Red Stag Where to go???
International
I would like to hunt Red stag in the future but I am not sure which location is best, New Zealand or Argentina? Who has gone? Which, in your opinion, is better and why? Which one is easier to get you trophy home? Any suggestions on outfitters? Thanks for you time.
I haven´t go to Argentina, but just came back from New Zealand and had a great hunt with Kiwi Safaris. I shoot a Red Stag and Thar with my bow in 3 days Services and everything was first class all the way
Depends on what you want out of the hunt. I hunted free range in the mountains Australia for the truly wild Scottish Highlands variety during the roar and it was one of the greatest and most challenging hunts of my life. I know other guys who have gone inside the pens in NZ and killed one with much bigger, genetically selected antlers, who said the "hunt" was blah. I know guys who hunted outside the fence in NZ, some had a great time, others were very frustrated and ended up paying to go through the gate after the first week. The guys from Bowhunter have hunted outside and tried to ambush the outside stags that came down to the fences to roar at night.
I have not hunted Argentina but have been there a couple times and the country where the stags live seems much better suited to rifle hunting.
As far as getting it home, you should contract with one of the services here that does that. They handle all the paperwork and logistics, the animal shows up at your door.
Heard it's hard to get trophies back from Argentina. No firsthand knowledge though.
Doing a free-range stag hunt with my father in Scotland this fall during the roar. Using rifles on this trip but it's free-range--which is the most important aspect to me. Never hunted behind a fence and have no plans to ever do so.
You are welcome to PM me after I return in early October. I'll give you the details. The outfit we are going with attends Dallas SCI annually, which is where we met initially.
I've hunted New Zealand for free range Red Stag and Tahr. One of my favorite places to go. They have pretty good free range Fallow and Arapawa Rams too. Don't know about the 'fence' stuff there. Been there twice with Scott Thomson of Southern Hunting Safaris. He is a great guy and guide. You have a great hunt and a great time. Love New Zealand as a country too, the people, the land.
I'm heading to Argentina in November for Asian Water Buffalo. From what I researched/saw the Red Stags there are not as big, that's why I went to New Zealand for Red Stag. Can't confirm that though as I haven't actually been yet, but will be by Thanksgiving.
This stag was taken in a large paddock (think typical pasture in the states) at the base of the high country. Fence was 5 foot tall and the Stags came and went as they pleased. I listed him as Estate but in my mind it was free range as the Stags went into the hills and mountains at night and came back down in the day and weren't restricted in any way. Just like hunting low fence whitetail in Texas or Oklahoma. Very similar to hunting Elk in New Mexico or Colorado. I did see areas that other outfitters had where they had taller fences or high fence but didn't hunt any of those areas. I can't say enough good things about New Zealand. Would go back to New Zealand in a minute and have been twice.
Second trip went after Tahr. Can't say enough about the beautiful high country. All free range. Glaciers too.
Here is what an Arapawa Ram looks like from New Zealand. As I understand it Capt Cook left some of these in the early 1800 to run free range so the sailors could come back and hunt them for meat when they came back through the islands. They've been there for almost 200 years and are free range. I thought they would be like hunting a Corsican ram or something in Texas but found them to be wily and wild. About as hard as hunting Aoudad sheep which I think are a great challenge.
Here is what an Arapawa Ram looks like from New Zealand. As I understand it Capt Cook left some of these in the early 1800 to run free range so the sailors could come back and hunt them for meat when they came back through the islands. They've been there for almost 200 years and are free range. I thought they would be like hunting a Corsican ram or something in Texas but found them to be wily and wild. About as hard as hunting Aoudad sheep which I think are a great challenge.
I went to New Zeeland with my Dad and we were not on an estate. The outfit we used had both and at the time we had them scored my Dad's score was 309 and that was good enough for a gold Medal score In SCI for Non estate. We went with rifles and mine was just a shade smaller. The Estate Stags were twice the size of what we hunted. The Outfitter we Used was Wilderness Quest. Don't know what they are like in Argentina but New Zeeland is a gorgeous country to visit.
I'm on the Scotland trip at the moment. We started with salmon fishing (yes, got one) and getting ready to go after free-range stag on the western coast. I was informed today that bowhunting is illegal in Scotland. If you wanted to bowhunt for stag, you are out of luck in Scotland.
