For the back country experts
Equipment
For those that have been there would the Mountain Smith LT shelter be a good inexpensive choice for a montana archery elk hunt? Plan to mostly stay in the vehicle but want to have a light weight option available for a night or two if I find a spot that makes more since to spike out to. While I have you experts here, will I have to worry about bugs in the mountains of western montana during the archery season? Any and all advice welcome on this idea would be appreciated greatly.
Not usually much problems with bugs. I know it may sound like a smart assed answer, but on the tent I'd say it will be fine unless it's not. For average weather you will be fine. A major storm, not so much. That said I've spiked out with much less shelter!
That shelter will be just fine in MT, IMO.
If cost budget is your main concern it should be fine. For just a few more ounces of weight you could get a full UL backpacking tent (Big Agnes & others) with a floor, screen doors, rain-fly, vestibule, and with a ridge/corner pole design making it much stronger in wind & weather.
I have this shelter. used it for a week in CO archery elk. it did fine. My issues with it were some condensation and im not a fan of the trekking pole in the middle. It seems to cut down space for me. I bought a ultra light 3 man tent last season and I seemed more confident and relaxed and no worries of above mentioned issues as well as possible rain getting in if it were really bad conditions in the shelter . I guess for the money, the Mountainsmith is a great value but overall comfort id go with a tent
What Thomas said. Shelters like that work great until the spit hits the fan. Snow is one issue. A BIG one.
If it doesn't snow you'll be fine. What cured me was a terrific rain storm where water was literally flowing across the ground in the middle of the night.
Mine is a Kifaru, and now I just carry it as an emergency shelter against hail for day scouting trips. Afternoon hail is real common in our part of N.CO in late summer and early fall. My spike camp is a UL-3 tent.
yelp. It actually snowed and iced quite a bit where we were in mid sept CO last season. I felt much better in my tent. You just don't know how quick the weather can change in the high country even early season
Rain running into from the bottom is something I was thinking about as well. Been looking at the UL tents as well. Really looking for simplicity, something you can put up after dark and take back down before daylight.
I did a solo hunt in Montana 2001. On September 3 it snowed like crazy. Just saying it can happen.
^^^^ This happens in September.
This is hail that happened on August 28 a couple years ago, afternoon before season opener
You all are getting my hopes up, I would love for it to snow and blow while I'm there.
Here it is rolled up with the Tyvek ground cloth and pole
Here it is rolled up with the Tyvek ground cloth and pole
It looks very similar to my Golite Hut 1 that I have used many times elk hunting. It works well for a lightweight shelter.
I made a lightweight pole out of sections of aluminum arrows that screws together using arrow inserts and small pieces of threaded rod
I've camped a ton in kifaru shelters! Have camped thru snow storms, heavy rains, and crazy wind!
when it rains, watch the drainage angle
when it rains, watch the drainage angle
two weeks later I also utilized my mt tent.
two weeks later I also utilized my mt tent.
Here are two light weight nylon tarps for my early spike camp
That will work. If the weather goes bad pack out. Nothing g wrong g with hiking back to the trailhead to regroup. I would take a ground cloth of some sort.
The Mountainsmith shelters were made by the same guy that makes the Kifaru shelters, so I wouldn't hesitate to use one, it'll be just fine... Hope you get an Elk!
Just to clarify Nick above, yes it was designed by Patrick. I'm sure it is not made of the same materials that Kifaru currently uses.
Having said all of that, yes it will work just fine for all but the worst weather. I would prefer it to any of the similarly weighted ultra light tents.
Just pay attention to your setup location and you should be fine. I've not found bugs to be an issue in September unless you are in the Missouri Breaks.
Thanks for the info guys. I want to keep it really simple but not be totally miserable.
Any other ideas on how to stay light and mobile I'm all ears.
coldest night under a tarp, 2008 mt zirkle.
coldest night under a tarp, 2008 mt zirkle.
if you bivy and are the move its hard to beat a tarp, but, for extended nights I prefer a tent. everything stays dry and contained. also, I have found that I get sinus issues if I have a breeze blowing on my face all night.
latest and greatest during the wetness of colorado
latest and greatest during the wetness of colorado
GDX that looks awesome. I may go ahead and get a good UL backpack tent to leave in the vehicle in case I find a really good spot holding lots of elk to play with. Then I might put up a permanent camp. Like I said this will be my first trip so definitely want to try different things.
