Watched this show the other nite and the host took and made a 101 yard shot on a bull. Granted the bull was standing unalarmed and never moved but still 101 is really pushing it. Was a perfect heart shot. I must say he appeared to be quite confident when he ranged it and then shot. I believe his name was Levi, can't remember his last name. I would say he has a future in the hunting field:)
I would say he will wound a bunch of animals that start to move in the nearly 2 seconds it takes for the arrow to get there, to say nothing of the unknown winds between him and the target.
You always see the success stories, never the failures.
In both rifle and compound hunting, it's become more about shooting and less about get up on the animal. If you want to shoot live animals at 100 yards, take a gun.
I hesitate to make arbitrary statements about what distances 'anyone' should be taking. I take shot angles that many people think are unethical. I'm sure there's someone who would say a shot distance that I'd consider taking would be unethical.
That said, I'm accurate to the pie plate size target far beyond the distance at which I'd consider shooting an animal. We shoot subsonic missiles and animals move at random and sometimes jump the string.
I think it takes more skill to get close and execute the shot, than it does to execute a 'long distance' shot. To me, that's what bowhunting is.
I recently met a "young" trad bowhunter who shoots a longbow and his take on his range, which is 20 yards and under, is that he feels it's basically the same range that non-human carnivores use. For instance, if you're a mountain lion, you don't start running at a deer from 100 yards. You start from 20 and run/pounce. The beauty of archery instead of using a gun, is it brings us back to our roots as carnivores. Yes, even a modern recurve is beyond early human technology, but it's still to the range that is on par with other carnivores and the prey's defenses that are built to defend against those distances.
I'm not going to fault anyone for shooting an animal at 100 yards, but I don't understand using a bow to do it.
If it was Levi Morgan, he can shoot at 100 yards like the rest of us shoot at 20.
Everything is relative. A couple days ago a guest in my home, who is a rifle hunter now dabbling with an old compound barebow from the 70s, declared that using sights on a bow is "the lazy man's weapon". He is planning to hunt elk this season, and on the range at 20 yards he is shooting 3 FOOT groups.
To each his own, I've also heard Levi practices out to 120+. Some guys practice to 50 then try to apply kentucky windage. Though I don't condone it, its not my choice to make.
It was Levi Morgan, he has a new show called "Name The Game" out that is filming his superslam. I guarantee you he is more comfortable shooing at 100 than the majority of guys are shooting at half that distance. He's good. Real good.
Like Nick said, good for him. Impressive. I'm glad he's attained such skill.
I still don't understand it. Just like I don't understand killing an animal at 1000 yards with a rifle or these custom scoped MLs that people are taking 400 yard shots with. To me, the shot doesn't fit the weapon and pushing the limits of the weapon betrays what the hunt is all about. In fact, a big part of the reason I don't rifle hunt at all is for the challenge that comes with getting close and drawing on an animal.
There was a time I practiced out to 120 yards and I felt I was a pretty good shot at 100. I'm certainly no Levi Morgan, but at the time, I was a damn good shot when I practiced as much as I did. I know for a fact I was lights-out beyond 60 and even 70-80 I shot groups that would consistently kill an animal, but the farthest I ever considered taking a shot on an animal was 60 and the farthest I ever have was 42. And nowadays, I wouldn't even shoot 60, even though I still practice and am proficient that far out.
That's me. And again, I'm not going to say it's wrong for others to do whatever. But I just don't understand it. But then again, I don't understand running a 200 mile race either. I'm big on fitness and exercise, but Cam Hanes and I don't see eye-to-eye on what's important to him and I.
Let's face it. There's guys that go into the woods every year that are more prone to wound an animal at 20 yards than Levi Morgan is at 100. I think that makes the ethics discussion at least partially a personal issue.
The only thing I can guess is that if you can, then you want to try. Some people want to try just because they've become so desperate to get an animal down that they'll try anything, but I think those folks will never succeed, so it must be something else with the folks that try and succeed. More of a personal test.
I used to agree with PECO, but a guy like Levi shooting at an unalarmed animal at 100 has a much higher success probability factor than a rattled guy with an untuned arrow shooting at a critter looking at him at 20 yards. That happens many times every day.
The stalk and being close is my favorite part. I believe Levi Morgan is a world champion 3d archer, so it'd make sense a guy like that could be confident with shots that far. These shows should put more emphasis on not winging shots at animals. Like "Disclaimer: world champion archer, don't shoot animals at 100 yards with a bow unless you're also a world champion archer" haha
Freaks me out when I hear people who rarely shoot their bows talk about taking shots even past 40 on an animal. To each their own I guess, but definitely gives me a sick feeling in my gut when I think about people taking those shots.
I've seen a few shows lately that either the animal turns, or the hunter jerks their body on the shot. The arrow goes into a hind quarter then they cut the shot, and explain "at least I hit an artery". And none of those shots were past 50 yards.
There is no connection between one's ability to make a given shot and the probability that the animal will still be in the same place when the arrow arrives. That is the folly in the logic of long distance shots. To each their own, but I place more emphasis on being a good hunter than being a good shot. It has been my experience that being good at the latter often retards one's ability to improve at the former.
Maybe 100 yards is a chip shot for Levi Morgan? If so, that puts him in the company of an elite few. The part I take issue with....is advertising such a feat as real world bowhunting on television. What kind of message is that sending?
I think most archery seasons were set as a primitive weapon seasons as they are listed in the Wyoming regulations this being said at what point do we start losing hunting seasons and or more equipment restrictions because we have become as lethal with a bow as a rifle hunter.
"at what point do we start losing hunting seasons and or more equipment restrictions because we have become as lethal with a bow as a rifle" hunter.
I don't know..........when that happens, that archery in any form is as easy and effective as firearm, check back in. until then anyone launching an arrow is at a decided disadvantage to anyone launching a bullet.
Shooting an animal like an elk at 100 yards is totally different than a whitetail. An unalarmed elk is going to be standing there waiting to soak an arrow. Levi is the elite of the elite. He took an even more difficult shot on the previous show while sheep hunting. I can't remember the exact distance but it was around 65 yards with a 40 degree slope and it required 9 yards to be cut from the rangefinder. He is in the 99.9 percentile of bowhunters that can make these shots.
I personally am not interested in taking long shots but I am interested in the ability to do so. I also admit that I have had a sliding scale over the years as to what I consider a long shot. When I started bowhunting, anything past 20 was a long shot. The more accurate I become and the more I learn about setups, 50 or 60 yards doesn't seem as far as it did in the past.
For century's bows have been shot at distances considered "unconventional" . Who am I to question their abilities and ethics. Many of the founding fathers shot distances most of us wouldn't.
Like Levi said after he shot the elk , people might thing it was a hell mary shot well it was not he practices all the time and at even longer distances and a lot goes into the shoot. He talked about wind drift and the and angle of the shot . Man is one the best archers in the word.
If I had to take a 100 yard shot to get my bull, I would consider it a failed hunt. He's a great shot, but I would want to get close. Isn't that what archery is about?
I agree with LKH and I don't care if it's Levi Morgan, Fred Bear, or MTQUIVER, that is ridiculous, totally unethical, and is the reason bowhunters get a bad rap. There are many people who can punch a pie plate at 100 yards, hell I can even do it, but taking a shot on any animal at that distance is moronic. Way to many things could and does go wrong with shots at that distance and a lot closer. I also agree that only those recovered animals would be shown, while most likely 10 are lost for every one that is taken at lofty distances like that. Just my opinion but I'm sticking to it.
