If I follow my PT exercises I can still shoot a compound bow.
No shame using my new x-bow however.
And I won't post any pics here if I kill anything with it.
The ridicule isn't worth the trouble and they'd probably be deleted by the moderator anyway...
For all those complaining about this what do you use for muzzle loader season? A side lock shooting patched round balls or an in-line shooting sabots? If you're shooting an in-line you have nothing to complain about.
And yes I guess I am a hypocrite and proud of it. Of course their are VERY FEW real traditional archers anymore. Everyone that I know uses some type of modern equipment on their traditional bow. Weather its factory made arrows, broadheads, rests, tabs. sights, quivers, arm guards, strings, silencers ect. The common thread with all vertical bows vs crossguns is pulling and holding the bow back under human power, watching for all the tork that goes along with that for making a clean release and practice practice. I could go on but this has been beaten to death.
You crossgunners got what you wanted,,, to use a shoulder mounted weapon with a gun style scope and stock on it to hunt with during the rut that takes little or no practice or dedication compared to the real sport of archery.
And yes I believe inlines with scopes have also crossed the line.
Zinger you posted,,,""" I would get one and hunt with it for no other reason that I've never shot anything with a crossBOW before.""" What a lame statement/excuse/reason ! We had a law that allowed for that. Why didn't you take advantage of that before ? ( lesser weapon law ) Oh I see you couldn't hunt the rut and get the edge on that monster before. I think I am seeing the whole picture now..
I would use an xbow versus not being in the woods in a NY minute. Being in God's Country hunting is what it is about to me. Not the weapon. I also love gun hunting.
I hold nothing against people for their weapon of choice. Crossbows will be coming up on the 40th anniversary in Ohio and the state of hunting affairs in that state has never been better. The sky is not falling IMO.
I think people have tendencies to endorse what they have a passiin for, and seem very narrow minded when someone disagrees with them. Less of a hunter because you hunt with a crossbow? Only if I'm less of a hunter for my compound, or the traditional guy because of his long bow. After all we used to use rocks. Sorry if I stooped to that level.....but my apologies go to Neanderthal Man, not a guy who thinks a guy should have to wear a scarlet (or pink) letter because he uses a crossbow?
I often wonder what the real scorn is all about? Selfishness is the only thing that comes to mind.
Good luck to ALL HUNTERS this year.....
Another thing that bothers me, is what I started this thread about. If people want to use a crossbow fine, but why lie about it? Probably because those that will lie, want people to believe they did it the hard way. Which is fine, but how many other things do they put up a false front about? I told the buddy I mentioned in my original post that he was no longer welcome to hunt on my land.
And if you don't care what any body uses to hunt with then lets start gun season in sept.
When my time comes, I will definitely be using an xbow if it allows me to keep hunting.
To everyone else "If ya dont hunt like me - your pond scum, a piece of crap in the toilet bowl of life"...
Because as everyone should know by now - mine IS the right way to hunt!
It gets pretty old!
Crossbows legal? I guess so! I like it - I dont like it - whatever!
Time to get over it - Some people are going to use them! Who cares why - some will not!
Some people will lie and other folks wont lie! Wont be the first time and not the last - do ya think a gun hunter ever registered a buck as a bow kill? Ya think? Dont like it - but that's dishonest folks - they have been around a long time!
The root of the problem is that when we as hunters precieve that someone else may be getting a "foot up" on us in the sport of hunting or what we precieve to be an unfair advantage - we take it personal and we become selfish and upset!
Doesnt matter if it's as legal as legal comes, but damn it, someone now has an "unfair advantage" and I HATE THAT!
OMG!!
We've seen that in the bait debates - "Those dirty SOB's, golden piles, violator's, late shooters making all that extra work for the wardens, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah! Really?
Get over it - get over yourself's and enjoy your legal hunting methods - whatever they may be! Enjoy!
If ya dont like it - dont use it! It's really that easy!!
How we got here with the crossbow is really OLD news -there here - and apparently not going any place in the near future! Oh well.....
Geeezzzz!
I dont own a crossbow - dont have the desire to shoot one - but I like to be open minded - someday - maybe -perhaps...I dont know!