My experience is miniscule compared to some, but I think it would be perfectly fine for what you described. You might limit your trek in a bit, so that you can return to the truck if needed. If it was your only shelter and you were packing in 12 miles, I would have a different answer.
You'll be fine for what your using it for. If it looks like it's gonna snow or forecast for it, don't spike out that night. If most of what your doing is by the truck and you just need an option for possibly spending a night out, that'll do.
get the tent. you'll be happier in the end. I think my Easton Carbon kinetic weighs 3lbs and a few ozs. The mountainsmith weighs less but u still gotta have a trekking pole or something to setup. and then you still have the same issues with condensation, water coming in under, single wall design and no floor. I love my Easton kinetic so much I quit using a larger cabelas Alaskan guide tent even when truck camping. A 2/3 man tent takes literally the same amount of time to set up as a shelter. 5 to 10 minutes tops
You'll learn a lot on your first trip. May find that a tarp works just fine for what you like to do. You may return and vow to never have only a tarp ever again. From your OP it sounds like you'll have a truck camp and be flexible, which is a very good choice.
If money isn't real right, pick up a used 2 man UL tent from classifieds on Rokslide, etc.. and then you'll have a choice if you discover tarp hunting isn't for you. But as SBH says, with a waterproof ground cloth you'll likely be good with what you have for just a night or two out.
I spent many dozens of nights under nothing but a Visqueen tarp when I was young and tougher (or dumber...) If you notice Paul's photos above, he started out with a tarp camp, then went back to the truck for his tent. We tend to get smarter as we get older. :-)
I was just over on rokslide looking for the classified section and I guess I am really technology challenged cause I couldn't find it using my phone.
I agree with most of what others have said. Years ago I would spend a couple weeks in the mountains with my Golite Hut1 or another floorless tarp (with Tyvek for a ground cloth) and it was fine for the most part. But then there are those times when you have mice running all over you and spiders are attracted to your body heat and might want to share your sleeping bag with you. I had a spider or something bite me on the neck one year and it swelled up pretty bad.
I still use a floorless shelter occasionally but if I'm going to be out for more than a couple nights I always use my Tarptent Double rainbow tent.
Is there spiders in the mountains of montana if so then I will definitely be sleeping in a tent. Running into a bear ok, but having a spider crawling on me in the night not good at all.
Like Mike, I got a spider bite once I elk camp that swelled up, caused a fever. Now I'm sort of paranoid about them and roll the top of my sleeping bag when I'm not in the tent, check under stuff in the corners at night. Those brown ones are fast and nasty-looking and love to hide in tent corners.
I used to use a 8x10 tarp. I to have had a mouse killing frenzy under a tarp at 2 AM. (NM) Got sick of them running across me so I clicked on the headlamp and started smashing away with a boot.
Same trip (On the hike in). I came up short of my intended camp location so I decided to find a flat spot off the trail. Sky was clear so I didn't even pitch tarp. Slept under the stars,,,,,,,, until something crawled on me. Way bigger than a mouse, (I am thinking rabbit) Didn't matter, I freaked and kicked my bag. Whatever it was went flying through the air, hit the bushes and ran off. Try falling back to sleep after that one!
Too old for that cr@p now. For an extra lb, I have a BA Fly Creek tent. Still not the lap of luxury, but definitely warmer than under a tarp. (Although the mice chewed the bottom of my tent last year.)
Several years ago me and a buddy camped in a mouse filled meadow. I should have realized the fun night I was in for when we were sitting on a log after dark boiling water for our Mountain House and the mice lined up next to us on the log waiting for their turn at the scraps.
Anyway, my buddy crawled into his enclosed tent and I crawled into my sleeping bag on top of the piece of Tyvek under my tarp. I don't think I even got my sleeping bag zipped up before they started noisily scampering across the Tyvek! I would lay there listening to them scampering around and each time one jumped onto my sleeping bag I would swear and punch or kick at it through my sleeping bag. My buddy was laughing his ass off! I finally fell asleep and awoke to a mouse brushing against my chin. I almost lost it! If you ever saw the movie "Never Cry Wolf" I could certainly relate to the scene when Tyler kind of flipped out and started eating the mice!
