Mathews Inc.
Aus Buff Bow-Hunting
International
Contributors to this thread:
eugeneb 21-Jul-16
Dino 21-Jul-16
Stekewood 21-Jul-16
ToddT 21-Jul-16
bowonly 21-Jul-16
wildwilderness 21-Jul-16
HerdManager 21-Jul-16
Pat Lefemine 21-Jul-16
Dino 21-Jul-16
Stekewood 21-Jul-16
bowonly 21-Jul-16
eugeneb 22-Jul-16
eugeneb 22-Jul-16
eugeneb 22-Jul-16
eugeneb 22-Jul-16
eugeneb 22-Jul-16
Charlie Rehor 22-Jul-16
bowonly 22-Jul-16
bowonly 22-Jul-16
bowonly 22-Jul-16
Dino 22-Jul-16
Medicinemann 23-Jul-16
eugeneb 23-Jul-16
eugeneb 23-Jul-16
eugeneb 23-Jul-16
Gaffy 23-Jul-16
eugeneb 23-Jul-16
Beendare 24-Jul-16
tradmt 24-Jul-16
Buffalo1 24-Jul-16
eugeneb 25-Jul-16
eugeneb 25-Jul-16
eugeneb 25-Jul-16
eugeneb 25-Jul-16
bowonly 27-Jul-16
bowonly 27-Jul-16
bowonly 27-Jul-16
eugeneb 29-Jul-16
Scar Finga 29-Jul-16
bowonly 29-Jul-16
Buffalo1 29-Jul-16
eugeneb 29-Jul-16
Buffalo1 29-Jul-16
Rayzor 31-Jul-16
Medicinemann 31-Jul-16
Medicinemann 31-Jul-16
Medicinemann 31-Jul-16
eugeneb 01-Aug-16
eugeneb 01-Aug-16
Buffalo1 01-Aug-16
bowonly 01-Aug-16
eugeneb 01-Aug-16
bowonly 02-Aug-16
bowonly 02-Aug-16
eugeneb 02-Aug-16
1Arrow 03-Aug-16
1Arrow 03-Aug-16
eugeneb 01-Sep-16
eugeneb 01-Sep-16
eugeneb 01-Sep-16
eugeneb 01-Sep-16
eugeneb 01-Sep-16
eugeneb 01-Sep-16
spike buck 04-Sep-16
Jaquomo 04-Sep-16
eugeneb 05-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
eugeneb 06-Sep-16
From: eugeneb
21-Jul-16
Hi,

Recently became a sponsor, and somewhat excited about my new safari business.

For those interested in hunting Aus Water Buff ... please check out my website www.ausbuffsafari.com

Let me know what you think of the website or whether you have any questions.

Thanks & regards, Eugene

From: Dino
21-Jul-16
Eugene, your website looks good. However, some of your bow and arrow requirements are too restrictive, too many stipulations. With modern archery equipment,one can certainly get the job done without 200 gr broadheads and 800 gr arrows.lol We kill mooose and elk regularly with 400-500 gr arrows and 100gr broadheads...

From: Stekewood
21-Jul-16
Moose and elk are not Water Buffalo... Curious as to how many Buffalo you have shot or seen shot with archery equipment Dino. I'm guessing that Eugene has a bit more experience and us more than qualified to make those recommendations.

From: ToddT
21-Jul-16
I just sent you a pm

From: bowonly
21-Jul-16
Congratulations on becoming a Bowsite sponsor. I have made three trips down under to bow hunt buff. Hopefully my observations are helpful to you and those adventurous bow hunters on Bowsite.

Your website seems well done. I especially like your description of your hunting philosophy and the fact you focus on bow hunting. When I started talking to the Aussie operators, some refused to take bow hunters and some would just laugh and say "sure you can bring your bow along" with the assurance the next sound after the twang would be a boom from their rifle!! Bowsiters, it is important your PH is committed to bow hunting.