Well good for Levi :/ . Isn't part of Bowhunting seeing how close we can get to the animal for a ethical shot ? He better watch some of the Primos videos. :)
Most guys, with proper equipment set-up, tuning, a little coaching, and a modest amount of practice, can become quite good on foam targets to 120 yards. That's not exceptional in this day and age. However, most will also understand that a live hunt situation can be much different, such that settling for a long shot isn't the wisest decision. But if you do successfully make such a shot on game, IMO best to keep your mouth shut about the range, and count the blessings of your good fortune.
1 shot at just over 100 yards with all the pressure of an ice cream cone bet with my 10 year old. We all know those are far more pressure packed than any elk hunt! Ha!
In all seriousness, just because you can doesn't mean you should. That choice is up to the individual archer's ethics and standards though and it's not my place to assign them. I personally would not risk it on an unwounded animal. It sure is nice to have the option though if a follow-up shot is required or possible. Practicing at those ranges also makes a 30-40 yarder seem very tame by comparison.
"Just because you can, doesn't necessarily mean that you should. I can afford some really nice hookers. But I don't pay for it."
Pretty sure all aspects of our hunting abilities make or break us as hunters. Shooting, calling, physical shape, decision making abilities ect. To me the guys has it going on and in this case used one of his strong suits to achieve success. Good for him. Maybe the next guy runs up 1000ft of elevation in 2 minutes tosses out some slut talk before a bull slips away and makes a 10 yard shot. Is that better somehow? I personally have shot elk at 60 yards. When conditions are right I will do it every time I have the chance. I also won't feel like I cheated either.
Am I missing something? Isn't the end game to put your tag on an animal? Also...don't tell me shooting 100 yards isn't ethical for Levi Morgan. I shoot with compounders that are unethical for shooting at an animal at 20 yards because they suck at shooting. I shoot with trad guys that are unethical when they take their crutch (bow) out of the truck because they are horrendous shots. Bowhunting for many of us is an up close and personal game but that doesn't mean it can't mean something different for somebody else.
I am just curious what distance Levi would have needed to shoot that elk for it to be Bowsite acceptable?
Anyone questioning Levi's "hunting skills" has no clue what his accomplishments as a bowhunter are. I am not condoning 100 yard shots but he is one that can make that shot almost every time on an unalarmed elk. I bet he could even do it right after running a 200 mile race! lol
You guys are criticizing the judgement of the best archer on the planet. Not only is he a GREAT shot, he is a good hunter too. 100 yards on an elk is pretty far. But 100 yards at the "right" elk is not TOO far!
What Matt said. I don't care if you're Levi Morgan, Levi Garrett, or Levi Strauss. IMO it's a sad day when we've reached the point where a 101yd bowshot on a living, breathing animal is accepted, let alone applauded.
"Not only is he a GREAT shot, he is a good hunter too."
Then why does he need to take a 100 yard shot???
Shows like this give the viewer the impression that 100 yard shots are okay to take, even though very, very few are capable of making such a shot routinely.
If taking animals at 100 yards becomes frequent, at what point does the fish and game people decide bowhunters are too efficient and no longer deserve first crack at the animals and a longer season?
X2 on Bowfreaks comments! --- If I had the ability to shoot 100 yards & the right occasion arose would I take it? Hell ya I'd take it! Problem is I do not have that ability so I rely on other facets to shorten the distance if at all possible. My average elk kill is 23 yards with farthest being 50 yards, wish I could shoot 100. (grin)
Levi is not the casual bowhunter here, he definitely stands out in his abilities & is well known for them. I seriously doubt he is recommending all here to try it. Stay within your abilities & don't condemn those that may exceed our own abilities. -- I can't run 200 miles either but I do applaud guys like Cameron who can.
From what I recall there was no cover between him and the bull. He could not get any closer and since the bull was undisturbed and he knew he could make the shot he took it. I'm glad I started this thread as it has brought out some good discussion.
I personally believe that it is irresponsible to shoot at that range regardless of your ability. That being said, I have done many irresponsible things in my past and undoubtedly will do in the future. Do you think the video would have been posted if the animal had been hit and lost?
An arrow in flight for over a full second before impacting a living animal just doesn't sound like a great idea unless you enjoy trailing wounded animals.
Foam 3D target? Sure! I have never seen a 3D target ever take a step or jump the string.
I agree with Matt, it is a live animal and can take a couple steps even if unalarmed and standing at the shot. It takes a nit of time for the arrow to get there. That said he is an awesome shot and he is the one who has to live with a bad shot if that is the result. Who am I too say what is ethical, I have mine, you have yours and Levi has his. Shawn
I have more issue with the average bowhunter that dusts off his bow a week before season and heads out for a hunt. I would venture to guess that these guys wound game at a much greater rate than people like Levi.
I don't care if he can robin hood arrows every time at 100 yards ....
the reaction time and chances the animal can move increases the farther away the animal is. That elk could have decided to take a step and before the arrow got there then what ?
Can't speak for others, but I normally truncate my target-effective distance to roughly 2/3rds for live animals. Size of the vital zone also comes into play. For follow-up shots on wounded animals, there's no limit. For that, a sight allowing for 100+ is handy.
I've seen animals jump at 15 yards, which resulted in a bad hit, vs animals that stand unalarmed at long distances.
I'm not a long distance shooter (furthest shots are in the upper 30's with longbow and recurve. But for the ethics police, is 15 yards too close because the animal can jump the sound of the shot, resulting in a bad hit?
What is the "ideal" distance for an animal to be unalarmed, but still be considered an "ethical shot"? What about a great shooter at 100 vs a Crappy shot at 30?
Instead of arguing each others abilities and what is considered an ethical shot why don't we figure it in a new light.
Take an animals kill zone, use 8in kill zone for big north central Iowa whitetails. Then figure an animals ability to react to sudden stimulus. A center of zone shot will allow an animal to move up to 4in and still achieve a kill shot. Take how long it took that animal to react and move 4in then apply that to your arrow flight time.
So if an average deer reacts and moves 4 inches in .12 sec (I'm making shit up) and your arrow flies at 285 FPS (guessing) then your truly ethical shot range is about 11 yards. Anything outside of this reaction range would be considered unethical because it allows the deer to evade your arrow regardless of your skills with the bow.
Figured this way we could all quit bitching about what is and is not ethical and any misses could truly be blamed on the animal.
"the reaction time and chances the animal can move increases the farther away the animal is. That elk could have decided to take a step and before the arrow got there then what ?"
Reaction time does increase, that's a fact. But the chances an animal can/will move? That's a biased opinion. I would make an argument that a higher percentage of animals move at 30 and under than 60+. Levi taking this shot at 100 is no different than most of us at that practice to 70 yards taking a 50 yard shot.
Not very long ago this thread would be titled "60 Yard Kill Shot". Not long from now it will be "140 Yard Kill Shot".
The ethics part isn't an issue for me. Levi taking that shot is less risky than many guys taking a 25 yard shot.
What I hope is that folks realize that a lot of what makes bowhunting special is directly tied to how limited our equipment is and the commitment it takes to become proficient. Longer seasons, easier access to tags, less crowding, the amount of satisfaction that comes from overcoming the odds, etc. These fantastic parts of bowhunting aren't improved by technology that makes things easier.
