Contributors to this thread:
How many out there stake out and hunt wallows? Does the relative time of the season (I.e. Early, middle, or late) influence your decision? How do you like to hunt a wallow, for those that do?
Late Aug to first 10 days of Sept have been best, after that use dwindles as cows come into estrus & bulls become preoccupied with the ladies! That wallow there is on pretty flat ground, wind could be an issue there! It may be best to locate trail coming into it & back down it a ways where wind direction is more predictable for an ambush on the ground or a treestand! Other than that great looking wallow for sure!
ElkNut1
What little bit of elk hunting I've done from the start of CO elk season to the last day of the season, depending on the year, is about the first week or two they are a great place to set. After the Bulls get to breeding, I'm not sure if they loose their luster due to elk not using them as much or, the elk are vocal enough for the hunter to not need them.
Personally, they probably use them just as much but, when you find the concentrated elk, there are usually more fun ways to kill them. In other words, I'm guessing that where the elk are hanging out, there will be heavily used wallows. And, many not so fresh ones that the elk were using when they were more scattered early in the season. II'm sure it is weather related as well. God Bless men
I have yet to find any pattern or timing associated with the use of wallows. seen them used early during hot temps, and later in the month when cooler and raining.
Had a friend hunting Idaho several years ago in hot dry weather. He called and said he could not find the elk. I told him to find water and hopefully wallows. He found both and missed a really good 6x6 a few days later. My suggestion was not based on experience but on the conditions? and the thought that a revved up would need to cool down.
Most of the places I hunt are right at treeline. Usually lots of seeps and wallows. Have seen elk using wallows through summer and even see bulls covered in mud in late October when there is snow on the ground. Hard to figure out a good wallow that is getting hit regularly by a bull, but I have only tried hunting them a few times and never killed a bull sitting a wallow. I have snuck in on a bull rolling in a wallow, just was taking it too slow and didn't get a shot. Should have been more aggressive and moved faster! Might work better setting up on a wallow in drier country.
Last year my brother and I hung stands over two different wallows in the same area. I killed my 4x5 bull on the evening of the Utah archery opener (August 20th), and my brother killed his 5x6 bull on his wallow a week later on August 27th. My trail camera showed my wallow getting absolutely hammered with elk from September 5th through September 8th. Oh, and I shot my elk with a light arrow tipped with a mechanical. Clean pass through. :)
Wallows are like country bars. You never know when or where the next party will be at.
But its always good to know where they are at, in case you're in the vicinity :)
When hunting & asking about wallows hunters are generally interested in prime time. That's last of Aug & first 10 days of Sept. Yes elk can & do hit wallows after but not nearly with the same regularity & enthusiasm, it's a crap shoot once the rut picks up! We too have taken bulls that hit wallows in mid to late Oct but it's more luck at that time! Hot temps are best but not an end all. We killed a nice 6 point hitting a wallow in mid Oct when there was 10" of snow on the ground, that's lucky!
ElkNut1
ElkNut1
PC, you and I hunt the same general area, and of the 30 or so wallows I know (and cam...) I've yet to find one that bulls use regularly enough to make it worthwhile. As you know, they move a LOT in that country. One will get bombed for two days, then nothing for a week.
The other thing is that they tend to be below bedding patches, and those rising swirling thermals in mid-afternoon gets them when they're dropping down, even when in a treestand. We've watched this happen numerous times when one is hunting/glassing another ridge and can see elk bolt or get nervous and leave above the guy in the treestand, when the guy in the treestand had no idea the elk were coming in.
In country that has water everywhere I've found them to be unreliable. The only time I'll sit one is when I have no idea where the elk are and am ready for a mid-afternoon nap. Sitting a wallow in the dark timber gives me marginally more hope than just sitting in the dark timber.
I watched this little bull wallow for several minutes before I decided to shoot him. At time he was almost completely submerged in the mud. All I have to say is that I'll think twice before I shoot a bull fresh out of a wallow again. What a mess!
Ye sir, Dave has some great footage, I don't think he has any boring ones! (grin) Great job Dave!
