The NFL has become practically unwatchable anyway...and now this.
social injustice? racial inequality? what, are they pissed that the drug dealer with 15 babies fathered, but cared for by the rest of us taxpayers, gets arrested while selling crack?? Or maybe they are protesting the cops arresting one gang member for shooting some other "unfortunate homie" from the other neighborhood gang ??????????????
Maybe some of these clowns taking a knee should donate their time and money and go into "their neighborhoods" and talk to "their people" about getting a damn job, and taking care of the children they father. You know, like being a productive member of society instead of a drain on it.
And yes, I find the disrespect of our anthem and flag to be unforgivable.
NOT problematic for them to stand for God Save the Queen, because their beef is with the US Govt and our society - not that of GB.
So lemme just ask you this....
These guys are trying to call attention to a perceived injustice (and I'm using "perceived" simply to denote that that is their opinion, rather than to suggest that they're making this stuff up). Their position is simply that all is not Right in the Land o' the Free; yeah they're "millionaires" (though not too damn many of them are hauling in the contracts that make the headlines), but we also ask them to serve as role models -comes with the territory as a celebrity-type.
So my question is this: How would you prefer for them to voice their concerns AND in such a way that they can use their positions as public figures to generate an equal amount of notice?
JMO, when Athletes "take a knee", they're demonstrating that they're there for The Team; they're there to Listen. And what greater expression of Humility is there than to be "on bended knee"?.
I'm not entirely OK with the kneeling thing, but they're publicly expressing a concern with the way things are going in this country... and they ARE guaranteed the right to do so. Beats the hell out of rioting in the streets.
Personally, standing with arms linked to signify their common commitment to advancing their concern is a better approach, because it takes the focus off of whether or not they're "disrespecting" the flag, and that would allow the attention to go to what their concern really is, rather than just the way that they're expressing it.
And the player who resonated with me the most was the guy who knelt - yes - but with his hand over his heart and his eyes on the flag as he sang the anthem.
If that doesn't say "I love my country and (in my humble opinion) we have a serious problem here that needs to be addressed", then how the hell do you guys want him to do it?
Just askin'....
That said, whatever happened to, "We don't air team laundry in public" attitude of sports? This doesn't belong where they are doing it -like screaming fire in a theater.
BTW I guess this means athletes and owners can bring prayers or whatever back, you know, because it's their "constitutional" rights.
Just my take on the whole thing.
There's no doubt, this whole kneeling thing bothers me. That said, it has certainly elevated their concerns to Front Page News. As I said, it bothers me, but unless I can think of any other platform that brings this sort of attention to their concerns, although I don't agree with the method, I understand it.
What they are doing is perfectly legal in our country...peaceful protest. As far as them being "fired"? For what? By who? The only people that can fire them are their employers, i.e. owners, and the league has made it abundantly clear they fully support the players right to do as they choose on this matter.
Give me a break. Their only 'concern' is to stick it to Trump.
Bunch of overpaid retards pretending to be social justice warriors.
The media loves this "free speech" - what if a bunch of players chose to take a knee during the last administration because of his vow to "fundamentally change America"? If they are really open minded, that would've been ok, right? The media would've fawned over them for their courage, etc... I may have fundamentally disagreed with our last president, but the thought never crossed my mind to "kneel" during the anthem to stage a protest. United we stand, divided we fall. These players need to build a bridge and get over themselves.
Time to realize this - sports are really not that important in life - let the athletes, owners, etc ruin it for themselves. I'll spend more time with my family doing things that really matter. Nuff said.
If they want people to be on-board with their cause, my suggestion is to not start the conversation with a giant insult and also have a clear message of what you are trying to change and what you would like people to do. Joe football fan isn't oppressing anyone and you just ruined his day at the game that he could barely afford. So now he is angry and still has no idea what exactly you want from him or what you want people to do.
As for me, i just dont know. Im not a veteran nor have i ever seen /experienced this "oppression" or inequality that they are fighting for. I know there are crappy people, there are in every type of people. And no race is exempt from that fact. I try to fight for what i believe but understanding that i only know what i have experienced in my life, i try to stay open minded because i havent walked in the shoes of others. I dont know whats right or wrong, i just know how i feel inside about certain things knowing that ive never been in the shoes of the strongest proponents for either side.
