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Elk & Mule Deer

In 2016 I want to head out west to hunt Elk and Mule Deer. I may only get one trip in my life-time like this which is why I was thinking about going for a combo elk/mule deer hunt. I haven't decided yet on which state I want to head to but a good friend of mine went out to Colorado when his dad turned 50 for an elk hunt. They used an outfitter but it wasn't guided. My friend pulled a cow tag while his dad and good family friend pulled bull tags. Between the three of them they only filled the cow tag.

Where have you been before and if I wanted to hunt both elk and mule deer which state or states would you recommend? Were there any outfitters that you used that really liked or others you thought that were a waste of money? Did you use a guided outfitter? Did you use a bow or rifle? Like I said above, I might only get this opportunity once so while it would be nice to accomplish both with a bow, I also know using a rifle would open up more shot opportunities.

Thanks for the input!

If this is a 1 time only hunt for you and you want Elk and Deer I would go to Montana. A NR big game combo tag has been a lock to draw the last few years.

I've archery hunted all over the West for elk and deer. I've never went guided out west but if you don't have much experience with Western Hunting and your only going to do this once, spend the extra money and hire an outfitter. If filling your tags is high on your priority list, I would spend even more money and hire a guide to hunt private land if this is your once in a lifetime hunt.

If you want the wilderness experience look at the different public land outfitters. These hunts are less money than private land hunts.

I have not personally hunted with Montana hunt and fish company but know friends that have. All of them had good things to say about Vinny and the hunts they had with him. Best of luck choosing your adventure!

I've hunted wth Silver Peaks outfitters in CO many times. Lots of elk but not the best trophy area, they have really nice deer. All my hunts with them have been archery. It is worth looking at their website.

Too many variables here to point you in any particular direction... How much time are you looking at spending out there actually hunting? How much money do you have to allocate to the hunt? Do you have the equipment yourself to complete the hunt DIY? What are your objectives and "successes" as to this hunt? What kind of physical and mental shape are you in? Plenty of knowledge on here... I would post it to the main forum though as you will find a much expanded horizon.

Great advise I agree with all if dukes questions, And also agree about if this is a once in a lifetime I would go with an outfitter, If you really want to do a cambo I would find an outfitter that would book your hunt for the species you want the most and hunt hard for that one and charge you an extra charge if you do kill the other, many combo hunts are great but if you are more focused on the one I feel you have a better chance of filling that tag, Good luck!

Are you saying it is once in a lifetime because of vacation time or money?

Once we acquired all the gear, we can hunt out west each year for ~$1200-1500 including license/gas/food. You will probably pay 3-5x that for an outfitted hunt. By skimping on some of the luxuries, I can hunt each year out there. You will also probably be less successful at shooting an animal, but that is not always my first criteria for a good hunt.

If this is a true once in a lifetime, I would recommend buying both elk and deer licenses but you will probably be concentrating on one of the two. Since I can shoot deer here, I always like to be near the elk.

I echo the above recommendations for MT. You can get the elk/deer combo for $1000 and it has been 100% success the last couple of years. ID/CO have OTC for elk but I am not sure about their mule deer (might have to get in their lottery).

And finally, don't skimp on time! Back when I had more vacation, we would spend 3 weeks in MT - 1 for deer and 2 for elk. In general, the more time = more success. This also helps out getting used to the altitude gradually instead of feeling like crap for 1/2 (or more) of your hunt.

I'm looking at the price of going through an outfitter and seeing that between the outfitter and obtaining the correct tags for a combo hunt it would be about 8,000 for 5-7 days depending on where I look. That doesn't include flying or driving to and from. It doesn't include the price to have the animals butchered or if need be mounted. For that amount that's why I said it would be a trip of a lifetime.

I'm intrigued Amoebus, what route do you go to get your trip to $1200-1500? Do you hunt solely on public land?

Just to answer a few of the other questions. My time frame would be 7-10 days. We're typically not allowed more than 1 week of time off at a time. The monetary amount I had in mind is going to fall short of what I would need but I was thinking around $5,000. As I said before my friend has gone out west before and he went through an outfitter but didn't use a guide. I wouldn't be opposed to going that route. If I were to go without an outfitter I would open my trip up to a few family members and/or friends. As far as my objectives or goals go - My primary focus would be on getting an elk. I know most people would want a trophy 5x5, 6x6. I don't know that I would be that selective. My friend said they saw mule deer everywhere. If we were walking around and we saw a nice mule deer I wouldn't hesitate to harvesting a mule deer. In my book if I were to get either a nice mule deer or an elk the hunt would be a success. I know going out west is very different and I would have to do some work to get physically ready. I'm not overweight but I don't work out or exercise as much as I should. I would like to think I'm in good shape mentally?

