First Timers, rookies, greenhorns
Elk
Thought I would start a thread for us elk virgins and keep tabs on what we do to prepare and how we do once the season starts. I want to include all the unexpected twist and turns and all the grizzled veterans can say "I told you so". Everybody don't set well with egg on their face buy I want to remain transparent as possible. Advice is welcomed as is "friendly" ribbing. Who knows...might be a little bragging be for its over and possibly a HDYLMK( ' :
I just got started at trying to get in better shape. Walking some and riding my mt bike. All flat ground so far. Also just now making the transition from myturkey setup of one pin to 3 pins. Going with 20, 40, and 60....but the small voice in my head says simplify and go with 25 and 5O because with the heavy 300 FMJ Dangerous game arrows my 20 has to be high in the housing for my 60 to be above the bubble level and I don't care for my 20 being too high above center. I like it close to center in case if a fast close shot where I basically just put hair in the circle and shoot. Whatever I go with I need to do it soon. I don't like to have to think about anything under pressure.... not even yardage. I would rather see the animal and instantly see the sight picture that will get him...yardage never enters my mind. This takes lots if practice with set equipment. Right now it will be judo point practice but I want to get my Simmons dialed in soon for some live practice on hogs. Hogs present shots much the same distances as what I saw here on the shot distance thread. Hard to get 20 and under of our hogs ...easy to get 40...most shots come at 30. Havnt done anything to narrow down where I will be (Lord willing) going. Might not decide until mid August. Nothing I can do to prepare anyway. Might could look at topos and Google earth sattalite images but that still want tell me where elk are. I routenely find turkeys in places where I don't know anything about the land and hoping elk will be similar...find them then kill them.
Working nite shift ...plent of time to study up on things....I think I have come up with a diabolical plan...one that lends itsself to having high odds and doing something special....2 elks in one trip???? Maybe???
I really wish more people were like you. You are on a wonderful journey!
I'm pretty much a rookie too TBM! I have gone on one DIY elk hunt in CO about 15 years ago and called in a lot of cows! Hunted ten days and passed on a chip shot everyday! The tenth day I said I'll kill a cow if I have to, you guessed it...went home with tag soup! Great memories with my dad, but my arrogance cost me. My advice, shoot the first legal animal you can! It'll be a great accomplishment and you will not believe how good the meat is! Better than any beef I've ever ate!!! Good luck and have fun!
You know hunting basics. With those skills in the back of your mind, get into elk, don't try to over think things, put yourself in a good position to get a shot, and be patient. Even as a rookie you have a chance. Just stay out in the elk woods as long as you possibly can.
Make sure you get swede's book and the Elknut play book. Both are full of useful tips and information.
Good luck TBM! I'd still consider myself an elk virgin, although I did get to second base a few times with a couple bulls last year on my first ever elk hunt, which was DIY in Wyoming. I'm confident that I'll score this year! I have a good tag in my pocket and a bunch of mistakes under my belt. Right now I'm practicing calling on my way home from work each day. I wake up early and do either hill sprints, elliptical, weight lifting, or weighted pack hill climbs before work each day. I shoot my bow whenever it's breezy enough to keep the gnats at bay. I'm currently refletching my arrows. Slick trick standards are flying good and will be on the business end of my arrows. I correspond almost daily with some awesome people who have experience in the unit and am getting a solid game plan down for when I arrive 4 days early to scout. September is going to be awesome!!!
Elknut playbook. Interesting reading for us newbies. I've yet to kill one and not going this year but I recommend it for any flat lander.
+1 Swede-That is great advice. Elk aren't that hard to find and kill, its just that most newbies are even better at messing up a promising situation. WATCH THE WIND!!!! This is a newbies biggest nemesis-well every hunter's really-but newbies have a tendency to think they can beat the wind. You can't, so don't try.
You can kill an elk your first day out of your first year. It happens all the time. The first year my hunting partner and I elk hunted we called in two cows and two big bulls in the first three hours of hunting. The second afternoon, we had a bull on the ground.
Go into your hunt with the attitude that you will find elk, be alert and ready because if you hunt smart and move, move, move until you find steaming fresh sign, you have a very good chance of killing an elk.
More shooting and not figuring yardage...seeing the correct sight picture firing away, hitting the Gatorade bottle top or close to it. I want to be able to go from relaxed with bow by my side to putting an arrow in the air in 5 seconds. I got the fastest release hookup system and not thinking yardage shaves off a few milliseconds too. The faster I can operate the less I'll be rushed. Ran the river bank up and down today...my and my doggie. She out a shape too.
Practice so you're able to draw your bow slow and smooth with virtually no motion. I got my first elk that way. It was 9 yds from me walking by as I drew. Cows are not does. They are so much more wary than any deer.
I do not worry about my bow, I shoot a packable recurve and getting it ready and broad heads flying is the fun part. I do several gear checks with my gear prior to the hunt. I go out camping and make sure everything has a home in my pack and it Carries well. Walk in several miles find water, spend the night and pack out. You need to familarize yourself with new gear. That's the easy stuff. Now, run or hike up the mountain, run steps. Do leg blasters, and when your legs hurt and your lungs hurt, do some more everyday until they do not hurt anymore. What ever you do will not get you prepared for what your going to experience.
I'm an elk virgin too TBM, unless you count that drive-by shooting in New Mexico ( which I don't ). This will be a good thread, and I hope to see that HDYLMK in late September !
Practice shooting from you knees. I've shot a lot of elk in that position. Get elk nut's video's as well as the play book. Even as a seasoned elk hunter I learned a lot from his stuff.
