Moultrie Products
bug damage at tannery
Bears
Contributors to this thread:
Deerman1 26-Jan-16
Bear Track 26-Jan-16
FullCryHounds 26-Jan-16
Cazador 26-Jan-16
wkochevar 26-Jan-16
Deerman1 26-Jan-16
Drahthaar 27-Jan-16
venison 27-Jan-16
buff 27-Jan-16
Medicinemann 27-Jan-16
Bear Track 27-Jan-16
TSI 27-Jan-16
TSI 27-Jan-16
TSI 27-Jan-16
TSI 27-Jan-16
moch 27-Jan-16
wkochevar 27-Jan-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
Bear Track 01-Feb-16
TSI 01-Feb-16
Deerman1 01-Feb-16
woodguy65 01-Feb-16
TSI 01-Feb-16
FullCryHounds 02-Feb-16
moch 02-Feb-16
TEmbry 02-Feb-16
Stubbleduck 05-Jun-16
Dutch oven 05-Jun-16
Shiras 05-Jun-16
Topgun 30-06 06-Jun-16
Shiras 06-Jun-16
From: Deerman1
26-Jan-16
Just heard back from my taxidermist. The tannery my bear hide was sent to allowed bugs to get to it. When the problem was discovered, they refroze the hide,(partially tanned) and are sending it back to my taxidermist for inspection. The tannery would not tell us the extent of the damage at this time.

Anybody ever dealt with this before?

What course of action is available that I can take?

I am hoping that somebody here can give me some advice!

From: Bear Track
26-Jan-16
THAT! is very odd. I've been in this business for 3 decades and never heard of that. The bugs would have gotten in it before it went into tanning, meaning they have a bug problem there where they store the hides till ready for tanning and your taxidermist will be making a change I hope. That is if the bugs got in AT the tannery and not at your taxidermist shop. You have to consider that too. Hopefully it's repairable by your taxidermist. Good luck.

26-Jan-16
Never heard of that before either. Please post pictures when you get it back. What kind of bugs are they talking about? I too would also look at how the hide was handled and stored before it got to the tanner and also once they received it. As far as fixing or replacing, that is very easy to do on bears. There are a ton of bears on the market and it should be easy to replace the affected area or replace the hide completely. Most taxidermists have tons of extra hide for most of the more common animals.

From: Cazador
26-Jan-16
Write it off. Whatever you do, keep it out of your house if you have other mounts. Who knows where the bugs got on it, but the fact is, it got eaten up, keep away.

See if you can get a refund from your taxidermist but I'd call it a day.

From: wkochevar
26-Jan-16
If the hide was properly fleshed and salted by your taxi it should never get a bug regardless of where it was stored....just saying

From: Deerman1
26-Jan-16
I agree! I'm getting a load of BS from someone. This is not my regular taxidermist, it's the first time I've ever used him.

Once the bear was fleshed and salted and sent in, wouldn't the "pickle" prevent any bugs from getting to it?

The taxidermist said that there were about a dozen hides affected, but I couldn't get a straight answer from the tannery. The taxidermist gave me the phone number.

This is going to be a very hard rug to match due to a very unique color phase coat....which is why it was going into the taxidermist in the first place.

I'm just sick about this!

From: Drahthaar
27-Jan-16
I might be wrong but I also think it was whom ever fleshed and salted the hide. Forrest

From: venison
27-Jan-16
That sucks Deerman1 ! Why did you go to a different taxidermist ? I would Change my doc before my taxi !

From: buff
27-Jan-16
If the taxi gave you the tanneries phone # I would think it has nothing to do with him, sounds like the tannery is giving you the run around

From: Medicinemann
27-Jan-16
It will interesting to hear if the tannery accepts responsibility for the damage. Let us know how the follow-up call goes.....

From: Bear Track
27-Jan-16

Bear Track's Link
Deerman, if you can send me close up pictures of the damage, I can give you my opinion on what can be done possibly. I've done 1,000's of bears. If you follow my link and send them email, I'd be happy to take time to advise you, what if anything can be done. What is bothering me up front is, the tannery has taken it out of tanning process and having the taxidermist pick it up without trying to finish it. Contacting Dennis Razza on here would be a second opinion also.

From: TSI
27-Jan-16
Sounds like there was taint prior to tanning.bugs could be maggots.blow flies are pretty quick to a dead animal and within minutes are laying eggs.if the hide was left thawed for 18hrs the eggs would have hatched.perhaps the tannery figured tanning it was pointless.

From: TSI
27-Jan-16
Ive seen tannery damage but never from bugs mostly weak hides or slipage.poor pickle solution can also be an issue but other than maggots cant see what other bug is an issue on raw hides.moths and beetles can be issue on tanned hides

From: TSI
27-Jan-16
Ive seen tannery damage but never from bugs mostly weak hides or slipage.poor pickle solution can also be an issue but other than maggots cant see what other bug is an issue on raw hides.moths and beetles can be issue on tanned hides

From: TSI
27-Jan-16
Multiple hides from same taxidermist very likely they rotted.piled on each other one tainted hide will affect them all.likely not the tannery.

From: moch
27-Jan-16
Sometimes the spoilage starts with the salting process. the tannery gets the hide and during the rehydration process the hair starts slipping. not really bug related but the hide may not have been prime. hard to figure and harder to prove. thus disclaimers on most taxidermy and tanning invoices. Bugs do and will attack slated hides and tanned hides if the infestation exists so for sure do not attempt to keep the hide in the same location you have any of your mounts or you could create real issues if it did have bugs. Try to at least get a refund from your taxidermist and I would call the tannery. if they take responsibility they may pay you replacement value. Don't hold your breath. oh yea, if someone is wondering, I've been a taxidermist since 1976 and have done lots of my own tanning.