Never thought I would shoot an in-line muzzleloader with a 3X9 scope either! Whatever -
But for now - in the meantime I'll shoot my compound and look in awe at the traditional shooters!
Enjoy your hunt!
my choice to shoot what ever I want! What ever you
shoot, just do it the BEST you can! Anyway, its NONE
of my business what others shoot!
Good Luck this Fall!
Having said that there are a lot of people, my age and younger, that cannot use a compound bow because of injury or disability. They need to get a Xbow.
My opinion is the main reason for the Xbow interest is that it is now easier to get a deer. If it were not easier, then why would someone drop over $1000 on a weapon that weights about three times as much as a compound? People tell me there is no difference between a compound and a Xbow. If there was no perceived advantage to a Xbow very few people would get one. They are flying off the shelves not because they are new and unique. They are selling because people think it will be easier.
PSE advertised a few years ago that their Xbow had same-hole accuracy at 50 yards and 3" groups at 100 yards. It doesn't matter that the kinetic energy of the small bolt is less than an arrow, all that matters to some people is that they now think they can take longer shots.
Xbows are here to stay and more people will use them every year. What will be the long-term effects? We will find out. I cannot control what other people use on their property or public land. I can control what happens on my land. Me and the other two guys that hunt my land will only use compounds.
In my opinion/eyes that's the problem today.
"accept it and oh well it doesn't effect me"
"nothing we can do about it"
"who cares"
Like I posted a bunch of years ago - I would rather get my butt whooped fighting for something I believe in than staying QUIET and accepting things I don't.
The way it was done was wrong and although you are tired of hearing it BT I will continue to voice my displeasure when the topic allows me to. Much like the special youth hunt :)
As the old saying goes "You got to stand for something or you will fall for anything"
Crossbows are for quitters.
http://www.charter.net/tv/3/player/vendor/CNN/player/cnn/asset/cnn-theyre_beyond_endangered_theyre_dead-cnn/source/Clips
I am not a crossbow guy and dont own one. For the record!
Southbow - So your a Jesus kinda guy and an "old" saying guy...and that's good! - Here's an old one for you as well..."Lord grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change -the courage to change the things I can and the WISDOM to know the difference." May want to think about that for a spell.
Pasq - Really? The incessant whining and complaining here (generally speaking - not a personal attack) is going to change this crossbow thing how? I'm open to suggestions.
I certainly appreciate the fact that you "stand up" for something and I would never name call you - but really...it's been done hundreds of times here!
I dont like bear dogs at my baits or deer drives - I could piss and moan all day about that here - and that will change what....how? I might feel better, but outside of that...very little.
Dont think for a second that I dont care about some important issues....there's many to be concerned about. As you (Pasq) poke good fun of, you know I'm huge into youth hunting,education and hunter retention/recruitment. That is a solvable problem and one that can be worked on!
Bobbin hood - nice post!
As people often we subscribe to the "chicken little theory" - "The sky is falling, the sky is falling" - Let's wait and see - maybe this will work or maybe not....time will tell.
I am old enough to tell you that when compound bows first hit the market - holy hell! We didn't have the social media of today, obviously, but there was enough print out there as bowhunters were up in arms in many places across the State!
I really dont see much difference......
Good Hunting!
say ANYTHING!
For example; I hated EAB crammed down my throat, especially when I knew the doe population was low in my area.
I bet most of the guys against crossbows use trail cameras and even plant bait plots so it's easier to kill deer. They also hunt out of treestands which the original bowhunters didn't do so you chose to use technology and bait yet you complain about anybody else using technology if it's not the same that you're using. It boils down to greed and selfishness you're all afraid of someone else shooting "your" deer. There should be plenty of deer for everyone, if the numbers drop to low it's either manegment or weather, not the hunters that are the cause.
Pasquinell, I honestly don't know all the details on how it got passed. I assume you're talking about the Spring Hearing votes. I consider the hearings to be worthless, the votes mean nothing as they're basically just a referendum. The anti's that are at it will vote against anything to do with hunting and the old guys don't want anything to change. We live in a republic where the minority is also protected, just because the majority feels one way doesn't mean that's the way it's going to be. If that were the case women and minorities still couldn't vote, blacks would be at the back of the bus, etc. Remember this because hunters are a minority and if it went to a straight vote we might not be able to hunt anymore.