Good to see some more looking to bust their first elk. Good advice showing up here and on other threads. Hopefully we can all be successful thus fall.
"Practice shooting from you knees. ". Good tip...I should have that down as much as I shoot from a blind when turkey hunting.
I still have some logistics to work out but here is a couple of ideas for my elk plans. The ego side of me says I can do this ...just go somewhere otc and get it done. Find a place with some good elk success ratios and go kill a good one. Simple. My logical side says take the advice of some others...get a cow tag in a good area and kill an elk. The more I think about it the more I like the cow tag idea...but my ego side don't care for the idea at all....unless....there is still a chance I could do something spectacular...or I could fall flat on my face. If by chance I don't kill a cow...forwhatever reason...can't acclimate, get sick, fizzle out, get home sick, there is s good chance I wouldn't have killed a bull either. Besides(not sour grapes..just fact) I don't really have the money to mount a bull if I kill one. The cow will give me a chance at the full elk experience at a cheaper price, plus a little less to pack out should I kill one, plus the tastier meat than a bull can offer. Should I fill my tag middle to late in the hunt, I just pack up and turn the ram horns east. But...should I turn out to be some mountain eating , elk killing genius of some sort...kill a cow early in the hunt I can always swing by a otc state, buy a bull tag and hunt more....except now with a cooler of fresh meat, I can be extremely choosy and hold out for an exceptional bull....might be a 250 but if he looks exceptionally big to me, I might double up. That's what I'm thinking right now...might change as I research things better.
TBM- Just FYI, in Colorado the otc tags for archery are either sex.
Get there in plenty of time to get aclimated to the elevation. I went and followed some friends last year for a couple days. Really glad I got to the their cabin a full day before them to start adjusting. I had been walking and riding my bike since early spring. Thought I was in decent shape until opening morning and we started climbing to treeline. You soon feel that your pack chest strap is too tight and start unzipping your jacket. Something about the lack of oxygen gets your attention really quick.
Stop over thinking it. You are planning too much. Decide what animal you want to shoot. Shoot your first elk first, then worry about filling a second tag. Also, like LUNG$HOT pointed out, OTC tags are either sex.
Don't underestimate cows. They are not hiding behind every bush. They also are not feeling the same effects of the rut as the bulls. Many times, the bulls are the easy ones to find. A lot of guys think cows are like consolation prizes. They are not. Cows can be very difficult to kill.
Get your gear ready, try to find a good spot and go hunt. That is about all you can control.
Camp by the main roads in the NF and stay mobile. Getting back in "the wilderness" is hugely overrated. Scout before you hunt by driving around and glassing with binoc and spotter. Only hunt where you know there are animals and the sign is still steaming.
TBM, if you go and kill a cow Elk your first time Elk hunting with archery equipment that will be a huge accomplishment.
If you go and hold out for a Bull and eat tag soup your just one of hundreds...
If you kill a cow with archery I'll think your a very good hunter. If you kill a bull I'll think you just got lucky. I'd bet most other guys will see it the same way. Goodluck and great thread idea! Mike
Don't feel like you have to hide when you get close to elk, stay on your feet so you can lean, twist, slide step to get a shooting lane, etc. Let your camo work and just stand still! You limit your options once you tuck into a bush or get on your knees.
Don't be afraid to take a chance and/or make a mistake.
Practice at 60 to 70 yard, even if you don't shoot animals that far. It will make you a better shot at 40 - 50 yards. Also, do some sort of physical activity and then immediately shoot your bow at say 20 - 30 yards. This will prepare you if you are walking up a hill/mtn. and have an unexpected encounter or shot opportunity. Practice these shots standing and kneeling.
If you are still hunting elk in the trees, use your binoculars. You will be surprised what you might spot . . . an antler, ear twitching, etc. Use your nose . . . many time you will smell elk before you see them.
Don't think that you have to be hidden behind a tree.
If you can draw your bow slowly (to the point where it doesn't even look like you are moving), you can kneel in front of a tree or a bush (your outline is broken up either way)....and still get a shot. Don't forget, if you are facing the animal and you already have the bow up, there is less noticeable motion required(as viewed from the front) compared to the amount of motion as viewed from the side (profile)....as your draw arm doesn't "appear" to be moving as far.
Unlike turkey hunting, scent control is critical. You MUST pay attention to the wind and the daily thermals....in fact, you should be planning your stalk around them......
Medicinemann just said what I was thinking. Don't hide behind a bush or tree when and elk is coming in cause if you do you will be busted when you try to draw. Get in front of some brush and make sure you draw BEFORE they are on top of you. And I agree that any elk on your hunt will make it successful. Good luck!!!
First off congrats on going on your first elk hunt TBM. Second, where are you hunting this year? This will be my first year archery hunting elk, so I guess I'm a newbie to that aspect of it. I've been hiking, packing, and camping alone a lot lately. It's really helped me get to know my new gear, and figure out what I really need to take with me, and what I don't really need to take with me. I'm getting more familiar with my gps, marking water, old rubs, wallows, and other areas in my unit. I've been shooting a lot too. Actually too much. I've got a bit of tennis elbow right now, so I haven't shot in the last week trying to let it heal up. It sounds like you have the itch and the drive to be successful on your hunt. The only thing I would mention is possibly moving up to a 5 or 7 pin sight. Going with a 20, 40, and 60 yard pin really leaves a lot of guessing in between pins. We've been going up to the mountains and setting a target in a location and walking around to different spots and trying to range, nock, draw, and fire as quickly as we can. Even with my 7 pins (20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, and 80) there's a lot of guess work between my further pins (like trying to shoot 55 yards and holding between my 50 and 60 yard pins). That would be my only suggestion to you. But then again I'm a newbie to this whole archery thing myself. I'm just going off of info that my friends have given me, and they all have killed multiple elk.
