Summit Treestands
Grizzly Hunt is Gone in BC
Bears
Contributors to this thread:
Ambush 18-Dec-17
lineman21 18-Dec-17
skull 18-Dec-17
smarba 18-Dec-17
Pat Lefemine 18-Dec-17
smarba 18-Dec-17
Ambush 18-Dec-17
Guardian Hunter 18-Dec-17
Ambush 18-Dec-17
Elkhorn 18-Dec-17
Ambush 18-Dec-17
BMG2 18-Dec-17
stealthycat 18-Dec-17
Sage Buffalo 18-Dec-17
Grunt-N-Gobble 18-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 18-Dec-17
walking buffalo 18-Dec-17
Owl 18-Dec-17
BIG BEAR 18-Dec-17
Franklin 18-Dec-17
skull 18-Dec-17
Surfbow 18-Dec-17
Pat Lefemine 18-Dec-17
Medicinemann 19-Dec-17
BIG BEAR 19-Dec-17
Medicinemann 19-Dec-17
Northstickhunter 19-Dec-17
thedude 19-Dec-17
IdyllwildArcher 19-Dec-17
TGbow 19-Dec-17
Ambush 19-Dec-17
Franklin 19-Dec-17
DL 19-Dec-17
walking buffalo 19-Dec-17
Pat Lefemine 19-Dec-17
ground hunter 19-Dec-17
venison 19-Dec-17
Mad Trapper 19-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 19-Dec-17
njbuck 19-Dec-17
Franzen 19-Dec-17
kentuckbowhnter 19-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 19-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 19-Dec-17
Ollie 19-Dec-17
APauls 19-Dec-17
Ambush 19-Dec-17
TSI 19-Dec-17
Ambush 19-Dec-17
Franzen 19-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 19-Dec-17
air leak 19-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 19-Dec-17
Bowriter 19-Dec-17
TSI 19-Dec-17
stealthycat 19-Dec-17
Ambush 19-Dec-17
skull 19-Dec-17
TSI 19-Dec-17
elk yinzer 19-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 19-Dec-17
Ambush 19-Dec-17
Bowriter 19-Dec-17
orionsbrother 19-Dec-17
BIG BEAR 19-Dec-17
stealthycat 19-Dec-17
Ambush 19-Dec-17
Pat Lefemine 19-Dec-17
TSI 19-Dec-17
TSI 19-Dec-17
elk yinzer 19-Dec-17
Brotsky 19-Dec-17
bigswivle 19-Dec-17
TD 19-Dec-17
Bowriter 19-Dec-17
britfan 19-Dec-17
britfan 19-Dec-17
IdyllwildArcher 19-Dec-17
HDE 19-Dec-17
Stekewood 19-Dec-17
ground hunter 19-Dec-17
ground hunter 19-Dec-17
WV Mountaineer 19-Dec-17
TSI 19-Dec-17
skull 19-Dec-17
Mad Trapper 20-Dec-17
KyleSS 20-Dec-17
thedude 20-Dec-17
Pigsticker 20-Dec-17
elk yinzer 20-Dec-17
elk yinzer 20-Dec-17
elk yinzer 20-Dec-17
Redheadtwo 20-Dec-17
Redheadtwo 20-Dec-17
Rock 23-Dec-17
Bowriter 24-Dec-17
rattling_junkie 24-Dec-17
Stekewood 24-Dec-17
Bowriter 24-Dec-17
rattling_junkie 24-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 25-Dec-17
Rock 25-Dec-17
Pat Lefemine 25-Dec-17
walking buffalo 25-Dec-17
Ambush 25-Dec-17
TD 27-Dec-17
Irishman 27-Dec-17
TrapperKayak 27-Dec-17
TrapperKayak 27-Dec-17
SteveB 27-Dec-17
Missouribreaks 27-Dec-17
From: Ambush
18-Dec-17
Well, it's now official. The provincial government has announced that there will be no more grizzly hunting in British Columbia for residents or non-residents, except for native Indians. If you have a hunt booked for next year, you're not going.

The government readily admitted that is has nothing to do with science or sustainability and that hunting did not threaten viability. People just didn't like! So once again a disconnected bunch of SJW's have pushed their moral agenda onto the rest of us.

From: lineman21
18-Dec-17
I don't like liberals and their agenda so can we get rid of that too?

From: skull
18-Dec-17
“”””EXCEPT for native Indians”””””” Things like this they make me really angry

From: smarba
18-Dec-17
From now on I have chosen to identify myself as a native american woman. I'm planning to hunt them next spring :o)

From: Pat Lefemine
18-Dec-17
The ripple effects will be terrible. Expect grizzly hunt prices to go up everywhere else.

Sad. After four hunts My only grizzly was shot in BC. Incredible hunt.

They’re not done. This victory will renew their efforts to erode sport hunting one species at a time.

From: smarba
18-Dec-17
I did not mean to be flippant. This is a huge setback.

From: Ambush
18-Dec-17
The have shouted loud and clear that black bears and wolves are next on the list.!! They are drunk and giddy on this victory and plan to press hard for more.

In many ways it’s our own fault as we allowed them to run rough shod over us. We thought, we’ll be polite and reasonable and nobody will hear them. We didn’t bother to engage them at their level and with their tactics.

18-Dec-17
Ok so what's the plan of action. What do the outfitters say? Let's figure it out!

From: Ambush
18-Dec-17
No worries smarba, it’s a common joke here.

There are twenty five guiding territories owned by Indians or Indian bands. They can and very likely will tell this government to go pound sand. Our current governments (at ALL levels) run like scared rats whenever the Indian card is played, so it is possible that someone may be able to buy a hunt from one of the bands.

From: Elkhorn
18-Dec-17
Some of them now run grizzly bear viewing excursions, and tell all guests that grizzly hunting needs to stop. I think it costs $400/person and they take like a hundred people through there every day. These are very vocal aboriginal people.

From: Ambush
18-Dec-17
Elkhorn, that is nine very small bands on the south coast, bought and paid for by the enviro-lobbyists WWF, Sierra Club, Raincost etc.. There are a few paid off band spokesmen.

An interesting statistic they don’t want you to know. The mortality rate, in that small chunk of coast, from bear viewing is the same as what hunting was. The sows and cubs are driven off the prime estuaries and food by over zealous bear lovers.

From: BMG2
18-Dec-17
Sad day indeed. Took Ontario a very long time to get a spring black bear hunt back and even now it is not how it was. Don't ever think govt's give a hoot about outfitters. Not enough votes to bat an eyelid at..

From: stealthycat
18-Dec-17
it can be changed back quickly enough if the sportsman of BC banded together IMO

ARA's are just more determined to ruin hunting than hunters are to save it ... more often than not anyway

From: Sage Buffalo
18-Dec-17
How much grizzly hunting was being done before this?