Arnhem land is remote wilderness. I especially enjoyed all the other flora and fauna of the outback, not just the buff. You might play up more of that part of the experience on your website.

It is great you lay it all out right upfront about the heavy arrows, broadheads, and FOC. Hunters would do well to heed this advice and leave their whitetail hunter ideas about equipment at home. Buff are perfect for bow hunting up close. The way I see it, that is an integral part of dangerous game hunting.

Seven days (actually 4.5 days hunting) seems minimal to me with a bow. You must have great hunting. I would encourage a bow hunter to spend as much time as they can because they will be dreaming of a return anyway. Also, after traveling half way around the world, do some side trips. Australia is wonderful.

21-Jul-16
If someone is going to take the effort to go hunt water buffs, I don't think its too much to ask they use adequate gear. #70 and 800gr is not asking too much at all.

From: HerdManager
21-Jul-16
Need to change some wording from Dino:

"With modern archery equipment, one can certainly get killed using 400-500 gr arrows and 100gr broadheads..."

/:^)

Elk and moose are not buff...

From: Pat Lefemine
21-Jul-16

Pat Lefemine's MOBILE embedded Photo
Pat Lefemine's MOBILE embedded Photo

I used 200gr 2-blade heads. Dead in seconds.

Don't even think about a Rage head!!!!

From: Dino
21-Jul-16
Sheesh...someone becomes a bowsite sponsor and suddenly you get jumped on for offering insights, which the OP asked for btw... I never said use a whitetail rig or a rage for Buffs. I never said Elk or Moose are buffs. However, Elk and Moose live in some of the harshest climates in the world and are regularly and easily dispatched with 400 and 500 gr arrows. How long have fellows been killing buffs with bows...I am guessing a long, long time. Recurve guys kill them too. And Pat, the bows you shoot are not known for their speed. :) Bow/arrow/broadhead technology and advancements have made remarkable improvements even in the last 10 years. Many of our lighter poundage bows shoot much faster than our older heavier weighted compounds. At at point do we need to realise that just because an arrow looks like a fencepost and weighs just as much, this doesn't mean it kills better than a well weighted arrow(with good foc) traveling quickly.

My point is if you can get a 65-70lb modern bow to get a 500gr arrow with a good head like a Muzzy Trocar or Wasp Bullet etc...at around 280 fps, certainly by adding 300 grains and slowing it down 60 fps, you are not going to get more killing power. Seems futile, like the rule of diminishing returns. I believe that Buff are tough animals...I simply believe that with modern archery tackle, meaning more effecient bows, higher fps, good foc, and solid 100 or 125 gr broadheads, the rule of 70lb bows and 800gr arrows, and 200 gr broadheads seems archaic.

From: Stekewood
21-Jul-16
You've got some great deer in your trophy photos Dino but I don't see any buffalo. ;-)

From: bowonly
21-Jul-16
Dino, my comment was not directed at you. I must have been typing it up while you posted. I did not see your post until mine showed up. So, again it was not in reply to you or a personal attack.

My point is this. The whole archery industry is driven by whitetail hunting. So then, is the thinking of the great majority of bow hunters about equipment. I think Pat Lefemine even alludes to this by mentioning the Rage broadheads. (Pat, you know the risk of derailing this thread by even using the R word!).

It always amazes me how so many North American hunters go to Africa and Australia, paying substantial money to PHs, but disregard their advice on equipment and shot placement. Most of them are influenced by overwhelming indoctrination on bow hunting whitetails.

Water Buff in Australia is specialized dangerous game hunting. Eugene, the sponsor who started the thread, is in the business of trying to provide clients with a dead buff with a bow. That is the essence of it. In his experience, the equipment he lists maximizes that endeaver. He may take a hunter shooting something different. But, I am betting he will tell them, in his experience, it decreases the chances of a dead buff. His website states "for trad bows, contact Eugene. Any trad shooter must recognize it may decrease their chances, just like any bow shooter must recognize their chances are reduced by not using a gun.