A young bull is easier to kill than a cow in September. They respond to calls better. They also taste just as good as a cow.
Prepare yourself mentally! Keep your calorie intake up even when you dont feel like you will want to eat. Drink plenty of water as well.
Like JMG said dont be afraid to take chances. I feel my partner and myself were to cautious last year. There are times you need to be aggresive.
Last but not least have fun. Because when your on your way home you will be wishing you were on your way back in and you will have to wait a year to do it.
"Cows are not does. They are so much more wary than any deer."
You're kidding, right?
Lots of great advice! Three in particular are important enough to bear repeating IMO.
1.) NEVER set up behind a tree or bush, or you'll wish you hadn't!
2.) Keep the wind in your favor at all costs, even if you have to risk moving. You can sometimes fool their eyes. You can sometimes fool their ears. You will NEVER fool their nose!
3.) Be selectively aggressive. By that, I mean if the conditions just aren't right, it's ok to back out and leave the herd until the odds are better. When the condition ARE right, however, then go all in. You want to make the bull so mad that HE makes a mistake! Most inexperienced elk hunters are way too timid at the wrong time.
One other tip I'll add. Try to become proficient with a diaphragm. You can make all the elk vocalizations and, best of all, it's hands-free. No better way to stop a bull for a shot than a well-timed mew.
Hi,
I am in pretty much the same boat as you are TBM. I have some recent posts here looking for information on DIY hunts.
Although I have been on three outfitted elk hunts, I have not been very successful. The first two were archery and the last was rifle. I finally shot a spike on the last day of the third hunt. In a way, I wish I'd have let him walk. I killed him more to finally "get it done" than anything else. I had an easy shot on a small 5 or 6 point on the first day of that same hunt and ... Turns out he was big for the area I was in and would have bested the bulls that my three buddies got on that trip!
Anyway, if you have not "discovered" this yet: in Utah you can get an OTC "any elk" tag. It's the General Season Archery tag (NR $393) and is good pretty much state-wide. From what I've gathered, it's good for the type of elk (bull, cow, spike) depending on the type of area you're hunting in (i.e., could be a spike only area, etc.). Download the Big Game Field Reg's booklet on the wildlife.utah.gov website and read page 18. There's a lot more to know of course, but it's a good place to start if interested.
Don't be afraid to drop into those deep canyons/basins to get after them. If you stand on top and just listen to them without going in you will regret it the whole way home.
I just reread my post and something got left out: I passed up on that 5-6 pointer on day one of hunt three! In hindsight, not one of my smarter moves!
But I'm really back to let you now that you can also get a second elk in Utah as well. The Tag I mentioned covers the earlier archery season. There are other options as well. The folks at G&F are real helpful and very patient with idiots like me: 801-538-4700
New guys generally wait too long to draw the bow. It's over before the bull even stops walking.
I'd pass on the cow tag and get an either sex tag. On our hunt last year (first elk hunt) we had many more encounters with bulls than cows and there is no doubt that our chances of killing one were better just because you could hear them and chase them. Coming home with tag soup, my best memories of the hunt were when I targeted specific bulls and got into screaming matches with them. It wouldn't have been the same hunt had we only had cow tags.
If I were you, I'd get an either sex tag and shoot the first legal elk you can. There is a good chance it will be a bull. If you want to continue hunting, then get a cow tag.
"New guys generally wait too long to draw the bow. It's over before the bull even stops walking."
I am guilty. It haunts me.
Who's going to make sure I have plenty of toilet paper to wipe my ass while you're off chasing elk?
I just want make sure you've arranged "coverage" if you know what I'm saying.
Here are a couple things I wish I had known on my first elk hunt:
First, if you are calling, make it as easy as possible for an elk to come check you out. If you are hunting "broken country" where there is a mix between open meadows or parks and timber, don't make an elk walk across an open area to get into bow range. This can be where being aggressive really pays off. I don't stop closing distance on a bugling bull until I am sure I am just about to see him. Especially if you are working a big bull on public ground, most will not step into the open in which case he will most likely hang up and leave.
Second, if you are calling, put a terrain feature like a hill between you and the elk so he has to be in range to see you. I have never seen an animal pin point the location of a call like an elk. You need to see it to believe it. If you are calling and there is 100 yards of visibility, that bull will probably not come any closer than 80 yards. They know when they should see another elk.
Finally, learn what different bugles mean. So many hunters just want to learn bugling to call and they learn a locator bugle and a bugle with grunts, but you can tell alot about a bull by his bugle. The two main things I listen for are lip bawl bugles, which in my experience mean he has cows with him so watch out for extra sets of eyes. And just what I would call a half assed bugle. You hear these bugles early in the season, it is a weak locator bugle. This bull has no interest in you or your calls, he is saying,"I'm here" and that is it. He isn't looking for cows and doesn't want a fight. I usually keep moving and looking for more vocal/aggressive bulls.
If it's your first time make the most of every bugle you hear. You never know when things will work out, but you might understand what I'm saying about the uninterested bulls by the end of the season.
Knowing what bugle you are hearing can greatly influence how you can go about hunting that bull. Some of this stuff just takes a little experience but I encourage you to not just listen for bugles but really listen to how the bugle sounds and then notice how the hunt plays out. After a couple years you will see the patterns.
