointed commissioners. Some of those greenie commissioners did more to harm NM's wildlife and sportsmen than all of the previous commissions ever. But then it boils down to politics. At least Governor Martinez is trying to hold the line on the liberal onslaught confronting our daily lives, but I don't support all of the Game Commission members she appointed.
The NMCOG is aligned with the NM Cattlegrowers and other natural resource groups in the Legislature in Santa Fe because much of our livelihoods and interests are intertwined and working together we can get more done. We are, however, different entities and do not agree or see eye to eye on everything. You make it sound as if we conspire against the regular joe sportsman. Quite to the contrary we are fighting for many of the battles that contribute to the welfare of sportsmen everywhere.
In this day and age of extreme demand for limited quantities of quality big game licenses in the western states, the battle among sportsmen, landowners and outfitters is crescendoing into a seemingly unattainable outcome.
The piece of the pie is becoming smaller and smaller and the battle to get a piece becomes harder and harder. Unfortunately the rich get richer and they are doing the bidding that overwhelms all of us who want to keep hunting from becoming a rich man's sport.
It is unfortunate that those of us whom agree on more than we disagree, have too many turning ugly against each other.
Statement on Newberg Appointment to RMEF Members of Montana Outfitters and Guides Association (“MOGA”) have supported Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation (“RMEF”) since its inception in 1984. MOGA and our members take the work of wildlife conservation very seriously. As many MOGA members are also RMEF members they have accounted for hundreds of donated trips at local and national levels in support of the RMEF Mission. As active members and major donors to RMEF many of our members have a material interest in appointments that lead this premier conservation organization.
The nomination of Randy Newberg to the RMEF board prompted numerous members to call the MOGA office expressing their concern over his nomination. Prominent among these concerns was the perception of a strong anti-outfitter and anti-landowner sentiment based on prior experiences, interactions and affiliations involving Mr. Newberg. They wanted to know how to communicate those individual concerns to the RMEF selection Board. MOGA staff contacted David Allen, RMEF President and CEO, and advised him we were receiving significant push back on the Newberg nomination. David acknowledged his awareness of those concerns and confirmed the appropriate persons to which any comments should be directed. MOGA members received an email that included appropriate contact information allowing them to offer comments directly to RMEF if they chose to do so. Nowhere in our member communications did MOGA take a position on the Newberg appointment. Nor did we encourage any member to withhold donations. Messaging that has followed, primarily posted on Mr. Newberg website, wrongly suggests that MOGA as an organization is attempting to block his appointment to the RMEF board. Our goal has been to respond to the concerns of our members and facilitate communication with the appropriate individuals at RMEF. Efforts to portray it otherwise fosters a false dialog that is unnecessarily divisive. We are increasingly concerned by the nature, tenor and rhetoric attacking our Association and our staff. We stand by our membership’s right to voice their individual opinions and will continue to encourage them to do so.
MOGA President Brett Todd has served on Senator Tester’s Sportsmen’s Caucus alongside Mr. Newberg and both individuals recognize the serious threats that exist to Montana’s wildlife and hunting heritage. In any collaborative effort in the name of conservation & wildlife, all interests need to be at the table to achieve long-lasting solutions. Let’s get back to the table and go to work.
##END##
From: Bob Looney
Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2013 6:28 PM
Subject: Randy Newberg
Can you cite one instance where Newberg stated or implied he was anti Outfitter? Just one....
cantgetdrawn's Link
Keith- Sportsmen For Wildlife, a group whose work in Utah became notorious for its privatization of public wildlife resources. They succeeded in taking unprecedented large numbers (roughly 500 per year) of Utah's public draw game tags and placing them up for raffle at their convention in SLC, and for auction there and at a multitude of other sporting conventions in Utah and elsewhere.
I'm going to join right now. It's refreshing to see an organization with principle.
This brings me to Randy's show. A couple of shows ago Randy had an elk tag in Arizona and it appeared from the way the country looked and the way he told the story he was most likely in Unit 1 near Springerville, AZ. It was so frustrating to see him basically flounder around in one of the top elk units in Arizona day after day not being able to figure out how to find the elk. This is certainly one show that the DIY attitude was very costly to what could have probably a much more productive hunt and made his probably once in a lifetime elk tag pay off with a big bull. That is certainly do able in this unit. Don't get me wrong I am a great supporter of DIY but sometimes some hunters need to swallow their pride and ask for a little help. But then success is in the eyes of the beholder. (I know, I know, most of you die hard DIY's don't need any help)
I may be way off base Randy but that is the way the show came off to me. You did however redeem yourself in one of the following shows where you took a nice bull, I think in WY. Keep up your good work!
I too let my RMEF membership lapse, but am re-upping today and will include a note as to why.
And, though all I've ever done is DIY in carious states, I don't consider myself anti-outfitter as if I ever mange to draw AZ, I'll be giving Chappell or Bif Chino a call.
Thanks to WapitiBob and MulePower for their contributions to this topic.
RMEF is an organization comprised of hunters and non-hunters who all have a deep passion for wildlife conservation. Recently an issue has arisen regarding the election one of our new Board members. The following will state our position on this issue.
RMEF is a diverse enough organization to allow for opinions/beliefs of all hunters and those non-hunters who support hunting as part of our conservation toolbox in this country. We support and work with private landowners, outfitters and do-it-yourself hunters alike; RMEF’s history speaks for itself on this issue. We intend to continue with these relationships.
Relative to the recent issue of Randy Newberg being selected for a RMEF Board seat, the leadership of the RMEF Board has notified Mr. Newberg that we welcome him to the Board beginning March 3.
RMEF strongly believes that hunter vs. hunter confrontation is non-productive for the future of hunting and wildlife conservation.
Respectfully,
John Caid M David Allen Chairman, RMEF Board President & CEO
__________________
Note to self: One bonus point for the RMEF