As we race towards making things easier, we might want to stop and assess whether or not we are really working in our own best interest long term.
Did you see this one! His dad shoots a alert bull in the back of the neck with a mechanical broadhead, while it's spooking and rolls it in it's tracks.
Levi's groups with broadheads at 150 yards are about 2"
I've seen a lot of elk shot over the years....and some very long shots. My take; animals move....so that has to be factored into your thought process.
These buddies of mine were shooting the ASA 3D circuit way back when. I'm telling you these guys were amazing shots with a bow but that doesn't factor in an animal moving....this bull took a step on the shot 55 yds ranged by me, both shot at almost the exact same time.........
I always go back to my basketball days. My range was ridiculous as I could hit at a strong percentage from 35 feet out.
However, I would NEVER take that shot in a game because there are always better shots. A patient shooter will get his chances and forcing shots usually ends bad.
Same thing when bowhunting - can guys make extreme shots? Sure. However, there are better and higher percentage shots.
Do I care if you shoot at 100 yards? Not really but don't tell me probability is better than a 20 yard shot. If you take 100 shots at that distance you will wound more animals than someone with the same ability at 20. Fact.
The old timers took super long shots regularly with longbows. They missed and wounded a lot too. Howard Hill killed the elk at 167 yards with his third shot.
Seems like some are now trying to make bowhunting into a "close range" pursuit, which of course it can be, but during the early years of modern bowhunting it was about getting an arrow in them at whatever distance possible. But today we also have to consider the image in the eyes of nonhunting voters who control the future of our sport. None of them will see Levi's great shot, but they may see videos on TV news of the gut shot deer hit at 25 yards and don't care a bit about the shot distance.
The old timers took super long shots regularly with longbows. They missed and wounded a lot too. Howard Hill killed the elk at 167 yards with his third shot.
Seems like some are now trying to make bowhunting into a "close range" pursuit, which of course it can be, but during the early years of modern bowhunting it was about getting an arrow in them at whatever distance possible. But today we also have to consider the image in the eyes of nonhunting voters who control the future of our sport. None of them will see Levi's great shot, but they may see videos on TV news of the gut shot deer hit at 25 yards and don't care a bit about the shot distance.
Fact is that Levi Morgan shoots more arrows in a single week than most of the guys on here do in a year. He knows his limits and he made his decision based on his gut. And is the OP stated, heart shot... But yet the same guys who tell their buddies "i can hit a pie plate at 30 yards" are criticizing him for taking the shot...
I agree with Ike, both posts ( except the hooker part ). I am not going to disparage Levi Morgan's skill, but it ain't for me. I know he can do it, he has the talent, but is one animal that important ? I don't think so, but folks have different levels of " give-a-shit ". It makes me sick to wound an animal. So much so, that I've only lost two deer in my life with a bow. I have, however, passed some shots I think I could have made. The longest shot I ever took was 47 yd. on a pronghorn, and even though it was perfect and he died within forty yards, I cussed myself afterward thinking about the " what ifs ". After all, I had already drawn my bow, and was easing on the trigger, when he spurted away from the water after a doe, then abruptly stopped. I let down, ranged, and shot. After he fell dead, the " what if " popped up in my mind. What if he spurted off again when I shot ? I know you can't guarantee what an animal will do at any yardage, but at twenty I at least have a better chance at something closer to where I want the arrow. That said, each and every one of us gets to make that decision for ourselves.
Old news, people been doing this as long as bows and arrows have been around. The difference is now these shots are much more doable with these bows today.
Some say that it doesn't matter, people wound stuff at 15 yards, same as 100. True it is, but I think the real problem isn't the ones that don't miss, the ones that don't wound, it's the ones that kill! When you lose 2 weeks of archery season to flintlocks you will see what I mean.
So post up some more 100 yard kills, it's really cool.
An arrow at 300 fps and a bullet at 3000 fps take a second to travel 100 and 1000 yards respectively. Same type of question about what could happen between touching off the shot and when it gets there. What was the elk doing that Levi "knew" it wouldn't move less than a foot in that second - bedded and sleeping? That half a step to munch on the next blade of grass turns a clean kill to a gut shot or a stuck in the shoulder bone shot.
Assume he can hit a coin at 100 yards 99x out of 100, or whatever level of certainty makes the shot range itself on a static target a high probability 'ethical' shot. But that 1 second hang time is an unavoidable wildcard. Shoot...one one thousand...arrive at target range. As said earlier, they only televise the clean hits.
A 100 yard bow shot on an elk is fantastic accuracy...great shooting. I would equate the hunting satisfaction as being on par with kissing your girlfriend through a screen door. I'll wait for a better chance.
Glunt makes some great points. Many will not recognize what he talking about. I am not questioning the bowhunter's skill (Levi) as it is obvious he is one of the best, if not THE BEST, shot in the world or archery.
I do, however, sincerely question the thought process that would air this on TV. This tells me something about the hunter, or producers, or both, and that they really don't have the "give a shit" in them, regarding the future of bowhunting and properly representing us to the remainder of our citizenry.
Setting aside the aesthetics/definition of hunting issue, I have the same take on 100 yard bow shots as I do on 1000 yard rifle shots:
There are about 1 in 1000 hunters with enough proficiency to even attempt such shots without a very high likelihood of missing or wounding the animal. To me, that means that there only about 1 in 1000 hunters who should be taking such shots.
BUT, the trends towards publicizing and glorifying such shots translates into more and more people who have zero business doing so flinging lead and arrows at game at these ultra long distances. The rifle makers want to sell rifles and the bow makers want to sell bows - so the airwaves are increasingly filled with such shots and the magazines are increasingly filled with ads promoting "Long Range" rifles/bows trying to convince folks they can buy proficiency. Which is a lie - and a lie for which game suffers.
(And arguing that others who shoot at lesser ranges are often not proficient is not a valid response, because showing wrongs occur at lesser ranges does not excuse taking shots at ultra long range if one is not proficient enough to do so.)
"I'm still waiting for someone to tell me the acceptable distance for an elk to be shot and still survive the Bowsite ethics gauntlet?"
It's obviously the triple digit phobia. Two yards closer and we'd be fine with it. ;)
Seriously now, I could make that shot ten for ten on a 3D elk using a rangefinder. Maybe 50 for 50. In that particular live hunting situation, it wouldn't even occur to me to nock an arrow. Maybe if he was bedded/sleeping (maybe).
Jaq - it says they missed. Beyond that, I couldn't say without knowing more. Misses/woundings happen, but surely you agree that we should not just openly court them by flinging an arrow at any animal we see?
These bows these days are amazing!put them in the hands of a guy like Levi Morgan and it's lights out.I'm sure if Levi was not 100 percent sure on the that shot he wouldn't of taken it.would I take that shot?absolutely not..bow hunting for me is all about being close.
Doesn't matter how far the guy can shoot a target! That is BS to guess that an animal will stand there for two seconds until the arrow gets there when it can move a full body's length in that amount of time. Not ethical, period, no matter how good he is on targets at that distance! Same goes with people shooting animals at 1000+ yards with a rifle! What next, a tank that you can buy surplus!
I have to agree with Topgun. Don't care if you are lights out, there is NO ONE that can be 100% sure that the animal won't move. If he is sleeping, maybe?
