3Rivers Archery Supply
Interesting Spec for Cape Buff Hunt
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Contributors to this thread:
eugeneb 12-Jan-17
drycreek 12-Jan-17
eugeneb 12-Jan-17
Buffalo1 12-Jan-17
drycreek 12-Jan-17
glunker 12-Jan-17
GF 12-Jan-17
eugeneb 13-Jan-17
Brotsky 13-Jan-17
sticksender 13-Jan-17
GaryB@Home 13-Jan-17
Brotsky 13-Jan-17
Ollie 13-Jan-17
Capra 13-Jan-17
Huntcell 13-Jan-17
Pyrannah 13-Jan-17
Treeline 14-Jan-17
1Arrow 14-Jan-17
tradmt 14-Jan-17
1Arrow 14-Jan-17
tradmt 14-Jan-17
The last savage 14-Jan-17
cambow 17-Jan-17
CurveBow 18-Jan-17
Glunt@work 18-Jan-17
Glunt@work 18-Jan-17
LBshooter 18-Jan-17
1Arrow 19-Jan-17
From: eugeneb
12-Jan-17

eugeneb's embedded Photo
eugeneb's embedded Photo
Speed calculator from Back Country Bowhunting ... 350 grain arrow for Cape Buff ...

From: drycreek
12-Jan-17
The closest thing to a Cape Buffalo I've ever killed is a hog, and that ain't very close, but I think I would paraphrase Bob Ruark and " be sure and use enough arrow ".

From: eugeneb
12-Jan-17
forgot to add the sarcasm thingy ... lol

From: Buffalo1
12-Jan-17

Buffalo1's embedded Photo
Buffalo1's embedded Photo
I believe it would be safer to try to take a cape on with a .22LR bullet than a 350 gr. arrow. Just remember to save last bullet for self !

From: drycreek
12-Jan-17
He's looking at me like I owe him money..........^^^^^^^^^

From: glunker
12-Jan-17
Basically the archery calc has a glitch.

From: GF
12-Jan-17
"I believe it would be safer to try to take a cape on with a .22LR bullet than a 350 gr. arrow. Just remember to save last bullet for self !"

Either that, or pack a back-up rifle that's big enough to knock you out of the way when he decides to speak to you about this privately....

From: eugeneb
13-Jan-17
add a Rage and go for elephant

From: Brotsky
13-Jan-17

Brotsky's embedded Photo
Brotsky's embedded Photo
Here's my exact set-up (speed is pretty much spot on as well based on past chrono)....according to that calculator I'm just as well off using 350 gr arrow? Something is not right with this :)

From: sticksender
13-Jan-17
The calculator is fine....it's just math. The flaw is in the lack of sophistication in recommending game animals based only on calculated kinetic energy.

From: GaryB@Home
13-Jan-17
The only 350 grain arrow I would shoot at that guy would be a short lead one with much more speed.

From: Brotsky
13-Jan-17
Gary, I can't get the calculator to work for 2500 fps. :)

From: Ollie
13-Jan-17
I don't think I would have any confidence in a calculator that it telling you that that a 350 grain arrow weight is sufficient for Cape Buffalo. Good luck finding any outfitter that would be willing to walk behind you with that setup!

From: Capra
13-Jan-17
The calculator has failed to consider momentum. Without a big argument I think most of us know that a heavy arrow is always better for large and dangerous game.

Unfortunately with the internet people who have never hunted with a bow can quickly throw a KE calculator together. Even the largest arrow manufacturer was guilty of this.

We have such great options for arrows these days there is no excuse to be shooting a light arrow at big critters.

From: Huntcell
13-Jan-17
It's for the frontal shot, softest skin on the buff right in the oooh sweet spot! O•,•O

From: Pyrannah
13-Jan-17
momentum x 2

From: Treeline
14-Jan-17
Funny that most of the modern bow hunters put so much faith in kinetic energy. Have had quite a few guys wound elk and not recover them with light arrow, fast set ups over the years and had quite a rodeo with a bison a few years back due to light arrows & broadhead failures. Would be better off on really big critters like buffalo and bison with an 850 grain arrow and solid 2 blade leaving the bow at 170 fps.