18-Dec-17
How long do you think it will be before we hear of the first grizzly mauling?

18-Dec-17
Many hunters on this board are against guided hunts, they should be happy. This is not good for hunting, sad day for BC.

18-Dec-17
An expected and disappointing decision by this government.

That was a pretty low blow Missouribreaks. And yet some truth to it.

If BC offered non-outfitted NR access to hunt Grizzly Bears, there would have been a huge increase in out of province support to keep the season open.

From: Owl
18-Dec-17
"B.C. Forests Minister Doug Donaldson said public consultations have made it clear that killing grizzlies cannot be allowed, with the exception of First Nations who hunt for treaty rights or for food, social and ceremonial reasons.

"It is no longer socially acceptable to the vast majority of British Columbians to hunt grizzly bears," Donaldson said Monday. "That's the message.""

- The rationale is frightening. If it's not 'socially acceptable' to kill a G bear, BC folks will all be forced to eat tofu and falafel... all except aboriginals (good for them, by the way). Tell me what objective claim to their history and connection to earth do aboriginals have that no one else can rightfully claim? Man, that's the very definition of racism. And liberals are the "fair ones" amongst us... This whole situation is depraved.

From: BIG BEAR
18-Dec-17
This is bad.... one thing you can do is join bear hunting organizations here in the states... Michigan Bear Hunters, Wisconsin, Minnesota, etc

From: Franklin
18-Dec-17
Boycott Canada....I don`t hunt Canada for the nonsense that goes there. They obviously don`t want you to hunt there.

From: skull
18-Dec-17
Times have changed. Way back when the original treaties were signed the FN tribes were self sustaining for the sizes they were. Living off the land was their way and the land/environment kept their population numbers at a balance, This is what happens when you give someone the sense of entitlement, they think the fish and animals were put on the earth for them alone, I do believe there are 634 different FN tribes in Canada. Which tribe was here first and which one came last? Does the first tribe get more rights then the last tribe? Canada is a divided nation in many regards. We have Canadians, we have FN, we have Quebecers, and we have immigrants. There seems to be SPECIAL laws and privileges for each but not for all, We need one Canada for all Canadians with one set of laws.

From: Surfbow
18-Dec-17
You know, I went to Canada once when I was 16, it was ok. After this, and all the baloney with Caribou hunting I am really struggling to find any reason at all to visit Canada again. I'm glad we own Alaska, I'll spend my dollars there...

From: Pat Lefemine
18-Dec-17
Feel sorry for Babine. They ran Grizzly hunts. They also do wolf. I imagine that’s next. Maybe goats and sheep soon too. The doors open now. The progressives won’t stop.

A lesson for all of us. This is not just a Canada thing.

From: Medicinemann
19-Dec-17
Speaking of Babine.....where is their annual trapline thread?

From: BIG BEAR
19-Dec-17
It's up and running.... keep looking.....

From: Medicinemann
19-Dec-17
Got it!!

19-Dec-17
Inow live in Saskatchewan but was born and raised in BC as of lately have spent a lot of time hunting with my son who lives in Northern Alberta,where grizzlys have been banned for quite a few years now .In the last two years our moose and Elk huts have been totally ruined by wolf and Grizzly predation>One of my sons best buddys friend was severly mauled by a grizzly two years ago.If he had a side arm he could have greatly reduced his mauling hes lucky to be alive .This year I called a grizzly while Moose calling for my son .A large group have no said screw the govt. and all the native BS rights well be taking matters into our own hands .My cousins in BC while Moose hunting have had severe encounters with grizzlys that were life threatening.The stupid politicians have no idea of the numbers out there even in the farmland country where grizzlys run rampart.Don't even get me on oboriginal hunting and the wanted waste and proliferation of wildlife they incur many closed seasons here in Sask.by there unwanted slaughter of wildlife .The BC and Alberta govts are so out of tune its ridiculous.

From: thedude
19-Dec-17
The pathology of liberal "progressives" continues.

19-Dec-17
Crazy stuff. Humans have come so far from what we are.

From: TGbow
19-Dec-17
Remember, with Liberalism common sense doesn't apply.

From: Ambush
19-Dec-17
Quote walking buffalo: "If BC offered non-outfitted NR access to hunt Grizzly Bears, there would have been a huge increase in out of province support to keep the season open."

There is a lot of truth in this statement, and not only for grizzlies. There is room for non-resident draws on every species available in BC.

From: Franklin
19-Dec-17
Who offers NR non- outfitter Grizzly hunts??? ...we don`t even offer that in Alaska to fellow Americans.

From: DL
19-Dec-17
Welcome to BC, the California of Canada.

19-Dec-17
Franklin,

In a way, Alaska does through Next of Kin licensing.

The point is that with the future of hunting under attack around the world, the hunting community needs to support each other in order to face this threat. Divided into small entities, "we" are easy pickings, especially in the world of "social license".

Most people, including hunters, couldn't give two..... unless they have some skin in the game. That's just a natural fact.

If ALL jurisdictions made a portion of ALL hunt-able species available to Non Residents, ALL hunters might take more notice of these lost opportunities outside of their homeland. The effect maybe enough that "WE" could change an outcome.

From: Pat Lefemine
19-Dec-17
Go on Facebook and you’ll see the bashing on many extreme trophy hunts like grizzly, leopard, wolf and elephants—-by fellow hunters.

We’re doomed if this nonsense continues.

Social media is fueling this. These governments see the viral outrage and are swayed by online pressure. It’s happening in every aspect of society because of these platforms; race, gender, guns, and now hunting. We’re all asleep at the wheel as progressive adversaries build power by using online social platforms that intimidate politicians and businesses. I’ve never been more concerned about the future of hunting than I am right now.

19-Dec-17
Pat - I never have been on face book in my life, do not even know what Twitter is really, and do not care too, but you are right on the money,,,, this is the only social media I am on,,,,,,

I will never hunt elephants, but they only survive, from the dollars of those that do hunt them,,,, I have no idea, of why a hunter would bash that,,,,,,

Grizzlies have no fear of man in the lower 48, and a season is needed here,,,,, Wow, that is crazy, but remember, it is a different country,,,,,

It shows why we need to stand together here, and not put up with bad state legislation, when it comes to hunting,,,,,, Wisconsin is far from perfect, but it is what I call an involved state.

It has a spring hearing for citizens to vote on resolutions, it has a Natural Resource Board, it has hundreds of conservation groups,,,,, they might not always be right, but they pack hearings, and let their feelings known, ,,,,,, even each county as a deer committee,,,,, lots of fireworks, but that is good, to stay engaged,,,,,,

It is needed everywhere,,,,, I have said it for years, the anti hunters are a well organized, well oiled machine, obtaining a lot of money behind them, and gaining ground all the time......