I believe Levi is now an 11 time world champion hard to argu with his skill. If you watch the bowhunter mag crew hunting mule deer show, one of there executives shoots at mule deer running quartering to, and hits it in guts then says that's why u shoot a rage. What message is sent there.
There is some distance to that too far, we can all agree on that. Or do you propose that someone taking a 500 yard shot at an elk with a bow is OK for some?
Not everyone will agree on exactly what that is because there are always those that will push the limits. But I bet in a poll, 95% of Bowhunters would say that 100 yards is too far.
Take a look at that elk Beendare posted that two expert guys shot at just 50+ yards. When it moved at that distance that is half of what the OP posted the one shot hit it in the ass and the other is not much further forward. Pathetic to be even talking about shooting at a live animal at 100 yards!
BTM, then I guess my 30+ yard longbow kills make me a wild-eyed arrow flinger!
:-P
Point is, we can judge all we want but that's all it is. I've never seen a bowhunting rule book that says you can't take a shot you "feel" under the circumstances, which is within your competency range.
Nor can I find the rule that says bowhunting is supposed to be a "close range sport". Can somebody show me the chapter and verse? If your personal choice is to make it so, good for you. If you want to take a shot at an unalarmed animal at a range where you can hit the ten ring 10 out of 10 times, and you pinwheel the animal, who am I to judge?
I just read a story by Saxton Pope describing their hunting methods. He talks about Compton shooting a running deer at 65 yards with a primitive longbow. Now Compton is the traditional icon. Was he "unethical"? Not talking about a deer taking a step, but flat out running.
I remember back when compounds first hit the commercial market. Oh boy, the campfire and coffee shop consensus was that compounds would ruin bowhunting, end our seasons, lead to guys taking shots of 50 yards or more. Yet the success rate has stayed virtually the same for elk across the west.
This is all much ado about nothing. Thank goodness hunting is starting soon!
I posted that pic to prove the point- animal movement is a factor on any shot. Now in the case of Levis 100 yarder...it could be there was little chance of that bull moving... Making it a better shot than a guy at 30yds with an elk that was coiled and ready to bolt.
In the instance i presented, my 2 ASA buddies were at full draw, i ranged the bull and stopped him with a bugle- so he was looking at us from across an avalanche schute when they shot. Big difference shooting at aware animals... EDIT; - I think Levis 100yd shot at an unaware stationary animal considering his ability is a better shot than an avg Joe Blow bowhunter that grunts a whitetail to a stop at 30 yds with the buck on alert.
Buddy of mine hunted the Deseret in Utah a couple years ago. I believe the hunt was like $15,000 or in that range. The rules of the ranch - when you draw blood you are done for the week/hunt.
He said it really made you think about your shot.
I bet if the same decision process was applied, many people would not be launching some of the same arrows they do in such a cavalier fashion on distance or tough angle shots.
Many people are able to drive tacks at 100 yd targets, but live animals way to much can happen. I feel there is way to much monkey see monkey do. So if they shoot at animals like that keep it off tv, magazines,etc. It just puts ideas in people`s head that if they can do it I can do it. I feel it is not what are beloved sport is about. What happen to the meaning archery close??
I have a friend that is a nationally ranked archer and he practices daily at 100 yard shoots. is groups are normally 4-5". I am confident he would easily hit elk at that range. Not me but money money would be on him. As far as on live animals I have seen him shoot multiple whitetails at 75 yards out in a field. Shoots a 58# Hoyt Elite with GT Hunter pros and Rocket steelheads.
Good for Levi.....for practicing his craft for tens of thousands of shots over many years. There are "a lot" of keyboard Cowboys out there that would rather sit on the couch, eat Cheetohs and watch faux whitetail "hunting" vids than get out there and embrace the discipline needed to be an overachiever.
Personally, I get great satisfaction out of stalking within 40 yards of critters, but I am in no position to critique one of the greatest archers of all time.....
good for him and not for everyone. Your ability, your choice. Dont let your individual inability dictate someone else's ability.
On another note, Iv seen far more animalls"move" at 20yards then any other distance after seeing hundreds of animals killed with a bow and arrow, so based on my own real experience, I have not problem with it, given his ability.
I'll go with some advice I read from Chuck Adams. "Take the first good shot you get." He also said he's more concerned with the animals attitude than how far the shot is. (what's more ethical, a 25 yard alerted deer or a 45 yard grazing deer?) He said he's never lost an animal but took grief for shooting a good buck at around 50 yards. Know your ability and what is a good shot within that ability.
It's pretty simple I like levi so i watch his show and enjoy it. i also think he gives back to the sport of archery more than he ever takes. He's in alaska bowhunting as we speak and all of us are sitting at a computer reading this post. Real simple if you don't like levi click the TV off. I bet Levi is ready to hear the click go off on another perfect arrow. Wait he should stalk in on a Grizz to at least 5 yards and get a good shot.
Remember when Chuck Adams killed at the time the new world record couse Whitetail stalked and shot at 63 yards with a slow bow and giant 5 inch vanes and huge heavy easton alluminum arrows, shooting fingers none the less. All i could say at the time was wow Chucks the man. Chuck knows when the right time to shoot is and so does levi.
Eric Chasser, shot the bull the first time at 76 yds with a mech and full shoulder. It lived and then he went back to the same place days later and made a shot further tp klll it??? Had to track it for a day with a fixed.
Is the the time WE are ushering in of long archery kills?????? Lests max it out and hope and pray for everything to come together. Well if not, ill just keep hunting!!!
People have been launching arrows and bullets beyond their effective range since long before TV shows, internet, even books. That's human nature. I still haven't met an honest bowhunter who hasn't pushed the distance on an animal at some point in his life.
The difference is that Levi Morgan routinely makes shots way beyond the effective range of most of us. 40 years ago everyone on this thread who shoots animals at 50+ yards would have been considered wild, unethical arrow launchers by the judges.
You can't legislate personal ethics and beliefs. That's why I don't say it's wrong for people to take very long shots. It would be wrong for me...that's all. I happen to also think it's wrong for our sport but that's a personal thing and open to debate. As Jaq stated there have been people pushing the limits and taking shots far beyond their known certain accuracy for as long as there have been bows. I haven't yet seen a written law governing maximum shot distance; nor have I seen one saying you must punch your tag if you draw any blood. Bowhunters are still free to fling arrows with wild abandon just as some firearms guys can pound 5 shots at running game with only a remote hope they'll connect. It's legal...but it's not politically correct in this age. We've gone from 'just kill it' to 'kill it the way I say'. I sometimes chuckle and wonder what our predecessors would say if they could talk.
I admit I'm a paradox. I'm against (for myself, not politically) long range bowhunting. Still, I think you and I should always have the right to burn an arrow at whatever distance we wish...be it a prairie dog or an elk. Both lives matter to the natural world.
I have learned a few things and still have a few questions. First thing I have learned is that it is unethical to shoot animals like a Coues deer with a bow. Everyone knows that Coues deer move like crazy even at 15-20 yards. Therefore I am saying its unethical to shoot at them with a bow.
The one question I still have is if Levi's mailman wounded any deer last year with his bow?
My guess is if we can get another 15-20 posts on this thread we will resolve this issue to everyone's mutual satisfaction and agreement once and for all.