Darn "Greenies" know how to screw-up everything, don't they?
I got this one in NZ with Kiwi safaris
Just so it's clear Scotland and New Zealand produce MUCH different animals. Different climates and diets.
You are not going to kill anything in Scotland that looks like a NZ animal - not even close. Much, much smaller antlers.
I just got back from a trip in Scotland - was on biz trip in London and took a day trip up. Had the best time and took a 12 year old stag with rifle (as someone mentioned illegal to bowhunt in Scotland). It's incredible to see a herd of 150 stags bedded on a flat.
This is a pic of a GIANT Scotland red stag - most are much smaller.
Be very very careful when dealing in New Zealand with places that say "free range" Red Stag. There are some true free range areas and animals but typically no where close to the trophy quality that most expect when hunting there.
1Arrow.... I am glad you listed your second stag pictured as Estate. There is no shame in that. Hunting stags on large areas is free range but if the animal was born through a breeding program...it is not by definition free range.
Either way...if you go with a reputable outfitter you will have a blast. Dont get caught up in the estate vs free range crap. Just go have fun.
Sage - Who did you hunt with in Scotland? can you share a picture of the animal you harvested?
kscowboy - Please send pics and story when you get back.
Second: I hunted with Atholl Estates where you get to hunt on 150k+ acres - they have different "beats". The castle is 800 years old and it's a really cool experience to hunt where royalty hunted.
Ronnie was my guide and 6th generation guide and absolutely amazing.
Not only did he get us on animals but his skill was excellent. We crawled and then belly crawled to get my shot.
I had only ONE day to hunt so he worked hard and by 2:30 finally had a stalk work out.
This animal is what I would call an average stag for Scotland. Almost any bar or hotel you walk into that area would have an animal like this on the wall (or smaller).
We saw bigger and the herd we stalked in on was 150 stags!
I found this place top notch and very reasonably priced (you can shoot as many as your budget allows).
Like I said - these bulls get no where near the freakish size the NZ stags get. Don't let the size of the rack fool you these guys are tough to hunt and wind is critical.
I took the train up from London (7 hours but wanted to see the English countryside which was worth it).
I used the estate rifle which was easier.
Not bad for 2 days before a work conference.
Second Shot, PM me your email and I will get them to you. I can also text pics.
First day in the field today and Dad got a 13 pointer they aged at 15-16 years. I shot a "Royal" 12 pointer that would be about 8 years of age.
Dad passed on a 14 point stag that was about 6 years of age to take the old man.
We have 2 more stags to go and 2 more days. If you saw the recent Sports Afield issue, we are hunting the same area. It's the Ardnamurchan area and from what we've seen, these have to be the largest of the free-range stags here in Scotland. One of the celebrity hunters was here earlier in the week and shot the Scotland National Record for Muzzleloader.
I will definitely 2nd that NZ stag dwarf anything over here but this is where it originated and I don't have the desire to do the NZ thing for stag. Just a personal/family preference. I'm not judging.
If you want REAL free range red stag hunting in New Zealand, in my mind the best place is called Te Awaiti hunting adventures. There's a huge difference between farm bred stags that are released and then called free range and truly free range stags in New Zealand. Here's a picture of a big one from Te Awaiti. They look like the Scottish ones. To each their own, but when I was looking to book a free range hunt I was told by people in the states that it doesn't exist. Don't listen to them it does...but, it's very physical, low altitude but big elevation changes and thick country. Very hard but so worth it. They don't charge trophy fees either. You pay one fee and you can shoot as much as you want-take a hind for meat, get a small stag one day but a bigger one shows up later? No problem shoot it. Best value for the money hunt too. Also Fallows on the property.
-I just plucked that photo off their website, I didn't shoot it.
https://www.facebook.com/TeAwaitihunting/photos/a.1685579585061681.1073741829.1684737511812555/1769146656704973/?type=3
Ug, can't figure out how to put a photo in. Maybe this works.
Knowing the country where this stag came from, I have a couple of observations.