Thank you to all the veterans that have fought for all the freedoms we have in America
As far as a not starting the conversation with a giant insult, I think that was pretty much taken care of by our Twitter president. A couple months or so ago,there were black people killed by a white supremacist. Instead of coming out and condemning such violence, Trump stated that there was blame on both sides, and that there was good people marching with the supremacist's. Where was the outrage then? People were killed for no reason other than the color of their skin for crying out loud. He couldn't condemn that insanity, but he sure had no problem condemning a peaceful, legal protest. Hell, I'd be pissed too, which is why this whole thing escalated to the point it did this past weekend.
"Why?"
"Well, all day when you rang customers up, you told them that hunting should be outlawed and people who hunt are murderers."
"But thats what I think?"
"Thats fine, but we are a sporting goods store and most of our customers are hunters. Most of the stuff you rang up was gear for hunting or fishing."
"So?"
"So, you don't see how expressing your political beliefs is detrimental to our business?"
"I have fee speech rights!"
"Yes, you won't get a ticket for what you said. I am just exercising my freedom to fire you for insulting customers."
I still have yet to watch one NFL game this year.
I am not a Vet, but most of the Vets that I know are fully supportive of the players' right to protest during the anthem - EVEN THE ONES WHO THINK IT IS INAPPROPRIATE TO DO SO IN THAT CONTEXT.
For the record - Kapernick knelt, paying no particular attention to the proceedings - just looking like a pouty little kid being forced to eat his vegetables - THAT is (IMO) behavior that deserves criticism. The guys who kneel, but are paying just as much attention as Villanueva did? They're VASTLY more respectable.
But... Seriously? This big flare-up got started with a tweet when "somebody" needed a distraction. And from a Commander in Chief whose wife had to elbow him in the ribs to remind him to place HIS hand on HIS heart? Rings hollow.
I'm still trying to figure out why they're protesting - it's never been clearly articulated. Whatever the reason, there are a billion ways to peacefully protest without disrespecting our flag, anthem, service members and our country.
Maybe they should be protesting the murder rate in Chicago, or St. Louis, or New Orleans, or......
That is my point.
""Maybe they should be protesting the murder rate in Chicago, or St. Louis, or New Orleans, or......""
The NFL can go on its blind, merry way. I'll be in my treestand.
I have yet to see a valid reasoning for what they are doing. Maybe those who say it is obvious can help with some hard evidence.
To me their actions do not align with the supposed injustices that they are "fighting" against. How does disrespecting American freedom help their cause, other than to elicit a reaction? I admit they are getting quite the reaction, but unfortunately the reaction is one of division. So shouldn't they stop with their BS because they are dividing, not uniting?
They have every right to act as they are as long as their employer allows them to do so. So far, their employer has been supportive. However, they have the right to any repercussions that come about due to their actions. Unfortunately, that is the part that the supporters generally forget.
The NFL isn't doing anything right now because they are prone to bending over backwards and capitulating for a bunch of egotistical arrogant self centered prima donnas. 90% who really don't know exactly what they are protesting or exactly what they want done.
This (among other things) is hurting their "brand" and the NFL knows it. I'm going to guess it will be addressed this off season if not sooner. They won't let you wear what you like or write messages on your shoes even, they have very strict rules and fines or worse for not following them. I'll bet they will come up with some more.
WRT free speech...... If you're on your own dime, douse yourself with gasoline and set yourself on fire for all I care. It's not right to do so when you are supposed to be doing the job people are paying you for. That includes your behavior at the game.
You mean the draft-dodging President who got off on a medical waiver so that he could stay home and play on the varsity tennis team?
"What if a bunch of guys did this to protest the poor treatment of veterans coming back from wars? Would you still think it was bad?"
Exactly the point. Trump refused to denounce those who were willing to stand AND SALUTE the NAZI flag (and who paraded around carrying torches in a part of the country that remembers KKK members doing exactly that on their way to lynch somebody)... but he's coming down on those who kneel quietly before the stars & stripes?
That really goes both ways.
If you are out there protesting for BLM, I sure as heck hope you can step outside yourself and look at why folks may be perceived as being on the other side of many issues. Similarly, if you think BLM is bogus BS, step outside yourself and honestly, humbly consider it.
There is WAY the heck to much "MY SIDE" or "YOUR SIDE" in our dialogue as a nation today. It's as if we are playing sport or becoming increasingly tribal at the request of a million social media sound bites a day. And that is frustrating as hell. We shouldn't, so easily, be turned into puppets.
As for the anthem. I was brought up like most here. Believing passionately that the flag, the anthem, stood for something bigger than me. It stood for all of us. It's not owned by the government (they are supposed to be "We The People" after all), nor any one branch of the government, or service there of. It's us. "We". So I stand, proud. Because overall, "We" have created something amazing, in the form of the United States of America!