I wish that I could shoot like Levi. He is no doubt one of the best shooters of all times. 100+ yard shots are certainly within his skill level. I believe that he is trying to complete the 29 on film and I am sure is feeling the pressure. I have taken some long shots and practice shooting longer shots for when a follow-up may be necessary. However, part of the charm of bowhunting for me is getting close to the animal. For me shooting is just part of the equation. Bowhunting for me is having the ability to get within the animal's safety zone. Some species are easier to get close to than others. Every situation is different. I don't have the pressure of needing to get a successful hunt on film. As I get older, I find myself passing up more of the longer shots even if I end up eating the tag and I have ate a lot of tags lately :-(.
Well strungs video above of Levis dad shooting a bull in the neck is a prime example of why all shots are not the same. Levi drills a bull in the heart at 100 his dead gets lucky on an alert bull at 40-50 yards. The proofs in the pudding on Levi's 100 yard shot. If you hit a bull on the heart at 100 yards you must be doing something right. An unalert bull at 100 yards isn't much different than an alert coues at 20 yards. How many wouldn't take a 20 yard shot on an alert coues?
I know from "renting" a few for business clients that a high-end gal who charges $1000-1500 on a Saturday night might haggle down to $500-750 on a Monday night if it's slow.
The corollary here is to never pass one up on Monday that you'd settle for the next Saturday.
I have a cousin who practices out to 100 yards and can put it in the breadbasket from that distance...being the billy badass that he is he has said if given the opportunity he would shoot an animal at that distance...this is something we bring up when talking about hunting and because he does brag about it, I personally, will not shoot an animal from that distance...I tell him "you want to shoot 100 yards at an animal get a muzzle-loader." So, a few years ago he is on a deer hunt and has a muley buck at 25 yards, takes a shot and misses...after he told me this story and being the smart ass that i am i reply "you should have walked backwards 75 yards!" and instantly received the finger and some choice words ;)
100 yd shot at an animal changes it from a hunting challenge to a shooting challenge. Shooting an animal that far away wouldn't be much different to me than just finding a dead deer that someone else shot. One of the reasons I hunt with a bow is the need to get close.
I believe Howard Hill killed an elk at 180 yards with his longbow. Now, he didn't have a laser rangefinder, but I also recall the video of Ben Pearson killing a running javelin at 125 yards.
It's not worth worrying about. Take care of your own stuff.
The whole distance thing is sort of a internet jibberish.
Excuse my bluntness but you practice in the backyard at 100 yds...sure its fun, sure its impressive but truthfully? doesn't mean your good to go every time a bull steps out of the timber at 100 yds. Host of things can go wrong between you and a bull 100 yds away, wind being worthy of mention.
What really makes me chuckle is the whole well such and such did it? archery legend stuff.
You guys need to put your big boy pants on and quit living under someone else's shadow. I have no problem with congratulating a guy or "legend" on a good shot.
The guy made a 101 yd kill shot...To debate it is stupid. He killed it for pete's sake , he didn't miss or wound it, if he had then we'd discuss it after that matter.
But he killed it, that's dead folks...congrats.
Does that mean ..."oh boy" oh boy" me too! me too!
hah huh, nope....If I knew I could? well yea maybe....Point is its my choice my call.
What he, or you, or , or Fred Bear or Howard Hill does or did has no bearing on what I do WHATSOEVER!! after all I'm the one holding the bow not them.
To many of you idolize, and live a monkey see monkey do life.
Bottom line is you make the call, because your doing the shooting and no one else.
On today's show his brother (who is his camera man) fell and broke his arm on their BC hunt then a few days later Levi shot a Mtn. Goat then a huge Black Bear. He's on his way to the Super Slam! He's very good!
I agree it is none of our business or concern, but the comment "He killed it for pete's sake , he didn't miss or wound it, if he had then we'd discuss it after that matter." is an empty one.
You will only see the kills. he may only make kills on very long shots, or he may only make one clean one out of 50, we'll never know. Everyone bats 1.000 on TV.
The thing that surprises me the most about this thread is the sheer number of people who claim the ability of themselves or several people they know to drive tacks with a bow at 100 yards. Personally, I do not have the skills to shoot over 100 yards, but an archer of Levi's caliber taking that long of a shot, under the right circumstances, does not bother me a bit. I would rather take a longer shot at a relaxed and feeding animal than a 20 yard broadside shot at one on full alert.
I would say he will wound a bunch of animals that start to move in the nearly 2 seconds it takes for the arrow to get there, to say nothing of the unknown winds between him and the target. You always see the success stories, never the failures
Definetly agree with this one.
To the best of my knowledge there is no law against wounding an animal.
Really ?? There is such a thing as wanton waste, yes it is illegal.
Dear Matt - "There is no connection between one's ability to make a given shot and the probability that the animal will still be in the same place when the arrow arrives. That is the folly in the logic of long distance shots. To each their own, but I place more emphasis on being a good hunter than being a good shot. It has been my experience that being good at the latter often retards one's ability to improve at the former. "
I think there's probably more animals wounded at 5,10,15,and 20 yards than 101 yards. Animals move at any distance, short or long. hehe Just keeping it going.
Ok. It's time to get this thread back on track and discuss hooker strategy.
Is it better to pay the full asking price of $1500 with guaranteed opportunity or negotiate down to $500 and risk not getting a shot? Just because you can afford to pay $1,500 doesn't mean that you should.
I haven't seen anyone claim they would pass a 20 yard shot on an alert coues, yet. If you'll take that shot a long shot, by a proven archer, on an unexpecting elk shouldn't bother you. Ask Ermine how many couse he had duck the string at close range this year. Personally I'd take a 20 yard shot at an alert couse and an 80 yard shot at an unsuspecting elk. If I were Levi 100 wouldn't bother me. I assume by a lot of the posts on here many of you would pass the 20 and try to kill your couse at 10 or less.
Hitting a target at 100 yards is one thing- (I can with a 30-06!)but eventually if you keep taking that shot wind or the animal moving is going to result in a wound- not a good choice in my book. I have a buddy who went to NM on a guided elk hunt a few years ago- he took a 77 yard shot in high winds-hit a 350 way back someplace- he lost the animal- the outfitter kicked him off the property! His hunt was over. At the range in Wisconsin he was grouping that shot at 4 inches-hunting shots are different.
From: wifishkiller Date: 18-Aug-16 Yikes we are still going at this??? He's one of the best archers in the world let's give it a rest.
I could give a rat's azz if everyone thinks he's God! That's too damn far and long for an arrow to travel HOPING the animal doesn't move in that time frame! Nuff said!
The bad thing about TV shows and 80 plus yard shots is that average hunters start to think that is acceptable. I'm a fishing and hunting outfitter in Wisconsin. I stopped watching hunting shows two years ago. I guess I'm old school. Don't care-that's to dang far-even in perfect conditions-as an exhibition-great-hunting-H..l no.
"I think there's probably more animals wounded at 5,10,15,and 20 yards than 101 yards."
Agree!
1) There are probably a thousand game shots taken at animals under 50 yards for every one 100 yards or farther.
2) Probably only one out of ten actual hunting shots over 100 yards would even connect on the animal. The rest would miss completely.
Kind of like saying there are more car accidents at speeds under 60 mph vs over 100 mph. Most folks aren't into triple digit speeds...or bowhunting shots.
Any of your guys ran the numbers on how long it takes a 340 fps bow to shoot 100 yards vs a trad bow shooting 40... I know a lot of trad guys that would not hesitate to shoot an elk at 40!
