Mathews Inc.
Kuiu down bag stuff sack
Elk
Contributors to this thread:
Wishedhead 04-Dec-17
Carnage2011 04-Dec-17
Wishedhead 04-Dec-17
Kurt 04-Dec-17
JTreeman 04-Dec-17
Bowboy 04-Dec-17
Jaquomo 04-Dec-17
Kurt 04-Dec-17
Deertick 04-Dec-17
Jaquomo 04-Dec-17
Surfbow 04-Dec-17
Jaquomo 04-Dec-17
Treeline 05-Dec-17
Treeline 05-Dec-17
Kodiak 05-Dec-17
greg simon 05-Dec-17
Nick Muche 05-Dec-17
Rock 05-Dec-17
TD 05-Dec-17
Paul@thefort 05-Dec-17
Scoot 05-Dec-17
smarba 05-Dec-17
Aluminum Rain 05-Dec-17
Jaquomo 05-Dec-17
Scrappy 05-Dec-17
Scoot 05-Dec-17
Matt 05-Dec-17
Jaquomo 06-Dec-17
Lark Bunting 07-Dec-17
Scoot 07-Dec-17
TD 07-Dec-17
Scoot 07-Dec-17
Kurt 07-Dec-17
Wishedhead 07-Dec-17
Surfbow 07-Dec-17
From: Wishedhead
04-Dec-17
Just bought the 15 degee bag and it did not include a stuff/compression sack. Was wondering what system you guys use for packing these upper end down bags in your packs for hunts. Thanks!!!!

From: Carnage2011
04-Dec-17
That bag will fit in the Kuiu dry bags.

From: Wishedhead
04-Dec-17
What size?

From: Kurt
04-Dec-17
Mine came with a stuff sack (not a compression sack) as well as a very large storage sack.......I'd contact KUIU about the omission and have them send you one. They are very lightweight sil nylon, or at least mine from 2014 was. Good luck with it.

From: JTreeman
04-Dec-17
Same here. Mine came wirh stuff sack, and storage sack. I think it's certainly worth a call.

--jim

From: Bowboy
04-Dec-17
Get a Sea to Summit stuff sack.

From: Jaquomo
04-Dec-17
Is the Kuiu "15" truly a 15 degree bag? I don't sleep as warm as I used to but looking at this one.

From: Kurt
04-Dec-17
Lou, I sleep fine in mine in August and Sept above treeline. At 15* F I definitely wear some warmer clothes in the bag to stay comfortable sleeping on the ultra-light 12 ounce Neoair Thermarest pad. Mine bag has decent loft...and it has been used since August 2014. They are snug in the chest area which bothers some people. Good luck with it.

From: Deertick
04-Dec-17
I am of the opinion that there is no bag that is really even close to what they say. Big Agnes is terrible like that. Lou, just buy they warmest one they sell. What's all that "lightweight" stuff worth if not for buying more insulation than you need and sleeping like a king?

I think fit is at least as important as insulation by the way.

From: Jaquomo
04-Dec-17
Doc Tick, I agree. I currently have three "packable" bags rated from 0-25 and none keep me warm within 10 degrees of the EN rating unless I wear warm clothes inside. I used a North Face Superlight for many years and managed but I'm older now and don't appreciate being constricted or chilly.

From: Surfbow
04-Dec-17
Lou, I have the 15, it's great. My bag came with an certification sheet from some testing group that says it is actually a 15 degree bag. So far it's been awesome on about 90% of the nights I've spent in it. I sleep cold, so on the 10% of the night I'm out and the forecast gets into the teens I carry a very light down quilt I use as a liner, that easily keeps me comfortable down to single digits. I originally thought I wanted the 0 degree bag, but it would have been way too warm for most of my use.

From: Jaquomo
04-Dec-17
As far as the EN rating by the testing groups, I'd have given one a much lower temp rating 35 years ago than today. As Idyllwild said once, the "rating" means "he was still alive in the morning".

Another gem from AndyJ after he showed up shivering at my camper door one morning (where I had the furnace going and drinking hot coffee in my jammies), "It's all about your tolerance for suffering".

Bowboy showed me his backpack bag this year. It looked like one leg of a pair of down longjohns for me. He's a lot tougher than I am these days.

From: Treeline
05-Dec-17
Lou, I have the 15o bag from Kuiu as well.

I would say it is pretty good down to around 20 for me stripped down to my undies. If I wear my longjohns, wool socks, and a beanie I can push it down into the single digits. A bit too warm at 35-40 and above and have to keep it unzipped.