So I stand.
But if you choose to take a knee. Ill extend my hand and help you up. And Ill ask you why, and how I can help. Because just maybe... That will help you and I live better, and motivate someone else do the same.
TRUMP: "Racism is evil, and those who cause violence in its name are criminals and thugs, including the KKK, neo-Nazis, white supremacists and other hate groups that are repugnant to everything we hold dear as Americans." Yup, sounds like he's a supporter to me.... good grief.....
People can protest what they want to. As long as it's just words or symbols.... knock yourself out. Physical confrontation is actually denying others their rights to free speech and breaking the law. Funny how it seems a one way street for some.
Free speech all you want on your own time..... not mine...... I reserve the right to join, ignore..... or call them morons and refuse to watch. On my time.
But no one answered my question. If they were kneeling for a cause you believed in would you feel the same way, that they are disrespecting the flag and the anthem and the country and those who fought for its freedom?
It isn't even logical for them to disrespect the flag or veterans. The Union carried the flag which ultimately led to freedom for blacks. And I'm sure they are aware that many blacks and other minorities fought and died side by side in several wars with white soldiers. They are not protesting the flag or the anthem or the country. They are trying to raise awareness to an issue. If you can't sit down and think it out and separate those things, you are closed minded. And honestly, dare I say it, Politically Correct (the very thing we hated about the left remember?)
Yes I don't like the way they are protesting. But you have to be able to put your outrage aside and be able to look at why they are doing it. What is it they are trying to bring attention to. Then make a decision on whether it is legit and justified.
Actually they do. It's called the 1st Amendment of the Constitution.
This isn't about IBM, Ricoh, or any other place of employment. Granted, the 1st Amendment only guarantees Freedom of Speech, as well as the Right to Peaceably Assemble. That said, it does not guarantee repercussions against said speech or assembly. As of now, there have not been, nor will there be in the foreseeable future, any repercussions. Only when the backlash reaches a point where it is detrimental to the pocketbooks of the league will there be any policy changes concerning this or similar issues. If enough people boycott, there will be change.
Let me ask a question of those that are veterans. When you chose to serve, did you do so to protect the rights and freedom of all American citizens, or just those whose words or actions align with yours? Just curious.
Respectfully and seriously, I'd like to ask if you know EXACTLY what these guys are protesting. You both seem to feel they are standing for "something". WTH is it? Exactly what is it they are protesting?
Don't give me a BS one liner like "racial inequality" or "social injustice", as those are nothing more than BS terms with zero backing in facts.
I understand the issue (s) and I do believe it is their right to voice their opinion or to peacefully demonstrate their position.
The First Amendment does not say "pick a political correctness " in choosing your freedom of speech. What you or I may or may not perceive to be correct does not matter.
IT IS THEIR RIGHT
Personally I do not agree with their method of protest. I place the kneeling during the National Anthem, the same as burning the flag .
However, the First Amendment does not require my approval.
Bullhound, I'm not going to pretend to know exactly everything behind these protests. I understand alot of it, as do a lot of whites, latinos, etc, that chose to kneel on Sunday, as well as blacks. I do know that what Trump Tweeted did nothing more than throw gas on a burning ember. It went from a couple kneeling here and there to damn near everyone.
What I do know is these players have every right to this peaceful protest, just as everyone else has the right to protest THEIR protest. That's what makes America the Greatest Country on Earth! If they were burning the flag, that would be one thing. That's illegal. What these people are doing is not only legal, it's protected by the Constitution. I'm old enough to remember the Watts Riots, as well as Rodney King, etc. Although I don't condone kneeling during the Anthem, I damn sure will take this over that.
well, please explain what you do understand, cuz I don't get it. When asked, I've not seen one of these guys provide ANY sort of identification of ANYTHING whatsoever, regarding what they are protesting. I've seen about 6-8 of them asked what SPECIFICALLY it is they are protesting with zero credible answers. They clam up or simply say something like "Racial inequality", or some other BS, but nothing specific.
I was asking politely looking for an answer and you just gave me your bullshit smartass answer. I see inequality everyday. it comes from, and goes in every friggin direction pal. There's good people and bad people. These millionaire NFL players and their "neighborhood friends" don't have the market cornered, with regard to tough times, or INEQUALITY.
He has the Right to protest. But in reality..... he has no "right" to protest. The man isn't even a registered voter and has never voted or participated in any political or civic process his entire life. He's basically nothing but a football player to me, I couldn't care less about his views or thoughts on pretty much anything else..... and to this point he has done nothing but to reaffirm that view.