Thanks again for all your advice!

I've only missed one year hunting out west since 1998 and have hunted CO numerous times, NM 4 times, ID 2 times, MT 2 times, WY once and currently building points for UT and AZ.

I've never hired a guide (although I did pay a wrangler twice to pack out elk and rented horses once) and have always hunted public land. A few of my hunts have been relatively easy draw limited units and many of them have been OTC units.

I've killed 9 bulls and 1 cow on those hunts with one bull being a 360" monster that would be respectable even in the best units in the country. I've had shot/kill opportunities on every hunt I've been on and I've had close calls with some monsters in OTC units.

I think you're cutting yourself short if you're only going for 5-7 days especially if you hope to kill an elk and a mule deer. I've had combo tags in the past but usually there isn't time to concentrate on two species even in a 2-week hunt.

I agree that MT is a good option for a combo tag and another nice thing is that you can use the same tags for archery season and/or gun season. So with a 6-week archery season and a 6-week gun season you could hunt for 3 months although that doesn't do you much good if all you have is 5-7 days.

ID is another good combo tag option. The last time I hunted there you could shoot a deer, bear or mountain lion on your deer tag and if you killed a bear or lion, for something like $30 you could get another tag that was good for another bear or lion. I think wolf tags are pretty cheap there too.

I agree that western hunts can be done in the $1000 to $2000 range depending mostly on the cost of the tag(s). Tag costs range from around $600 to around $1100. Fuel costs can be split if you ride together and I don't count the cost of food because I have to eat whether I'm out west hunting or at home. I actually commute to work 100 miles per day round trip so in 2 weeks thats 1000 miles. If I go on a 2 week hunting trip and split fuel costs with a buddy the cost isn't that much different than if I was paying to commute (car vs. truck) to work for those 2-weeks. Now factor in the value of 200-300 pounds of healthy nutritious elk meat and I don't know how you can afford not to go ;^)

I agree that if this is truly a once-in-a-lifetime hunt you should pony up the big bucks and pay an outfitter to put you on animals.

But personally that's not the way I would go. Instead I would try to make it an annual or every-other year thing and do it yourself for $1000-$2000 each year. Maybe one year you concentrate on elk and the next year mule deer. 10 days is doable but it would be better if you could get a full 2 weeks off.

Cheesehead when you hunted those public lands, did you get or exchange knowledge from locals? I guess what I'm getting at is how did you know where to go?

I don't know that I'd be interested in going for a mountain lion or wolf. Bear might be something that would interest me but I haven't bear hunted here in Wisconsin yet.

I've heard good things about MT and Co from other people. What about sport shows? I know there are usually outfitters at these events, would this be a good place to start or get information?

I have hunted several times with Elk and Mulie combo tags . Heres my advice , focus on one only and hunt it until you suceed . Then go after the other tag . Don't try to hunt both at the same time . It can be done but the odds are not in your favor .

For example , if you hunt Elk during prime time { 1st 2 weeks of Sept } the big Mulies won't be in the same area , if your hunting AZ,CO,MT,or WY . In ID , NV , and UT they mix pretty well . You could get shos at both in the same day . MAYBE .

Never used a guide out west but we have used ranchers 4 times to pack us in and out . Gets you away from the other hunters for about $ 1000 each . Not to mention hauling your critters out .

If I had to pick a dual hunt this year it would be 1 of 3 areas . CO , just east of Craig . MT , northwest corner . NV , area 10 , gods pocket , it will take many years to get both tags .

brewcrew,

I agree with Ruger's advice but for a rookie I might lean a little more toward the 2nd and 3rd or 3rd and 4th weeks of September because bulls will probably be more vocal then. They're much easier to find when they're vocal, especially when you don't have much experience.

I've talked to "locals" on a few rare occasions but it's certainly not necessary. One thing you have to be careful of is if the info you're being given is any good. Most people have good intentions but they might end up sending you places that might not be as good as places you might find on your own.

My first elk hunt was in a location that was recommended by a friend who hunted there before. Since then I've hunted some areas based on information from trusted sources but many of my hunts have been in areas that I found totally on my own through research and a little understanding of elk habits.

Colorado is a good place for a first hunt because there are a lot of OTC units and a lot of elk and it's not as far of a drive as ID or western MT. Pretty much any/every unit in the mountains in Colorado have elk so it's pretty hard to wrong, you just have to find them.

Sport shows are a good place to talk to outfitters but they're probably not going to help you all that much unless you are one of their clients.

