Bowsite.com

A hunter can purchase a archery license at full price and then purchase a crossbow license at a reduce price.

Purchasing one or both license will only allow you to harvest one buck total and the antlerless tags for that unit(if any).

Lessor weapon does not apply.

By rule, the seasons are concurrent for two years and then managed independently by the DNR which with Act 21, would take 1-2 additional years to change season dates.

Which license will a CB hunter have to buy if they already had a CB permit previously?

After the two years is up and if changes are made to the length of the season, will these individuals have to hunt the CB season or are they still exempt and able to hunt the normal archery season?

Thx

I have no problem with allowing bow/crossbow hunting during gun season under the lesser weapons rule, in which any such kills must be put on a gun tag, but even that seems foolish unless it's in an area where guns aren't allowed.

We're concerned about deer numbers and quality bucks, yet making it easier for cheats to steal.

A hunter will no longer have to apply for a CB permit as they can purchase a crossbow license.

"After the two years is up and if changes are made to the length of the season, will these individuals have to hunt the CB season or are they still exempt and able to hunt the normal archery season?"

Crossbow supporters reasoned no longer needing a disability permit as a plus for full inclusion or a concurrent crossbow season set by statute. There were concerns from disabled hunters(as a guide for Adaptive Sportsmen, I don't like this term) and hunters over 65 that they would lose if crossbows would eventually shorten both the archery and crossbow season.

By allowing the DNR to manage the season by administrative rule, it allows for Dept to make rules to allow for disabled permits and/or over 65 to use crossbows in the archery season if needed in the future.

This fairly protects hunters with special needs and it should. Like archery hunters, they should not lose their opportunity because of crossbow inclusion.

With the clean slate on here to start the new year (a breath of fresh air) hopefully we can debate this without name-calling or saying some guys aren't bow hunters, etc. We archers have been awarded additional opportunities in recent years, including not having to "give back" the four extra days of bow hunting the week prior to the gun season once the Oct. antlerless hunt was killed, allowing bow hunting during the nine-day gun hunt and new for '14, allowing bow deer hunting the day prior to the gun opener. Many gun-only hunters don't like the "week prior" part, especially, and IMO allowing bows/crossbows in the gun season will end up with more "lead-in" archery/crossbow bucks, esp. if/when we go to online/phone registration.

I'd have no problem with starting archery where it is now (or even Oct. 1; how many early season deer spoil in the warm air?) and ending it the Sunday prior to the gun season, then reopening it after the muzzleloader hunt. Only exceptions would be in non-firearm areas, where bow and crossbow use would continue to be allowed throughout. I know it's not going to happen, but we keep hearing how we're going to protect bow hunting but greed got us here (full inclusion no matter what you want to call it) and continued greed will lead to more losses in the future.

Especially some of the big groups will be doing this, of course with call in registration it won't matter. There will be many "forgotten" deer.

Rutnut, what currently compels hunters to register deer? I would have to think a phone call, online registration or if the dnr was smart a text message Would be much easier than getting in the car and driving to register.

Wait for the dissertation, it won't take long for him to log-on and explain it all to us!

You were the "someone else mentioned cheats" and you injected off topic post to suit your agenda.

Every day I wake up able to make personal decisions on what is right and wrong. Each day laws are there to be broken, possibly for a personal gain. I choose to do what is right.

You imply that removal of speed limit signs on a highway will change human choice of what is right and wrong which will lead to all driver to speed.

Violators will violate regardless of rules and regulations set before them. You imply sportsmen will violate based on easement of regulation. You choose to over regulate a majority of sportsmen for the few violators who will do so regardless of laws and regulations. Sounds like you'd rather live in a country which distrusts it citizens and are policed by the KGB.

Any other comments or questions relating to the OP? Or is this another thread injected with personal agendas?

I believe you did, several times. Trying to portray hunters as law violators/cheats is something you do a lot, which is something I expect from anti-hunters/peta, but since you are neither what is your motive?

Have you guys even checked the latest Warden Wire linked above? If you had, and if you still believe after reading that there are only a "few" violators, you're both sadly mistaken. Since you mentioned speed limit signs, how many speeders get caught vs. speed? Get the picture? We already have cheats, plenty of 'em, and how many not getting caught with thousands of hunters per single warden? You want to make it easier on them by allowing bow and crossbow users to be able to simply call in deer without bringing them in? The deterrent of having someone look at your deer with in-person registration is enough to stop a lot of "lead" bow kills, in my opinion, and when it's not and they bring in their gun-shot deer anyway, or a bow-shot deer and haul a non-hunting "mate" along, a number of violators have been caught that way. Now we're even going to let bow and crossbow hunt deer during the gun seasons; I say we'll see a lot more bucks being put on bow/crossbow tags. Yes, unfortunately, there are a lot of violators among us. I am not portraying "hunters" as cheats, just the violators in our ranks. I don't believe in making it any easier for them, and I certainly don't see in-person registration as "over regulation."

Thanks Naz but this was posted after both of your "cheat" post.

You talk about a new year and "a breath of fresh air", maybe you should be banned as it is proven your hatred of certain individuals clouds your judgement.

