3Rivers Archery Supply
low tear
Equipment
Contributors to this thread:
nockup 07-Sep-17
JTV 08-Sep-17
Franklin 08-Sep-17
dmann 08-Sep-17
Ironbow 08-Sep-17
x-man 08-Sep-17
Hawkeye 08-Sep-17
Russ Koon 08-Sep-17
Bullhound 08-Sep-17
Hawkeye 08-Sep-17
Hawkeye 08-Sep-17
Bullhound 08-Sep-17
CCOVEY 08-Sep-17
TD 08-Sep-17
From: nockup
07-Sep-17
I can't tune out a straight low tear on my bowtech experience,ripcord combo. With the rest in upright position and arrow level, I get a 2 inch low tear. I lowered the rest as far as it will go. The nock end of the arrow sits half a bubble ( bubble level on arrow) high. I now have a 1/4" straight low tear. I need bullet hole tears for my fixed blades. What's going on?

From: JTV
08-Sep-17
An arrow isnt always going to be level after/during tuning ... you dont "need bullet holes", try shooting BH's and fps see where they impact in relation to one another...it sounds like a cam timing issue ...I stay away from paper, I hate it... I do an indoor french tune, then on a calm day do a walk back tune and then BH if needed... my fp's and Slicks and even Exodus Fulls have same poi at 50 yds.... paper will give you headaches at times... but, as I said it sounds like a timing issue, IF you have the right spine ..

From: Franklin
08-Sep-17
A 1/4" tear is tolerable....are you seeing any of this in the flight of the arrow....inconsistent grouping or arrows in the target at strange angles or this only shows up on the paper?

From: dmann
08-Sep-17
Have you tried yoke tuning yet? Or checked cam timing? I do agree with the others, paper tuning has never gotten me anywhere, i always bareshaft tune, i get better arrow flight that way.

From: Ironbow
08-Sep-17
Check cam timing. I recently had the same issue. Up and down, cam timing. Right and left, yoke tune if your center shot is good.

From: x-man
08-Sep-17
If you don't have a press...

Take a half turn out of your lower limb bolt and see if it changes. Report back what changed.

From: Hawkeye
08-Sep-17
I bet your bottom cam is hitting a bit before the top. Put a twist in the bottom cable to slow it down and see if that helps.

From: Russ Koon
08-Sep-17
What JTV said.

I used to use bareshaft tuning as my sure-fire absolute final word on tuning, going all the way back to my recurve days in the '70's, but went to tuning for BH and FP groups being same POI, after having persistent difficulties in getting reliable results from bare-shafting with my full capture rests more than a decade ago.

IMO, all else is unneeded. Just make initial settings per manufacturer recommendations. Check brace height, axle-to-axle distance and any timing marks, set center shot and rest height as a starting place, adjust as needed in small increments to bring POI's together at forty yards, check at twenty to be sure adjustments still result in POI agreement, and you're good to go.

Arrow spine is only a factor (with modern compounds and past-centershot risers) if it's insufficient, and that will also be reflected in inconsistent POI.

Yoke tuning is something that needs to be considered only if you can't get the BH and FP POI's to the same spot. Same with fletch interference. Other steps in seeking perfect arrow flight are pretty much like waxing your truck before your western trip to get better mileage....might make you feel better, but there won't be any measurable difference. 8^)

From: Bullhound
08-Sep-17
with respect Russ, yoke tuning on these bows IS the recommended way to achieve perfect arrow flight. And the fact of the matter is that if you get straight bareshafts to have same POI as your straight fletched arrows, your straight broadheads will have same POI. I start with paper before going outside. I decided I didn't want to tear up targets any more than I need to so I normally will tune with bareshafts as they require things to be right and don't tear up targets.

nockup, Bowtechs will shoot excellent but set up nock level. It is ok to be a little higher through the berger holes if need be for rest clearance, but get it level. If you don't have a press, you have to try to address your issue with rest and loop. If bows cams are not in correct position to start, you likely will not be able to get the best flight, be it fletched, bareshafts, or broadheads.