The stag shown broadside was killed by poachers near Tiverton in Devon, England; he was nicknamed the Emperor [in a Cecil the Lion kinda way] and his disappearance caused a LOT of anger locally
You will be very VERY lucky to encounter anywhere as big a head [set of antlers] as this is Scotland...genetics and lack of food being the main factors. On Exmoor, not many miles to the north of where this stag lived and died, the heads are nowhere as big [again, lack of good feeding]
Alas, archery equipment is still not a legal means of take anywhere in the UK [it wasn't banned per se, more omitted, in the Deer Act 1963 as amended; though the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 does prohibit the use of archery equipment] although a lot of work is in progress to endeavour to return archery equipment.
I myself am looking at planning a trip to Spain to hunt Red stag with my bow, and will gladly share what I can.
Good luck and good hunting
Kenneth A British Bowhunter and Proud of It
Barty: Yea that's why I posted that to show the max size one could expect.
They actually found that it wasn't poached but legally shot by a hunter.
Let me know how your Spain trip goes!
Dad's ancient stag
Dad's ancient stag
My "Royal"
My "Royal"
Dad's "Royal"
Dad's "Royal"
My "Monarch"
My "Monarch"
Great stuff, guys! As I wrote in my Bowhunter magazine story on my DIY (with a couple Aussie buddies) free range hunt for the Scottish strain in Australia, "The size of the rack doesn't reflect the size of the challenge.
I'm with Jaquomo. I've hunted red stags in several places, but the absolute most interesting and fun was free-range in southern Queensland in thick tropical rainforest during the "roar."
Antlers there were not impressive; a 5x5 is a shooter and there is little crowning. But what a neat hunt!
Pete
I had a great hunt with Poronui Hunting this past May. I went a little after the roar, but we still saw a good number of stags. After many blown stalks, I was fortunate enough to get this great stag. The hunting, lodging, food and everything was top notch!
Wayne Preece Safaris in Australia. His prices are really reasonable and the US Dollar is really strong now at about 1:1.33 so its an even better value. I haven't been there (yet) but several people I know both from here in the US and in Australia have hunted with him. I believe his clients can take one trophy and one mangagment type animal. They are the Scottish type that as has been mentioned are typically smaller but there are really nice ones there too.
+1 on Wayne Preece. I hunted red deer with him before he started outfitting and it was a blast. Not only is he a world class bowhunter himself but a terrifically funny guy. He knows how bowhunters hunt.
And Ray, that 3 blade VPA you gave me zipped right through the stag I shot, thank you very much!
Check out hunting in Patagonia. They have both Tule Elk and red deer and the size is literally unbelieveable. Just type in Hunt Patagonia . They also have boar and a huge feral bull that dates to the conquistadors.
God bless, Steve
I hunted red stag in Argentina while I was living in Peru. The hunt, lodging, food and the people were spectacular. Might have some language issues - luckily I could converse in Spanish. Very tough stalking conditions for bow hunting due to the lack of trees. Would have been a cake walk with a rifle. Got lucky and found some bedded in a small grove of trees where I could stalk in on them.
I did not get my stag back to the US. Very difficult dealing with the shipping agent and the costs were higher than the cost of the hunt. You will want to get the full details on shipping before you book your hunt.
New Zealand or Australia would be a better choice (high fence for a really big one or free-range for a normal one) due to the language issues and I think they probably have a better handle on getting your trophy back to the US. Some of the European countries have fabulous red stag, but may have more logistical issues getting in and out as well as getting your trophy back.
I worked with a trophy shipping service out of San Francisco to get my stag back from Australia. I was assigned one person there to manage everything and I could call her anytime to check on the progress. They took care of everything, door to door, all the permitting there and here, and logistics, and I think it was right around $800 total.
That sounds much better than the crap I went through! It was over a year before the guy in Argentina got back to me and he wanted over $2K just to get it out of Argentina! It would have cost even more to get into the USA after that! Needless to say, I told them to keep it.
hi,my names graham and i,am a nzdr.those animals you guys are showing from nzd hunts, are all basically farmed deer,over6-10 yrs in age past their usefull breeding life,that are then on sold to socalled ranches for the canned hunt market.Even if they were in a 2000 acre paddock,they generally have been prized breeding stags on the deer farms. Truely they are not genuine wild deer.Just look at the antler formation and you would know what i,am saying.You need to think more deeply about your hunting,cheers.