Andyj I see you are from Colorado...probably not a serious turkey Hunter, but what you described would kill you more turkeys than you could imagine. With turkeys you want to be on the same ridge with them and if he is on the side of the ridge you will need to get higher on the ridge than he is. He will always try and get above you. It's always easier to call them down the edge of an opening than across the middle. I think muffled over the hill calls have more drawing power than clear nothing but air between you and them calls. Turkeys will not cross from one ridge to another but rather strut on the side and look across. They are called up hill easier than down, but will get above you on a ridge and walk to the edge and peep over to look and see if they can see a hen. Not trying to give you Turkey tips here...just trying to see if any other Turkey tactics apply to elk hunting.
Read all the books and watch all the videos you want, but nothing, i mean nothing will prepare you for the mental toughness required to hunt elk for a week to 10 days at 10,000ft
You will have your ups, your downs, trials and tribulations. When you think its all over, an elk will be standing there within range. Your whole season comes down to just a few seconds.
Will you be ready?
If you are, you're in the 10% club.
Skipnoid I been reading your thread and it is what convinced me going for a cow in a good area would be best. Now after reading today I'm not sure again. Everyone knows I want a bull and I guess trying for a cow first is considered a waste of time...plus it seems like that a cow might be harder than a bull that is by himself. Kind of like turkeys. Lonely gobblers are the easiest to call. Anyway not much progress made today in the form of preparation. Looking for a frigrator box to cut out a soulowet of a elk.
Well, I'm just barely out of the beginner's box myself, so take it for what it's worth but understand that I WOULD BE going for a bull if I had the option. My trip in (mid-to-late) September is a pronghorn hunt, not an elk hunt. And THAT was a last-minute trip to boot. I just planned this whole thing on a whim last week when I was laying awake with ionsomnia! I just figured that if I'm going to drive 1000 miles anyway, I might as well have some fun along the way ... or now, more likely on the way back.
In the process I've learned a lot about the different seasons in the States along my route. It all started as a quest for an antelope tag as close to home as possible, which is Arizona. Even though there are huntable populations of PH here, I did not get drawn. So my options are either OTC and/or leftover tags ... and of course big-money guided hunts, which is not a real option for me! If fact tomorrow is the day that the leftover PH tags come up for sale in WY. Keep your fingers crossed for me! It's a mostly private property zone and there are 218 tags available, so hopefully I'll get one. If not, this whole trip is probably going to be a bust ... at least my current plan will be! That said, I've learned a lot about CO and UT, and I would probably just make this an elk trip to one of those states instead.
As for the elk part of my plan, that is also dependent upon the WY draw too. I will be trying for one of 162 available cow/calf tags in the zone I've decided upon. Those come up for sale a week from tomorrow.
If you want to take advantage of any of the info 've gathered, PM me and I'll give you all I've got!
Tight lines! ... oh yeah, wrong website ... Shoot straight!
Disclaimer: I am NOT an expert but I have killed some elk.
One of the many mistakes I have made is not staying mentally sharp. Fatigue and not seeing any elk for hours (or days) tends to make your mind wander and then when you least expect it you stroll over a rise rather than sneak over the rise and all hell breaks loose and elk are running everywhere.
A veteran elk hunter told me to stop when I get tired or discouraged about not seeing elk. Eat something, regroup mentally, then start again. It seems to keep me hunting rather than just walking.
Lost Arra- A great tip. Every elk hunter is full of piss and vinegar on the morning of day 1. Much tougher on Day 5 to be sharp and be willing to push.
When you stop for lunch or nap, lay your bow down, nock an arrow. (Keep your release handy or in my case, my fingers are always handy) ALWAYS be prepared.
Never call unless you are in a good setup (RE Wind, thinking about where you expect an elk, etc) Nothing worse than kicking a rock, letting out a squeak and taking a few steps to be caught with your pants down staring at an elk.
Cnelk is right. You're standing at 10k and hear one bugle 800 feet above you, so you charge up there. By the time you get there, he's dropped 1000 feet crossed a small creek drainage and made it halfway up the next ridge. Separates the men from the boys. All I did my first two years was catch multiple ass whoopins. It sure is fun though. I'm going back.
Shoot the first legal elk that walks by! If I'd done that instead of listening to my ego I'd be 2-3 instead of 0-3 on elk...
KJC , oh not kidding. Here's my experience on elk and deer. If your driving and spot a deer at 4-5 yds you can glass them for hours. You spot elk and stop your vehicle and they are out of there. They just don't tolerate anything out of the ordinary and those fricken lead cows are a pain in the butt if your after a bull. My first elk was a lead cow. She came in solo with the heard watching her 100yds away. I shot her and the rest of the heard just hung around as long as I kept cow calling. They were confused at that point without her. Watch a heard of elk sometime on TV. You'll have a lead cow and on the flanks sentry cows that will stop every so often to survey whats going on. The more cows the worse it gets. Now I've been in the middle of large heards(2-4 hundred elk) and you can get away with a lot of movement. They don't seem to be as spooked by your scent either. Some may run but only a short ways. It's happened to me twice where i hunt.
Try and get out there a day or two in advance this way u allow your body to adjust to the alt!!! Also once u find a herd stay with them at all cost unless they wind u Ive dogged herds all day following them into there beds , waited till they got up and killed them later that day !! also if I do a location call and get a response I usually wont answer back but make a mad rush run towards the bull/herd If u call to far out most bulls will pick up and leave I have better success killing a bull with a bugle then a cow call cow calls are fun u will get a ton of response but usually the herd bull just sits there screaming at u never to come in !! You have to play elk like a fiddle in your case a Banjo !!! Best of Luck Louis
Yep, I'm a first timer, rookie and greenhorn.