The old saying "you pay your money and you take your chances" comes to mind. If a hunter wants to pit his bow and arrow set-up against a water buffalo, Australia awaits.

From: eugeneb
22-Jul-16
Hi Dino

Thanks for your reply, appreciated.

We have tested a variety of arrow weights (500-850) and bh's (Montec G5, etc. in various grains) and the heavy arrow by far produces the best one-arrow-kill consistency ... relating to penetration.

I am comfortable that a client's arrow will reach the vitals from acceptable shooting distances and angles. In fact I like closer to 850grain

Not all buff are equal … there is a difference between: 1) a cow vs a bull … bulls bigger; 2) an animal during the early dry-season vs late dry-season 2.1)early dry-season … the mature bulls in prime condition, thick-as-mud, huge and built like tanks ... its like shooting into a Rinehart bh target 2.2)compared to shooting them towards the end of the dry-season = they lose condition, especially some of the older cows and bulls becomes real skinny.

I appreciate your input, but unfortunately I will not allow light gear.

Thanks & Regards, Eugene

From: eugeneb
22-Jul-16
BowOnly,

Thanks for your input, appreciated.

I will definitely next time take more pics about the scenery. I never thought I'd start the safari thing ... so when I did the website I was in short supply of nice pics about the surroundings.

Re hunting days: There are plenty of buff ... from all sizes ... and great cover to relatively easy get into bow distance. I will have an email conversation with each potential client understanding exactly their requirement, hence ensuring I can deliver and allow enough time where appropriate

Thanks Eugene

From: eugeneb
22-Jul-16
ToddT: Email received, I will reply shortly ... thanks

From: eugeneb
22-Jul-16
Hi Dino

Something I forgot to mention ... the bows used during our trial-by-error stage ... by my buddies CPXL's and Bowtech destroyer 350 ... all bows at 70lbs at 29"dl

My specs ... I draw a tad over 32" and shot buff with 68, 70, 72 and 82lbs (my personal bows K&K Vindicators, Obsession Addiction, BowTech Old Glory ... I think my bows are rated between 320-330 IBO

So these are not archaic or slow bows

Cheers Eugene

From: eugeneb
22-Jul-16
Thanks Pat and others for the comments

22-Jul-16

Charlie Rehor's Link
Eugene's weblink attached!

PM sent!

From: bowonly
22-Jul-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo
The hide on a buff can be an inch thick with white fibrous material under the tough outer skin. As Eugene says, plaster some dry caked on mud to the outside and you have almost armor,

From: bowonly
22-Jul-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo
Then the ribs are closely spaced, more bone to hit than there is meat. And those ribs are thick, too.

From: bowonly
22-Jul-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo

From: Dino
22-Jul-16
Eugene, Thanks for the information and good dialogue. Sounds like you are knowledgeable and will do an excellent job of guiding. I want to be clear again that I am not doubting that buffalo are tough and that they require top equipment in order to kill them effeciently. The thing I have a hard time wrapping my head around is this... If you shoot a 70 lb bow with a 30" arrow, it has a small diameter and it's 550 grains and you can get it to shoot 270 fps...that's a bad ass set up...

Now take that same bow, take a 30" arrow, it's 850 grains, it's going to have to be fatter, and because you have weighted it with 300 more grains, you will slow it down by at least 60 fps...will this penetrate better? Have you done tests like this? Curious to know.

From: Medicinemann
23-Jul-16
Eugene,

I really liked your website. I have some questions/observations.....

1.) You mention that there are no salt water crocs where you are guiding/hunting....only "shy, freshwater crocs". Just how big are these "shy" crocs? Shy doesn't mean that they aren't dangerous, does it (especially if hungry)?

2.)I didn't see any price list for your hunts? ...extra charges for shooting a feral pig? By chance, we won't be anywhere near the feral horses or camels, will we? ...even if we were, it might be the wrong time of the year to bowhunt them, right?