Honestly, there are a good number of very civic minded players who volunteer their time and money to make a difference in their communities. Too many to list. Good people who are actually trying to make a difference in peoples lives. Not all ballplayers are self-important self-centered azzes. I really don't want to paint all players with the same broad brush or call to boycott because of the actions of a couple of morons. And I do enjoy watching and being a fan.
But the NFL themselves right now are fumbling the ball. If you aren't going to stand for the anthem..... stay in the locker room until it over and then quietly move to your sideline. If you are going to insult your public to their faces...... suspend them. If they want to make a statement, make it after you've left the stadium.
WRT burning the flag..... that actually is legal as well. Supreme Court decision some years ago. Long as you aren't breaking any fire codes.....
How about we change the scenario a bit. Most of us, if not all, can't relate to racial issues, millionaires, or billionaires in the first place.
Suppose your mother/wife/daughter has a cancer that can only be treated with an extremely expensive form of chemo. Had any of the attempts to repeal Obamacare succeeded, pre-existing conditions could have been denied insurance. If this same protest was conducted in response to this denial, would you still feel the same?
So until they get back to playing football and stop with the BS I will hunt or watch a hunting show on YouTube when a game is on.
Besides ever since the big 3 left Monday night football it has sucked in the commentator department.
To me it simply does not matter why they did it. It isn't helping their cause. It was a political move on every single one of the players who did it. They got their little feelings hurt because the were called what a good bit of the American society feels about anyone who disrespects our country. And, they did it on private pay time. Not their own time. So, each employee has the right to fire every single one of the bums.
FWIW, I've never watched it and, for sure never will. And, I'd love to see the NFL go bankrupt for allowing it. They have picked and choose what political message they allowed the players to send over the years. So, playing if from the 1st Amendment angle now is a joke on them. God Bless
Kaepernic did. That was actually a part of his reason when asked why he did it. Again, "I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color," said the poor lil oppressed minority knocking back 11.9 million a year.....
Personally, I couldn't care less about what a bunch of overpaid jocks want to do, I have nothing invested in them emotionally or financially. I do think it rather ironic that they are so butt hurt over social injustices but they don't mind taking the check.
I have to ask ...................where in the world did you grow up? Cause I can't imagine it was in the USA!
Tim Tebow took a knee to thank God and was threatened with fines if he kept doing it! (Freedom of expression)
Players are fined for excessive celebrations at times. (Freedom of expression)
Players are fined for arguing with refs. (Freedom of expression)
A player was fined for wearing 9/11 never forget on his cleats. (Freedom of expression)
John kitna of Bengals was fined for wearing a ball cap during an interview with a cross on it. (Freedom of expression)
Why did all of this happen? Because they broke the rules set forth by the NFL and they were enforced!
The NFL also has a rule that all players must stand for the national anthem and their helmet is to be in the left hand and they are to refrain from talking!
Well Goodell has lost complete control of running an organization and he needs to go!
BucI313 is my father and I was taught when the national anthem is being played you face the flag, take your hat off, you place your hand over your heart and you either remain silent or sing along!
I do this to respect those who are willing to die for me and for those who have kept me a free person!
As an adult I have learned it's all in the delivery. Well these players have a delivery that is all wrong in my opinion.
So this year on Kellys most excellent hunting adventure there will be no going to get the greatest wings in America and watching football even if it is my Bengals playing!
Just like in Colorado, because its legal to smoke marijuana doesn't mean it's not a condition of your employment that you don't. Most private companies are "at will" employers. Which means you can leave or be asked to leave at will.
Yet we all (me too) are coming to a conclusion about whether what those athletes did last weekend was American, or anti American. We are choosing to immediately decide they are jerks, or not.
If, as it seems from all I've heard - which sure isn't all of it... that this is really about racial injustice or poor treatment via police... Then a big part of it, is going to be figuring out how to help folks in economically depressed communities, where violence rates are much higher by default, change that situation. That's awesome, because there sure as heck are a lot of beat down, poor, predominantly white or hispanic communities that need the same knowledge and help...
It also means folks IN those communities need to stand up, and fight for themselves. They have to help change the community they live in. That goes for any race. Any.
The problem is that when those people stand up, no one cares. Its on most of our local news every day, where ever we live. Some mother who's kid just got shot sobbing. We dont care, because it happened "over there". Maybe there is a little rage for a couple days, but most of the time... we just hit the up button on the clicker and change the channel.