I will be in Idaho, 10 miles in on horseback, camp, then spike camp. Can't wait, sure seems addicting!! In one hand, I wish I started elk hunting earlier, and on the other, I'm sure I will suck in every moment, every smell, noise and hopefully the elk experience.
In reality my brain had been on overload with all the videos, and reading.
Any elk would be a bonus, but the experience I feel , like my Mt. Lion hunt is going to be nothing short of amazing.
TBM don't WASTE yr coin on them elknut videos I still think I have that set I could hardly watch the whole set ! Very bad production If u want I can dig um up if I didn't toss them !!! Also If u bugle u want to sound like a mature bull not some spiker !!! In a herd u might find numerous bulls the larger bulls keep the dinks in line with just a glance !! they are not in any shape threatened by a young bull !!! sounding like a spiker will not piss a dominate bull enough to come unglued and turn and fight !!!!Be ready it usually happens fast !!!
A little bit of training today...walked barefoot in swift water Rocky slimy bottom for balance and strengthing stuff normal treadmill type walks don't get. Feet getting tough...cut grass barefoot with push mower...mostly to keep the dog crap off my shoes.
You'll want to elkhunt barefoot too TBM. That will keep the elk droppings off your nice boots.
OMG TBM, now that was funny lmao.
Yeah, cuz dog crap on your bare feet is sooooooo much better...now that's funny!
DL, Here's my experience. I've only been on three elk hunts. This September will be four. I shot a cow 4th day of my first hunt. I had cows all around me. That was the 2nd time that week that I was "covered up" in cows. On my next two hunts I had multiple opportunities at cows that were, once again, all around me. I came close a few times but was never able to close the deal on a bull. Hopefully this year will be different.
I've been hunting whitetails for 35 years. I've killed hundreds of them. I've shot many, both bucks and does, from the ground in spot and stalk situations. In all that time, hundreds of days in the field, I've never been "covered up" in does. Stalk up to a small group, yes. But be on the ground with whitetail does all around me and unaware, never. But it's happened on every elk hunt so far.
Covered up in cows....hmmm...I got to check the regs cause 2 in one shot is going to be tempting and aunt no dought the Simmons and my 900 grain arrow will clear a couple
So, what does HDYLMK mean? Just out of curiosity
The k stands for futur elk killer. I get a good walk in today and shot the Simmons some. I still have to impute some torque to get good flight with the tigershark.
The first year I rifle hunted a bull, they told me that only 30% or less of hunters got one. I wonder what the bow stats are?
I see why everybody wants to draw a unit because it's hard to decide which otc unit to hit or even which state. I do know I would rather hunt mid September when the bulls are bugling. I also know I don't want to be out there with gun hunters, muzzle loaders included.
I see why everybody wants to draw a unit because it's hard to decide which otc unit to hit or even which state. I do know I would rather hunt mid September when the bulls are bugling. I also know I don't want to be out there with gun hunters, muzzle loaders included.
>>The first year I rifle hunted a bull, they told me that only 30% or less of hunters got one. I wonder what the bow stats are?<<
I read 15-18% (could be Colorado, I don't remember)
Our campfire discussions put residents at 25%, private land non residents at 20% and the DIY non-residents at around 8-10%
We were tired and elk-less at the time, so we could have been wrong.
What are the conditions that make the bulls bugle. With turkeys most days only 10 to 25% of the toms gobble, but occasionly close to all of them will . Are elk like that where sertain conditions will bringon the bugling?
There's always exceptions to the rule, but normally cool, wet weather is much better than hot, dry weather. Biggest factor is cows. When a cow goes into estrus, bulls can go nuts regardless of weather. Things can change fairly quickly. I've heard literally hundreds of bugles one day, then not a peep the next.
don't get the cow only tag. My hunting partner did that last year. The other two of us had bull or cow. We both shot bulls. My friend came in to see where I shot mine as I was going in for my last load of meat. What do we see 50 yrds ahead of us on the way in? 5 x5 bull. Young one by himself. I got behind my friend and did a cow call and he came in 20 yrds broadside. Couldn't shoot him. He worked the next 6 days to try to fill that cow tag but never got the chance.
For all the effort to get there go for the bull/cow tag so you don't find yourself in that situation. We went out and called about upgrading but he would have had to rip up the cow tag and buy a new bull/cow tag and he didn't want to lose the $325 and pay another $585 (last years prices)
I will take that in consideration Guar. I think it's his is the direction everyone is pushing me to go. Any other rookies not equipped like me. I have no game meat way of packing. I am thinking about feed sacks. I have no pack frame. I have a blind toting contraption made by Magnus. Will that work?
Getting a cow only tag will virtually cut your chances of killing an elk in half.
Tbm, I wouldn't use feed sacks. Round up some old pillowcases, or buy some cheap ones. They work OK. Can't help you with the pack. Somebody you know have one laying around?
I don't personally know anybody who has been on this type of hunt. Packingin several miles and packing animals out on you back is something I have only read about. It's all going well o be knew to me.
If you use ebay, you can find cheap packs on there. Craigslist is another great option that you don't need to register for in order to use. I'd think for $20-$50 you'd be able to find something that will do the trick. Make sure you get one with a sandpaper pocket so you can keep it handy for conditioning.