From: 1Arrow
14-Jan-17

1Arrow's embedded Photo
1Arrow's embedded Photo

1Arrow's Link
Hope this works but tried to attach link to Dr. Ed Ashby's paper on Momentum, Kinetic Energy and Arrow Penetration to share with you all. Is very Deep but if you scroll to the bottom it gives the formula's for Momentum which is Mass (total arrow grains) X Velocity (FPS)/225218 and for Kinetic Energy which is 1/2 Mass (total arrow grains) X Velocity (FPS)/225218.

I compared my 'Whitetail' arrow of 410 grains against my Cape Buffalo or anti-tank arrow of 956. The KE was 90.9 for the Whitetail arrow vs only 88.3 for the Cape Buffalo arrow. But the Momentum was only .58 for the Whitetail arrow while it was .87 for the Cape Buffalo arrow. Thus said, you need Momentum for penetration. I would never think of using my Whitetail arrow of 410 grains (at 316 FPS) for a Cape Buffalo while my 956 grain Cape Buffalo arrow (at 204 FPS) performed flawlessly on my Cape Buffalo.

From: tradmt
14-Jan-17
I wonder if that arrow would work on whitetails?

From: 1Arrow
14-Jan-17
tradmt, yes...after I hunted Africa I came back and kept the same set up shooting 3 or 4 whitetails. Problem is they are very expensive so lost a couple to pass throughs and hitting rocks (that momentum thing). Basically there is not a bad angle on a Whitetail. A quartering towards shot is not bad as that arrow will easily drive through the front bone structure. I still try to get conventional shots but is nice to know if you think you need to try that shot. Only thing is that arrow does put the 'arch' back in Archery compared to the normal whitetail size arrows. But they are deadly quiet. All that weight takes all the sound out of your bow even if it was quiet to start with.

From: tradmt
14-Jan-17
That's pretty cool 1Arrow.

14-Jan-17
Treeline....Damn straight..As our predecessors have CLEARLY shown us...No.hoyt..No Mathews...Ummm no compound at all...Send the weight downtown,on the mark..good BH....Works great.... Not looking for a debate about Trad vs comp. Just stating what has always been a successful combo.....

From: cambow
17-Jan-17
Dr. Ashby IMO got it right. I am in the momentum camp for bigger game. Not as important with deer, but why not build an arrow for a 300 lb. deer and a 60 yard shot; my idea has always been to build a arrow for the worst case scenario.

From: CurveBow
18-Jan-17
I don't know this for fact, but being a Dangerous Game wannabe, don't African countries that have cape buffalo have minimum KE's and arrow weights that require 90 or 100# pull bows?

>>>>-------->

From: Glunt@work
18-Jan-17

Glunt@work's embedded Photo
Glunt@work's embedded Photo
I wish I would have had this calculator years ago. The minimum speed it allows is 200 so I can't calculate at the 175fps I shoot, but even at 200fps (maybe close to IBO speed?) it tells me I can't make a successful harvest...on anything.

I guess all the critters I have killed were all just flukes :^)

Looks like they got their algorithm at the dollar store.

From: Glunt@work
18-Jan-17

Glunt@work's embedded Photo
Glunt@work's embedded Photo
Adjusted the IBO speed to match and it looks better although I can't see getting any arrow to launch at 291fps from my longbow. I'm now certified for deer and small game :^)

From: LBshooter
18-Jan-17
I think a Cape buffalo shows what the true power of an arrow is. Buffs can take a lot and led in particular when full of adrenaline. I know guys who have pumped multiple rounds of 375HH, 470 nitro, and 458 wins and the buff keeps fighting. You see guys take a arrow slip it in and the buff is down, as long as the arrow is placed in the right spot.

From: 1Arrow
19-Jan-17

1Arrow's Link
Curvebow, you are right. 80 foot lbs is the minimum for South Africa for Cape Buffalo. But there isn't a draw weight requirement of 90#'s or 100#'s. Might be different in other African countries. Below is copied from a website that references the South African requirements. I included the link as it references where they got the South African regs. I know I was told 80 foot lbs was the minimum to be legal by my outfitter Chattaronga Safaris in South Africa too. My rig shot 88 ft/lbs at 70#lbs draw weight shooting 204 fps with a 956 grain arrow. Key is a heavy, front of center arrow with a 2 blade single bevel broad head on it, not speed necessarily although that doesn't hurt.

(d) Cape buffalo (Category 4)- (i) bow with a minimum draw mass of 80 pounds; (ii) bow generating a minimum kinetic energy of 80ft/lb; and (iii) minimum arrow weight of 750 grains; and

Hope this helps.

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