3.) I have a bow set-up for a 2014 elephant bowhunt (which was cancelled at the last minute). I don't remember my exact arrow weight...but it was in the 790 grain to 830 grain range. If I am a few grains under your 800 grain requirement, but my poundage is higher than the minimum required, would that still be acceptable? My arrow shafts are rather small diameter (smaller than some broadhead ferrules), so they shouldn't have much trouble passing through thick ribs. I had stainless steel outserts on the front of the arrows, rather than footing them.

4.) Asiatic Buffalo seem to be wider than Cape Buffalo....do their ribs "overlap" the way that Cape Buffalo ribs do?

5.)Can extra days be added on....on a per diem rate?

6.) Can Americans bring the meat back to the U.S.? Would we WANT to? If that IS possible, is there anyway to prevent it from spoiling until we can get back to a place where we can freeze it, and pack it properly?

Dino,

There are small diameter arrow shafts in the 17-21 gpi range now. A 30" shaft with a 180 or 210 grain German Kinetics Silver Flame Broadhead can get to 800+ grains without being any larger than the broadhead ferrule.

From: eugeneb
23-Jul-16
Hi Dino

Please refer to MedicineMan's comment ... I had great success with Easton Full Metal Jacket .250 spine DG arrows ... I also shoot .200 spined GoldTip Kinetics for many years. There are other ways you can also increase weight upfront e.g. screw-in weights for e.g. thicker arrows, etc.

As BowOnly eluded to ... The reason I propose the weights I do is to increase the penetration odds under a variety of shot conditions i.e. I want the buff down as quick as possible for obvious reasons. People pay a lot of money for their dream hunt.

To answer your question re your bow: - I will not let you shoot your setup with a 550 grain arrow on buff - However if you bump up your arrow weight to +800 grains with a solid 2 blade COC bh (not the ones you mentioned) = yes, I will let you

I killed a few buff with my BowTech Old Glory set at 68lbs, 850 grain total arrow weight @ 218fps, 210 grain German Kinetic = no problems

From: eugeneb
23-Jul-16
Hi MedicineMan

Thanks for your comments.

1) Also please check google ... the largest I have seen is approx. 1 meter ... their mouths/jaws are very narrow and designed to catch fish = they have needle like teeth. The worst they can do is puncture you a bit lol ... what I mean by shy is they hit the road once we are in the vicinity i.e. they are difficult to find. Also one can walk 100m up or down the creek to find shallow clear water of your choice e.g. knee deep 2) Pigs and scrubbers are free ... no camels there ... there are horses and donkeys. Note I do not dedicate time to hunting pigs/scrubbers ... only if encountered while hunting buff OR when the buff quota is full 3) Sounds fine 4) No 5) Depends 6) I am unsure ... we have tried over the years to do different stuff with the meat ... large bulls very tuff (boot-leather) and lean ... there are some restaurants that specialise in this ... the locals eat it, but they prefer the young cows ... I will take some backstraps, etc. and we can try it and you can see if you like it ... the dingos seems to like it. I can find out if you like ... I think the issue will be on the USA side, not Aus ... from memory I think one hunter from Perth took frozen meat back on the local airline.

Thanks & regards Eugene

From: eugeneb
23-Jul-16

eugeneb's embedded Photo
eugeneb's embedded Photo
Scrubber/Wild Oxen ... these things are jittery and worse than buff lol ... and some grow the size of buff ... do not need heavy gear for them ...

From: Gaffy
23-Jul-16
Hi Eugene Mate love the website, it looks great and works well.

Hello All Gaffy from Australia here, I have hunted large Aussie game (Buff, Scrub Bulls and Camels)and have hunted with Eugene also.

Firstly Eugene is a stand up guy and has taken many buff with a bow, one arrow per animal, quick and humanely.(He Knows his stuff)

He is exactly right with the weight requirements of bow and the arrows, good strong arrows with weight up front and 200gn or over all steel broadhead.

I have had great success with 822 grain arrows shot out of my Monster 7 or my CPXL both bows are 70 lb models and the speed was 219 and 220 fps.