Remember, your readers are the majority of law abiding sportsmen/women(or at least I hope). Your attacks on sporting ethics would not sit well with me( if I was a reader of your articles).

Going off topic as this thread apparently has and after watching the Star Wars marathon....Why does Chewabacca shoot a crossbow that shoots lasers? Kind of defeats the purpose as the guns shoot lasers too. If Chewabacca had a bow, would he have to pull it back each time to shoot a laser?

Maybe Hans Solo would not have been frozen in carbonite if he had used a bow as crossbows or guns are heavy and ackward. Or maybe he realized that the time it took for him to pull back(vs lifting and shooting) would have given Darth Vader the time to give him the hand/throat squeeze from a 100 feet away.

Anyway.....any questions regarding the OP questions? Or shall we just point fingers at the "cheats"?

Naz, I am doing my best to remain civil but you of all people know that the law as it was passed is not "full inclusion." For you to continue trying to perpetrate this myth makes you no better than those who you reference with your "clean slate" and "breath of fresh air" comments.

If you want to keep promoting your agenda that is your prerogative but don't be a hypocrite and try painting them in a light any different than the one currently illuminating you.

Naz, I've never had a deer inspected for the proper wound when at a registration station. How does it stop cheats. If a person was going to "cheat" why register at all, phone or in person?

There's no agenda. I am not a cheat either, but again, for you to act like it doesn't happen very often is ludicrous. Read the warden reports in the most recent link and see all the archery-related violations. We need to stop those types for bow hunting to continue to enjoy the 100-plus-day season.

Sorry Geitz, back on topic. Here's some info from Jan. 2 issue of the Green Bay Press-Gazette (posted Jan. 3 on wisconsinoutdoorfun.com). Page 2 has info on the separate licenses and registration and p. 3 has some info on backtags.

rjn, why would a violater bother registering a deer in person or calling it in. There's still the potential for wardens to randomly check call in registrations. In person registration is nothing more than a cultural practice related with deer hunting in wisconsin. I know that in person registration carries special memories and historical importance for a lot of hunters, but to say it reduces violators vs. call in registration just isn't fact. The people that want to break the rules will break them and the people that want to follow them will regardless of the system in place.

Wouldn't you still have an untagged rack laying around after butchering. Plus if you register that doe and a warden came directly to your home after calling in, like I said could easily be done on a random basis, and you have no physical evidence of the doe I think that would be an issue.

Or according to your barstool biologist Van Deelan, we still must significantly reduce deer population in order to save the trees.

What is your concern? Cheaters taking 4,000? Or 40,000? According to your resources, we should have taken at least another 100,000 deer as herd estimation was at 1.5 million according to the "scientists".

Heck, with your thread on severe winters, we should have taken probably another 200,000 deer so the "winter kill" would be less. Cheaters can have a field day and things would be finally managed to "scientists" who you believe in.

So how many of us "cheats" are out there and how many of us non "cheats" will convert to a "cheat" with loosened regs? Your readers want to know.

I understand and appreciate you having a stance/belief or opinion but you cannot stand on both sides of the fence.

Our recommendation to the DNR was to still make in-person registration mandatory if a person wants to earn a buck.

LC, you are a "cheat" by association. We are all guilty until proven innocent. It is quite apparent by the media we are.

Funny.....I hunt on ranches in WY every year. I have my tag and can purchase just about as many doe tags as I want. I cannot tell you how many times the ranchers have told me just to shoot another doe, two or three. I tell them I don't break rules/get busted. They laugh and tell me how well they know the wardens and they would take care of it.

I never took them up on the offer

Never called any Bowsiters cheats, and I've never said "when in doubt keep shooting" but I do believe that anyone who has a lot of antlerless deer in their hunt area (and far fewer bucks) should not worry about killing one or more. In fact, it's called QDM.

Phone/online registration IMO makes it much easier to have someone else tag a deer. No need to bring the "fake" hunter into the registration station. That's just one example. You either get it or you don't. It is what it is.

Geitz, a million deer in Wisconsin is less than two deer per 40 acres of deer range (last I checked they considered WI to have 34K+ square miles of deer range). A whole lot easier to swallow when you think of it that way. 1.5 million deer would be less than three whitetails per 40. Sure some areas have less, but some have a heck of a lot more.

Has anyone been interrogated at a registration station and been asked "did you really shoot that deer?" I've never seen it? If there is a tiny percentage of people that have been caught doing this, I would also bet the majority of times it was a tip given to the warden about the illegal act....versus the lady behind the counter noticing his nervous behavior, like a drug mule bringing dope across the border lol!

Captmike's recommendation to have an in person registration for earning a buck is logical thinking. I assume it is the only way it will be, or else I would then agree that cheating would be easier as phantom antlerless deer would be registered to get a second...third.....buck tag. I hunt in a CWD zone, and assume that in person registration will continue to remain here.

Nope, not an insurance agent.

"you're trying too hard"

Actually, you are. I could start a thread about which flashlights are best for tracking and you inject your belief on in person registration.

As for ease of taging another person deer, how difficult is it to shoot a deer and go back to get another to help track, then have them tag it? The gal at the gas station doesn't know nor does she care.