What boils my cork is the name calling "quitters" "crossgun" "able body crossgunners should b ashamed" "lame"....Really?
What is that kinda garbage talk going to change?
Not a crossbow guy, dont own one!
Poachers gift? Because a poacher couldn't use one before? Because poachers follow the law?
Asian dream? Ya that's being racist implying that asians are poachers.
Compound with sight and a release don't take much to use either. Being busy this year I will probably take my bow out a month before the season to check the sights on it and be good. People who think they need to practice all year are either very incompetant or just enjoy shooting.
And those using the word crossgun are you really that stupid or just trying to rile people up? It shoots an arrow with energy stored in the limbs and cams just like a bow does. It kills with a broadhead that bleeds out the animal just like an arrow out of a bow does. It does not use powder or kill by shock like a gun does. It may not be just like your compound bow but it's a lot closer to your bow than it is to a gun.
Bloodtrail says "It gets pretty old!"
What gets old is Bloodtrail jumping on everyone of these threads and spitting out the same old "we need to be tolerant" trash. BT if you want to be tolerant go ahead but don't think I want to hear your BS every time. Get over yourself dude.
I bass fish every Wed night with 11 other guys at local lakes. One person is in his 70's and uses a crossbow. Always a compound guy before senior status. He said "ya know I can understand why they didn't want them in archery. It's like a rifle for goodness sakes" This guy travels all over the world hunting in New Z, Africa, S.Amer, Alaska and good old Langlade County Wisconsin.
There is no argument they are here now but don't like how it was done. I am 54 and voted at the worthless meetings against their use for anything other than disabled or seniors. There was never anti's at the meetings I attended in Kenosha County.
Questions - Does anyone get target panic using one? Are they just fun to shoot? What is the reason one wants to shoot them other then "cause I can".
Weapon of choice for a bowhunter doesn't determine his skill as a bowhunter. You guys that belittle a person and name call for the use of a crossbow, grow up!! Do you call a bowhunter that uses a ground blind or the fully enclosed box blind, names or less of a hunter? You claim that a vertical bow is a true bowhunters weapon, because of the fact that you have to accomplish the draw undetected. How hard is it to remain un detected with a full blind? Support your fellow hunters!!
rjn - I'm not a crossgunner - dont have one, didn't buy one - never shot one - no plans too so let's pay attention!
I'm not advocating crossbows but rather acting like decent folks and engaging in appropriate debate without acting like an ass's.
jjn - Really? Asian dream? Are you kidding me? I have two Hmong friends who are dedicated hunters and I think highly of them. They are gentlemen - you sir, are anything but!
Bottom line here is two fold -
(A). If you dont hunt the way I do...your crap!
(B). OMG - someone "clearly" has an advantage over me!
No one says crossguns are "bows" they clearly are not!
Do they have a place...maybe...I dont know and neither does anyone else. Time will tell.
The key here - is if you dont like them - dont use one. Pretty simple stuff.
>>>--arrow1-->'s Link
>>>--arrow1-->'s Link
Nice boots!
SCI tried hard to garner support as was seen in their full page add in WON around that time.
Might have been best to allow the 55 and older proposal versus saying no and then allowing what amounts to full inclusion. With 55 and older, they might have bought some time saying they wanted to see and document the net results.
That all said, it is a done deal. xbows will be a part of WI hunting forever now at least until they become obsolete due to new technology.
I agree with you for the most part - I think that the public hunter may be impacted more than anyone else - that seems to be the way all too often!
So I understand what most of the complaints are and agree as well with most of what level headed hunters are saying.
What I dont agree with is all the bashing, name calling and disrespectful behavior that seems to be the norm when some people dont agree or get what they want. Pretty sad!
I still find 10's post to be the most interesting post as it refers to the bowhunting clubs and organizations that appeared to be rather silent on the issue. He asked a very good question!
I guess now it's a wait and see!