Young buffs (meat models) cows and end of dry season bulls (not so fat) pass through's would be expected, on wet season animals (very fat and heavy) with bulls the arrow would me mostly through a good 20 inches or so hanging out of the off side.

I have taken camels with lighter gear but using the 800 grain and above arrows it guarantees that bone crunching penetration.

My thoughts about concerns with the gear, if you you are putting in the time, effort and $ to go big game hunting .. take the guides advice or at least use what the locals are using.

Eugene congrats on becoming a sponsor and a safari operator!

Cheers Gaffy

From: eugeneb
23-Jul-16
When I say a scrubber is jittery and worse than buff ... I refer to their to their behaviour i.e. unpredictable and aggressive

Gaffman: Glad you like the site & Thanks for your input, appreciated.

From: Beendare
24-Jul-16
Eugene, Do you have exclusive rights on that territory?

So you dont hunt any stations?

From: tradmt
24-Jul-16
Eugene, I'm curious about what you would require for traditional equipment.

From: Buffalo1
24-Jul-16

Buffalo1's Link
Dino,

There is an old saying, "Just because you ride a horse once, doesn't make you a cowboy." I don't proclaim to be a cowboy, but I have ridden a horse once. I have killed a water buffalo and I used lightweight equipment in regards to hunting water buffalo. I would never attempt it again. Please refer to my hyperlink for the full detail of the hunt. I stand by my original comment of "hardest animal I've ever tried to kill."

I have also killed eland of equivalent size and bison. Both species were easier to kill and I used 55# and 62# bow weights respectively with lighter weight arrows. eugeneb is giving you solid advice on equipment needs to hunt the animal. Not only are you dealing with mass size, but an animal with an attitude. It is secondly only attitude wise to a cape buff. It is wider than a cape and one thing in the hunter's favor is the that the ribs do not over lap like on a cape buff.

If you decide to take one on, good luck.

From: eugeneb
25-Jul-16
Beendare:

No hunting is conducted on any station ... there are no fences and animals roam free.

Re exclusivity ... there are 2 adjacent areas:

1) One I share with my buddies ... we nowadays have an annual hunt once per year as we now live in separate cities ... so the area does not see much hunting like in the past (no-one else besides us hunt this area)

2) The other area for which the safari business has exclusivity

Regards,

Eugene

From: eugeneb
25-Jul-16
Tradmt, please email me.

From: eugeneb
25-Jul-16
Buffalo1

Congrats on your buff and i appreciate your input and reading about your hunt.

Regards,

Eugene

From: eugeneb
25-Jul-16
Beendare ... in case it's not clear from my previous reply ... both of these areas may be used for hunting

From: bowonly
27-Jul-16
Some photos for the dreamers among us. Lots of things to think about in this situation.

From: bowonly
27-Jul-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo

From: bowonly
27-Jul-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo
Doesn't get any better than this.

From: eugeneb
29-Jul-16
BowOnly,

Nice pics and congrats on your buff.

Where if I might ask did the hunt take place? and did you see much of NT e.g. Kakadu National Park or Katherine Gorge, etc.

Regards Eugene

From: Scar Finga
29-Jul-16
Very cool!

If I where a rich man... I would be there in a heartbeat looks like a full on adrenaline rush to me:)

I wouldn't argue about the equipment needs/ requirements!

Super heavy arrows with high FOC will outperform the fastest lightest arrow with high a "light" broad head any day of the week!

Its about arrow momentum, not fps or kinetic energy.

From: bowonly
29-Jul-16
Eugene, my first hunt was on the old Elsey Station near the Roper River of We Of the Never Never fame. The second was actually bordering Kakadu. The last was on Melville Island.

We managed to see a lot. Snorkled the Great Barrier Reef, sailed the Whitsunday Islands, Uluru at sunset, a Kakadu tour, Sydney, Darwin, and spent some days with a local camping and hunting the outback somewhere way south of Darwin. Never got to Arnhem Land which has always intrigued me with its vast, wild places.