How many states require in person registration? How many don't require registration at all? I haven't heard their sky fall nor have I heard the massive amount of fines to cheats that have been busted by wardens.

The OP had three questions: "With crossbow season being seperate but running concurrently with archery, can one person buy a license for both then? Or is it one or the other? If you can buy a license both can you crossbow hunt with your bow under the lesser weapon rule?"

Your answer: "My opinion is once online/phone registration is instituted (2015 or '16?) we'll see an increase in "bow and crossbow" buck kills DURING the gun season. I have been against allowing bow deer hunting during the gun season for that reason all along, as it adds to the ease of the cheats who are already out there"

Your post had nothing to do with this thread and you effectively hijacked it with an agenda. Do you have something to ad which answers the OP questions?

This is Bowsite which is "pro" bow hunting. Being anti bow hunting opportunity person, you probably are in a minority on here.

Am certainly not anti-bowhunting, but if you want to keep pretending all is perfect in the Wisconsin archery world carry on.

Based on what Geitz said, and if that is not the way it was meant, I am sorry I misunderstood it. Problem is, perception is reality.

Joke or not, I'll be saving some time and gas money. Not sure how it will allow me to cheat, and I really have no need to considering I'll have a bonus buck tag, an archery buck tag, a gun buck tag, and an Illinois archery buck tag. Come to think of it I'll need the extra time that calling in will save me to even have a chance to harvest 4 bucks.

Before you go giving me an impulsive, knee-jerk answer, please explain using logic.

Before you start, I will make this easier for you. The cheating that happens right now is done by cheaters. Correct? Honest people are honest. Those same honest people use the call in registration for turkey. Right now there is only one thing preventing anyone from cheating.....now, and in the future. It is the moment between affixing their illegal tag, no tag, or someone else's tag to the deer, dragging it to their vehicle, and either taking it home and butchering it, or taking it in and falsifying in some fashion the claim that they or someone else shot that deer. The reason they even register it in the first place is they cannot keep their mouth shut, want to be recognized for killing a deer, or want to show pictures of the kill. If they simply took home the illegally tagged deer and butchered it up, and never said a word, they currently take the exact same risk as before. Once again for the hearing impaired, the only thing stopping the act of cheating, is the risk they take in tagging. If you want to claim that honest men will cheat, then I'm certain they already were cheats.

I cannot understand why this is so difficult to swallow, and have yet to hear an argument that has and weight?

If there was some more latitude in the old way, then it would not have to change.......

Its not a problem for me now, but when you had to drive to hunt your favorite spots, it was to strigent, and here is a typical scenario.....

You shoot a deer on Sun pm, recovered after 6pm. You need to drive to Green Bay to get home. BUT you have to find a registration station. Lets use Florence Co for an example. Okay the only spot in Long Lake is closed. However, on the way home, the station in Crivitz is open. BUT, you are too far out of the DMU..... This never made any sense to me......

Yes you can drive to Florence, but its another 26 miles out of your way. You do it, because you need to, but its not convienent........

Lets explore the lack of common sense from Madison again. I will not name the buisness, but this year, this Florence CO asked to be a deer registration spot. They were denied. The reason: No station can be within 10 miles of another..... Who cares, isn't it about customer service, I guess not..... Same business was also told, that taverns from now on, can not register deer. Those that do now are grandfathered in, I find that strange........

I think that when the new system kicks in, it will be a non issue, just like the xbow.... Cheaters are always going to cheat. Most hunters do not cheat, I have more faith in my fellow hunters.......

No deer herd in the country, has more money spent on the study of that herd. than Wis does. I think the herd will be better served, in putting pressure on our representatives, to cut the woods, and manage for Fed forest better,,,,,,

It will be the same info you fill out now, type of deer DMU taken, type of weapon, private or public, type of conditions.......

Michigan has no problem with their data, and you do not have to go to any station to register station. Like you do not have to wear a back tag, and they have no problem with that either.......

People are afraid of change. If it does not work, they can always go back to the old way, but I think more forward thinking will prevail.....

I'll continue to use the registration station just because of the tradition of it. The place I go likes the business it brings, and the owner comes out to see, take pictures, and post the pictures in his store. It's nice, real people talking face to face, (communicating like humans not digital robots).

"Michigan has no problem with their data, and you do not have to go to any station to register station."

I've hunted Michigan on and off (mostly on) since '88. They don't have a good handle on the deer kill and there's plenty of talk of wanton sharing of tags and unregistered deer. Michigan doesn't rank anywhere near the top in book bucks.

In Michigan you get a little "cooperator patch" if you bring your deer to a check station so DNR can age it. Few hunters do. State checks vehicles with deer on crossing the bridge from U.P. to L.P. and sends out a random mail survey (same place the "data" from their crossbow hunt comes from). That's their science, and the crying of "no deer" gets worse every year.

That digital robots part made my day.

Actually, if all components of the Kroll plan are implemented, they will have more data. By setting DMU's based on county borders, DOT info on car/deer accidents, forestry management and crop damage claims will be more relevant and carry more meaning.

Some counties (Marinette, for example, and there are many others) are incredibly different north to south.