Steve you are correct in your assessment. Instant gratification and Quality Public Land hunting was delivered a death blow with the approval of cross bows. It goes back to my reasoning that this state administration wants everything privatized. Yes that includes hunting. If they had their way, Wisconsin would have no public hunting land financed by taxes or fees. It's the administrations M.O. That is why Troll was brought in from the VERY PRIVATIZED HUNTING STATE OF TEXAS. It is why they did what they did with public sector workers. It is what they are evangelical about. It is a I've got mine, I don't want to pay for yours mentality. The governor said it in his own words, "divide and conquer".
Fact is, the quality of Wisconsin's Public Hunting opportunities is what made Wisconsin a once great deer hunting destination. It is where I started and shot my first deer. Unless you are on private land, quality deer hunting in Wisconsin is now a joke.
I am blessed to have a private land opportunity. I don't mind having to pay my share to ensure there is quality hunting opportunities for guys on public land. It is an issue that can keep the hunting community united and on solid footing. Besides, my good fortune could all go away in the blink of an eye and then what? I would have to rely on public hunting land opportunities. The approval cross bows will trump any positive rule changes for public land.
Speaking personally I have never had better bowhunting in my life! The wife and son are involved and deer sightings are down somewhat but overall I would be the last to complain.
I live in a County that is almost split 50/50 private/public and have shot very nice deer in both!
Guys like "Mike the Cheesehead" and Les Welch continually score on BIG bucks on public land. From what I understand however they work hard, very hard to reach their goals and continue to do so.
Is some public land garbage - absolutely! Will more become the same - maybe!
I believe that public land success is directly related to two factors - A). a little Luck and B) How hard are you willing to work?
Again, some places are not worth considering but others.....you bet!
I used to hunt a section of State forest alone. I mean alone - I never - never saw another hunter. And it was all public land! But again - it took alot of scouting. For the bowhunter I believe that quality deer hunting is alive and living for those who want to work at it. If it was easy - everyone would be killing BIG bucks!
I predict that eventually someday, access to huntable land will be the demise of hunting overall! At some point - some time - there just will not be enough to go around - unless perhaps your wealthy.
Do I enjoy hunting private land - yes, I do - but if things changed tomorrow...and they could - I am still confident I could still make a living as a bowhunter on public land!
Gotta see what happens his season with the crossbow guys. Then I'll make my decision whether nay or aye!
Good Hunting!
I did see Iowa has opened the door ever so slightly for X-guns late season Ah! In few years it will be a level playing field once again!
I bought the crossbow out of curiosity, and it was such a good buy, with case and extras, I could not pass it up. 500.00 is what I paid, for a 10 point Wicked Ridge, with all the extras, and you have to use a rope cocker.........
My initial test was on an indoor range at 30 yards. I found the scope to be of high quality. The bolts were not consistent, and BH sensitive. With luminock arrows, and 125 BH, it was zeroed in, in 10 minutes. Done and ready to go......
Now a friend of mine, with hard times, and age difficulities, will and can use it, when he wants, and no one has problems with that I think.....
They are easy to shoot, and for a ground hunter they will be deadly, and most I think will shoot them at 30 yards.
Yes I think, especially in the south and central part of the state, it will effect public land hunting, and gun hunters take to them. They are heavy and you get one shot, and they are nosiy. I can reload a compound alot quicker........
The plus side of having anymore hunters is increase revenue for the Pittman Robertson fund, and more hunters the better. You have to understand the NRA and the SCI, are about getting more hunters.
I bowhunt with a recurve, but think the revolution of the compound was a very positive thing, since it brought so many into archery, and strengthed our ranks, and we have the seasons today, because of them.....
I do not consider myself a "trad" hunter. What the hell is that..... I shoot my stick, because its more effective than your compound in the woods, in my opinion, and would not want to carry that weight all day.
I do understand, not everyone can shoot a stick well, heck not all of us, can play baseball well, its just that way......
As for the bickering with compound and traditional shooters, those that bicker, or think they are better than the other, are just goofs, and you find them anywhere......
Some guys can not shoot stick, heck some can not shoot compounds, its too bad, terrible shooters are allowed to hunt, but it is what it is.......
Everyone in their life is going to make a bad shot, wound game and lose a deer. If this has never happened to you, well I am glad, but it has happened to me, and it made me a better hunter. My woodsmanship and tracking skills improved thru the years, and I have not lost a deer in a long long time.........