A good way to go about it is to decide what type of hunt you want and then start doing some research on the internet. For example when I was searching out new spots in Colorado I had certain criteria like I wanted to be in a designated Wilderness area to stay away from motorized vehicles, ATV's, etc. and I like to be around water because I like to mix in a little trout fishing. Then I started searching on the internet. I found a site called Wilderness.net that has all kinds of info on Wilderness areas. I studied the different Wilderness areas in CO and then I went on Bowsite and used the search function to search on the areas and learn what I could from other guys who have hunted those areas. You can also figure out what Hunt Units they are in (you might as well limit your research to areas you can draw or hunt OTC) and then I used the search feature on bowsite to search for info on those units. You can also do searches on Google and you will find all kinds of info from non-hunters like hikers, campers and backpackers. It's all good info. You can also look at outfitter's websites who hunt public land and get an idea what kind of success they are having and what the terrain is like.

You can also start a thread on the elk forum asking about certain units or wilderness areas. The more specific your questions are the better info you will get. The best way to share info is with the Private Message feature. I've met a lot of guys over the years on Bowsite and have exchanged a lot of good information.

I make a file and print out a lot of information and keep it in the file so I can study it in depth later.

Once I get enough information and decide on an area I start narrowing things down by looking at topo and aerials on wilderness.net or Google Earth and then pick good looking spots and start developing a game plan (Plan A, Plan B, Plan C, etc.)

For me searching out, studying and learning new areas is a lot of fun and it's very rewarding when it all comes together.

It helps to have previous hunting experience in an area but it is not necessary for success. 8 of the 9 bulls I have killed were killed the first time I ever hunted those specific areas. Sometimes not having previous experience in an area can be a good thing because you have an open mind and keep moving and looking until you find elk instead of continually going back to the spots where you found them last time.

I go to Co. every year,always public land.In my younger years I would take our horses and hunt wilderness areas,those were very crowded. You are not going to walk your way past hunters in fact it might be just the opposite. Outfitters go in farther and there are a lot of them I mean a lot. We basically use topo maps to learn a new area once you know what to look for. Outside of the license and gas its very reasonable. What is there to spend money on when you are miles from town. This may sound Hard but are you a good hunter? I don't mean sitting in a treestand on private property waiting for a deer.Elk hunting is the ultimate outdoor experience and by all means do it. If you can go with an experienced person the first time that would be great.It doesn't have to be hard,shucks I will be 74 and still go in a tent. A couple years ago I went by myself and stayed in a tent. Have fun but be realistic the success rate is not very high

I think I have narrowed it down to the 900-20 tag in Montana, elk only as I should have enough points. Was thinking of doing the combo tag but like most said, hard enough to get one animal in 10 days let alone two as the mule deer tag for all those units is unlimited. I do have help with this one as a rancher I know has 36 sq mi that I can base out of free of charge. I also can hunt his property.

Like with most things in life the more you go or do it you will learn a little more each time. Going on my 6th western hunt this fall. If it was a one and done never coming back hunt I would pay the extra for a local outfitter to put you in elk territory at a minimum.

Listen to Mike here... He has great points above and is probably the best flatlander elk hunter that I know of.

Brew , once you decide what state your going to hunt , go to that states Bowsite and ask for advice . You may get a few NR crybabys but ignore them . The majority will help you out . In 2005 A CO bowsiter gave me great advice on a OTC public land spot that resulted in a very nice 6 x 6 Elk . We scored 3 out of 4 and 1 guy turned down several 4x4's while chasing the herd Bull .

I know I said focus on 1 animal but it wouldn't hurt to have a Mulie tag in your back pocket . 1989 I was hunting Elk in Northern ID . I didn't buy an OTC Mulie tag on the advice of a rancher . You guessed it , 3 rd day of the hunt I was covering a small pond/wallow when a 250 class non typical Mulie came in a had a drink at 30 yards . That still hurts .

Oh yea , we never saw an ELK in 8 days .

all great advice. the greatest thing you can find is a good partner. I am done going out for short hunts, 10 days would be my minimum..... but at 65, hard to find a partner,,,,,,,, you need someone laid back, and who is going to have fun, no matter what is thrown at you........

this year will do a solo antelope hunt in SD, just because, but would go after elk in a heartbeat.....

brewcrewmike - I hunt roadless areas, either designated Wilderness or areas that close the roads during the hunting seasons. Getting away from trailheads seems to be the key to getting away from people.

Getting information from locals is iffy - either through deception or lack of knowledge. I enjoy the mountains too much to not just head out 2-3 days each week and explore (including the fly fishing that Cheesehead mentions). The time constraint will limit your ability to do that.