I think Australia is a great place for a first time international traveler from the USA. Same language, or close enough! Same kind of money. Good exchange rate. And very friendly people. Like visiting cousins you have never met.

From: Buffalo1
29-Jul-16
bowonly,

"Like visiting cousins you have never met."

This is an every day event in the South. You don't have to go to Australia to to that !!!! Wasn't that what "Deliverance" was all about- "kissin cousins"?

From: eugeneb
29-Jul-16
BowOnly

Great ... so you made the most of your trips.

I have hunted Elsey Station think 2009 for pigs ... it must have been hard hunting for buff ... as the buff were few and far between when we were there.

The Bulman area I hunt which is approx. 8.5 hours drive from Darwin ... if you take a 15 min drive with the vehicle it is not uncommon to see +100 buff ... e.g. if you walk to a swamp 800m from our camp site you will likely see +30 buff.

Thanks & regards Eugene

From: Buffalo1
29-Jul-16
eugeneb,

Just out of interest- what have been your findings with penetration of 2-blade vs 3-blade BH"s on buff and scrub cows?

Have you had much experience or witnessed the use of VPA and German Silver Flames on buff and scrub cows?

Please feel free to elaborate. Thanks

From: Rayzor
31-Jul-16
Buffalo1: Lots of Scrubbers and Asiatic buff taken with VPAs. Including SCI #1 with a bow Asiatic Buff. I dont want to hijack the thread but you are welcome to email me want pics or info on buff and scrub bulls taken VPAs. ray@vparchery.com.

From: Medicinemann
31-Jul-16

Medicinemann's Link
Here are a couple links for people interested in learning more about this type of bowhunt....

From: Medicinemann
31-Jul-16

Medicinemann's Link
This one offers some arrow/bow recommendations

From: Medicinemann
31-Jul-16

Medicinemann's Link
Another video to watch....compliments of Cameron Hanes.

From: eugeneb
01-Aug-16
Buffalo1,

Unfortunately I do not have much experience in comparing 2 vs 3 blades on buff/scrubber. My one hunting buddy used a Montec fixed 3 blader on buff (before we really targeted buff) and the feedback was not good ... so after that we only used 2 bladers.

None of us has used a VPA bh on buff/scrubber.

I have used the German Kinetic 210 grain on buff with no issues. (unsure how many, but would guess 10)

After trying some 2 bladers we pretty much only used a local bh called an Outback Supreme 220 grain single bevel ... they were cheaper and easier to get hold of than the GK's ... nowadays these local bh's seem difficult to get hold of so I will go back to German Kinetics.

Regards Eugene

From: eugeneb
01-Aug-16
forgot to add ... the bh + the easton 75 grain brass insert ... which gives around 300 grain upfront

From: Buffalo1
01-Aug-16
eugeneb

Thanks for your response on the 2-blade vs 3-blade question.

At the last DSC Convention I met a guy from Australia and he showed me a photo of the Outback Supreme BH. It is a pretty sturdy looking BH.

From: bowonly
01-Aug-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo
Eugene, you are spot on with your guess on buff hunting on Elsey Station. I really was only in bow range twice in ten days. This is one that came wandering in to a waterhole, but immediately started thrashing around before I could shoot. But, I'll tell you, it sure was a rush at about 12 yards!

From: eugeneb
01-Aug-16
BowOnly

Wow ... nice big bodied bull ... when you say thrashing, do you mean head shaking and foot stomping?

Also what time of year was it?

My perception is that the bulls have a bit more attitude very early in the dry (I assume when they come out of the breeding period) e.g. I have hunted them during May ... but hunting is difficult very early in the dry as the bush is too thick and grass at places are very high e.g. you get under 20 yrds ... you can hear and smell them, but cannot see them.

Regards Eugene

From: bowonly
02-Aug-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo
No,he didn't know I was there. He plowed into the water , flopped over up to his neck, rolled around a bit, then blew out just as fast when a small bull came in. It was the last days of September.