Why would anyone shoot a deer with an xbow, and claim they shot it with a compound. I do not see that much difference in the two of them anyway, so know I do not think that will happen much.......
The xbows will not be a factor on private land, unless the owner wants to use one..... We will have to see the impact, on the numbers, at the end of the year, but those numbers will come out of the Central Forests, and Farmland areas, the north will only have buck numbers anyway.........
At least Wis is going to have a 2 year study....If those numbers are very high, than what 10 said, should kick in, and the complaints should be loud and strong......
In my opinion, Wis had it right, with the lessor weapon law, but the problem with Wis, is the politicians, run the show now, and they act, on what the voters want.........
The crossbow does not belong, in the season, unless handicapped or 65 or older............
I think the average guy, is going to spend about 400.00 dollars on one, set it up, only fair, and are going to just shoot, and many will wound deer, I mean you can not fix stupid......
I know dedicated xbowers, I have met them. They are good deer hunters, and will be deadly with their weapon of choice. They will kill a deer, like I do, and they will enjoy their weapon.
MI has the xbow, but to tell you the truth, I would have to read the stats..... I hardly see anyone hunting for the most part all fall, let alone an xbow hunter, I am sure they are out there, but most are not far off the road.........
In the end, I think we all need to know one thing. We should be most concerned about the health of our deer herd, and do what is best for the deer.......
Always Hunt Fair Chase
I think it's guys who label people as their enemy because they see things different than them is of poor character. I am just as passionate about what I love as the next guy. I may not agree with him, but hate him is a different story?
Rut, I know of no one who is jumping ship, and switching to a crossbow. All my friends shoot compounds, and most of us hunt private land. I have a neighbor who owns forty acres that adjoins the 960 I hunt. He wants to shoot 6 does a year. He also will only shoot a four year old buck or older. His forty will not hold six does, and quite frankly without the does during the rut, he'll be less likely to shoot a buck of his caliber. Likely, he will shoot deer I will pass. He may never shoot six does, but he will most certainly impact my hunting. I will never hate him though. Won't agree with him, but never hate him! What I don't have time for, is guys who knock down fellow hunters. We have plenty of enemies already, without the inter-fighting amongst ourselves. Antis must really dig this forum lol.
So if we are really being honest, is the true disdain for cross BOW hunters because their "slob" hunters or "less of a hunter" or more like a "gun" hunter or that people are worried someone has an advantage, and is going the shoot "their" deer?
This is coming from a guy who personally thinks there isn't that much advantage to that particular user, and never plan on using one. Not bragging, but I shoot pretty damn good at forty yards with my bow, and sitting in my advantaged tree stand, deer rarely see me draw my bow....after all, most people really hate the fact the crossbow is already cocked. Hate to inform the obvious point, you still need to lift it from its hanger, and aim the clumsy thing!
I think its also important to list how I started shooting, and where I am now. Started with a bear recurve Kodiak in about 1982. Shot cedar shafts, no sights, finger tabs, arm guard, and plaid clothing for camouflage. Bought some camo (treebark lol) went to aluminum arrows. Bought a compound in 85 (pse Nova), it came with sights, hell on the fingers, bought a release. Later a new bow, new release, better sights, carbon arrows, better camo, better tree stands, and today, I'm shooting like my eyes are that of a kid. Shooting bullets really. Still only shoot (just how I feel) to 20 yards. I have made every improvement needed to better my shooting and kill deer cleaner. Yet the line is drawn in the sand at the crossbow? Please don't tell me that drawing my bow is the difference. I draw 70 pounds, and hold 14 pounds back at full draw! ALL OF US HAVE AN ADVANTAGE OVER DEER! Some of us have advantages amongst fellow bow hunters. Some of us hunt private land. Some of us can afford the best equipment. Some of us have food plots. Some of us hunt over bait. Some of us (me) take off thirty days at the end of October into November. The lust of advantages is ongoing, but that slob hunter crossbow dude, is somehow a pos because he thinks his pre-cocked BOW (sorry people it's not a damn gun) is giving him an advantage? If so, get yourself one, or quit crying about it!
Selfishness IS the only answer.
