Sitka Gear
A Backward Trend in Deer Management
Whitetail Deer
Contributors to this thread:
Bowriter 06-Nov-17
Mike/ky 06-Nov-17
WV Mountaineer 06-Nov-17
OkieJ 06-Nov-17
Bowriter 06-Nov-17
From: Bowriter
06-Nov-17
I thought this might be of interest to some who care what is happening with deer management on a state basis.

There is, quite close to me, a locker plant that has been in business for 40-years. They were the first to offer deer processing. The owner keeps great records and also takes notes of his observations. He has long been a source of information for me and his records are a close indicator of just is happening in deer season, for this area.

In some states, there is and has been a 3” law on bucks. Meaning, if it has antlers over 3”, it requires a buck tag. Under 3”, it does not require a buck tag. In some states, if the antlers break the hairline, it requires a buck tag. Good arguments can be made for either. In fact, I can make those arguments.

In our state, one which is rapidly going backwards in the field of deer management, two years ago, after reducing our buck limit from three to two, we abolished the antlerless deer category. That being, if a buck had antlers less than 3”, it did not require a buck tag. I was strongly opposed to that measure simply because, there was no biological need for it, just as there was biological need to reduce the buck limit from three to two.

My argument was…is, that since we had an online check in system, this was going to lead to appreciable false reporting and therefore, useless data. These young bucks, formerly accounted for as male deer, were now going to be checked in as does, to avoid using a buck tag.

Yesterday, I visited the processing plant owner. We talked. This is a direct quote. “John, during bow season and the first day of muzzleloader season, I wish you had seen this.” Here got out his notebook and rifled through the pages. “I took in 18-coolers of deer…coolers. These deer had been skinned and quartered and checked in as does. They had the confirmation numbers and everything. Of the 18, I could prove 12-were young bucks and probably at least three more were. I also know of at least two individuals who have so far, killed three bucks. Our data is useless.” Here he thought a minute, then continued. “In three years, we have stepped back 20-years in our deer management.” This man has over 30-years of records on what has been brought into his plant. It is a treasure trove of information because as his business goes, so goes deer hunting in our area. He handed me his notebook and said, “Take this, use it any way it can help you. Use my name, quote me, I’m too old to care and I hate to see what is happening all due to politics.” (Sidebar) On private land, I strongly support the rule, if it has testicles, it is a buck. But that is on private land that can be monitored and controlled. On a statewide basis with no physical check in, it is a horrible law. I would very much like discussion on this. How do you veteran hunters feel? Please, keep it civil and remember, this is not about trophy hunting or trophy management. This is about factual versus useless data.

From: Mike/ky
06-Nov-17
All about the $$$. Telecheck is cheap. The state wants more deer shot. Thats more tags bought. Thats more $$$$. It comes down to changing the culture of the hunting community. It's like politics. There is no changing peoples minds. If its brown its down. Sad

06-Nov-17
There are so many things to consider on a management plan that fits a state. Or, a large area that many different hunters hunt. The biggest variable is making a law that fits most while best accomplishing the objective. Problem is, most guys simply cannot relate the difference in a public plan and a private plan.

People recreate deer hunting in the east. It is a pastime full of heritage and even though a good bit of the participants are not as dedicated as many here are, they want to kill a deer. So, they shoot a deer. Doesn’t matter if it’s big or small, they like chewing it and they like killing it. It’s simply a tradition.

But, whenever you take away accountability of people and place them in a situation where they can fudge it to their benefit, that is what’s going to happen with a percentage of them. It’s simply human nature. Expect it. It’s going to happen.

As far as the data being flawed, I personally believe that to be the biggest factor in people misunderstanding deer hunting. Add in those that don’t check them in, those that poach, and those that fudge the numbers, and you have a confidence interval that is super large in your statistics. Way to large to be certain of anything. And, game departments country wide are consistently basing tegulations on these flawed numbers.

That is simply why a state plan has to be basic and outlining to remove as much subjectivity as possible.

In states that have multiple buck tags, if the percentage of people using the second and third tag is small, what effect will lowering the harvest have? Not much in reality. But, in instances like you describe, the below three was devised to give the hunter the chance to recover if he made a hasty mistake. Allow him to be a multiple season hunter so to speak. It has good intentions but, bad results. Because it’s HUMAN NATURE.

In my mind the biggest thing everyone could do to see bigger bucks is shoot does like it’s their job. Religiously. And keep doing it. I believe in states like mine, people are killing older deer than they realize. Our check in station info proves that. We simply have so many deer in some areas that they remain small and grow small racks due to nutritional stress. Hunters just assume they killed a 1.5 year old because his rack scored 90. Not so in a lot of cases.

Anyways, the kill numbers based on liberal limits have to be considered more accurate. If a guy bow hunts, muzzleloader hunts, and rifle hunts, you can be guaranteed that he wants the ability to enjoy all those seasons. If he’s tagged out, that ain’t going to happen.

This isn’t the West. The quantity of the resource is huge and allows for a very aggressive harvest. You can’t squeeze grape juice from a prune either. So, people need to enjoy what they have and, go to other places to get something different.

That’s my long winded take on it. God Bless men

From: OkieJ
06-Nov-17
That sounds like the rules here in Okla, all the same right down to the E Check. I wish we would go back to having Check Stations where they would gather data and age the ones brought in.

From: Bowriter
06-Nov-17
Some excellent posts- Ground Hunter, I agree on Ozoga, certainly in the top two, especially on "wild" deer. You post is dead on.

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