Your comments on the varying body size on bulls got me thinking. Most bulls I remember seemed bulky, some more than others. But mine was obviously a smaller body size than most. I believe it was an old bull, but still his condition was noticeably different. The horns were pretty good though. I shot it the first part of July.

I actually got to see the full body mount of Charlie,the famous bull in the movie Crocodile Dundee. The one that stood in the road and Mick did his mind trick on. It was at the Adelaide River Inn. He had great sweepers, but was tiny body wise. Dwarf really. Check him out.

From: bowonly
02-Aug-16

bowonly's embedded Photo
bowonly's embedded Photo
Here is my bull.

From: eugeneb
02-Aug-16
Hi BowOnly

Thanks for the reply and that certainly is a great trophy! and yes it looks like an old bull ... congrats!

Yes, I have made a few stops at the Adelaide River Inn ... great relaxing atmosphere for Sunday lunch.

From some of the research I have done ... they age up 25 years in the wild and longer in captivity and their horns apparently never stop growing until they die.

I am no expert in ageing them, but to me it seems at a certain age their body mass deteriorates/decline more with each passing year i.e. body-wise they do not recover (during the wet) to the same size as the previous year.

Certainly some of the larger/wider horned specimens I have seen were not as full in the body (even right after the wet). I will post some pics later on.

Regards Eugene

From: 1Arrow
03-Aug-16
Reference to Dino's "My point is if you can get a 65-70lb modern bow to get a 500gr arrow with a good head like a Muzzy Trocar or Wasp Bullet etc...at around 280 fps, certainly by adding 300 grains and slowing it down 60 fps, you are not going to get more killing power. Seems futile, like the rule of diminishing returns. I believe that Buff are tough animals...I simply believe that with modern archery tackle, meaning more effecient bows, higher fps, good foc, and solid 100 or 125 gr broadheads, the rule of 70lb bows and 800gr arrows, and 200 gr broadheads seems archaic."

Dino, I would suggest you read the research done by Dr. Ed Ashby, link included: http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Dr.-Ed-Ashby-W26.aspx

What I gathered from this penetration research for my Cape Buffalo hunt in South Africa was if you have ever seen a Speed Boat tool down the river and cut their power, they stop really quick as opposed to a Tow Barge pushing a large load. When it cuts it power it takes almost a mile to stop. Point being the light fast arrow loses it's energy too fast to penetrate while the heavier arrow keeps it's energy and is able to penetrate.

The other thing to pick up on is a heavy two blade broadhead with offsetting bevels is critical because it causes a twisting action that splinters the rib bone and creates space, allowing the arrow less friction as it passes into the animal and retaining more energy.

My PSE 2014 DNA was getting 314 FPS with my Whitetail arrow (418 grain arrow with 100 grain Thunderhead). That got 78 footpounds of energy but was still 2 lbs under the legal limit in South Africa for Big Game like Cape Buffalo. I used a 956 grain arrow with a 315 Ashby Single Bevel broadhead. That reduced my speed to 208 FPS but my Footpounds was 88. 10 more than my light White tail rig. And I could shoot this setup with my same Whitetail rig, same release, just had to resight or have a separate sight for the heavy arrow.

Since I never had hunted Buffalo I wanted to take advantage of what other's had done before me rather than risk figuring it out on the maybe one chance I might get to have. It sure paid off me for me. My Cape Buffalo went down in 85 yards and less than 60 seconds. I plan on shooting this heavy arrow setup on Asian Water Buffalo in Argentina this November and someday in Australia for their Water Buffalo. I would sure suggest looking into Dr. Ashby's research to help guide you to your choice in hunting big game like buffalo. Good luck to you in future hunts and I hope sharing this information helps you make an informed opinion. Good hunting.

