Deer study with parallels to WI deer
Wisconsin
Contributors to this thread:
You mean that when the onslaught of baiters go out to there gun stands constantly and dump bait isn't doing anything different compared to hunters going out to check stands before season? That's a laugh right there. Good read though. Funny how I've seen a dramatic change in deer movement during the gun season since baiting started getting more and more popular.
"Funny how I've seen a dramatic change in deer movement during the gun season since baiting started getting more and more popular."
Your area must be "unique" then. Baiting is banned in a large portion of the State, and now only 2 gallons is allowed where baiting is permitted.
If in fact baiting was making deer movement different or all nocturnal, then shouldn't we have seen hunter success and satisfaction with deer sightings skyrocket when the bait bans were put in place in those counties that now have bans?
That didn't happen.
Unfortunately, it's not banned where I am.
Nice BS article.. LOL.. apparently WI now has more cracks and crevices to hide deer then they had in past seasons... Numbers do not lie..
Please post historical deer harvest numbers again.. don't need to be a road scholar to understand what the issue is..
Over hunting has dwindled the herd to a joke in the Decimated 19 counties... other day on a 26 mile fresh snow road trip through county and town roads at 5 am told me exactly what the issue is..
Corn piles at homes .. shacks and hunting parcels... it's thee only place you see tracks for miles at a time ... in fact you could totally eliminate deer at all between feeders....
But .. folks can't live without it... and instead the deer are shot off by the Eradication piles..
deer have huge holes in habitat that house zero deer because of the Kernel Club.... and what's not shot off .. hugs the pile and feed wagon like a bus load of illegals heading to the free lunch program in the USA. ...LOL
So bait piles have no effect on deer movement. In other words if I dumped a pile and got deer coming to it, it has nothing to do with the pile of food. I just got lucky when I dumped it out and happened to pick a spot that the deer like to come and stand at every day. That's good to know. If that's the case, why are people dumping piles everywhere in the woods? Trying to grow crops?
Deer don't go nocturnal during gun season? Good one!!! Lol
My experience, in the southern part of the state, going nocturnal is a big part of it. In heavily forested areas, deer might not have to but, once the crops (i.e. corn) are out of the fields their options are really limited in agricultural areas.
Actually live2hunt brought up a point about the nocturnal effects of baiting. Then 519vx brought up an opposing opinion about bait and nocturnal movement. I responded to 519vx point with my own point. If your wondering about what turned it into a baiting thread you would have to scroll up a couple responses before mine. Please pay closer attention as I dont have time to hold your hand and explain this to you. Thanks for your concern though.
Ron Kulas would be better received if he posted the link to the study and the Executive Summary. A peer review in a universally-accepted publication would be great.
Until then he's just another violater cited for shooting a hapless spike buck off of a corn pile with a center fire rifle.
I agree with the study to an extent. The study was done in big woods, hills, mountains. It depends where You hunt. In 50% ag country with 40-80-120- acre woodlots mature(3,4,5,6) yo bucks are smart. They are already post rut, tired, they find little pockets. Our 3 remaining shooters all made it so far living in the corn and giving the first and last 10 minutes of legal shooting for movement. Our number 1 was intact on 11/28 and by 12/4 he broke off 2 tines now grossing 140 so he gets to see 2015. Mature bucks are basically nocturnal beyond week 1 of bow and only get dumb in peak rut. Beyond that it takes a boot to get them up in daylight. Nothing to do with baiting or no baiting.They don't see year 4 south of hwy 29 by riding the short bus.
Field and Stream had an article this past spring about hunting pressure affecting turkeys. This is really no different when it comes to a big tract of public land with multiple access points or roads, whereby 98% of the hunters stay within 200-300 yards of the road.