Who is this Barbara chick you speak of? I think I would like to Google her.
And does anyone know how long it takes a typical arrow, say 450 gr, to get to 100 yards if it started out going 300 fps? Speed would decrease to approx what? KE or momentum? That might be interesting.
What about 300 yards? Wow you would have to aim something like 90 feet above the target. Would that be ethical?
Thank you Levi for showing me what is possible. I'm not going to call myself a 100-yards bowhunter (yet) but half that distance should be easy-peasy, right? The new standard, don't shoot more than half the distance your hero on TV is shooting. Look out elk!
My buddy guided on a pig ranch in Ca for many years, some good pro shooters too. He loves to count shots- (I know as he will tell me how many hits and misses every time we go carp shooting- grin)
I can't remember the exact numbers now but out of something like 35 shots over 75 yards and out to 120yds on deer and pigs...they had one kill. Some were aware animals....so again, can't compare to Levis shot.
The Big League "escorts" are top-level pros. They know how to judge a shot opportunity to determine if $1500 is makeable, if they need to walk away, or settle for a $750 shot.
As far as each individual bowhunter's competency, effective range, situational ethics, and shot choices we've all made in our lives, the lyrics of another old country song comes to mind: "No one knows what goes on behind closed doors".
Broadcasting it for the world is a whole nother thing.
I'll be the first to admit no way I'm shooting 100 yds with a bow. I'm not good enough.
Bou bound.. Your statement about "everyone bats 1000 on TV"
Can't argue with that.
I tend to believe what I see though, I see a 101 yd kill shot. After all that was the original topic of this thread, not how many does he wound.
How many he wounds at 100 yds without actually knowing becomes purely speculation. Is he 100% is he 75% 50% ?
We have no way of knowing if the guy "Levi Morgan" routinely takes hail mary hope I can kill it 100 yd shots.
I'm kinda thinking probably not. What I think is the guy is an excellent shot, remains calm and takes the shot if he knows he can kill it.
What so many of you fail to recognize is you need to be doing this every time you loose an arrow regardless if its 100 yds or 15 yds.
Obviously we don't, because every year I hear the same old, same old..."hit but never found" and they are not all 100 yd shots. In fact the vast majority are far less.
So obviously in many cases it's not the yardage that is the problem, its us.
I've been bowhunting now for over 35 yrs. One thing clear is way back in the beginning of my bowhunting capades, my wounding percentage was higher, but in the last 10 yrs I'm batting 100% why ? Truthfully I was just as good of a shot back then.
I can't put a date or year on it, or say I suddenly had some bowhunting revelation. But a transformation from thinking in terms of "yardage limits" to a "kill it, kill zone" mentality took place. And it came gradually through experience.
I never loose an arrow now just because an animal walks into a predetermined range limit, I loose an arrow now because I know I'm gonna kill it.
I have left countless deer go, having never felt that, "kill zone, kill it" opportunity, only to range where it walked afterward and discover it was only 20 couple yds.
Yet on a opening evening had a doe step in an opening at 31 yds and drilled her and watched her drop within sight. It wasn't the yardage that made the difference.
Our nerves are our number #1 biggest enemy,and the pressure of the moment often causes us to make a bad hit regardless of range, Whether it means we shot to quick, shot before we should have, or took a risky shot.
As yardage increases so does the risk. That is simply common sense that cannot be denied. Nobody shoots a bow as accurately at 50+ as they do at 20yds. Not on the range, and certainly not in the field.
That is not saying some of you are not good enough to make a kill shot at longer ranges.
But you should know that when you release that arrow your going to kill it regardless of range.
If you cannot remain calm and poised during the shot then your going to have problems occasionally regardless of yardage.
Bottom line.....
The animal is in the right position, Your nerves are in control, Your focused, your form is good, all your thoughts are wrapped around sending the arrow right to where in needs to go, and you've done this countless times before.
and in that instant.....
The arrow is gone, a flash of fletch, a puff of hair right where you knew it would go, a good shot.
As long as your blootrailing skills (whole different topic) are good.
It's over until the picture taking.
Each of us needs to know when the shot is right regardless of yardage.
It is a lot easier to get within 100 yds of an elk than 50 or even 30. I'd say he's either lazy or afraid he can't do it right and just took the long shot rather than work for it. Maybe he is one of those rifle hunters that bow hunts just to get out in earlier season. Anyone can release on 100 years shot. I say he is overall bad for archery.
Jason- I think you had better read this thread over very carefully. Me thinks you are clueless about who we are talking about. Saying Levi Morgan may be a rifle hunter who bowhunts just to hunt earlier in the season is just plain ridiculous.
"The Big League "escorts" are top-level pros. They know how to judge a shot opportunity to determine if $1500 is makeable, if they need to walk away, or settle for a $750 shot. Lou"
You can't drop a bomb like that and just walk away!
Sorry but what gets me is the ethics issue. No one can really judge what is ethical for someone. I myself feel it is unfair to use trail cameras like they are being used today, is it unethical? Who am I too say, but now guys are patterning deer to the point that they know when they get up out of their bed, don't seem fair to me. I saw the shot Levi made and sorry but on an animal that was totally relaxed and someone who can shoot ping pong balls at 100 yards, I think it was a lot more ethical then a lot of yahoos who go out and shoot field points all year and then screw on a broadhead(mechanical or fixed) and go out and hunt. I also saw the shot on the ram as well, that would really get this group outraged as that was closer but their was a lot of elevation change and kentucky windage. I will say this, if I could shoot as well as Levi I would not have a problem taking some longer shots, I don't so I try and keep everything around 20 yards but I have killed deer to 48 yards oh and by the way my two longest kills were with my recurve. Compound I believe 40 is about the farthest I have shot at game. Last thing, I would think that a bow that shoots an arrow at 300 fps. said arrow would arrive in 1 second at 100 yards. A-thousand-one->>>-----> Shawn
Congrats to Levi for having the ability to make those shots...it will have to be a perfect situation for me to even think about attempting a shot at over 45 yards and I'm pretty good on the archery range to 80 (I think I am anyway).
I think Levi's shooting is ethical for him...I just don't know if it is the right thing to do in promoting it.
Regardless of the weapon, there becomes a range at which shooting is either unethical, unsporting or undeserving of the advantage of special season dates. People don't like to talk specifics but, given advancing technology and increasing dedication to skill development, we will eventually have to cross that bridge.
I love the ethics cops! I guarantee that Levi shooting that elk at 100 yard is 100 times more "ethical" than 90%+ of bowsiters shooting one at 40 yards.
I would wager that he could take that shot 20 times and you could take yours at your ethical distance 20 times and he would beat you out on every trial.
From: Velvet Muley Date: 21-Aug-16 I love the ethics cops! I guarantee that Levi shooting that elk at 100 yard is 100 times more "ethical" than 90%+ of bowsiters shooting one at 40 yards. I would wager that he could take that shot 20 times and you could take yours at your ethical distance 20 times and he would beat you out on every trial.
That is pure malarkey, just like everyone else that is condoning a shot that far just because the guy can shoot targets that stand still! Nobody other than a clairvoyant should be shooting at a live animal that far with the time lag there is even if he can hit ping pong balls at that distance regularly! When is the hunting community going to start holding these kind of people accountable for stupid actions like this that they post on the net?!