The next morning I woke up and a pair of smart wool socks I had hanging in a tree were chewed full of holes.
I put the tarp into semi-retirement after that hunt...
Mike I think you need to start filming your adventures for our entertainment.
I always carry an 8'X10' Siltarp and a Silponcho when hunting from a backpack, even if I have a tent. That set up stays with me for unintentional overnight opportunities.
But for camp, I use a lightweight tent. The only time, here, the bugs aren't enough to eat you alive, is when the wind and rain are cold enough to kill you.
If you hunt someplace with reliably predictable weather. then the lighter the better. I think a person really has to tailor their outfit to the conditions they will encounter. And that will come from experience; either your own or those that have gone before you.
Unfortunately for me, even in August I have to be ready for a few days of cold and snow. Can't count on it being a drying, blue blazer after a short burst of ugliness. So a tent is worth the weight. I can pitch the 8'X10' into a pretty weatherproof structure for two in about five minutes. But I'm sure my current tent goes up in about ten.
Shelters are like the rest of your gear, which is a series of educated guesses and some compromise.
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I got bit by a spider (I'd assume) on Kodiak about a month ago and the infection in my finger is just now clearing up.
A small tent is easier to setup than a tarp imo. They're brainless and quick. You're not really saving any measurable time/effort by not going with a tent.
Here is one place a tarp worked and not a tent. The only flat spot on this mountain side was in an mule deer bed. I did enclose my sleeping bag in a bivy sack. I do agree, a light weight tent with decent head room, is the best option in most cases.
Keven,, I PM you about some ideas about your current shelter. But I thought I would bring them up here also.
1. If you have adjustable trekking poles I would lower them so that that the sides would touch the ground not allowing wind to blow under. You can also position a few long logs around the tent to help keep out the wind. Pine boughs will work also.
2. Pine boughs on the floor will provide a softer sleeping area and help provide some insulation form the colder ground. Also if it rains and some moisture does come in, you will be elevated off the ground some keeping your air mat and bag dryer. Add a very light weight painter plastic tarp as a ground cloth will also work and not add any weight. A painter ground cloth can also be used to store you equipment under if left outside.
Great info guys, I'm definitely going to have a tent in the vehicle as well and let each situation decide on which to throw in the pack.
My research so far has lead me to be looking for a 2 man tent with a vestibule so any and all recommendations would be appreciated.
Whatever you choose to go with, try it out at home. go to a state park or somewhere for an overnighter to help work out the kinks.
I have a Kelty Grand Mesa 2 that has a vestibule. Label says It weighs in at around 4lb 10oz and costs a fraction of the price as some of those "super light " tents. I purchased some aluminum stakes to replace the steel ones that came with it. Not sure how much weight that cut but I imagine at least 6 or 7oz. In total it cost me around $130.00. Lots of options out there.
Lungshot that Kelty was on my list until I found this Sierra design summer moon 2. Still looking but this one seems the best value I have found so far.
Scrappy, I noticed that the rain fly does not extend to the ground all around the tent especially on the ends and back side. Can be an issue with wind driven rain and rain just flowing off the top to the unprotected sides. Not bad for $180 and lite weight but that rain fly drew a red flag for me. Paul
Bag vs shelter-Timely post, I am also looking at spike options and those are some good opinions. I also set up a truck camp and spike out as necessary. I have a very well used and beloved clip flashlight 1 but I need more space. I'm not very inclined to do stuff outside the tent in the a.m. Its cold and I occasionally suffer from the heebie jeebies when solo so I like to emerge and take off. I have been looking at some 2 or 3 men set ups with vestibule and etc but now after seeing some options Im thinking setting up a tarp in tandem with the trusty clip flashlight and investing in a lighter bag.
Good point Paul, I was looking at it as a good thing for ventilation. Which the only tent camping I have done is in east Texas. For those that know in humid places if you don't have good ventilation you know you will be soaked before morning. Will excess condensation be a big issue in the mountains.
"Mike I think you need to start filming your adventures for our entertainment."
Why, there are NO shennanigans on our hunts! Ask him about the flashlight in the butt trick :)