Too, on Wallows, if hunting them & you are winded you now have possibly blown them out of the area for good during your elk hunt. They rarely return within a week or so. Anything is possible though. Do everything you can to avoid that! Only setup where & WHEN, you know the wind is in your favor! Be prepared to patiently sit it if you're a die hard & do so for at least 7 straight days & hope they show on the 1st day! (grin) I'd have trail cams out if possible to help me out on the best times & what type of elk are using them.
Do not waste your time on dead beat wallows that may look OK, if they do not wreak of a barnyard & there are no fresh tracks on trails leading to them you are most likely spinning your wheels there! Active wallows are a must!
Some guys are taboo on calling or making any noise at wallows, I do not subscribe to that line of thought, I believe most those are the same guys that rarely bugle period. When able to locate wallows within ear shot of a bedding area I will get there a couple hours before dark. Once there before I'm setup I will splash the crap out of the wallow with a good sized branch off & on for a couple minutes along with some voice groans & growls. I will stop after 30 seconds or so & toss out a bugle advertising myself & continue splashing. When I'm done I will walk away from the wallow 40 yards or so & give one more bugle as if I were leaving. I then get back to my stand area & stay quiet. -- I've had bulls come storming in on just the splashing & others bugle back once I've bugled & other times they say & do nothing! But what is cool is I've left my calling card there & on many occasions a nearby bull comes slipping in just before dark. I've not noticed that splashing & calling from the wallow has run anything off, quite the opposite!
It's very common that bulls will rake & thrash branches/brush & leave their scent from the scent glands on their foreheads as well as urinate in or around the wallow, this in itself can have bulls come over your way to smell all around to see who you were! All these are pluses at times! If a bull bugles while I'm splashing or bugling I'll bugle back coarsely to him & rake/thrash whatever is around. Moving up from the wallow towards the bull 30-40 yards where you expect him to come from & do not call can produce a shot opportunity as he slips your way to size you up.
If sitting the wallow after my sequence is done & a bull bugles I do not answer him, He's most likely wanting to know if that bull is still around, I stay quiet & get ready!
ElkNut1
I once sat a waterhole/wallow in NM and it was being hit regularly. The tracks were big so I had high hopes of a big bull coming in. As I sat quietly at about 10 in the morning I heard crunching sounds some distance away. So I cow called. He came in on a string. He was HUGE and he was looking for the cow at the waterhole. When he didn't see the cow that called him he got nervous. Then he circled and got even more nervous before blowing out of there. Moral of the story: never call from a waterhole or wallow. If they're already coming to a waterhole/wallow then let them come in naturally. This way they'll be more relaxed and will give you a good shot if you've positioned yourself right.
With all due respect, that bull most likely fled as he circled & he got your wind or saw you, that's why he would bolt. It's happened to many of us! I've called in way to many elk to a variety of destination spots over the years with success, the main reason they bolt is because I was seen or winded. Hunter error! (grin) I've had bulls bust me from both bugling or cow calling, I don't stop using either one because of it, I make needed adjustments in my mistakes & move forward!
ElkNut1
I'm curious where you guys would position yourself on a wallow on a steep slope. I am thinking of one in particular where the elk always bed above it, and come down to approach it in the afternoon when the thermals are going consistently uphill. No matter which side of the wallow I sit, the thermals are still going to take my scent right uphill to the elk. Maybe a treestand would help, but on a steep slope it's hard to see the point of climbing 20 yards up, only to be eye level with the ground that's 30 yards away.
Ridge Ghost, that's exactly what I'm referring to in my earlier post. We've tried high treestands but the scent cone still gets them if they are coming in from above on a steep slope. Seen it too many times, not worth blowing them out.
Cnelk hit the nail on the head from my experience. Good to know where they are but in my neck of the woods there are just to many little wallows for me to convince myself to sit one. I am sure in some areas they are a much better option than where I hunt. Now if I come across one with sign that looks 15 minutes old I am gonna do something in that area to draw interest based on wind and conditions.
I'll add that what may or may not work in one place may or may not work elsewhere. There are lots of variables- Jet Stream effect, temperature changes with elevation, air density, humidity, terrain effect on wind direction. There is no universal answer. You might try the smoke bomb trick in summer to see where the thermals take your scent cone, but variables change in fall too, especially with thermal shifts due to the temperature changes.