All that being said from a guy that has lived a long time in the cold (Leadville, Routt County, Andes, etc.). When I have hunted with other guys from warmer country, they typically have a much tougher time handling the cold. Especially the guys from Arizona - even the guys from the White Mountains of Arizona are constantly cold up here.

I am not a big fan of how tight it fits - and I am not a big guy! I tend to move around quite a bit when I sleep so a tight bag tends to wake me up.

I have a big 0 degree bag that has a nice fleece lining that I really like for camping in November/December/January. Heavy. Not a backpack bag. Much more room to move around though.

From: Treeline
05-Dec-17
BTW, mine came with a small stuff sack and a larger storage bag. Call Kuiu and tell them that yours didn't come with one and they will send you one.

From: Kodiak
05-Dec-17
A 15 degree bag is good to about 45 in my experience.

From: greg simon
05-Dec-17
Kifaru makes the best compression stuff sacks I have found.

From: Nick Muche
05-Dec-17
Kifaru 5 string horizontal stuff sack is a good (best) option too as it'll compress your bag horizontally so it can fit in your pack without taking up more room then necessary.

From: Rock
05-Dec-17
Like others have stated they are tight thru the chest but that seldom bothers me as I use a sleeping bag more like a quilt and only zip it up to around my knees anyway. I have the 0 degree bag and it has been very comfortable the way I use it.

From: TD
05-Dec-17
I don't know about KUIU, but WM bag ratings are pretty spot on. Been to 17 in my 15 degree Badger and was comfortable, just base layers on. My thermostat is set pretty high and I don't even zip it up until freezing. Badger has a "mummy" shape but is a "full" cut bag, pretty roomy.

Nick+1 on the Kifaru compression sack. Only issue with it is it's not 100% waterproof if you take dive in the river.

From: Paul@thefort
05-Dec-17
I also ran into the same issue with my 17 degree bag from Big Ag. I purchased this down bag (3 1/2 lbs) believing I would be comfortable down to 17 degrees. SEEMS NOT SO.

I contacted them about my concern as I had just returned from 25 days elk hunting and on those much cooler nights in the 35 degree range I was uncomfortable even though I wore a set of merino wool long johns.

There is what they told me: Check the attached tab on the bottom of the bag. I did and here is what was printed. T Comfort=28 Degrees, T limit=17 degrees, T Extreme = -17 degrees. So it seems that the total comfort is actually 28 degrees and not 17 degrees and as printed on the bag. I elected to keep the bag but will then purchase a bag liner (14 oz) that will add 10-15 degrees more warm when needed for cooler temps. When I suggested that they actually place the 28 degrees on the bag, they told me that they had met (industry standards) with the current tab info.

From: Scoot
05-Dec-17
Lou and others-- I'm not trying to be a smart aleck or critical with this question, but I think it's a reasonable question. If you're willing to pay the money for a 15 degree Kuiu bag, why not use that same money and get a Western Mountaineering bag instead? I think they are semi-comparable in price, aren't they? WMs are tried and true and IME keep me warm to more than their rating. WMs are the "cream of the crop" according to many, so if they cost similarly why not go with them instead of Kuiu?

For the record, I have a number of Kuiu articles of clothes and I really like them. I've got nothing against Kuiu. But... when it comes to sleeping bags, Kuiu is a new kid on the block and WM has been around making really high quality products for a long time.

Maybe you just want to try something different, maybe you don't like WMs for some reason, maybe I'm wrong about the money being similar, maybe you've got a different reason... I just thought I'd ask since I think it's a relevant question that may steer you in a slightly different direction.

From: smarba
05-Dec-17
I'd echo Scoot's logic with tents. As an example, Hilleberg has been around for years and is arguably the cream of the crop. Newcomers are making expensive/quality tents, but I'd worry about them being around if/when I needed to deal with a warranty or repairs. I'm more apt to trust a company with a track record...

05-Dec-17
Scoot x2

From: Jaquomo
05-Dec-17
Scoot, I go back and forth on this every year. The WM 5 degree antelope weighs 2 lbs 7 oz (plus stuff sack) and costs @ $700 TYD. I have a great down bag that's rated to 0 and is an honest 10 that weighs 4 lbs with stuff sack. So my quandary is whether to spend $700 to cut a pound and a half and be a little squeezed, or spend that money elsewhere, like on freeze-dried Scotch..

From: Scrappy
05-Dec-17
As far as the original question on stuff sack. I dont use a sleeping bag i just have a quilt. I use the XO3500 pack that has a long tube on each side of the main bag that most folks use for spotters and tripods. I don't have either, one morning when I got up instead of putting the quilt in its stuff sack I just stuffed it down one of the tubes. After I took down the tent I just stuffed it down the same tube and then my air mattress topped it all off.

Bam my entire sleep system was all squared away minus the poles and stakes.