In the woods, out west@13,000 feet, or at a 3d shoot a stick/recurve is at a distinct disadvantage over a 300fps wheelie bow. I have shot 200 3d's and they have a stick/recurve class for a reason. I have never seen a stick recurve shooter even sniff the compound class on score. 12/42 targets beyond 45 yards? Goodluck with that. Weight? An extra 5 lbs? In Wisconsin that means pulling it up a tree and hanging it. Out west? I take off Thursday with my Daughter for a 47 mile backpack/fishing trip on the Jmt.Multiple climbs from 8,000 to 13,300 and back.Funny how guys weigh all gear to the ounce but are 30 lbs. overweight.Many guys drop 5 lbs. in the Kohler each day. We have had a disabled hunter for 30 years that has used an xbow.A Hundred bloodtrails with poor results. No able bodied hunter will be allowed to use one.
I have also talked about crossbows with a buddy from Ohio where they've been legal for quite some time. He's said that his anecdotal experience has been that there is little impact in any of the areas he hunts, but he does not hunt much public land.
I don't know how much impact they will have in WI. We'll see.
I can't say that I have a lot of kumbaya feelings about anybody and everybody being able to shoot crossbows in a concurrent season, but I shoot a compound. So, maybe that makes me a hypocrite to the trad guys.
I guess you miss my point, shoot what with you like, I do think the stick for deer here is an advantage. You have to realize we all do not hunt the same way....
I do not hunt out of a treestand all day. I walk alot of miles in the western UP and N Wis, and hunt on the ground, so for me the weight is alot.......
I will agree with you, the compound is the go to bow, on the praries of SD.......
I guess I enjoy it all, but I think, you missed my entire point.....
I do not hunt at 13000 feet. The highest I ever hunted was in the late 80's when I hunted at about 11000 for august mulies out of Pagosa Springs, had some great hunts......
At 64 11000 is out of my league, just the way it is. I wish you good luck this year
Also I do not shoot 3D, just not my thing, I would rather just roam around and shoot at stumps, but that is hard to explain to some people.......
I will agree the compound does have an advantage in the high country, alot of times, I had no shot because of distance, but that is why it is called hunting
I just do not get your point.......
By the way, are you still surfing...........
If I drew a once in a lifetime tag no question it's a fast, short axle compound, recurve a far distant second, well ahead of an xbow. I control what folks use on my place and frankly could care less what the neighbors use. For me, no .222, .223, no xbows, no expandable bh,no roundball/smoothbore muskets.
You can go to one buck per hunter, no party hinting and no deer drives. That's a ll a personal preference and it has already take place in our deer camp. We see more deer during shooting hours and they aren't as pressured. Now getting the neighbors to agree is another hard task!
In the past 12 seasons we have only taken 13 bucks between 6 hunters.
Good to see we are not alone!
And in regard to your comment about admitting being wrong, I wasn't mentioning Ohio to champion crossbows and counter anyone. I was just relating what I've been told and hoping.
Without writing a long, drawn out recount of what happened and who did what, I will simply tell you what the leadership you refer to was doing.
We were in Madison, attending hearings and speaking with legislators. WBH realized that this was an NRA promoted and backed agenda. An agenda that came with considerable political clout. To top it off, the WI Bear Hunters jumped on the crossbow support bandwagon with their political clout and dollars. To simply oppose the crossbow entirely would have accomplished nothing as there was no way legislators were going to ignore the money and clout those two organizations brought with them.
The handwriting was on the wall. WI was going to have a crossbow season. Knowing that, WBH, along with the SCI SE WI Bowhunter's chapter chose to fight for an attainable goal which was to keep the seasons separately defined so they were not rolled into one.
As Happygolucky noted, we (the SCI SE WI Bowhunters) attempted to use the media to inform all hunters of the state as to what was occurring. WI Outdoor News is by far the most read sporting rag in this state and so we approached Dean Bortz, editor of WON, asking him to allow us to present our perspective to his readers. We were answered with a complete rejection. Our view was in complete contradiction to his viewpoint and so he would not consider running an article presenting anything other. The only way we were able get our message out was to PAY for a full page ad in the publication. We did that, at a cost of $1,400.00. Even then, it was still subject to his approval. Similarly, we approached Paul Smith from the Milwaukee Journal/Sentinel. and, similarly, Mr. Smith's perspective varied from ours and so we were not able to utilize that avenue either.