From: venison
19-Dec-17
I don't do Facebook , why do fellow hunters bash other types of hunting ? Are they jealous ? They don't understand these grizzly , leopard, wolf and elephants need to be hunted also ? Do they think these trips are expensive and they choose not to participate so its cool to jump on the anti bandwagon ? I love hunting and I may never get to hunt any of these animals , but I would like to have my options open to do so , if I choose to . What can the average guy do Pat to help stop this anti-hunting agenda or are we helpless and its just the way its going to be ?

From: Mad Trapper
19-Dec-17
As much as it pains me to admit it, Pat is spot on. It is not just a Canadian problem. We have it right here in the good old US. Look at the polar bear situation. Look at the lion and elephant situations. Just watched a 60 minutes special on rhinos. In general, it was about trapping and transferring rhinos to protect them from poaching. That is a good thing. However, they failed to mention that most of the funding for such actiivites likely comes from hunter dollars. The do gooders don't fund conservation. We do. We need to stick together and be very mindful of how our actions (on-line and off) appear to the non-hunting public. Like it or not, they will control our ability to continue to hunt. Wringing our hands and complaining about it won't do any good. It all begins with each of us. If you are not a member of SCI, Wild Sheep, RMEF, NWTF, etc. you are not helping our cause. You can continue to sit on the sideline and bitch and watch it slowly slip away. We are either moving forward or slipping backward. There is no standing still. My two cents.

19-Dec-17
Unfortunately, some hunters right here on Bowsite bash hunting with guides and outfitters. Threads this week portrayed the divisiveness.

The situation in BC did not happen overnight, there have been discussions about this for years. Similar situations are happening right here in the United States, better take note. The former great elk hunting area of Missouri Breaks of Montana is headed towards developing into a National Park. Yet,.... the concept is continually backed by city hunters with a Liberal agenda who have no vision for thirty years down the road, or even care to attend the town meetings. From afar, they simply hate BLM grazing, Outfitting, and private ranch owners so a no (or limited twenty year promise of hunting) Park looks good to them. The haves vs the liberal have nots , causing division amongst hunters and eventually loss for all hunting. This liberal agenda is real and is happening in many states, not just California and Montana.

From: njbuck
19-Dec-17
Its an absolute shame that this has happened. Unfortunately I believe that it is just the tip of the ice berg. The door is open and we all know that if you give a liberal an inch they will take a mile. This decision is only going to make them push harder to get more areas/species closed to hunting. They do not care that the bears and wolves are eating all the moose and elk, they are happy with it cause it will further limit hunting for those species. Unfortunately instead of coming together, we hunters fight amongst ourselves and rip each other down which only helps the anti hunters agenda.

For some hunting is going out on the back 40 and hunting local whitetail, and for others its traveling to the ends of the earth chasing species that 99% of people will never see. Neither is right or wrong but we need to stick together to preserve all our rights to hunt. With grizzly in BC, caribou in Quebec, Lion banned in CA, Arizona is now trying to bad Lion hunting. Hunting unfortunately is only going to get more limited and thus more expensive. If you want to go chase some of these more exotic species, one thing is for certain, go do it NOW cause tomorrow is not guaranteed.

From: Franzen
19-Dec-17
This really is assinine. Yep it's mis-spelled. It really seems odd to me that a country (province) with such large expanses of wilderness would do such things, but it just goes to show what can happen when city liberals gain all the power. Locals are forced to take it upon themselves to control things and become "lawbreakers". Really sad.

Some speak of the divide within the hunting ranks above, ironically one who would likely be seen as very divisive. Let's not live in fantasyland and pretend there is a side of innocents. Many with money or less-than-stellar financial skills don't care that they drive up prices for hunting, thus pushing the average joe out. Just watch any thread on here where increased costs are discussed and how many simply state it is more for them when someone gets pushed out. Outfitters have played a major role over the course of the last many years as well, so lets not pretend there is no reason or justification for the divide. I myself have simply come to terms with the way things are... don't hate outfitters but don't really like what hunting has become either.

19-Dec-17
the grand plan of these people all across north america is to get the predator population high enough to get rid of us hunters.

19-Dec-17
Hunters are the ones paying the money for Outfitters, not the other way around. Hunters have created the market for outfitters, therefore hunters are the problem, not Outfitters. As I mentioned earlier, I have hired outfitters as I desired to hunt Alaska sheep and brown bear and Africa where guiding was the law of the land. Outfitters are not the cause of the downfall of hunting, you can blame Liberal Dem hunters and voters for that.

19-Dec-17
Kentuckbowhnter has it correct, too bad many hunters miss that concept, even right here in Montana. Ballot box game management is the Liberal's Ace card, another concept I cannot believe so many hunters endorse.

From: Ollie
19-Dec-17
BC has lots of grizzlies! Sad day for hunters. Looks like Elizabeth Warren is the only person who will qualify for the BC grizz hunt.

From: APauls
19-Dec-17
More hunters definitely would have joined in to fight if we were allowed to hunt there. Sad how as a Canadian resident I can't even hunt Canada. Meanwhile all of Canada can come hunt my backyard.

From: Ambush
19-Dec-17
quote missouribreaks: "Hunters have created the market for outfitters, therefore hunters are the problem,"

I will only speak to BC and here your statement is incorrect. Guiding territories were initiated many decades ago to give locals (usually farmers, trappers, loggers) the ability to subsidize their incomes and stay "on the land". Territories were allotted for free.

That has evolved into what we have today. There are still some small operations and some bigger, multi generational outfits. Like all businesses we have some great ones that give very good value and we have a few on the opposite end. But there emerged the big money business model. Foreign owned and money'd and using the association to further their interests through political leverage. The Guide Outfitters Association of BC was soon run by an elite executive seeking to increase the value of territories that were already out of the reach of any average BC resident.

Not all outfitters are represented by the GOAoBC and some members certainly do not agree with their methods or objectives. The GOAoBC drove a massive wedge between them and resident hunters before the last election.

The GOAoBC has lobbied hard to cancel the Hunter Host Program where a licence'd BC resident can host another Canadian or other direct relative from anywhere in the world. They will never allow unguided hunting.

Then we have the selfish, myopic resident hunters that want to keep "their" wildlife all to themselves. They rant and rail against "fat, lazy, rich foreigners coming here and shooting our game!" They are an embarrassment. If you put forth the idea that BC should allow draws for non-residents, the knives come out and blood flows, then they go home believing they have "saved their heritage".