If you have a press and draw board you need to check cam timing and cam starting position. There are reference marks on your cams, and the cables should be going thru those timing marks at brace. If the cables are not going through those marks as bow sits at brace, your cam starting position is off. Need to twist, or untwist each cable to get cam starting position inside those timing marks. Bowtechs are the easiest tuning bows but you will have the best results with a drawboard. After setting cam starting position you can now synch up the draw cycle of them. If you don't have draw board, have someone watch your cable stops very closely as you come to full draw. They should hit the same time. If one hits earlier put one (or one half) twist in that cable which will slow it down. this will allow you to have them synched up together. Continue until draw stops hit at same time.

From: Hawkeye
08-Sep-17
"They should hit the same time. If one hits earlier put one (or one half) twist in that cable which will slow it down. this will allow you to have them synched up together. Continue until draw stops hit at same time."

This is true and I start as such in my drawboard. But....then I shoot a bareshaft. I do think that the board often hits a "little" different than the hand and can fool you...making you move the rest etc. In saying that-dont be afraid to twist the top or bottom cam to get rid of high/low tears or FBBH that are high or low etc. if all else fails. You think its synched but in your hand-as an example-the top might be just a bit off and thus cause low or high flight.

You can be off by 1/8 on cam synch and still feel like you have a good wall. Past that and you will "feel" it. However, it can affect arrow flight, at least to the degree of bareshafts an FBBH.

From: Hawkeye
08-Sep-17
Example:

Cams are Synched in draw board. Rest right down the center and arrow level. Looks great...feels great...fieldpoints shoot laser .

However.....Bareshafts hit low with nock up (ie high tear). I dont want to move the rest UP because then I start with a nock HIGH position-not good :(

So I simply add one twist to the top cam (to slow it down ie make it hit AFTER the bottom by just a smidge). In board it looks like the top now is JUST a bit behind or hits after the bottom. But wall still feels good when I draw it and NOW.... the bareshafts hit level with the fletched arrows. If that happens-almost always the FBBH hit the same. as FP.

From: Bullhound
08-Sep-17
Hawkeye, Totally agree. I have two draw boards that I go back and forth between at times. Some bows show spot on with draw board while others "need" to show off by a little bit to have perfect arrow flight. I've found hybrids are more finicky regarding difference between "shooter" and "drawboard" drawn, if that makes any sense. That is just my experience anyway.

nockup, stick with it but keep that arrow level on that Bowtech and you'll get great results.

From: CCOVEY
08-Sep-17
i agree with Hawkeye. Ive shot Bowtechs for 7 or 8 years and his logic is correct. I also agree (and its something the "pros" dont talk about enough) that draw boards and hand grip are always a little different. You can be perfectly timed on a board and then shoot a shitty hole through paper due to too much palm in your grip, etc. Draw boards are good for getting you close, not exact.

From: TD
08-Sep-17
In this particular case.... I'd look to cam timing. Not so much the marks, which can be off a bit even it properly timed, but to get the stops to hit at the same time. Have yet to have vertical issues I couldn't adjust out with the rest (if I had to move it at all) when the stops are synced. Gives you the same reference to go to if you work on multiple bows for multiple shooters as well. Personally I wouldn't mess with cam timing after stops synced. If something is going on its either limbs not the same in some way (unmatched, damaged, adjusted unequally, etc) or form of the shooter. Vertical is the easiest plane to deal with in my experience, once timed it's pretty rare to have many issues with it. As stated above, with these bows horizontal plane is best dealt with using the yokes.

For me, while it's a good tuning method, I don't mess with bare shaft. I'll check things with paper and go right to broadhead tuning..... which is what I'm going to do as my final tuning anyway even if i bare shafted...... and personally I need every shaft I can scrape up to shoot stuff ... =D

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