From: Velvet Muley Date: 21-Aug-16 "That is pure malarkey, just like everyone else that is condoning a shot that far just because the guy can shoot targets that stand still!" Looks like he can shoot more than just targets that stand still.:)
The only statement you've made so far on this thread is that you're the silly one, LOL! Please tell me how he can know at 100 yards that the bull was not going to move enough from the time that arrow left with the lengthy flight time it took to get there so that he wouldn't miss or even worse wound it. Answer is you can't and don't try to tell anyone it's the same on close shots because it's not!
Yes Levi just shot a huge Dall Ram can't wait to see a picture of it and personally don't care how far the shot was, the fact is he made the shot again did i say again. Give Levi credit he is better than us in pressure shot execution suck it up.
Who is the "hunting community" and how do you hold arguably the best bow shot in the world "accountable" for making great shots on animals?
Where is the rule stating how far a bow shot "should be"? I keep looking through the bowhunting rule book and can't seem to find it..
My maximum effective range is 40 yards. I shoot 3-D's with guys who shouldn't shoot at 20. People who shoot poorly-tuned rigs and can't hit the ocean, yet still hunt, are the ones to "hold accountable", not world-class shooters who make amazing shots under pressure.
I guess what bothers me about 101 yards is that, I have this maximum shot yardage in my head for an elk hunt, and 101 yards is way, way beyond what I have in my head. I can imagine a really good bow shot taking a borderline ethical shot and killing an elk at 60-70 yards, but 101 is so far beyond that it is shocking to me. But that is just me.
I once saw a friend empty his quiver twice at 15 yards. Does kept laughing at him, but hey he was a "traditional archer". If we are going to dive so deep in ethics maybe trad gear could be unethical or be restricted to -15 yards. Slippery slope when the ethics police arrive. Lots of what ifs and those same ifs can happen at 20 yards. I'd rather miss an animal that moved at 80 than wound one that moved at 20-30. Personally never had to shoot over 35 but if someone does I don't think it makes them unethical or not a skilled stalker. That was just as close as the could get on that stalk and they have confidence in their ability to shoot a feeding animal at an unconventional distance. Personally I think many of you fellas are jealous you can't hit a target beyond thirty.
here we go again , hunters telling hunters how each other should hunt. the bull is dead period. i say great shooting!!!, I've guided hunters to hundreds of animal. and have seen more gut shot at 20 yards then at 60.
From: Velvet Muley Date: 21-Aug-16 Lengthy flight time? Ok, since you have it all figured out explain lengthy to me. What's the difference in flight time between 50 and 100? The FACT is he made the kill, so unless you know of shots hes taken at that distance and missed your argument is nothing but based on opinion. There's your statement.
You can sure make some ridiculous comments and now that post was the worst of the bunch! It's obviously going to take longer for the arrow to get from the 50 yard spot to 100 yards than it did from 0 to 50 yards, so you're talking a huge difference in time for an arrow that is moving slow to begin with compared to a bullet. All you guys keep talking about this guy Levi like he's God versus other people that can't match him on targets. I'm talking about shooting at a live, breathing animal that can move at an instant and I don't care who the guy is because he doesn't know that animal is not going to move as he releases the arrow. IF it does, he is in a lot deeper shit than one that moves at less than half that distance and I'm not talking about a Coues or Whitetail that jumps the string. One last comment to the members making comments about the ethics police and that is if we don't police ourselves on some of this crap like 100 yard bow shots and 1000 yard rifle shots it will come down to someone else doing it for us and I don't care to be around when that happens because it will involve a lot more than just distances! You all have a great time trying to justify the guy and his 101 yard kill in this thread, as I'm heading for a bunch of hunts in Wyoming and Arizona and won't be around again until it's time to vote in November!
The fact is it takes less than a second for his arrow to get there. Did you watch the segment? That elk's body language didn't indicate that he was going to move much at all in the period of time and he didn't. Dead elk!
Top gun, the anti hunters have all ready won if we are " policing" ourselves. Nothing like hunters condemning hunters, just like Republicans, we are not afraid to eat our own.
Fuzzy you are right! Did you hear the joke about the three hookers having breakfast? Hooker one told the other two "I had sex with a fireman last night." The other two said "how do you know that?" She responded "because I saw his big hose". Hooker two said "I slept with a bowhunter, because he showed me his long shaft". Hooker three states "I had a farmer". The others ask "how do you know that?" She responds "because first he complained it was too dry and then complained it was too wet and when we were done he wanted to know if there were any free hats to give away!"
Topgun 30-06 the statement you made about not knowing how it was not going to move at 1-- yards is just as funny, we as hunters don't know if they are going to move at 20 yards at the sound of the shot. I have heard some say it is better too take longer shots then close ones as animals at farther distances do not jump the string so readily. Lots of folks capable of killing at longer distances. I am sorry, they are animals and although they deserve our best to make a clean quick kill, it does not always happen, whether that be at 10 yards or 100. I watched a guy last night on NAW gut shoot a texas buck at 110 yards with a rifle. I am one who does not have a problem with the shot. The Dall ram was quite a bit closer but he had to do the math to make the shot, to me the 65 yard Dall shot was way harder then the bull Elk shot. Shawn
"Give Levi credit he is better than us in pressure shot execution suck it up."
"i say great shooting!!!"
I don't know the guy, but from the last two kills posted here - 101 yard elk shot, 65 yard sheep shot - all I know is he's a great shooter. Something more appropriately demonstrated on targets. We are supposed to be bowHUNTERS. Seems he's pretty lame in the 'hunter' part of that, otherwise he would be confident enough to close the distance.
Just because some screw up at shorter ranges doesn't mean longer shots are better. Distance alone, no matter how accurate, increases the chances for a bad result.
"The old timers took super long shots regularly with longbows. They missed and wounded a lot too. Howard Hill killed the elk at 167 yards with his third shot."
There are two problems with that argument. Tolerance for hunting and wounding were much higher back then. And, unlike now, they took the ENTIRE shot on their own abilities, including range estimation. I'd be more impressed if these long range shoots did it consistently without the electronics.
I'll tell you guys how to solve this problem once and for all. Get 6 and 10 year old daughters. When you do have time to watch TV, you watch some cool stuff like "cake wars", "cake boss", "tree house masters" and animated classics like shimmer and shine.
They build some cool stuff on tree house masters. Bake offs on TV and my kids eyes are glued. Holy crap they make elaborate cakes these days - that is a skill.
If you don't watch the 101 yard shot, your undies won't get bunched up over it.
why is it when somebody posts about long range shooting and it discussed that anything can happen by the time the arrow gets to its mark, the only defense is that the guy is a great shot and he can and should do it, isn't anybody listening,, its not about the accuracy of the archer its about what happens between the shot and when the arrow gets to where its going, no matter how good a shot you are, if the animal moves just a bit you don't have the shot you had, if the wind drifts the arrow 8 inches you don't have the shot you had, The problem with long range shooting is about what happens that you have no control over and there is plenty
To calculate how long an arrow takes to travel 100 yards, you can't just divide the the distance by the speed the arrow leaves the bow at.
First of all, arrows don't go straight to the target. They go up then come down. The farther the shot, the bigger the arch, which increases the distance. So for a 100 yard shot, the arrow has to travel more than 100 yards.
Bowtech RPM 360 with a Carbon Express Maxima Red—a solid, 417-grain finished hunting arrow will leave the bow at 323 ft/sec taking 1.027 seconds at 100 and arrive with 67# ke.