There is simply no defensible reason the BC couldn't offer a number of draws for Stone sheep or goats. There could be thousands of black bear draws, particularly in the spring. We have thousands of square miles of lightly hunted land and spreading a few more hunters out there would have little to no impact.

But no, we wanted it all for ourselves!! And now we find ourselves loosing it and no one outside of our little world cares or wants to help. Surprise, surprise!!

Anti hunting org's are international and draw support and money from around the world. Meanwhile we clutch our greedy little fingers tightly around the local scraps that are left and snarl at any other hunter that glances our way. Looking to the future, I sometimes don't mind being old.

From: TSI
19-Dec-17
A house divided can not stand

From: Ambush
19-Dec-17
Apauls, if there is something in BC you'd really like to experience, let me know. Almost zero chance you'll get a sheep permit, but everything else is on the table.

From: Franzen
19-Dec-17
I don't know whether the chicken or the egg came first, but I do know both are required for the existence of the species. Missouribreaks, you are a sterling example for why there is and will continue to be a divide.

19-Dec-17
My simple point was this,....... if hunters such as me would stop hiring outfitters, there would be no outfitting industry. It is in error when hunters blame outfitters for ruining hunting, outfitters are merely a tool used by hunters such as me. There is no game on earth I have to hunt, I simply elect to and sometimes it requires outfitting.

Lots bigger problems than worrying about Outfitters.

From: air leak
19-Dec-17
Ambush..

"quote missouribreaks: "Hunters have created the market for outfitters, therefore hunters are the problem," I will only speak to BC and here your statement is incorrect. Guiding territories were initiated many decades ago to give locals (usually farmers, trappers, loggers) the ability to subsidize their incomes and stay "on the land". Territories were allotted for free.

That has evolved into what we have today. There are still some small operations and some bigger, multi generational outfits. Like all businesses we have some great ones that give very good value and we have a few on the opposite end. But there emerged the big money business model. Foreign owned and money'd and using the association to further their interests through political leverage. The Guide Outfitters Association of BC was soon run by an elite executive seeking to increase the value of territories that were already out of the reach of any average BC resident.

Not all outfitters are represented by the GOAoBC and some members certainly do not agree with their methods or objectives. The GOAoBC drove a massive wedge between them and resident hunters before the last election.

The GOAoBC has lobbied hard to cancel the Hunter Host Program where a licence'd BC resident can host another Canadian or other direct relative from anywhere in the world. They will never allow unguided hunting.

Then we have the selfish, myopic resident hunters that want to keep "their" wildlife all to themselves. They rant and rail against "fat, lazy, rich foreigners coming here and shooting our game!" They are an embarrassment. If you put forth the idea that BC should allow draws for non-residents, the knives come out and blood flows, then they go home believing they have "saved their heritage".

There is simply no defensible reason the BC couldn't offer a number of draws for Stone sheep or goats. There could be thousands of black bear draws, particularly in the spring. We have thousands of square miles of lightly hunted land and spreading a few more hunters out there would have little to no impact.

But no, we wanted it all for ourselves!! And now we find ourselves loosing it and no one outside of our little world cares or wants to help. Surprise, surprise!!

Anti hunting org's are international and draw support and money from around the world. Meanwhile we clutch our greedy little fingers tightly around the local scraps that are left and snarl at any other hunter that glances our way. Looking to the future, I sometimes don't mind being old."

Well said.

Hunters are our own worst enemy..

You see it right here, and on the most elitist of them all, AT...which I haven't been on in years..can't stand that site..

Hunters whinning about other hunters that shoot does and small bucks...to them it should be mature bucks only..

Hunters whinning about others using crossbows..

Hunters whinning about gun hunters...

Hunters whinning about baiting...

Some guys will whine about anything...

Sometimes, it comes back to bite them.

19-Dec-17
I support many forms of hunting, including Outfitting, food plotting, baiting bear and even crossbows for all during non bowhunting seasons. I would not call that divisive, but if you insist, all is well with me.

From: Bowriter
19-Dec-17
I predict that quite soon, all bear hunting will be banned. I have a good friend, an outdoor writer in BC and he said this was coming, quite a while ago. The current government is in favor of banning all sport hunting in BC.

From: TSI
19-Dec-17
All areas where the vast majority of voters live in metropolitan areas and are liberal based diverse ethnic populations culturally do not hunt or do not hunt for social reasons are doomed to have hunting taken away from the rural communities that do have a hunting heritage. This is why Ontario lost its spring bear and why BC lost Grizzly hunts.The natives are protected from non native laws this They will eventually be the only group allowed to harvest from the wild.Biggest looser is the Outfitter not the individual hunter. Other ethnically diverse areas with no heritage of hunter gatherer will follow suit .

From: stealthycat
19-Dec-17
I cannot help but think if all the sportsmen in BC banded together - and for a few years stopped buying all licenses and financially crushed that part of the hunting industry/Gov/however they run their Game and Fish commissions ...... this would change

They just outlawed grizzly hunting - yet there will be no negative affects from it. Hunters and sportsman won't boycott, they won't threaten backlash in any shape or form really.

That's the problem - fighting back, its just not what hunters and sportsman do and that's sad and it'll be the death of hunting IMO.

Next they'll take moose or sheep or goat ............ and when they do then what? Nothing, not much

I hope I'm wrong -

From: Ambush
19-Dec-17
Heck, some hunters can’t even stand how others hold their arms in pictures!!!

From: skull
19-Dec-17
“”Missouribreaks“”outfitters are merely a tool used by hunter When Ministry Natural resources give certain area to an outfitter do you understand what that means ? Do you know the outfitter responsibility he has for the area ? Apparently the way you talk you don’t know anything about it

From: TSI
19-Dec-17
Hunters just can not get enough votes compared to metropolitan Centers!BC is a hot bed for liberal policy it was a matter of time.Boycotts would only help achieve the end of hunting in some places. There will be places that easily retain a hunting heritage and should for a long time.

From: elk yinzer
19-Dec-17
I don't agree at all that we have to join hands and sing kumbaya and defend a guy that spends $100k so he can have a grizzly bear hide. The locals that have to deal with predator overpopulation have those bloodlusty conquistadors to thank. We can whine about the liberals all we want, or we can look in the mirror and realize that many forms of trophy hunting defy the norms and mores of modern society. We know bears, lions, wolves, etc. need to be killed somehow, but the strategies in place clearly aren’t working. It hasn’t been working for a long time, and it is only going to get worse. If you don’t recognize that, you are as delirious as the SJWs that are giving us a beatdown in some of these battles. I’ll join hands and sing kumbaya with yinz as soon as you figure out how to make high $$$ trophy hunts not look so perversely bloodlusty. Flame away but those are the facts as I see them.