I agree with all the above! This is why I love running & gunning so much! (grin) I'm only in a setup just long enough to get it done! Wind can be an issue but when done in the first few hours of daylight it's much more predictable. Like Lou points out there's no universal answer especially when guys sit one spot for hours, it's a gamble, sometimes it pays off & sometimes not! (grin)
ElkNut1
Elknut1 with all due respect I don't think the bull winded me. He was coming in and taking his time. He hurried up when I cow called. But the problem was that the waterhole/wallow was fairly open and it only had enough cover to hide me. There wasn't enough cover nearby to hide an elk. So when he came straight to me he stopped at 20 yards (Oh, how I wish I knew about the frontal shot back then) and got nervous. He came in and didn't see what he expected to see. Sure, it's possible that the wind swirled also but I don't think so. Bottom line: he was coming in to the water so calling to him was an unnecessary chance that I took. I wouldn't do it again. There is no benefit to calling an elk that is already coming in to the ambush.
Thanks Jaquomo. I just read your post again and that makes senses.
Elkstabber, no problem bud, thanks for the further explanation but I am a bit confused?
In your original post I was under the impression that you had cow called from your stand & some time passed by before the bull came in towards the wallow. But in your 2nd post I'm under the impression you cow called after you heard or saw the bull coming your way? If it's the 2nd one then yes that's a mistake to call then as the bull would indeed expect to see this cow there he had just heard.
Whatever the case do not let that keep you from calling from destination spots as wallows, waterholes, mineral licks, bedding areas, etc. Now if you've had a trail cam on these spots & knew elk were coming in like clock work during a specific time frame then yes I'd most likely stay silent too. But if I didn't know what was out there & just hoping for the best I'd incorporate calling to up my odds!
The reason being is elk could be within earshot, these elk know one another by sound, so when you call, elk that may be around (hopefully a bull-grin) will not know who you are! This can plant the seed of curiosity, if a bull is around he could now consider coming your way to check the area out for her scent. He would like to know if she's in or nearing estrus. No guarantees but it can certainly up our odds of a physical appearance!
Here's an example from last year. I had a trail cam on a wallow/waterhole (used for both) I had one small 6 point on it & a doz different cows showing up there in the mornings. My son & I decided to hunt it early Sept in hopes of locating a bull & checking the camera. When we got there just after daylight two bulls bugled a 1/4 mile away or so in the dark timber, we couldn't see anything we could just hear them vocally. After hearing a couple bugles we could tell it was a satellite harassing a herd bull with cows & no doubt one cow was in or nearing estrus. I decided to cow call excitedly 3 times or so from the wallow, after two series in 30 seconds or so we did not hear the satellite bugle anymore. We setup there & cow called every couple minutes letting the bull know we were there hanging out. He eventually showed up, he never bugled again we could just hear him walking. My son took the bull at aprox 20 yards as he slipped in looking for this new cow! -- We've had similar experiences as this in the past, it can work!
Here's the bull!
ElkNut1
Elknut1 I probably should have explained the entire situation better. I'm an experienced tracker (don't use trail cams) and it was obvious that one or more elk with really big feet were coming to the waterhole/wallow. The age on the tracks told me that the big-footed elk was visiting the waterhole daily or maybe even more than once per day. There also weren't any other water sources within a mile that I knew of so it was a great find. It was September 3rd or 4th I think and they weren't talking. The tracks showed that the elk was approaching mostly from below so I set up for rising thermals. It was a perfect set up except that I didn't have a lot of cover to work with. I was in wilderness so I didn't have any kind of treestand or blind with me. I just got comfortable on some logs with a small spruce as background cover. Shortly after the morning thermals were rising a cow and spike came in and spent 20 minutes at 20 yards or so. The big bull came in about an hour later.
It was the best waterhole or wallow (it was both) that I've ever seen. It was an ideal set up and I screwed it up by cow calling. If I hadn't cow called he would have gone to the water and turned broadside just like the cow and spike had at 20 yards. I still think about that bull all the time and wonder just exactly how big he was. That was in my 3rd or 4th season of elk hunting and I've seen a lot of bulls since. He still haunts me. He was the bull of a lifetime.