My own study? 3 years ago I hunted 5 day's during the gun hunt in the Chequamegon forest. There was a lot of deer sign and rutting activity in the snow. I never saw a deer during the gun season. Fresh tracks every day when there was new snow, but no deer seen. I thought there was too much sign and figured the bait and the amount of people kept the deer down during daylight. So, I went up again the last Friday of the muzzleloader season. By noon, I had already seen 5 deer. There were no hunters around the area I was, and by the tracks in the snow, there had been no one around since the rifle season. The bait dried up, the woods quieted down, and the deer were moving around normally feeding as they did years before. So quit stating it has no effect on deer movement. The bait and the placing/maintaining of the bait piles has all the effects on deer movement.
Howatt, incredibly interesting. Thanks for the links.
Thanks Ron. I'll read this when I have time.
More pressure on land via hunting, walking, picking berries does affect deer movement to less and less daylight activity. The central farmland zone is basically small woodlots. Mature bucks can hardly find a pocket anywhere that is safe. I watch this every year. I know right now where 2 big bucks are bedding all day within a 2 acre circle. They give You maybe 10 minutes of a legal window moving. In big woods like the study area sure, they simply move much further in where most activity won't be. If hunter presence/pressure were not an issue on daylight movement than the multi million $$ scent/scentless/camo industry would not exist. Why do many guys only check trailcams at night? Why do so many properties now have sancturaries that are never stepped in except to shed hunt in spring? Up until recent, the bow season closed 5 6 days prior to the 9 day gun opener to let the deer calm down. Are deer more on edge and apt to string jump a bow shot on 9/14 or 12/20? By Late season bow, after 3 months of relentless pressure deer will string jump a rabbit fart from 2 40's over.Elk are a prairie animal that were forced into the mountains to survive hunters/pressure 100 years ago.
I agree with Novemeber. I think it is naive to think that pressure does not cause deer to move far more at night than during the day. There is not deep cover everywhere in the state for deer to crawl into.
"My cams showed 2 dozen diff bucks and a lot of does using the property throughout the bow season that I enjoyed sole access to and always saw deer. When gun deer hunting rolled around, 10 orange guys arrived the weekend prior and during the week leading up to the season these guys that never step foot in the woods the rest of the year created a lot of commotion. Those ten guys killed a grand total of one doe off that land and never saw a buck."
Good point. Hopefully you'll remember that the next time you rail on "DNR excuses" for lower than expected gun deer kills.
Finally had a chance to read this stuff. The website was down over lunch hour. Must've been all the bowsiters that overwhelmed it? :)
Nothing there that I didn't already know or hasn't already been studied.
RC,
" For the most part it was things we all knew about mature deer but the info about the deer not going nocturnal was interesting."
You didn't know deer do not go noc due to hunters? I thought everyone knew that. They don't go noc ever no matter what with exception to different movements IMO when there is a full moon. There is no such thing as Noc. Just read the study. lol...
People think they go Noc only because their cams occasionally pick them up at night whereas before the pressure they got day pics. The deer are smart enough to be where they are not during hunting hours awake and well and doing what deer do even when we are hunting them. They just do it where we are not at.
The deer going Noc thing is very misunderstood by a great many hunters out there. Us guys here that share data and knowledge know better and learn. Most of the best bucks I have harvested came during the day right smack in the middle of orange army week. Then again I go where other hunters refuse to make the effort to go. The past few years are an exception to that due to health issues.
LMAO. Ok if you say so.
Why would you find anything interesting that you already know 100%? I mean seriously? I find things like that interesting only if I didn't know or thought differently. If it was a slap to those that think deer go Noc then that's not to nice now is it. How's that go..."Na na na na boo boo stick your head in doo doo".....Is that what you were really saying to those who insist deer go Noc even though you tried to set them straight?
Pshhhhh! How you like me now?
;o)...
Oh wait....That's right you are not the rancid crabtree that was banned so how would I know who I am really talking to even if I was new here or been here for years. Apparently your handle was high jacked and you are also Howatt and RC to boot. Something like that. So hard to keep track of it all ya know?
:o)
LOL
yes sir yes sir. mmmmhmmm.