So, where were we you ask? We took time off from our jobs and families, spending considerable time talking with legislators to present our points of view. We attended meeting and hearings. We even fought with other SCI chapters of the state who wanted full inclusion, as well as with our own, paid lobbyist, who also happens to represent the bear hunters. Remember, these are not paid positions, we did this of our own choosing and at our own expense.
Myself and WBH president Mike Brust were accused in a legislative hearing in Madison of being selfish in our effort to keep crossbows a separate entity from vertical, hand held, hand drawn bows. We spent many thousands of dollars with our lobbyist in fighting this. That is where we were.
I will not continue this discussion as we now have crossbows in this state. What we did, be it good or bad, was far more than anything than most of you readers did. Complaining and bashing others from the comfort of your computer rings hollow when you cannot show what YOU did to combat something you are apparently against.
Lastly, to all those who cite physical abilities or limitations as a reason to utilize a crossbow, we already had that ability in WI. Similarly, those who simply wanted to use a crossbow as an alternative weapon already had that ability under the lessor weapons rule.
I'll also add that I am a life member of the NRA and I used to be a contributing donor to the Bear Hunters.
You are correct, and I can understand how you and many others were not aware of what was going on. Without having the media make any attempt to present all sides of the subject, it was difficult to get a message out.
It is a shame that we, as sportsmen of the state, cannot even be presented with different aspects and perspectives from our news sources. I guess finding ways to get info from all perspectives out is something that needs to be worked on.
In any event, thanks for the acknowledgement, even though that is not why I wrote my explanation. There were many others who were intimately involved beside myself, including the senators I mentioned, along with Geitz, one of our own forum members, and Kaz, an archery shop owner.
If there is one thing to be learned from this is that all of us need to be proactive with issues that affect our passion of hunting. I have certainly learned that there are many out there working against us, and that includes legislators who are ignorant of issues or who are simply against hunting. I have also seen a little of the dirty side of politics and it is indeed dirty.
That is a true statement regardless of the weapon, even a trad bow.
Just like P&Y or BC. I see no reason to put them in a book. Just like those pictures of guys sitting on the back of a deer holding the head up.
If it's something you want to do go right ahead, it's a free world.
I have been a compound hunter for over 20 years and I will continue to be one, but I have added a x-bow to my arsenal and I won't be apologizing to anyone for it. I could say "my shoulder has been hurting when I shoot my compound, but I won't." Truth is I had no intention of buying one but I shot one and I really enjoyed it. So what?
Some people I know were the biggest compound haters when they became popular and now they almost all shoot compounds. Whenever this point gets brought up all they x-bow haters just want to skirt this particular subject matter.
I really get a kick out of the people that say x-bow hunters should only get a portion of the season. I guess if we want to look at it that way here is how I see it. Most perceive the x bow to be the easiest to harvest a deer with, the compound 2nd and the recurve 3rd. So that being said if we are going to break the season down that way the recurve guys should get first crack at November and the rut. The compound guys get the second best time(whatever that may be) and the x-bow guys should get what's left. I am not knocking anybody for their choice of weapon and I really have a lot of respect for the traditional guys.
I will use my Z-7 extreme for the early season and save my x-bow for the really cold sits.
When will us as hunters wake up and realize that we need to stick together. Maybe one day after all the peta and anti hunting groups get their way and we can't hunt at all anymore we will look back and say "Wow, what happened? Maybe we should have all banded together as hunters and this might not have happened." I hope it doesn't come to this one day.
United we can stand or divided we can fall. Come on guys, we have to wake up and get our heads out of our own backside. The anti's are gaining momentum and we are worried about what weapon each one of us is using. Really?
It is kind of funny how the cycle of hunting goes. When I first started hunting just harvesting a deer was my only goal. Didn't matter if it was a doe or a big buck or a spike. Quite frankly those were some of my best hunting memories. Then I evolved into the so called trophy hunter and I shot many huge bucks over the years. Don't get me wrong, those were great memories also. But now days it seems that too many people are judging the quality of hunting in inches of antler. It is sad to see young hunters not be able to shoot a buck because someone tells them it is not big enough or someone pass a buck because they are worried about what their peers will say. I am all done with the trophy phase of my life and I am going back to what makes hunting fun for me. Enjoying the experience and shooting whatever size deer that may be. I don't need a x-bow to accomplish my goals as a hunter, but I bought one anyway because I enjoyed shooting it.