I wonder how long it takes with a bow that's closer to average of most hunters.
That's a new speed bow with a 6 inch BH, a relatively high draw wt (70) and long DL (30). Additionally, many elk hunters hunt with a heavier arrow than 417 grains.
I wonder where the average is and how long it takes for that?
Might not be a big difference, but a draw wt of 60-65 lbs, a draw length of 28 inches, and an arrow wt of 450 grains out of a bow with a 7 inch BH is going to travel slower. Those aren't my specs, but my arrow isn't even close to 300 fps.
At a constant 280 ft/sec 1.071. I can't figure for the arrow slowing down after all the best I could do in college algebra is a C. Most elk hunting setups out there maybe 1.2?
Compounds, (and especially crossbows) are very, very effective at ranges out to 175+ yards. All you have to do is practice at these ranges and cut some arrows and bolts loose, you may be rewarded with a trophy of a lifetime.
Howard pulled big poundage. Most stickbows are very good out to 125+ yards if one practices at that range. The snow buck was killed at around 70+ yards by Fred, and that was with a relatively inefficient bow. I am sure even 175 yards is not a stretch for modern stickbows,...... with some practice. You will miss 100% of the shots you never take.
Re-posting Well-Strung's video...were they trying to show that this was intentional...I'm seeing this bull move way ahead of the arrow arriving. Anyone else thinking "lucky miss"?
Definitely a blind hog factor on that one... "Glory Glory" because it was nothin' short of a miracle that the bull moved exactly enough in exactly the right direction to take the arrow in the back of the neck.
And you'll notice that they zoomed the hell back out as fast as they could so that you can't get a better look at what happened....
Levi is not the only guy out there that can shoot an elk at 100. It is happening more than people think. Like said above Levi could probably shoot a tweety bird at 100, so he shouldn’t be looked down on for doing so. The problem here lies in the fact that our bows have gotten to that point, and we as bowhunters better realize we are and will lose more oppurtunity because of it. Our liberal archery seasons were set way back for primitive equipment, back when a 40-50 yard shot was a long shot. Simple math boys if you can shoot twice as far, kill twice the animals, they are going to start cutting half the tags! I have talked to biologists and fish and game they see this stuff too!
One of the most exciting hunts I’ve ever done was when I shot a cow at 9 yds. I had practiced to be able to draw my bow as slow as possible. I wasn’t going to shoot this lead cow that was walking towards me, only to see if I could draw without her noticing. When I was able to do that as she was right in front of me was as good as it would get in hunting for me. Let that arrow fly. For others it’s shot skill at distance. I know I’m not that guy. Nerves get in my way. I like those close shots that makes it tough to miss. One year I had practiced to be able to take a longer shot. When I saw the elk at 70 yds I said no way could I hold steady enough. I waited and got to shoot under 40.
Levi could kill the elk 100 times in a row at 100 yards. Why would anyone be anything more than impressed. I would rather shoot him at 10 but part of being a good hunter is honing your shooting skills.
Just because he can doesn't mean he should, especially when it's in film. He is giving the average shooter the permission to start launching arrows at game at ridiculous ranges which will end up wounding a lot of game. I don't doubt Levi amd Tim wells can take animals at the range, but they shouldn't do it on film. However, I know the they will continue to do it and they probably don't give a rats ass as long as their checks keep flowing. Funny, I started bowhunting because of the skill it takes to get close to the game you take, if I want to take game at hundred yards I'd use a rifle.
Just because he can doesn't mean he should, especially when it's in film. He is giving the average shooter the permission to start launching arrows at game at ridiculous ranges which will end up wounding a lot of game. I don't doubt Levi amd Tim wells can take animals at the range, but they shouldn't do it on film. However, I know the they will continue to do it and they probably don't give a rats ass as long as their checks keep flowing. Funny, I started bowhunting because of the skill it takes to get close to the game you take, if I want to take game at hundred yards I'd use a rifle.
Time to establish the Super Duper Slam....all animals must be taken at 100 yards plus....and only those bowhunters who have 100% certainty in their shot and know through a special gift of theirs that the animal will not move before the arrow gets there are allowed to participate. So far we have two potential competitors...Lee and Levi. These guys NEVER miss, they can repeat a 100 yard shot at a game animal 100 times and make a perfect hit each time! I doubt either of them would ever make this claim, but for some reason others say it and want to believe it.
Everyone has different abilities. Some have incredible accuracy a long ranges. I don't, but I can get real close to make up for it. Still, if I could shoot my longbow at even 50 yards, I would kill a pile of deer, but no way. Therefore, I have to be patient and sneaky.
So if he took that shot at 100 yards and wounded the animal do you think that would make his show or would it be chopped to the editing floor? How much kynetic energy is left at that range. Just don’t understand why a advocate for the archery industry would put this out there! Just my thoughts!
"Levi could kill the elk 100 times in a row at 100 yards" No he can't. He could hit a pie plate a thousand times in a row at 100 yards, the pie plate does not move. Why is so hard to understand that live animals can and will move? Who here is willing to bet their life Levi or Lee can make 100, 100 yard shots in a row at live game and the animal will not move and the arrow will hit it's mark? I wouldn't bet on it once, too many variables.
What Shade Mt. said. I personally don't hunt anymore so it's all irrelevant to me. My opionion is most people should not take that kind of distance shot to be ethical unless you really like tracking or something. The fact that he made a clean heart kill shot is great and he is a living legend. If Hill made a 125yrd shot on a running animal than that's incredible. A 150yrd shot by Fred is also incredible to me.
I know the owner of a bow shop who can hit a ping pong ball at 80 yards almost every time and if it's a miss, it's ALWAYS still in a 4" distance (less but saying a heart is at least 4" in diameter). Farthest I've ever shot my bow is 60 yards at targets. If I were hunting I wouldn't be comfortable past 20 yards and my 55lb LB, 40 w/ modern wheelie @ 70#'s. I've whacked birds at 172 yards w/ a .25 pre charged pneumatic because it & I could. 46.69ftlbs 880fps but I know the wind, the drop, and they were pest birds. That is where a lot of guys differ. A varmint is one thing but a Game animal is another.
LKH, agree. might as well hunt with a gun and make sure you don't wound and lose one, esp. an elk that has a LOT of non-vital area to hit. To me, 101 yd shot with a bow IS NOT HUNTING, ITS SHOOTING.
What Shade Mt. said. I personally don't hunt anymore so it's all irrelevant to me. My opionion is most people should not take that kind of distance shot to be ethical unless you really like tracking or something. The fact that he made a clean heart kill shot is great and he is a living legend. If Hill made a 125yrd shot on a running animal than that's incredible. A 150yrd shot by Fred is also incredible to me.
I know the owner of a bow shop who can hit a ping pong ball at 80 yards almost every time and if it's a miss, it's ALWAYS still in a 4" distance (less but saying a heart is at least 4" in diameter). Farthest I've ever shot my bow is 60 yards at targets. If I were hunting I wouldn't be comfortable past 20 yards and my 55lb LB, 40 w/ modern wheelie @ 70#'s. I've whacked birds at 172 yards w/ a .25 pre charged pneumatic because it & I could. 46.69ftlbs 880fps but I know the wind, the drop, and they were pest birds. That is where a lot of guys differ. A varmint is one thing but a Game animal is another.