All I know is that there are a lot more elk killed by not hunting wallows than hunting them.
To me they are just a piece of the puzzle.
Here's my hunting wallow perspective. I've marked many wallows and game trails on my GPS. So, after a morning of chasing bugles I'll go to the nearest wallow and hang out. You have to hang out somewhere and if you've been chasing elk all morning you should be close and they may go to the wallow at some point. Once at the wallow I will hang out a few hrs during the afternoon when the elk are bedded. I stay quiet and let things happen naturally. I rarely bugle as I prefer to hunt in stealth mode (plus, I agree the elk know each others sounds/calls). Occasionally a bull will get out of bed and go to the wallow. Sometimes they'll bugle as they come. Either way I'll be ready. Frequently I'll be sitting a wallow and a bull will bugle a few times during the afternoon while they're bedded. If this happens I don't sit at the wallow and listen to him bugle. I will close the distance without making a sound and if conditions are right and he 's throwing out intermittent bugles, I will hunt him in his bed. The closer I get the slower I go. The wind has to be right and I have to see him first. Fun Stuff!!!
Here is another perspective. I do not hunt wallows. I hunt elk. If elk are frequenting a wallow, then it may be a great place to ambush one. A tree stand is likely the perfect way to set up. Just don't get too enthused when you see where a bull wallowed once. He may have thrashed the place and it may be very fresh, but remember it was a one time event. Check trails coming to the wallow/water hole for tracks and rubs. If the wallow is getting frequent use, the sign will be there. Bulls often call before they come into a wallow or water hole. Never answer them. Just wait. If you call back, they will go somewhere else. Stay quiet. It may take over an hour for them to show up, but they usually will.
I think it also depends on how available water is. If its the only puddle for 5mi you're onto something. If there's a wallow every 100yds then you could be spinning your wheels.
My first bull over water did exactly what swede said.
Good advice swede!
Since I just found out that I drew a NM tag I'll be back hunting in the area of this wallow.
I found this wallow very late in the morning while I was dogging a heard with multiple bugling bulls. I had to move slowly because there were some straggler cows bringing up the rear and I was close behind them. I kept catching glimpses of the bulls up ahead in the thick timber and I was able to call one of the bulls back to me and I had a head-on standoff at less than 10 yards but no shot. Right about the time of the standoff, I heard very loud splashing up ahead in the timber. When I moved ahead I got pinned down by some cows and I actually laid down in some of the taller grass close to the wallow. Minutes later I had a close call with a 330" class bull and a few days later I ended up killing a decent 5x5 that came almost on a dead run to my calls when I was standing almost exactly where I took this picture. Both of those days were instances where calling near a wallow worked for me...
I don't sit wallows but good places to let you know what's in the area for sure.
I used a tree stand set a good 20' up in a small drainage over a series of pools and wallows one year. Tons of fresh sign. I was in the stand for an evening hunt, had a herd of elk coming up from below. Wind felt in my face and I was even with the sides of the drainage so I did not expect my scent to be drawn down with the cooling thermals.
Elk got within 100-150 yards from the sound of it, just to where the steep ascent from below leveled off and the timber opened up into the drainage. I could hear them. I could not see them. They mewed and cracked branches for 30 minutes below me then went silent. I can only assume they caught my scent and moved out.
Exciting and disappointing.
Thermals are funny things. Like you experienced the "wind" can be in your face but cooling from above as the sun drops can push currents back down not far from where you're sitting.
I was on the ridge of a near-vertical hillside early one morning, watching elk 150 yards straight below me. The wind was blowing at me and away from the elk and I figured it would overpower the hard descending thermal. It didn't.
I too like to initiate a call when I arrive near my stand. Occasionally, when things have been quiet for too long, I will even give out a short two note bugle from my stand. It can and does work rarely. Usually I just stay quiet. I just don't answer a bugle. The temptation is to engage the critter that bugled. Resist. He is likely checking to see if anything is at the wallow. If it is occupied, he goes somewhere else.
"Both of those days were instances where calling near a wallow worked for me..."
What Cheesehead Mike said ^^^^
That's what works for me too