The well off, fortunate as heck athletes who manage to make an NFL roster on the other hand... Check it out. Like it or not, we are on a dang BOWHUNTING forum and we are talking about it. I said it above, kneeling for the anthem is not my thing. I stand. But wow. Those players have the entire country if not world discussing a really challenging and complex issue that IS a factor in society.
Hate the method or not, I don't get why trying to understand WHY there was ever a sense of need for them to do this is bad. And I really don't get why acknowledging what a big part of OUR nation feels seems to trigger so much polarization.
Some of those guys grew up with a middle class or higher background... a lot did not. We are the product of our experiences. If your whole life, you feel like everyone is out to get you, its going to be a lot harder to elicit trust. You have to be open to it, to look for it, but that's a lot harder when you believe you have been beat down over and over. Whether it really is, or not, if you think that the playing field is different for you... it is. And it's not going to be easy to change that - ask any one with an addiction... some pretty similar thinking patterns there when it comes to changing.
It's social and mass media driven. And yes, Fox and Brietbart share just as much hyper one sided BS as CSNBC and CNN. We get these little sound bites and we get parts of stories hyper analyzed for 30' at a block... It gets us all pissed off, feeds our individual bias and no one on any side ever stops and really seems to think about the full issue, how it's impacting ALL of us.
End point to me, is that with a hyper polarized dialogue - like we have on so many issues today - nothing changes, and everything worsens. We dig in deeper, self inoculate with bias affirming information, and keep assuming "the other side" are massively, hugely, tremendously wrong on the issue.
That's a bummer. Because we all miss out on a chance to grow.
If I did, his focus will be the tree and my car issue won't get much attention.
What a bunch of clueless hypocrites!
And yes, this goes for every single person, regardless of the color of their skin.
As someone has already said, this was a minor deal that Kapernick started with a few others since, until our draft dodger in chief tried to make some political gain by playing the big patriot in support of our veterans. He couldn't serve but he could ski every winter, but the sheep will bash anyone who dares to mention it. Yet someone who kneels is a bigger hypocrite because money has emblems of the USA on it?
If you don't support it, don't watch or pay for tickets. Many are boycotting, and if enough follow suit, the NFL will wise up if it costs them a dollar, don't worry. It is always about the buck for them.
I have the biggest problem with whole teams that avoided the national anthem. I am guessing that they were coerced into a protest whether they wanted to or not. I would like to know the story behind that. And I have a problem with Tebow or anyone being fined for taking a knee to thank God, if that is what happened. If so, the NFL is saying it is OK to disrespect the flag, but not OK to thank God. Wow.
But take a minute and think if you really believe they are pampered millionaires. I thought it was the liberals who hated wealth. I think there are a lot more pampered millionaires who just inherited daddy's money than there are pampered NFL athletes, when you consider how hard they must train, the hits they take, and the multiple surgeries they almost all endure. Remember, even many Heisman trophy winners in college were total duds in the NFL, so it takes the elite of the elite to even make it in the NFL. I don't know anybody personally who works as hard for their money as a typical NFL player.
That said, rules are rules, and if the NFL has it in the rules as posted above, they should be enforced.
Then protest during a Disney movie and not during the National Anthem that millions of people hold dear to their hearts. They have insulted millions of people and those people have the right to feel insulted and express their feelings.
I keep reading it is not about the Anthem or the flag but they continually use is as their venue/media KNOWING the insults it is throwing to millions of people.
The message is great. The methodology is insulting.
For example, the personal responsibility of the folks kneeling suggests to them, that something bad is happening to many in the community, and some significant message needs to be sent to get others (us) to listen, and find ways to work together.
The personal responsibility of those of us hearing the message runs the gamut too. Some may feel they are jerks and thus the whole concept is bogus. Others may not care. Others may choose to learn more, to attempt to understand where they are coming from - agree or not.
I just dont think many things are black and white. Take the basic "test" used in a lot of Philosophy classes - "is it wrong to kill someone?" Yes. Yes it is.
But wait... what if you walk into your parents house, and there is a person in the act of trying to kill your parents, would it be ok for you to kill that person?
See where I'm going? This is not a black and white (no pun intended there) thing. It's nuanced. And personal responsibility is a huge player - both towards those protesting listening to those of us who feel standing is appropriate, and the other way as well. Cant fix it, unless we are all willing to learn from each other.
I sure as heck dont understand it... So I'm trying to learn more, and pondering what I/my family may be able to do. Even if it's as simple as doing more volunteer work in our community. I've had interesting conversations with friends who are black and friends who are white and friends who are Hispanic about it. Everyone has an opinion :)!