From: wkochevar
27-Jan-16
Regardless of where this problem started, isn't the taxidermist the one who should deal with the liability whatever it may be? He is the one you "contracted" with for tanning services and if there is a problem, he needs to fix it! That's who I would hold responsible. JMHO!

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16

Deerman1's embedded Photo
Deerman1's embedded Photo
I have got pictures now. I'm going to try to attach them with my phone

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16

Deerman1's embedded Photo
Deerman1's embedded Photo
1/2 the hide was damaged. To hear that is not already completely missing is balled up in the picture to follow. Upon closer inspection I did find one of the bugs in one of these hairballs.

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16

Deerman1's embedded Photo
Deerman1's embedded Photo
Here is what all the hairballs looks like

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16

Deerman1's embedded Photo
Deerman1's embedded Photo
This is what the bugs look like. They are tiny little suckers, I laid the pen in there to give you an idea of the size

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16
The cannery has stepped up and offered me $500 due to thei The cannery has stepped up and offered me $500 due to the their negligence. What upsets me most is I have $1600 and license and lease fees alone, not counting a weeks worth of vacation, 2400 miles round-trip on my truck and trailer etc. at this point, I'm just looking for advice. It's $500 a fair offer, or do I ask for more? I don't even think you can replace a color phase hide for $500.

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16

Deerman1's embedded Photo
Deerman1's embedded Photo
This is really the only decent picture I have of him. It got dark shortly after this picture was taken, and as soon as we got back to camp, the hide went into the freezer

From: Bear Track
01-Feb-16
I've never seen those particular bugs before. They are not what I was expecting to see. Is that hide now completely dry tanned? Cause what I'm thinking is, the tannery is infested with those bugs and your hide got eaten up after the tanning process. If the head is ok, about all you can do is a head mount. Sucks.

From: TSI
01-Feb-16
Gypsy moth

From: Deerman1
01-Feb-16
Not totally tanned yet Bear Track. I spoke to my regular taxidermist and he thought that it looked as though they had a bad batch of pickle, or forgot to add the bug proofing chemical. Either way, IF the remainder of the hair stays in, I will be lucky to end up with any type of mount. I just wish the tannery would have offered me enough to cover the tag and lease fee so I could try to get a different one. $500 seems low to me!

From: woodguy65
01-Feb-16
First I'm sorry this happened to you - thats a beauty of a bear.

Why not try and contact the tannery directly - get the number from your taxi and get their side of the story. Maybe they have started low - offered $500 to the taxi to see if you would take it and then they are done - they may be prepared to pay more. I would certainly call them.

I wonder how many other bowsiters have hides there?

My last Alberta bear I had to leave with the outfitter and use his taxi - (it was shot on last night - late to camp - and left early in morning - it would not have been frozen in time.

When I got the hide 10 months later (mailed to me), I opened it up and the stink just about gagged me. IT smelled like a wet dog that had literally rolled in chit and something dead. I contacted the taxi and after long discussion he said something similar - that it was bad pickle juice at tannery, don't know how he didn't smell it.

Anyway, the Canadian taxi was nice about it and seemed concerned - sent me a check for $200 - I thought that was nice considering there wasn't anything I could do anyway. I was worried about the hair falling out - year later it has not but still stinks!

I wish you the best - maybe somebody else will chime in with a solution.

From: TSI
01-Feb-16
Ive seen them its a gypsy moth not hatched yet.you likely seen empty cases as well from hatched larvae.they chew the roots off the hair.pray with raid or they will be back.

02-Feb-16
First thing you need to do is bag that hide and debug it. Keep it away from any other hides. $500 is very reasonable. The tannery is not responsible for any other costs like your lease fees. That's rediculous to think he owes you anything other then the cost of a replacement hide. You had the experience of the hunt. Check on Taxidermy.net for a tanned bear hide of similar size. $500 is more then enough to replace it with.

From: moch
02-Feb-16
Google Bear hides for sale and you should come up with other tanneries or fur companies that might have a good bear skin. Just beware and call and ask questions before you buy one as some are not complete or have the claws removed but I know there are a bunch out there. Myself I would just take the money and go kill another bear. why would you want a bear someone else shot anyway. most tanneries have disclaimers so the $500 sounds pretty reasonable. just saying!

From: TEmbry
02-Feb-16
While I wouldn't be happy if it was my bear, $500 is beyond reasonable for them to offer and sounds like a stand up business for making it right. I would just take the money and not look for a replacement though.

I have a friend that is going through this right now up here in Anchorage with the small Moths. Any recommendations on how to kill them?

From: Stubbleduck
05-Jun-16
I just noticed this thread so further information may be redundant. I sent the photo of the bug to a friend who is a well known expert in assorted infesting type insects. He says it is a dermestid probably a type commonly known as a hide beetle.

From: Dutch oven
05-Jun-16
Time for some real science. Stubbleduck's comment probably points to the culprit if the damage was done after the tanning and while the hide was dry. As far as gypsy moths-forget it-the caterpillars feed exclusively on plants, preferring oaks.

From: Shiras
05-Jun-16

Shiras's embedded Photo
Shiras's embedded Photo
That really stinks! Tannery ruined the hide on a beautiful bear that I shot also with similar color.

From: Topgun 30-06
06-Jun-16
Was the gun laying in the background of your picture for extra protection? If I shot a bear and lost the hide I don't believe I'd go looking for another one. IMHO that would be like going out and buying an antlered mount that you had nothing to do with. All that would do for me is piss me off more every time I looked at it!

From: Shiras
06-Jun-16
The gun laying in the background was the guides. We never even got the bait out or into the tree (he wanted to sit with me a film) before the bear was there and I shot him from the ground. Fun hunt!

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