Different topic but it keeps reappearing here.....I’ll never bash guides or outfitters as a whole. May not be my cup of tea but I have no problem with guys that use the service. But I sure will make my feelings known when they are given preferential access to public land or tag allocations. That’s just an anti-American, unacceptable welfare program.

19-Dec-17
Sorry Skull. I was not referencing Canada, but rather the US. I should have been more clear and stayed on track with the Canadian situation, not the mess here in the US.

From: Ambush
19-Dec-17
Stealthy, nearly all the revenue from hunting, in BC, go into general revenue and very little is returned to wildlife. The governments quite frankly don’t give a shit about wildlife and even less about hunters and fishermen. If the wild salmon all die, then there is no impediment to damming the rivers. If wildlife populations all crash, then you can close all hunting and let industry rape the land. And with nothing to hunt, why do people need guns? Take those to.

The health of wildlife is at the very bottom of the list for our government. Their approach is to “manage to zero” then there is no annoying nagging from a rag tag bunch of throwbacks to do something about it.

From: Bowriter
19-Dec-17
Here is a quote from one of my friends columns:

When the BC NDP government banned trophy grizzly bear hunting, but allowed hunting grizzlies for meat. I didn't believe them and I said so on numerous occasions. Only to be told that I overact. Well, I hate to tell you, BUT I told you so. Here it is, the NDP just issued a total ban on all grizzly bear hunting. I will make another prediction. Banning black bear hunting will be next on the list. How do I know? Because the anti-hunting groups told the NDP government that they want trophy grizzly bear hunting banned. When it happened they said; "...this is a important first step to ban ALL grizzly bear hunting. When we achieved that, we will lobby the NDP government to ban all bear hunting period." Remind me next year to tell you. "I told you so!" ;) Instead of hunters squabbling among each other about little things, such as who killed the biggest buck or what rifle caliber is better than another one, we should focus more on issues that really matter. Like a corrupt government, in the pocket of anti-hunters, banning one hunting opportunity after another one to gain votes from the urban society." by Othmar Vohinger

19-Dec-17
I sometimes wonder about our whole approach to these attacks on hunting and our rights. My inclination is to discuss the facts and biology of game management and the success of the North American Model, utilizing logic and a calm demeanor. Hunters are a small percentage of the population. We need to sway the non-hunters, not the anti-hunters. Right?

That's my nature and has been my method, but maybe we're wrong and should learn from what goes on around us.

We're a small percentage of the population... So what?

Depending on the source, homosexual, bisexual and transgender individuals combined total 4-8% of the population. Their agenda is everywhere I look. It's pervasive in urban areas... heck, in my kids' schools. Did they make these inroads with logical, fact-based arguments that focus on the science, benefit and success of their culture?

No. They did not.

They went obnoxiously public with parades, protests and an assault on the media and pop culture.

We worry about having an animal visible during transport. They march in downtown Chicago wearing assless leather chaps.

We admonish each other to be sure that any hero shots are sanitized. They strip off their clothes and perform and pantomime for news cameras during "Pride" parades.

Who's method has been more effective?

I'm growing weary of the expectation that I should explain, apologize and sanitize my culture for others. Screw them.

PeTA garnered a lot of attention with activists throwing red paint on women wearing furs. Maybe some of these anti-hunting politicians should get something dumped on them to highlight that they're douchebags, something appropriately symbolic and poetic.

Just a thought that doesn't fit in with the season.

I hope that this can be reversed in the future like Ontario's bear season.

From: BIG BEAR
19-Dec-17

From: stealthycat
19-Dec-17
Ambush - if its true that the money doesn't matter then hunting is lost for BC and maybe other provinces of Canada too.

This year grizzly, next moose, then deer and small game etc.

From: Ambush
19-Dec-17
Wolf and black bear are next on the list. Then other “Trophy” species.

From: Pat Lefemine
19-Dec-17
Orionsbrother, I’m already there. I’m tired of being PC and worried that some suburban housewife will be turned off. I’m tired of hiding the fact that we get satisfaction from taking animals. And I’m really tired of pretending that we don’t like big antlers or hiding from the fact that while hunting for meat is fine, setting goals (ie trophy hunting) is nothing to be ashamed of. When we behave as if there is something wrong with trophy hunting we invite these closures. Nobody can argue grizzly hunts, sheep hunts, wolves and other opportunities as anything other than trophy hunting. So we need to stop apologizing for them. Trump proved there’s a silent majority out there who is tired of all the politically correct bullshit. I say we stop acting like a bunch of wusses and hiding behind the fact that humans are the ultimate predator. Embrace it.

From: TSI
19-Dec-17
Fact is in many Canadian jurisdictions wildlife is a liability for government.Revenues from licenses sold totals less than the expenses to manage hunting so the loss of hunting isn’t a worry for politicians.In metropolitan areas politicians just ignore rural concerns.the strong holds will be in smaller less populated provinces mainly in the north and east.

From: TSI
19-Dec-17
The need for all types of hunting unite as a strong undivided group.”Unite the clans”(William Wallace).

From: elk yinzer
19-Dec-17
Politically correct is putting lucrative price tags on wild animals' trophy body parts (wait I'm sorry, it's "the experience") and trying to whitewash that as conservation. Where the North American Model went wrong is that it banned market hunting for meat but fostered a robust market for trophies.

From: Brotsky
19-Dec-17
I always find it interesting that native tribes are still allowed to hunt in these situations. Why is this? Were we not ALL hunters and gatherers as a species? Has the common populace become that much more civilized than aboriginal peoples? Is this saying that they are still savages? Help me out here....

From: bigswivle
19-Dec-17
Incredible. We had an overwhelmingly successful bear hunter down here in Florida a couple years ago. So what did our state conservation leaders do? Cancel bear season for the foreseeable future. Caved to the anti hunting pressure.

From: TD
19-Dec-17
What orgs cower politicians into the corner with just the thought of being on the wrong side of them? NRA comes to mind. And the pressure and VOTES that such an org can bring to bear. That kind of power and influence is key.

Support and development of orgs like SCI etc. will eventually be the only way to keep our hunting rights. Right now the orgs are split up and spread out. RMEF at one point was almost taking anti-hunter stances as they became watered down with Sierra Club members and those mentalities. B&C, P&Y, state orgs..... all these groups need to align and co-ordinate, maybe under the SCI roof as they seem to have a head start on the lobbying basics we need. Tie in closer to NRA help and tap their skill set and power? The anti-hunters have a head start, but many of these other groups are finding ways to integrate themselves and social media, link up together for a cause. At the speed things work in todays world that is going to be critical. But a good deal of dinosaur DNA in hunters and sportsmen..... could be a fatal flaw.....