This has been interesting to read too. It's interesting to see the different views and ways of thinking presented by all of us here. It's cool that, at least it feels to me, our "like" interest in the outdoors helps keep the conversation really civil. I mean wholly cow, check out comments on an article from a newspaper on this (online) or folks social media pages... WOW! Thats frustrating to see!
That's why I believe this protest isn't really about trying to help or find answers, its about division and an agenda.
2. I'm no more interested in sitting down with the KKK to better understand their position than I am in sitting down with players who exhibit the "black power" fist raised symbol - both are symbols of hatred/division - I'm not interested in that and won't give either a platform to "discuss" their bigotred hatred for that which I respect - this country, the flag and law enforcement.
Hopefully I'm done posting on this thread - :-)
Please read my post closely. I quoted someone else who said it was not about the flag. I disagreed with that take.
I understand your point about millionaires complaining about oppression. I was mad about Eric Reid, from LSU, joining Kapernick, and I disagree with him for the most part, but today I read where he said "That's the amazing and beautiful thing about the platform we have as professional athletes, for some reason people want to listen to us," Reid said. "I don't know why. There are people who are a lot smarter than me who don't have the same platform that professional athletes have."
Double that for actors/actresses. Why should anybody listen to them? But apparently people do.
So the flip side is why shouldn't people who have a platform speak up against oppression, while they clearly are not the ones being oppressed?
To me it is much more hypocritical to weasel out of military service, then get a platform to blast people for disrespecting the military.
PECO I said personally, and I personally know many blue collar workers and a few farmers. They don't get blindsided by super athletes and carted off the field on a regular basis, nor do any of them that I know go through the rigors of training camp, with hours per day on the field and in the weight room. I have worked side by side with plenty of carpenters. And no, I doubt they would claim they work harder than NFL athletes.
I heard this morning on the radio FOX will not show the National Anthem during their telecasts on Sunday. CBS still plans to show it.
I always did like college football a lot more. Now I will just get my fill of football on Sat. and Thurs nites!
My wife told me that she heard an interview with a Fallujah-bound vet (on K-LOVE, in case anybody wants to claim it was some "god-less, liberal-biased" operation).
He said that he totally understands and respects the players who quietly and respectfully take a knee before the Flag; apparently he and his squad-mates do EXACTLY THE SAME THING every time they're about to head out on Patrol....
More interesting context for this...
I saw somewhere (but have not fact-checked) a report that the "long-standing, time-honored" tradition of standing for the Anthem goes all the way back to something like 2004. (Really? As I said - haven't had a chance to fact-check it)
And just one question for those howling in outrage over the whole thing...
When you're home on a Sunday afternoon, kicked back, watching the game.... How many of you are on YOUR feet, hats off, hand over your heart, singing along?
At least these guys have all stopped what they're doing for a moment of reflection, and aren't just taking the chance to grab another bag o' chips, take a leak or crack open a beer.
But it's ALL BS, really - people who back Trump won't back down on this or quit his sorry ass for love nor money, and the people who can't stand him aren't budging either. Maybe there are one or two out there, but I have yet to see a Trump supporter come out in support of the kneeling players, nor anyone who can't stand the man who thinks the players are out of line.
So once again, it's not really about the "issue", no matter what you think it is or how you want to define it; it's REALLY just All About Trump, and he wouldn't have it ANY OTHER WAY.
And what someone does in the privacy of their home is none of anyone's business and it shouldn't be. If you want to stand on your head with your thumb in your rear go right ahead. We don't have to see you. What you do in public on the other hand is a different matter. I have family and friends buried at Arlington Cemetery and when you publically dishonor them, then we have a problem.
Who I blame is the NFL. This BS should have been squashed a year ago when Kraphead started this garbage. But like a game where the refs don't call the fouls, eventually the game turns into a brawl. That's what's happening now. But now the ratings are falling and the SPONSORS (read $$$$$) are putting their 2 cents in and NOW the NFL is starting to pay attention. None of this had to happen if only the NFL had abided by their own rules on the flag/anthem. Hopefully they'll learn when it starts to cost them money.
PECO - that vet's point was that they KNEEL. You say you'd BET that they're praying, but you don't KNOW, and you don't know what anyone on that sideline is thinking. The point is, kneeling is not acceptable-when-you-think-you-know-why-(and-approve-of-why)-they-are-doing-it and somehow suddenly disrespectful when you don't; it's just kneeling. Who are you, the Thought Police?