Major $$ setback today...got rolled up on by the city blue coats informed my liscense plate was expired...turned out they all were. $435 unexpected is going to be hard to recoup. Need tires on another vehicle before I go. This my be the game breaker...I'm gone be so dissapointed....the trip is hanging on by a sewing thread of hope.
I have a pack if u need it will do the job I used it in Canmore it has sheep blood on it
"Make sure you get one with a sandpaper pocket so you can keep it handy for conditioning"
Maybe a dumb question but: HUH?
I must be a lot like TBM ... I'm certainly in the same boat as he ... but the only thing I use sandpaper for while hunting is to keep my glass turkey call fresh!
Enlighten me!
Self inflicted setbacks are the worst kind.
I been working on my feet trying to toughen them up some. I got em asfault ready, but not jagged rock ready yet. I think barefoot is best for stalking and I want to be ready. Sounds like stalk is the best option in otc units where everybody is blowing a bugle. City do you go in with a backpack on a packing frame where you can pack meat out on the first trip out. I'm a little confused on the logistics of the hunt backpac and the pack frame for meat. I normally don't like to jinx myself by preparing for a kill untill I kill but I don't want a speck of meat to ruin either.
If you're tough enough to hunt barefoot then I would think you're tough enough to pack meat without a frame!
Barefoot elk hunting? Tbm you're gonna hurt yourself. Some other guy is gonna have to quarter you up and pack you out when you come up lame. Get some Moccasins or something for gods sake. Maybe some of those ridiculous 5 toe footie things they sell. Man up TBM. I wanna see a HDYLMK sometime in September.
TBM im like u I don't like to JINX myself I usually kill when my pack is miles away LOL , I carry a daylid with game bags I move meat to a safe area on my shoulders if I have too If u need a pack just PM me I will send out
Might want to condition your bare feet with some crushed ice. Good chance we'll get some snow a time or two with El Nino this year.
Great pic CH ... ever have to use that cannon?
You can make noise to stalk elk. Elk make a lot of noise as they go through the woods. Forget the sneaky feet idea. Instead, try to sound like elk. Kick some logs, pop some sticks, make a few calm herd sounds. I've "elked" my way right into herds before and killed the herd bull before anybody figured out I wasn't one of them.
I will check on the rackpac first and see if it will work. Mike Solm sent it to me a few years ago and I never used it but remember it was kind of neet. I feel fat. Just looked at the calander and it's less than 2 months away. I hate this anti excercise culture down here. I want to park 5 miles from work and walk back and forth from there but everybody thinks your crazy... I worry about that.
TBM,
I hate for a man to use a lame excuse. I also hate to see a dime holding up a dollar.
I will let you borrow my back pack for your trip. I live 1 mi. off of I-20. You will be passing by my house on your way to parts unknown. You can drop by my house and pick it up enroute and drop it off on your return to Alabama.
You say you can deliver the heat- I have successfully used it and several of my friends have also used it to bring meat back to camp. Would not want it's track record ruined.
Just need to know date & time of meeting. I will provide you with directions for pick up.
Man up TBM, and don't worry about what people think. Hell, we all think your'e crazy, but that's part of your charm ! I'm with patdel, HDYLMK !!!!!
Big thanks for the offer City, but I will just swing by and pick up Bufs...he is right on the way.
TBM thanks for starting this thread it is my annual elk refresher course. I think all my hunst are successful with a kill or not however, these guys on here are the best of the best!! I received some great advice years ago to read Mike Lapinski's Elk hunting books and I have and do every year or so!! Good hunting friend!! Rob
TBM,
I have a Cabelas Alaskan frame and bag (used in Colorado twice) that I can dig out of storage...Not sure where you are, but I am in Pensacola and I have a new property that we are working on regularly in the Pineapple/Awin/Greenville area. You can have the pack if you can meet somewhere to pick it up or if it's not that expensive I guess I could ship it to you.
I also have a Badlands 2200, but not sure that's enough pack....either one, just let me know.
Back to the bare feet thing: Up high you have pine needles, pine cones, talus fields and snow. Down low you have cactus...don't take off your boots. I wear trail running shoes, but I would never go barefooted. Keep in mind it is helpful if you can RUN when you need to, to get in front of the elk. You will probably make a lot more noise and definitely a lot more movement pussy footing your way through the woods. IMO elk aren't even close to as cagey as whitetails, so don't worry about the noise. One last thing: if you cut you foot and it gets infected (likely since so many leave a decent first aid kit at home) it will shut your hunt down in a hurry or make every step of it miserable...keep your shoes on.
TBM - I've only got a few years under my belt myself, but my advice for a first timer is to get in the best physical condition possible. Walking in flat county might not prepare you for packing out an elk by yourself. I hunt about 2.5-3 miles from my car, and it usually takes me 4 hrs (round trip) of packing per quarter. Packing quarters up and down mountains takes legs of steel.
Good Luck! I'm sure it will be a memorable adventure.
I have a question.In your guys experience,do cattle being in an area effect the elk being there? Like if cattle water at a hole, would elk use the same hole at the same time, during the same day, not at all?
Thanks
TBM, don't get a cow tag. Get an either sex tag. In 3 yrs elk hunting, I've killed 2 bulls and had exactly zero shots on a cow.
CO has either sex archery elk tags OTC as do ID and OR.