I guess that was the long way to say I done away with stuff sacks.

From: Scoot
05-Dec-17
Lou, that makes sense to me. I didn't realize you were comparing the Kuiu bag to a $700 bag. However, I still think the decision is easy-- buy a 10 or 15 degree WM bag for half of the money you're talking about (or less) and don't look back. If you're careful and picky you can get a used one for less money than the Kuiu bag, I think. A 15 WM bag should get you to where you want.

Lou, I've got a WM Badger that you are welcome to give a test run if you'd like. I love the bag, but I wish I would have gone with a slimmer bag than the Badger. Even though it's got slimmer measurements than my old Big Agnes, it's way bigger. I could have easily gotten by with a slimmer bag (I'm 6'0" and 185-190- depending up how many workouts and beers I've had lately). The only time you can't use it is next September! If interested, PM me and I'll ship it out to you.

From: Matt
05-Dec-17
I have a 25 degree WM bag and slept in it sans tent/tarp once (just a pad underneath). Woke up in the morning with frost on the outside of my bag but was toasty warm all night. If the Kuiu and WM bags are comparably priced, no way I would even consider a Kuiu. WM makes an outstanding product.

From: Jaquomo
06-Dec-17
Thanks, Scoot. There again is the question - the long badger costs just under $600 TYD, and I'll lose only a pound. If I was looking for only one good bag for the fall for what I do, seems like a worthwhile investment. But to only lose a pound vs. my current chilly weather bag is probably not a good use of $600.

From: Lark Bunting
07-Dec-17
I'm curious to know if you contacted Kuiu and whether or not the bag was supposed to come with the stuff sack and storage sack.

Personally, I've had some issues with Kuiu gear and their customer service so I'm really curious to hear how this plays out.

From: Scoot
07-Dec-17
Lou, I'd tend to agree with you. However, you're looking at the 15 degree Kuiu, I assume? That bag lists for $580. Also, given your build you don't need a Badger- you could get a Versalite, Ultralite, or Alpinelite that would cost between $500 and $575 and it would actually work better than the Badger for you IMO.

If I were in your shoes this would be easy-- I'd go on AT, BPL, or a few other websites and look for a used bag- any of the three WM bags I mentioned above. You can likely get one for under $300 if you're patient, which is a way better option than getting the Kuiu bag (or any new bag IMO). Then maybe you can sell your old bag for something to offset the cost a bit? Maybe not if it's old and heavier. Lots of "like new" bags for sale online that are actually in "like new" condition.

Or... you just keep lugging your old bag around and save the cash, which really isn't a bad option it sounds like. It's not like your old bag weighs 8 lbs. But... lighter gear is a beautiful thing IMO. Not sure what the value of it is per ounce, but it's significant when you lug your stuff up and down the mountain a lot.

From: TD
07-Dec-17
In many cases it's not only weight you are "buying" but a bit less space as well, less bulk, things fit better in the pack. I have to fly with camp and bulk starts to be a consideration along with weight.

WRT money..... sounds like your current bag is plenty warm enough...... but as I've told the story more than a few times...... it's 2am and you're shivering teeth chattering cold..... I'd have paid near any amount of money to be able to be toasty warm in that moment. Would have been a much better investment to have paid it BEFORE reaching that conclusion...... My next gear search budget consideration was only to get the best sale price I could find on what I was determined not to ever have happen again.....

Like a drill..... it's not the tool you want..... first consideration is the hole it makes...... =D

From: Scoot
07-Dec-17
"...it's 2am and you're shivering teeth chattering cold..."

TD, you hit the nail on the head regarding the exact scenario that resulted in me buying a WM bag! I also bought a lighter, smaller pad that has a much better R value than my old BAIC. I definitely dropped some money, but I was happy to. I waited and got a GREAT price on the bag I bought (more than 50% off) and got the pad on sale too. I sold my old gear and offset some of the cost too. As they say in the Milky Way commercial, "No regerts". :)

From: Kurt
07-Dec-17
When backpack hunting, rather than a heavier, bulkier, warmer sleeping bag, I prefer a 15*F down sleeping bag paired with a down hooded puffy and down pants when the potential for cold weather exists. They are easy enough wear at night to increase the bag rating by 20* or so and dandy to wear during the day as required for glassing....especially when you get up on a frigid morning with them already on.

From: Wishedhead
07-Dec-17
I called kuiu today and they are sending me a stuff sack for my 15 degree bag and yes it is suppose to come with it. Theses bags dont go on sale very often and i waited to pay $429 for it. I will give you a full review after a week in the backcountry

From: Surfbow
07-Dec-17
I think you'll like it, it's a good bag

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