IMO more support to these orgs by sportsmen (as well as the sporting goods industry) and better co-ordination among the groups to bring more pressure to bear politically as a unit is going to be the key to the survival of hunting.

Bitching about rich hunters or rich groups or the NRA supporting xbows or any of that other decisive crap will be the downfall. We will have the divisive chronic complainers and the perpetually outraged to thank for it.

Second to blame will be those who are apathetic and don't see nor care care to see the bigger picture..... they get to hunt their deer a few days a year and that is fine with them. Nothing is going to change for them as they see it and even if it did..... no big deal.

Bringing those two groups into the mix..... gonna be tough.....

From: Bowriter
19-Dec-17
I quit being PC many years ago. Yet, when I admonish people to say "Kill" instead of harvest, I get laughed at. I wonder how many know how that harvest crap got started? I saw it happen and railed against it then. I wonder how many gut animals and how many field dress? Anyone know when that got started? I said that was stupid, too. I said both those phrases insulted the intelligence of the non-hunter. I was laughed at...on this site and less than a year ago. There is a huge difference between being PC and being cognizant of non-hunter feelings. Rubbing their nose in the gut pile is not a good idea. It is the non-hunter we must convince. Forget the anti-hunter. It is the trophy and trophy picture we must be careful with, not the picture of a dead animal. It is anti hunting which starts a lot of the adverse action but it is the non-hunting voter that gets it passed. Never make the mistake of thinking common sense or logic or science is even considered. It never enters into it. Only in some areas do economics become a factor. We elect idiots and then we are surprised when they do idiotic things. Any "working" outdoor writer with half a brain can see these coming. We warn about it and year after year, even the hardcore hunters, ignore us. If you don't believe me, just go back 10-years and look at the pictures and then, compare them to the pictures posted just on this site in the last month. Do they still rub the nose of the non-hunter in the gut pile? Does the latch on the tailgate still get broken every fall? Is trophy hunting still the main line of 90% of the topics we discuss? (Note-I am talking generally, not this site specifically.) How many hunting TV shows would be on without the killing of "trophies"? No question, can't even be debated. Television outdoor programming is the best and by far, the worst thing to ever happen to hunting. And yet we not only allow it, we support it. Oh sure, we'll quit watching football when some NFL player kneels during the National Anthem. But we won't quit watching some "grip and grin" idiot gut shoot an animal them brag about what a Swamp Donkey he just gave a dirt nap. You should not have gotten me started. :)

From: britfan
19-Dec-17
It is great timing to banning all grizzly hunting in BC, right after the government decided to go ahead on the site C dam. Me thinks the BC coalition government had to cow tow to the 3 green party members leader Andrew Weaver. All of the governing politicians, with the exception of one, come from the populated Liberal lower mainland of BC which includes the Island. Now the pricks want to change the voting laws to help them stay in power.

From: britfan
19-Dec-17
It is great timing to banning all grizzly hunting in BC, right after the government decided to go ahead on the site C dam. Me thinks the BC coalition government had to cow tow to the 3 green party members leader Andrew Weaver. All of the governing politicians, with the exception of one, come from the populated Liberal lower mainland of BC which includes the Island. Now the pricks want to change the voting laws to help them stay in power.

19-Dec-17
The problem with "uniting" hunters is that there are those of us, like those on Bowsite, for which hunting is a way of life and exceptionally important in their lives. Most hunters hunt less than a week per year and only hunt for deer. Their "gig" is not almost up. White tail, mule deer, and birds will be the last thing that the antis go after. But there's not much support for fighting for things like bear and lion seasons. Not that many people hunt them and not that many people care.

From: HDE
19-Dec-17
Anytime tribal interests get involved - lookout. You're fixin' to lose something...

From: Stekewood
19-Dec-17
And the good old Humane Society of the US is sponsoring a proposed ballot initiative that would ban the hunting of mountain lions and bobcats in Arizona........ It may not get on the ballot this year but eventually it will and that's a scary proposition.

19-Dec-17
I wish Ted Nugent would chime in....................

19-Dec-17
Bowriter,,, you make good points but without paragraphs, you make hard reading

19-Dec-17
Rick and others, your idea has been practiced by several highly known people already. Nugent being the most poplar. It has been stated by many hunters that he is bad for hunting. Yet, I see no one in the liberal media that will call him out on his choice to be one. Because he makes no apologies for it and, refuses to live by the politically correct rules. Instead he tactfully but, in no misundertsandings tells them he doesn't agree nor will he apologize for it.

I too believe that is the right approach. We need to be well mannered but, ready to call BS on the notion that we are doing something wrong. People find weakness where it is exhibited. This is no different. Stand strong and stand for what we do. Or, we won't be doing it for long.

This movement has been going on for a long time. And, there intent is as stated above. There will no longer be a need for human hunters if they are replaced in the ecosystem. A chip at a time they are winning because we are letting them win.

God Bless men

From: TSI
19-Dec-17
Seems the poll was 3 days and a very small number of persons mainly not hunters and picked by the poll sponsors (animal rights groups like PETA)

From: skull
19-Dec-17
There you go Dave

B.C. is ending the grizzly bear hunt throughout the entire province.

First Nations still will be able to harvest grizzly bears in accordance with Aboriginal rights for food, social, or ceremonial purposes, or treaty rights.

Forests Minister Doug Donaldson said the decision came about during the ministry's consultation process on implementing the end of the trophy hunt, first announced in August.

"It's mostly a social values issue," Donaldson said. "When it comes down to it, this species is seen as an iconic species for B.C., and people just weren't willing to accept the hunting of grizzly bears anymore in this province."

According to Donaldson, 78 per cent of almost 4,200 respondents called for an end to the hunt altogether.

Follows August trophy hunt ban

Donaldson said the consultation process also involved face-to-face meetings with hunting associations, guide outfitters and First Nations. He said his government is committed to allowing other forms of hunting to continue.

In August 2017 the province announced it would end the trophy hunting of grizzly bears and stop all hunting of grizzly bears in the Great Bear Rainforest.

Those changes came into effect on Nov. 30, 2017.

Donaldson said there will be further discussions with guide outfitters in the province about how the government can support the transition away from grizzly hunting. Outfitters in B.C. charge upward of $17,000 for a guided grizzly hunting tour.

A report from the auditor general's office earlier this year found that the province has not been effectively managing B.C.'s grizzly population. It also found that the biggest threat to grizzlies is habitat loss, not hunting. Donaldson said ending the hunt will actually help to address that problem.

"A really good outcome of this decision is that we'll have more resources to monitor grizzly bear populations, as well as habitat conservation," Donaldson said. "We won't be focusing those resources strictly on managing a hunt."