Cattle are like mushroom pickers....they have a way is showing up at the most inopportune times. Panhandle I'm going to borrow Buffalo's. I have a rackpack and it will do fro training. It might be a pack frame but it's incorporates a chair system too. I stepped up the training today and covered close to 5 miles...some of it was on the tracks, zigzagging back and forth over the rails and down to the ditch on each side, slipping on the racks and battling uneven slopes and poor footing. It was very fatigueing and used muscles flat ground don't. Will start pack training next week.
The area I hunt is grazed heavily by cattle during the season and I would say at most they are a minor annoyance to the elk. Many times we have seen elk mixed in with the cattle on the out skirts of the cattle herd.
Sheep are a different story. If there are sheep in the area, pack your gear and head to another spot. Elk don't seem to tolerate sheep at all.
Last year was my first year hunting elk, but they seemed to avoid the cattle in the wilderness area I was hunting. The elk were all at least a half-mile away. But that's a beginner's observation.
elk don't like cattle they will be in same gen area but not usually by choice due to water or feed ,, cattle usually push elk out of the area were I hunt
If I run into cattle, I move on. If elk were there before, they seem to disappear when cattle move in.
Besides, I hate hunting around livestock. It takes away from the "wilderness" experience.
Put in an hour on the treadmill this am. Covered 3.6 miles. Going to order the altitude mask next week and incorporate that into my workouts.
When I read through this thread I get the bad feeling some elk hunter is going to find TBM with this note pinned to his shirt:
I, TurkeyBowMaster, being of sound mind and broke feet, do leaveth my bow to the next thing who finds it, Lord hope he be a southern man. It is a good bow, and kilt the turkeys at the next level. Anyway, I am lost. Sincerely, TurkeyBowMaster.
Keep working hard TBM, I sincerely hope you prove us all wrong in the end. Cold crow is delicious, God knows I've ate a bunch in my lifetime.
Brotsky,
Another nominee for Post of the Year!!
TBM,
On a treadmill, if you can go 20 minutes at 4.0 MPH at 4% grade with a 40#pack 5/6 days a week- you should be in fair shape.
Good luck
I don't know about the pack...that might be a game changer, but I could the 4 at 4% for an hour without a pack. I had it up to 15% and had to slow down to 3. I'm doing some unorthodox training too...walking in knee deep 3 mph current and zigzagging back and forth over the tracks that have deep ditches and loose slag is a killer.
I just ate a pepper jack cheese burger the size of a dinner plate - and onion rings.
I gotta get focused - 2 months to go.
I just ate a big green chili burrito while going over maps with my local game warden. Way more valuable than an hour of trail running! :-)
TBM's bow wouldn't be equivalent to the 'ol 50 cal. that Jeremiah found though! TBM, elk don't know how many legs a horse has btw. This is a good tip. ;)
Not sure if it was mentioned above, but Public Land Elk Hunting by fellow bowsiter DirtyD is a great inexpensive book for a guy prepping for his first elk trip.
Unless you roll your truck or someone gets hurt, its hard to not have a successful elk trip. Sneaking along in great country while a bull sounds off up ahead is good stuff.
Just ate half a bag of pizza rolls and we are having brats tonight.
I havent eaten in 3 days. Fasting myself. Its my new top secret tactic. HUNT
3 miles on the threadmill and some one the eliltical climber and stationary bike...over an hour non stop cardio.
I don't wear shoes most of the summer, unless mandatory, like when I go to the gym, toughens up your feet for if you need to make a barefoot stalk, plus, it freaks people out when you can run barefoot where they can't walk
Walks mixed with a running are getting easier...need to step it up but can't get as motivated as I need too because everone who knows me says I want have any trouble with the mountains and they have been out there. I need some negative reinforcement to get me going. Vegus has my odds of success 3 to 1 in spite if an untuned bow, not sighted in, arrows not done, very little practice and prep and don't even know where I'm going. The Turkey hunting experience is carrying the load now and when everything else comes into place odds should get 1 to 1....maybe even 1 to 2.
TBM. My wife and I just returned from camping at 10,000 in the Colorado Flat Top Wilderness area. We hiked 2-3 miles to three different lakes to fish and she did a 8 mile round trip hike, gained 1100 ft, by herself.
She is 62, not athletic and has medium asthma but made all of the trips without a whine with a 25 lb back pack.
Should be a piece of cake for you. Do what you are doing. Give yourself a couple days to get use to the elevation before charging out, and just go for it. It took us two days to get use to the altitude but we just took it easier and then picked up the pace.
25 years ago I left Ohio to elk hunt Colorado and my training consisted of running, jogging, and the only hill I had to climb was about 50 feet tall at the local golf course which I would do 10 times per run.
I was 49 years at that time.
Like trout, elk don't live in ugly places. Some day you might catch a mermaid or kill an elk and then salute the experience with a tin cup of bourbon and a prayer.
Paul
Dad gum this is seriously serious...it hurts. I want be walking far with this. Is the Rack Pak a good pack or what?
TBM - Your ability to marshal on relentlessly, regardless of abuse, should serve you well with whatever you do. You just have to believe in yourself. And no one believes in you like you do. I wish you luck. You are a good sport about being a good target.
HUNT - I don't mean to sound hypercritical, but I don't think you're supposed to advertise top secret.
TBM remember these words: Like anything you want bad enough... it is more mental than physical. If you give up you won't achieve your goal. If you push on and continue to do your best there is always a chance to succeed.
Key words are "your best". You don't have to be an Olympic athlete to kill elk. There are old guys, fat guys... and even dumb guys who punch their elk tags every year. While some have had a little luck the common thread amongst successful elk hunters is persistence.