Whatever you decide - have fun! Even if you don't come back with anything but memories.

Does your 7-10 days off include travel time? On a DIY hunt it can take 5 days to get into animals. If you have 10 days off, 2 days of travel time and typically a day to recover from driving and setting camp & breaking camp that leaves 6 days with your boots on the ground. If you're not experienced and on unfamiliar ground, that can be a big challenge in my opinion.

Another thing you need to consider is the gear you currently have adequate for a 7-10 day hunt?

Everyone is correct that an DIY elk hunt can be done for around $1500, but for a 1st timer, it will be a lot more expensive. I've taken a few friends elk hunting over the years and by the time they paid for all the gear they needed it would add up to over 1/2 the price of an outfitted hunt.

Not trying to steer you away from a DIY hunt, just want you to know what you're getting into.

I, like the others that contributed to your post, have accumulated gear over many years & have invested and committed to the process of applying and building points for many species in multiple states. The only real costs we have now is fuel and tags.

Looks like my friend is considering joining me on this trip. His previous knowledge, where he went, and who he used before will be a good starting point.

I think my travel time will be counted in those 10 days so yes my actual hunting time would be closer to 6-7 days.

I looked at a few outfitter pages for stuff to bring but just wondering how inclusive those actually are. What items would you all be referring to that are must haves?

Thanks again for all the advice!

brewcrew,

The gear that are must haves depend a lot on the type of hunt you will be on. Will it be a base camp style hunt or will you backpack in several miles from your truck and set up a spike camp?

My link is to a thread that is active right now on the elk forum. There are a lot of money saving ideas in this thread.

The most important thing you will need is a pair of good boots that are well broke in. Bad boots can ruin an elk hunt faster than anything else. I would go into the "search" function and search on boots on the elk forum. You will find endless information on boots. I would recommend a good pair of non-insulated hiking/backpacking style boots and avoid boots like Danner Pronghorns if you're hunting in September. Although Pronghorns are comfortable (I've owned a couple pairs) they don't have the amount of support and aren't durable enough for strenuous mountain hunting. Other's may disagree but that's my opinion.

Your whitetail bow setup should be fine as long as your arrows aren't too light; they should be around 400 grains minimum. Heavier is better for elk. Personally I would avoid mechanical broadheads for elk.

You'll need at least a day pack or fanny/lumbar pack and some kind of pack frame if you plan to pack out elk on your back. Again my link has some ideas and suggestions on packs.

You'll probably want some lightweight packable rain gear, I recommend Cabela's Space Rain but there are cheaper options.

You might need a light/warm sleeping bag and a tent or shelter depending on the type of hunt you're going to do.

You'll probably want a rangefinder if you don't already have one.

Some decent binoculars are nice but I don't carry mine all the time since I don't do a lot of glassing and my 8x rangfinder will suffice.

You'll need some elk calls. Check out Elk101 and Elknut...

You'll need some game bags. I recommend Allen Backcountry Meat Bags; you can get them at Fleet Farm.

I guess that's enough for now. I can help with other specific questions if you have them...

If you're going to car camp that makes things easier. Any old camping gear will do. If it's going to be a backpack style hunt the gear list changes for me Must haves in my opinion are comfortable boots, high quality socks, pack that can haul heavy loads and good rain gear.

I am not the hunter that cheesehead is, I am sure, but I have a great list, for back pack hunt. gave it to a guy last year, who went out for the first time.

anyway if you would like a copy, send me a pm....

cheesehead always has good info

Thanks for the link Cheeshead - I'm checking it out as I type back some feedback.

I have a good pair of cold weather boots (800 gr) but these wouldn't be good boots to use if the temps are above 20. My feet would die! I'll look into finding a good pair of hiking boots. I live not too far from Cabela's in Richfield so I'll keep an eye out for a good deal.

I'm actually thinking I will take my Remington 700 30-06 on this trip over my bow. I just got into bow hunting three years ago and I haven't gotten a whitetail deer yet with a bow.

I've got two fanny/lumbar packs (one blaze orange and another camo). My camo one is a pretty cheap one but it has plenty of room for the things I typically take out with me.

I don't have any rain gear so this would be another thing I'll have to keep an eye out for. Typically after the season they run pretty good prices on the stuff that hasn't sold. That's how I bought pretty much all the camo I have for deer hunting now. That stuff is all scent lok but its not good in the rain.

Sleeping bag I have a few different options. I've got a few light and a few heavier ones. I've got a small 2-3 person tent but again it's a cheap one and not going to be good for out west. I think the last time my friend went they had a base camp set up for them so I may not need to worry about a tent.