There are an estimated 15,000 grizzly bears in B.C

From: Mad Trapper
20-Dec-17
Huh?

20-Dec-17
In a couple years there will be a number of horrific maulings. There will be some public outrage and the government will pay professional hunters to cull bears ultimately spending tax dollars to do what hunters are willing to pay to do.

From: KyleSS
20-Dec-17
Maybe we can make a difference for our fellow hunters in BC

https://www.castanet.net/edition/news-story--11-.htm

Please go vote

From: thedude
20-Dec-17
Need more of the Joe rogan types with a strong social media presence to bridge the gap and bring awareness of how hunting impacts conservation to non hunters.

From: Pigsticker
20-Dec-17
We do not get the anti hunter liberal agenda. We fight it on a case by case bases and we are getting our bits kicked.

Liberals support anti hunters because it’s all part of the platform. Conservatives cannot get their messaging right because they view everything as independent actions and not the interconnected web that liberals have built from bottom to top.

Many may ask why make this political and it is not even America and that is the exact reason that why we are condemned to eventually loose the battle.

Ike, said it best in that have lost touch our own reality and that the predator fight is not my fight. This is like many gun owners supporting actions to reduce or limit assault rifles. Lack of insight and understanding that large predators and black rifles is just the first step in the overall plan.

Apathy and lack of rigor in society is allows the malignancy to grow and become lethal to the way we believe and the values are that we hold near and dear.

When I was about 13 I asked my brother who was the best person to have on your side in a fight and he said the guy that wouldn’t run. We want even choose sides until it’s either over or we are knocked down.

My brother also told me that once you get knocked down that it’s a long way back up.

I

From: elk yinzer
20-Dec-17

elk yinzer's Link
I really don't know what to make of this, but it's out there, there a few valid points interspersed with mostly, absolutely putrid bullshit, and it's what we're up against Most people aren't hunters and don't see this the way we do. Pretend you are just some Johnny Hockey watchin the youtubes, and see this, how would it influence you? Objective, hell no. But well-spoken, convincing stuff. We need to be this engaging, this convincing, and present our best side of the argument.

From: elk yinzer
20-Dec-17

elk yinzer's Link
As opposed to the above video, this is absolutely disgusting garbage "hunt footage" if you can even call it that. Thank these guys for your bear hunting ban. This boils my blood just watching it. I could go on and post some more videos like this, I'm sure I could search and find hours worth of garbage content in a short amount of time.

From: elk yinzer
20-Dec-17

elk yinzer's Link
Equally stupid if not worse. From the 0:08 to the 0:45 mark of this should have been edited out of the public version. That is all. Still wouldn't be painting the best picture but at least it's not shooting a hole in the hull of our boat with their 40 seconds of filth. Mind boggling how stupid one has to be to put this on youtube.

From: Redheadtwo
20-Dec-17
And the maulings will be those of us that hunt or possibly fishing,not the ones that should be mauled-the liberals and those that shut the grizzly hunts down.

From: Redheadtwo
20-Dec-17
Watched the last link video. Geez,this guy doesn't even need to shoot targets with a bb gun.

From: Rock
23-Dec-17
If anyone get mauled or killed from now on then there should be a lawsuite filed against the organization that pushed this and also the government for closing it. Seems they should be liable for any issues that this causes.

From: Bowriter
24-Dec-17
Just watched the first video Elk Yinzer posted on Grizz hunting in BC. I don't know who the guy is but he is a professional in front of a camera and he knows/ knew exactly what he was doing.

Although he was comparing apples to oranges in contrasting viewing/hunting, he used valid figures and juggled them in such a way as to prove a point. Here is what I mean. If you were in a debate and asked to defend trophy hunting for an animal where only head-hide-claws were taken...the meat not used, any competent person could tear you, or me, to shreds. And that is exactly what is starting to happen in some areas of the U.S. The anti's are starting to realize the need to sway the non-hunter vote and this is the way.

But understand this. Big, animal rights groups don't care a flip about banning hunting. That cause is for them, just another vehicle to raise money. That is their true cause-raise more money, get more donations so they can pay the management, higher salaries. That does not mean there are not many serious smaller orgs. and individuals who do want to ban hunting. There sure are and they can have some impact.

That video was professionally done...well done, convincing. The figures quoted are probably, to some degree, accurate. They are also juggled. Data is manipulated to prove a hypothesis...all the time. It is happening right in the state in which I live and has been for at least three years.

There are some major problems facing hunters and the first and probably largest is simply that hunters do not truly understand the dynamics or numbers that make up the hunter-non-hunter-anti hunter demographics and how they interact. There are just about the same number of hunters and anti-hunters. Logically, they should then cancel each other out when it comes to a vote. And they would if they voted in equal numbers. They don't. But it is the non-hunter who will and does make the decision. And in terms of swaying the non-hunter vote, it is the anti-hunting, professionally produced material...just like Elk Yinzer's video link #1, that sways them. Not another diatribe from Uncle Ted. Not an in your face confrontation. Not even valid figures that to most non-hunters, don't mean anything. What sways them is a calm, factual explanation of hunting at its' core and what would be lost, should hunting be banned. It must be narrowed down to something they can easily relate to.

If a person has never seen a bear, how do you convince them they need to be controlled. Substitute almost any animal for bear. Now. Where I live, both deer and turkeys have become and are a nuisance. When I first started writing my newspaper column here, 42-years ago, seeing a deer was big news. Now, you cannot have a garden. It is extremely easy for me to sell deer and turkey hunting and population controll to the non-hunter. Last year, a both a bear and a mountain lion were confirmed sighted in my county. Within an hour, I got an email from someone who wanted to ban bear hunting in this county. We have not had an open season on bear here since the area was settled. I know this is a long post and I also know, probably the point I am trying to make is not getting through. Last week, I had a long and infirmative lunch with a person running for a high, elected office. He pointed out just what a segment of hunting is up against and just what the probable, eventual outcome is going to be. Our talk was off the record but it sure made me re-evaluate the way I am going to write some of my columns and for sure, take a second look at all my pictures.

And Rock-think about your post. Although I may agree with your sentiment, by that argument, we should sue automakers and ban motor cycles.

Last item to ponder: Explain why consumptive hunting should not be regulated to non-consumptive, camera use only if the meat is not eaten. Try and argue that in a debate.

24-Dec-17
Elk Yinzer, really disgusting footage? Who's side are you on?

From: Stekewood
24-Dec-17
I don't see anything wrong with the footage either. I wouldn't choose to share it on YouTube but it pretty much just shows it as it is.