From: 1Arrow
03-Aug-16
Reference to Dino's "My point is if you can get a 65-70lb modern bow to get a 500gr arrow with a good head like a Muzzy Trocar or Wasp Bullet etc...at around 280 fps, certainly by adding 300 grains and slowing it down 60 fps, you are not going to get more killing power. Seems futile, like the rule of diminishing returns. I believe that Buff are tough animals...I simply believe that with modern archery tackle, meaning more effecient bows, higher fps, good foc, and solid 100 or 125 gr broadheads, the rule of 70lb bows and 800gr arrows, and 200 gr broadheads seems archaic."

Dino, I would suggest you read the research done by Dr. Ed Ashby, link included: http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Dr.-Ed-Ashby-W26.aspx

What I gathered from this penetration research for my Cape Buffalo hunt in South Africa was if you have ever seen a Speed Boat tool down the river and cut their power, they stop really quick as opposed to a Tow Barge pushing a large load. When it cuts it power it takes almost a mile to stop. Point being the light fast arrow loses it's energy too fast to penetrate while the heavier arrow keeps it's energy and is able to penetrate.

The other thing to pick up on is a heavy two blade broadhead with offsetting bevels is critical because it causes a twisting action that splinters the rib bone and creates space, allowing the arrow less friction as it passes into the animal and retaining more energy.

My PSE 2014 DNA was getting 314 FPS with my Whitetail arrow (418 grain arrow with 100 grain Thunderhead). That got 78 footpounds of energy but was still 2 lbs under the legal limit in South Africa for Big Game like Cape Buffalo. I used a 956 grain arrow with a 315 Ashby Single Bevel broadhead. That reduced my speed to 208 FPS but my Footpounds was 88. 10 more than my light White tail rig. And I could shoot this setup with my same Whitetail rig, same release, just had to resight or have a separate sight for the heavy arrow.

Since I never had hunted Buffalo I wanted to take advantage of what other's had done before me rather than risk figuring it out on the maybe one chance I might get to have. It sure paid off me for me. My Cape Buffalo went down in 85 yards and less than 60 seconds. I plan on shooting this heavy arrow setup on Asian Water Buffalo in Argentina this November and someday in Australia for their Water Buffalo. I would sure suggest looking into Dr. Ashby's research to help guide you to your choice in hunting big game like buffalo. Good luck to you in future hunts and I hope sharing this information helps you make an informed opinion. Good hunting.

From: eugeneb
01-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
My buddies just came back from the annual hunt (unfortunately I could not make this trip) ... they were 4 guys, 6 days on the ground, got 12 buff and some other items ... will post more pics as I receive.

Cheers Eugene

From: eugeneb
01-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
01-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
01-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
01-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
01-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: spike buck
04-Sep-16
Awesome pictures!! Keep them coming please... To me the scenery pics are as good as the trophy pics. Chris.

From: Jaquomo
04-Sep-16
My friend in Oz is also a PH and has killed a pile of buff and everything else, and uses nothing but Rage for every animal on the continent. He shoots heavy arrows and 80# though. His trophy room is amazing. I won't mention him because he's a competitor, but eugene's advice on the tackle needed is solid.

From: eugeneb
05-Sep-16
Spike Buck: Will post more shortly

Jacquomo: Thanks for your comment, but I will never recommend Rage on buff ... curious whether your PH friend recommend Rage on buff to his clients?

Cheers Eugene

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
Had a weak wet season ... my buddy tells me it was very dry i.e. some swamps = dry

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
Scrubber

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16
BowOnly

As per my post of 2 Aug ... I will post some pics of older bulls with good horns shortly.

Regards Eugene

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
BowOnly ... some of the older bulls with big racks ... 1st 3 pics = same bull ... and last 2 pics = different bull (last pics does not do justice to his rack ... it was a great set of horns)

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
Forgot to mention ... you can see they are over their prime i.e. losing/declining body weight

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
Next 2 pics from different bull ... pics does not do his rack justice

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo
Last few pics from the annual hunt

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

From: eugeneb
06-Sep-16

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eugeneb's embedded Photo

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