I actually got a real nice range finder and binocular combo for my birthday this past year. When I was bow hunting I didn't even bother with the binoculars I used the range finder instead. I actually didn't pack my binoculars for late season.

I'll check with my friend to see if they go any elk calls the last time they went out that way.

I think the outfitter that we would select we would pay for someone to pack the animal out for us.

Cheesehead again thanks for the good list to start on!

You're welcome brewcrew.

All of my elk hunting experience has been in September so I haven't been in the mountians during rifle season when you might get more snow and cold weather.

I would probably reconsider my boot suggestions for a rifle hunt. You'll probably want some taller boots and maybe something with 200g of insulation.

Another good thing to have is a good pair of waterproof leg gaiters especially when you could have snow. I wear mine a lot with my hiking boots in the morning when the grass is wet, if it's raining or if there's snow on the ground. Depending on how much snow you get on your hunt a pair of hikers and the gaiters might work fine for you. I would check with the outfitter or other guys that have hunted there on what they recommend. Either way, I wouldn't cut corners on boots.

Also as someone recommended, good socks. I own at least 15 pairs of smartwool or other brands of merino wool socks. Merino wool socks are fantastic and really help prevent blisters.

You'll probably want some kind of water filter or water treatment tablets too

here is another tip. make yourself a 911 card, laminate it, and wear it around your neck. it will have your name and address, emergency phone number, blood type, meds, allergies etc.

This will give ems info, needed, if you are unconscious.......

1992 I was faced with such emergency, in the San Juans, however I was able to be awake and answer medical questions,

Never forgot that, and it got me to thinking.......

1998 I got altitude sickness, but was able to get down, to lower park area, and rest, but you never know

I learned the hard way with boots and I said never again. When I was younger I would sit with my dad before I could rifle hunt and I had just a cheap pair of boots from Walmart of someplace similar. My feet would get so cold! I bought myself a nice pair of 800g boots from Cabelas and my feet stay quite toasty now.

My friend learned the hard way one time too and he is the same way never skimp on boots. He slipped into a river and the outside temperature was about 5 above. He made it about another hour and then spent a good part of the rest of the day in the truck while the rest of us hunted.

I definitely wouldn't recommend trying both at one time. From what I've seen, great elk country and great mule deer country conducive to spot'n stalk hunting are not the same!

As far as timing your hunt. Something to think about if you hunt very pressured areas (even roadless). I've noticed that the last week of September has been great because many of the other hunters are headed home after the second or third.

This past season I counted 15 trucks at the main trail head in the middle of September. Hunters everywhere. The last week, ONE. I literally had most of the unit to myself and was into elk every day.

In contrast the elk are less pressured the first week but harder to find if you're not familiar with their patterns.

Brew here a link to wiggy's they are a very lite weight hip boot sleeve that is very nice to have if you have to cross a creek or boggy area. It will keep your boots dry which is a must. They are worn short term.

If you weigh your arrows and they are not at 400 grn I would not go out and buy new ones. I have shot numerous elk moose caribou bear ect my arrows are at 370gr at 70lbs. Many females and others with lower poundage bows and lower grain arrows have taken elk. Its all about shot placement and the proper broadhead. I'm sure many elk have been taken with Mechs but I also would not recommend them but that is personal opinion and is open for debate.

Being that this may be your only elk hunt I would look at the Ranching for Wildlife Hunts/Ranches in Colorado. There are several advantages to these hunts which include tags, time of year, success and weapon used. They can be pricey but they are well worth the money especial if this is a once in a life time hunt. The odds for a first timer doing it on your own on public land and being successful are against you but it can be done.

Good Luck

Good grief, is it September yet?!!!!

Does anyone know of any websites that review outfitters? I found this one through bowsite but it's somewhat clumsy to use.

"brew" I bow hunted 3 years ago with Ross Adney [Beaver trap Outfitters} in the Big Horn Mtns in WY. One unit he hunts will take 3-5 pts to draw the other 0-2 pts, you can put in this year for a pt and probably draw next year for elk. His cost is $3500-$4000, he will put you into bugling elk, he will hunt you as hard as you can take. If you want to have a good chance at an elk with the bow this a good hunt, deer are not open during bow season though. I have done the "combo" gun hunts several time and unless you schedule 7 or more days there is just not enough time.

Things have changed in WY and I think it's doubtful that you will draw those Bighorn units with 3-5 pts anymore...

Members of SCI have access to member hunt reports. Lots of good info on outfitters, both good and bad.

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