From: Bowriter
24-Dec-17
rattling junkie- There is no doubt whose side he is on. He is simply giving examples of what hunting is up against. Failure to understand that one factor is one of the biggest dangers of hunting, today. As long as we make footage like that public, we cannot even staunch the blood flow from the wound in our foot. Every day, on public forums footage like that and disgusting pictures are made available to the anti-hunter and turning the minds of the non-hunter.

24-Dec-17
Bowriter- elk yonder is using terms such as "disgusting garbage" is clear he is not on the hunting side. What do you think killing an animal looks like? I guess our society doesn't want to see reality but rather be hooked on video games and porn.

25-Dec-17
There are voters who accept hunting but who do not care to watch it. The same is true of porn,...... if you think about it.

From: Rock
25-Dec-17
Bowriter, I understand what you are saying and am totally against all the lawsuit these days. But I do believe that a good case could be made (by the right lawyer) that the Anti's and government are at least partially responsible and should be held accountable for there actions.

From: Pat Lefemine
25-Dec-17
I’m not making this statistic up. 5 billion YouTube videos are watched on average in a single day. Over 300 hours of video are uploaded every minute. If anyone thinks a housewife in San Diego is going to stumble on the videos above you are kidding yourself.

I’m also in the camp of guys who checked out the links and didn’t really see anything other than a real life hunt. The kill is often not pretty but neither is the way my Christmas prime rib actually gets to my table. Maybe we should produce a video on the process for Starbucks coffee, or organic tofu, or coach bags. I’m sure liberals would be appalled at the migrant and child labor used for these yuppie necessities. Get real.

25-Dec-17
Censorship of what is currently considered "disgusting garbage" will simply make the next "Less disgusting" video the target for this anti-hunting campaign.

The abolition of ALL hunting, which includes hunting pictures and videos ARE the target.

This really needs to be understood.

As an example, the BC government actually used the potential for "Trophy Photos" to be a deciding factor in their decision to ban Grizzly hunting.

A statement from the BC Green Party leader ( NDP and Green Alliance government) in explaining the reasoning for their new Grizzly Bear hunting ban.

"The government said in August it would ban “trophy hunting” of grizzly bears but still allow a “meat hunt,” meaning hunters could still bag a grizzly as long as they harvested the animal’s meat but not its head or hide.

Anti-hunting critics called it a loophole.

“A hunter could still take a photo with a dead bear,” Green party Leader Andrew Weaver pointed out. “In the Instagram age, that’s the most sought-after trophy.”"

From: Ambush
25-Dec-17
If they can’t find the pics or footage they want, they simply alter one to their liking. And that includes dubbing in stupid talk and maniacal laughter and photo shop.

The hockey player with his grizzly was altered to look like he was holding just a severed head. Now you and I know that no grizzly hunter is going to cut the head off a bear behind the skull and leave the rest. But that is exactly the comments that they left up on their anti hunting sites.

I do believe idiots exhibiting extremely distasteful behaviour is bad for our image. But nearly all the rest is just hunting and does more good, through exposure, than bad.

Make no mistake, we are not our own worst enemies. The anti’s have that position by a huge margin!!

I believe the gloves should come off and hunters should smear and beat down the hardcore anti’s with ruthless aggresion. Expose their lies and publicly counter every untruth they portray.

Only the huge non-hunting public can hand us back our social licence to keep hunting. It’s to them we have to present our case, and that can only be done through a professional and relentless media campaign. Just keeping your hunter’s head down and out of the line of fire will get you buried in no time. Those that think just minding our own business will save hunting are incredibley niave.

From: TD
27-Dec-17
I'm in the "what was wrong with those videos?" camp. Saw nothing more "disgusting" in it than any other hunting video. Actually I though those were fairly respectful? Nobody danced on the bear or anything, they shot it. It was hunting. Because it was a big bear?

Plenty of data to point out all predators have to be managed, big and small..... or prey animals suffer as well. Long wild swings in population dynamics from mismanagement completely unnecessary. Habitat destructive animals as well, elephant hunts come to mind. (and not a morsel of meat nor even bone is wasted from them).

You want a true balance of nature and wildlife in the modern world where they are required to interact, man.... sportsmen actually, have proven over and again they are up to the task and do a pretty great job of it, in reality. Reality meaning no unicorns......

From: Irishman
27-Dec-17
It looks like grizzly bear hunting in Montana is going to be a possibility this coming year, and I will definitely apply for a license if it is. Why? Because I like to hunt, I like the thrill, I like the chase, I like the adventure of it. Not because I want to eat it, or because I want a bear rug, but because I like the adventure. I am totally for grizzly bear hunting, and feel it is needed. However, it is easy for me to understand why in a province like BC that grizzly bear hunting would be banned. First of all, most of the population in BC doesn't hunt, and for the non hunters grizzly bear hunting is hard to understand. Hard to in anyway say that you are doing it for any reason that they would understand as being justifiable.

The subject of outfitters has been brought up on this post, and I tend to agree with the view of some, that outfitters are bad for hunting. The whole business of outfitting, paying large sums of money to kill animals, leaves many with a poor impression of hunting. In Montana this year, I've talked to two people who used outfitters, and both told of stories where wounded elk were not tracked for fear of scaring the herd onto public land. Seems, at least in Montana, that outfitters tend to limit hunting opportunities, by tying up and leasing land, which can't be good for the future of hunting and the future support of hunting by the masses.

The key to long term success in protecting hunting, is to keep it as something that is popular and available to the public.

From: TrapperKayak
27-Dec-17
Ambush, you're right. We shoukd have been more like Trump and less like Obama, and maybe we would have won. And Im not looking to interject politics in this, I am talking strictly in terms of personality. You tell it like it is and stand firm on a commitment, not back down and suck up to the weak, and you will win your case. Ya be strong and solid, not some wimpass placator.

From: TrapperKayak
27-Dec-17
That was in reference to this: '...many ways it’s our own fault as we allowed them to run rough shod over us. We thought, we’ll be polite and reasonable and nobody will hear them. We didn’t bother to engage them at their level and with their tactics...'

From: SteveB
27-Dec-17
Call me crazy, but I failed to see much wrong with the videos? I can see why antis wouldn't like them, but they wouldn't like a kill video under any circumstances.

27-Dec-17
The bear killing videos are what hunting is like, I have killed two grizzlies( one coastal brown). In fact, these videos depict less suffering/wounding than actually occurs with some hunts. These were both pretty clean kills.

Whether we like it or not, public vidoes such as this will lead to fewer non hunting voters supporting hunting. So we have a choice, show the videos to the voting public and accept the fact that some viewers will be turned off and vote against us, or we can only show the videos to our known supporters and fellow hunters, this will not gain us votes, but it will not cost us votes either.

You make the call!

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