Frankly, the guys who kneel quietly and attend to the moment impress me a LOT more than the guys who are obviously all hyped up and just dying for the whole thing to be over.
And kneeling - quietly and respectfully - during the anthem is a posture of humility; not attack and not even disrespect. It's also a perfectly legitimate exercise of one of the rights that all those guys in Arlington lived and fought and died to protect.
That's your opinion and I disgaree 100% with it. And onced more, YES they have a right to do whatever they want. But I don't have to watch it or condone it. My impression is they hate America and the people who died so they can make millions of dollars playing a stupid kid's game. And again, they are AT WORK when they do this, so if their employers permit this then I guess they AGREE with this show of disrespect to the country so I will no longer patronize them or their sponsors. You stick it my eye, then I stick it in your wallet.
"an interview with a Fallujah-bound vet ....He said that he totally understands and respects the players who quietly and respectfully take a knee before the Flag"
Interesting read GF, why are you assuming the soldier is not a Trump supporter?
If someone doesn't agree with a lib on any issue, they call that person a Trump supporter. If they do agree on an issue they call them a democrat. By definition, that's probably why you haven't found a Trump supporter who supports the idea of kneeling during the anthem.
When customers call, 1-800-342-5283 they are greeted with a recorded message that gives them the option to voice their opinions about the protests.
“If you are calling with questions or comments about Anheuser-Busch’s sponsorship of the NFL, press one,” the recorded voice says.
“At Anheuser-Busch, we have a long heritage of supporting the nation’s armed forces, veterans and military dependents,” the voice says. “The National Anthem is a point of pride for our company and for the 1,100 veterans that we employ. Please feel free to share your feedback after the tone.”
The hotline was a huge success as millions of Americans called the beer company to voice their opinions. So many people called on Friday when the hotline was opened that the company had to shut it down since it was flooded with phone calls.
Here is more from Fox 2 Now:
Anheuser Busch’s consumer help line temporarily went down Friday afternoon. A company representative says there was a high volume of calls from a social media campaign. There was a temporary disruption in service to 1-800-DIAL-BUD.
A post to the “RockIt News” Facebook pa
Kneeling during the National Anthem at any NFL game is against their own policy. A policy that isn't subject to personal woes without consequence. The NFL has done a great job over the last decade ensuring they upheld their whole policy as long as coincided with liberal beliefs. Funny now that they want to play the 1st Amendment card as the reason the protests are being allowed. In the past, that reasoning didn't apply when you were on the clock for them.
No one knows what each individual is protesting when they chose to kneel instead of give due respect to our flag. Truth is, there have been quite a few reasons given. What is clear is they have chosen to do it in a venue and, in the face of EVERYONE providing their employment and freedoms. But, by their rules of employment outlined in the NFL's operation manual, the NFL itself demands that standing at attention, facing the flag, while holding their helmet in their left hand, is expected of each player during the national anthem. So, the question remains why they are not enforcing it?
We all know why they are doing what they are doing. The only thing left to wonder is why any one person would allow these players and this organization, to practice its brand of politics at your expense. That's why people oppose this. Not political beliefs. Most common sense folks don't inject politics into every facet of their life. Unless you simply despise Trump and, lack the principled reasons for feeling the way you do. Which is becoming an affliction it seems to those weak minded enough to allow it.
"Take a knee at the beach in Normandy where man after American man stormed the beach, even as the one in front of him was shot to pieces...the very sea stained with American blood. The only blockers most had were the dead bodies in front of them, riddled with bullets from enemy fire."
"Take a knee in the sweat soaked jungles of Vietnam. from Khe San to Saigon... Anywhere will do. REAL Americans died in all those jungles. There was no playbook that told them what was next, but they knew what flag they represented. When they came home, they were protested as well..and spit on for reasons only cowards know."
"Take another knee in the blood drenched sands of Fallujah in 110 degree heat.. Wear your Kevlar helmet and battle dress... Your number won't be printed on it unless your number is up! You'll need to stay hydrated but there won't be anyone to squirt Gatorade into your mouth. You're on your own."
"There's a lot of places to take a knee. Real Americans have given their lives all over the world. When you use the banner under which they fought as a source for your displeasure, you dishonor the memories of those who bled for the very freedoms you have. That's what the red stripes mean. It represents the blood of those who spilled a sea of it defending your liberty."
"While you're on your knee, pray for those that came before you, not on a manicured lawn striped and printed with numbers to announce every inch of ground taken...but on nameless hills and bloodied beaches and sweltering forests and bitter cold mountains...every inch marked by an American life lost serving that flag you protest."