I know people who are not the model of fitness that kill bulls. (me lol) I also know trim and fit "pussies" who don't.... because they whine every step of the way until the give up. Just keep putting one foot in front of the other and you'll get there man.
Print out this post and read it when times get tough and show us the dead bull when you get back.
great looken elk photos. cant wait to get the season rolling. best of luck to you all. may you have a safe and successful 2014 www.alloutoutfitters.com
Paul,
That last photo was dandy.....
Got my altitude mask ordered...soon I'll be at 12000 feet...all while walking the banks of the tombigbee. Feet are getting in sheep shape...Walking barefoot on pavement...sometimes rough pavement while toting a 70 pound load. That puts 270 pounds on each foot. Another month to toughen up. My goal is to tapdance barefoot with thumbtacks.
With all I am doing, I can't believe I'm gaining weight. Going to 're join the gym tomorrow...time to hit the iron. Next level for the next month. Got my arrow squaring tool ordered along with herbs Yellowstone sharpening powder. Can't wait to try both. The big Simmons Tigershark are impacting about 4 inches left of the judo points but flying straight...I think things need tweaking a little but scared to mess with it. Grouping good with the big bleeder installed. Going to hunt with the smaller lock in vented bleeder.
Jake, this has always been one of my favorite ones.
Should inspire some to climb the mountain.
My best, Paul
Yikes...still not comfortable shooting even two arrows of the same kind. The two low left are Simmons tigersharks. The one a little high is a 125 Landshark. This is at 50 yards...fmj are doing good.
elk should be out of velvet soon !!!!
Suffered a setback mentally this morning...my thighs fatigued while carrying a 60 pound load and I only went about a mile. I have been carrying that load without any negative results but this am I was barefoot and walking on a gravel road so every step had to be placed perfect and some adjustments had to be made when stepped on sharp rocks and I guess that simulates what you would have to do on rough terrain but my legs just gave out on me that easy. Oh well, it's getting me into fantastic deer treestand shape is that's a plus.
Finallly!!! Getting to the hump. Maybe over the hump. I feel like Humpty doing the Humpty hump dance. Everything is getting easier. Changing my intake some too and having less problems with heart burn with less caffeine in take. Another 3 weeks and I out to be shining. I was at 9000 feet this am on my altitude mask setting and humped put almost 4 miles....that was after the 2 late last night carrying 60+ pounds. I ain't nothing recovering or waiting to recover...everyday is a killer workout day. Get ya some...come on..gonna leave ya in the dust...it's on like a rib bone..
Dangitman now that I know it's on like a rib bone, I got work to do!!Love the eenthusiasm and I hope u shoot two of them!! Keep up the effort and thanks for the laughs!
I would find some steep hills to use with that altitude mask. At 9000 ft I can't tell the difference between it and 6k until I start climbing. Flat surfaces in thin air are pretty easy it's the climb that will get you.
Got all but a couple arrows spinngin true with the Simmons this am. Tobinsgoast that's mt Everlast..aunt no elk ever been that high. There down in a he aspens and lower. U just trying to intimidate.
LINK- Or you can can just smoke a cigarette while hiking hills. As legendary alpine climber and chain smoker says, "Smoking is great training for high altitude. It makes every breath feel like you are at 8,000 meters".
No sir! We seen elk on both sides of this mountain right at treeline which was 200 to 300 yards below the top. They have game trails right along the inside and are covered by the trees. The elk feed up at night to this area and head down to bed. Sure u can kill one down below in the aspens but know they can be up high as well. No intimidation intended, just the truth.
Elk love the above treeline stuff! here are 2 at 12,200' right at daybreak. Nothing higher than your shin for 5-600 yards around them. 3 miles and -2000 vertical back to the truck
Tibinsghost that last picture looks steep.
It is but I saw these on the other side so it was worth it!!
TBM,
What day do you leave for your bowhunt out west?
Leaving the second week in Sep. Hopefully if I can figure out what Montana permits I need I will go there for elk and a muly of wt and if I can get them quick I will head over to Idaho for spot and stalk mountail lion, wolf and possibly a nuther elk. It is going to be a full week of hunting and I am sure I will come up with a few lines for my elk rap song while I'm at it.
TBM, I'm pretty confident you'll get at least one elk, a trophy muley, and either a cougar or a wolf by spot-stalk. You're that determined and dreaming large. Two elk in different states in a week will be a challenge due to the pack-out time required.
I once killed a nice bull on opening day, packed it out the next day (with the help of a friend with a horse), drove to Denver for a Kinks concert the next day, killed a P&Y muley the day after that, packed him out the next morning, all with a hard cast on my broken shooting hand. Could've probably killed a bear from the stink of the cast as bait but I decided to go home and get the nasty thing cut off and replaced.
Lou... Kinks, lol(a)
TBM is more likely to kill a grouse, find a moonshine still, pack it out, go a see Billy Ray Cyrus where he picks up a cougar, and then write a thread about it that goes 500 posts before fading away.
Got the Simmons dialed in at 25...Will set the 50 later. 40 should be halfway between.
And you can use the bottom of your sight block for 80 with just a little alabamie windage for anything at 100.
Killer day today. Started off at 1 am walking the cardio course going up and down stairs, bear crawling, box jumps, etc. Did that for an hour. At 7 am I biked 2 miles to the gym, did 5 miles in an hour on the treadmill, a little on the stationary bike and some leg strengthening excersizes. Then ride bike 2 miles back home. When I get up I walk to Wal-Mart and back, one like each way. I'm feeling it.
My training paid off hopefully yours will...pic was yesterday, 8/28