To each his own and good luck to all. Have a safe hunting season.
That is very well stated. I too miss the days of putting any 'ol buck on the buck pole. They were "measured" in points and 6pt was a great thing. Now people actually refer to them in numbers like a 140 or a 150 or 1.5, 2.5, or 3.5. People are judged by their weapon of choice too. What a crock of crap hunting has "evolved" to.
I think we see more of that because the avenues to get that crap out to the general public is more available.
TV, Videos, Internet, Iphone, and the list goes on.
Back in the day we had none of that!
I still believe their are a good numbers of "grass roots" hunters out there, enjoying bowhunting and the great outdoors!
I have noticed over the years that about 90 % of the people I know that use a crossbow for physical reasons are full of crap. They are gun hunters that want to hunt the Rit, they are not archers.
I ' m closing in on 69 with a lot of worn body parts. I ' m down to 50 lb draw and will drop lower as needed. Archers don ' t use crossbows.
Not many are pretending a cross bow and a vertical are the same thing? The point is, we should unite as hunters.
I'm so proud of you for hunting with a vertical at your age. I plan on doing the same thing (health provided), but in the same respect, I wouldn't curse you for using a different weapon....nor anyone else for that matter.
The big picture is we already have plenty of enemies against us as hunters. Add the distention amongst ranks, and we weaken our side that much more. I am surprised a person at your age has yet to figure that out.....you're not alone in your close-mindedness though, and that my fellow hunters is truly what is wrong...not the damn cross bow!
Not many are pretending a cross bow and a vertical are the same thing? The point is, we should unite as hunters.
I'm so proud of you for hunting with a vertical at your age. I plan on doing the same thing (health provided), but in the same respect, I wouldn't curse you for using a different weapon....nor anyone else for that matter.
The big picture is we already have plenty of enemies against us as hunters. Add the distention amongst ranks, and we weaken our side that much more. I am surprised a person at your age has yet to figure that out.....you're not alone in your close-mindedness though, and that my fellow hunters is truly what is wrong...not the damn cross bow!
I think if you truly read the topic about being honest, you would no more embrace a fellow bow hunter than a crossbow hunter, because it seems like sharing "your" deer or "your" public land with the public is the true complaint. If you're a private land owner, you can make your own rules, and not allow them, but the seperate season has already differentiated the crossbow user as something other than an archer, even though the season runs at the same time?
I have yet to hear another reason besides the unwillingness to share as a credible argument.
So let's be honest. People don't want more people hunting, and unfortunately, this thinking is part of the problem when it comes to hunter recruitment. Ask the British if there is any regret over this mindset?
Once again, I have yet to meet a single person who is dumping their bow, or a gun hunter who is joining the rut with a crossbow. In my neck of the woods, the sky is not falling!
I was a traditional bowyer when I started. Compounds were new. The invention of wheels and pullies made archery what it is today. People shoot bows because they enjoy the season. If you choose a crossbow, and get to witness some of what I've seen, I'm glad to share!
Too many paragraphs for some of you I know, but there is thought behind my words. Good luck to my fellow hunters. Just know that I'll pull you from a ditch or hold the door for you....even if you're a mongrel crossbow user, and even if I'm on my way to hunt LOL.
Pete has said what I myself have been saying for many years and he makes some other fine points as well - very nicely done.
Pete is right people - we need to stand united on all fronts of the hunting/trapping/shooting sports.
And like I have said before - "selfishness" is the biggest scorn to our sport - because some of us believe someone, somewhere is getting the upper hand on us. Like Pete said, "my" deer or "my" public land -
We are all hunters!
Whether you shoot a bow, shoot a gun, shoot a crossbow or shoot a muzzleloader - we are all hunters! No one is better than anyone else and no one is less of a person or Outdoorsman/lady as long as they follow the rules. Really, that simple!!
Minnesota is going through some of the things we experienced here in Wisconsin before crossbows were passed - check out their forum! Interesting in many ways -
Pete - nice to know you'll get the door for me! You da man!