"No cheerleaders, no announcers, no coaches, no fans...just American men and women...delivering the real fight against those who chose to harm us...blazing a path so you would have the right to "take a knee."
"You haven't an inkling what it took to get you where you are; but your "protest" is duly noted. Not only is it disgraceful to a nation of real heroes, it serves the purpose of pointing to your ingratitude for those who chose to defend you under that banner that will still wave long after your jersey is issued to another..."
"If you really feel the need to take a knee, come with me to church on Sunday and we'll both kneel before Almighty God. We'll thank Him for preserving this country for as long as He has. We'll beg forgiveness for our ingratitude for all He has provided us. We'll appeal to Him for understanding and wisdom. We'll pray for liberty and justice for all...because He is the one who provides those things."
"And there will be no protest. There will only be gratitude for His provision and a plea for His continued grace and mercy on the land of the free and the home of the brave. It goes like this..."
GOD BLESS AMERICA!
PECO's Link
http://americanmilitarynews.com/2017/10/watch-a-female-college-student-throw-a-drink-on-lakers-fans-for-kneeling-during-national-anthem/?utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=alt&utm_source=tednugent
To the NFL players.........
You graduated high school in 2011. Your teenage years were a struggle. You grew up on the wrong side of the tracks. Your mother was the leader of the family and worked tirelessly to keep a roof over your head and food on your plate. Academics were a struggle for you and your grades were mediocre at best. The only thing that made you stand out is you weighed 225 lbs and could run 40 yards in 4.2 seconds while carrying a football. Your best friend was just like you, except he didn’t play football. Instead of going to football practice after school, he went to work at McDonalds for minimum wage. You were recruited by all the big colleges and spent every weekend of your senior year making visits to universities where coaches and boosters tried to convince you their school was best. They laid out the red carpet for you. Your best friend worked double shifts at Mickey D’s. College was not an option for him. On the day you signed with Big State University, your best friend signed paperwork with his Army recruiter. You went to summer workouts. He went to basic training.
You spent the next four years living in the athletic dorm, eating at the training table. You spent your Saturdays on the football field, cheered on by adoring fans. Tutors attended to your every academic need. You attended class when you felt like it. Sure, you worked hard. You lifted weights, ran sprints, studied plays, and soon became one of the top football players in the country. Your best friend was assigned to the 101st Airborne Division. While you were in college, he deployed to Iraq once and Afghanistan twice. He became a Sergeant and led a squad of 19 year old soldiers who grew up just like he did. He shed his blood in Afghanistan and watched young American's give their lives, limbs, and innocence for the USA. You went to the NFL combine and scored off the charts. You hired an agent and waited for draft day. You were drafted in the first round and your agent immediately went to work, ensuring that you received the most money possible. You signed for $16 million although you had never played a single down of professional football. Your best friend re-enlisted in the Army for four more years. As a combat tested sergeant, he will be paid $32,000 per year. You will drive a Ferrari on the streets of South Beach. He will ride in the back of a Blackhawk helicopter with 10 other combat loaded soldiers. You will sleep at the Ritz. He will dig a hole in the ground and try to sleep. You will “make it rain” in the club. He will pray for rain as the temperature reaches 120 degrees.
On Sunday, you will run into a stadium as tens of thousands of fans cheer and yell your name. For your best friend, there is little difference between Sunday and any other day of the week. There are no adoring fans. There are only people trying to kill him and his soldiers. Every now and then, he and his soldiers leave the front lines and “go to the rear” to rest. He might be lucky enough to catch an NFL game on TV. When the National Anthem plays and you take a knee, he will jump to his feet and salute the television. While you protest the unfairness of life in the United States, he will give thanks to God that he has the honor of defending his great country. To the players of the NFL: We are the people who buy your tickets, watch you on TV, and wear your jerseys. We anxiously wait for Sundays so we can cheer for you and marvel at your athleticism. Although we love to watch you play, we care little about your opinions until you offend us. You have the absolute right to express yourselves, but we have the absolute right to boycott you. We have tolerated your drug use and DUIs, your domestic violence, and your vulgar displays of wealth. We should be ashamed for putting our admiration of your physical skills before what is morally right. But now you have gone too far. You have insulted our flag, our country, our soldiers, our police officers, and our veterans. You are living the American dream, yet you disparage our great country. I am done with NFL football and encourage all like minded Americans to boycott the NFL as well.
I feel dirty.
Then the NFL will get the message loud and clear.
