commisioner meeting?
West Virginia
Any thing new happen at game commission meeting at wheeling today
Yep, DNR Commission set a new precedent by ignoring nearly all DNR biologist's recommendations.
They moved spring turkey season to 3rd Monday in April instead of last Monday in April which was opposed by the WV NWTF. DNR offered a different solution which was shot down like a 22 lb. gobbler with 10" beard.
Then rather than adopt a cautious approach to the new crossbow season and accept the DNR's recommendation for a season that would run last Saturday of September until last Saturday in October (not to mention all of big game firearms season which is in code)...the Commission chose to make the crossbow season run concurrent with the entire archery season.
The one small win is that crossbows, since they are not bows, are not permitted in the bow-only counties. Or at least not yet.
A very disappointing day to say the least. Everyone knew this day would eventually come with all the money from manufacturers, not to mention when the Chair of House Natural Resources, who is a self-admitted class Y permit carrying crossbow hunter, insinuates from the podium if DNR didn't impose a liberal season it would be addressed in legislation AGAIN. It was clear this was a lost cause. And eventually, just like in Ohio, crossbow kills will soon out number archery kills due to the ease-of-use and rifle like features.
Sorry, you probably didn't want such a long post.
A sad day for West Virginia Sportsmen.
Well,we can offset the damage the crossbows will due by lowering the buck limit...
If not, its gonna get ugly...
The chair of the House National Resources needs to be voted out.
Well we all knew the crossbow season would come but I am confused and allowing something that you say is not a bow in the archery season. I guess that means there is no real archery only season. Hmmmm. From what I have seen in years past not much has changed.
Well we all knew the crossbow season would come but I am confused and allowing something that you say is not a bow in the archery season. I guess that means there is no real archery only season. Hmmmm. From what I have seen in years past not much has changed.
I can't help but to get a lil disgruntled by all of this. What you are essentially saying is that the hunting seasons are set by people other than the experts that should be setting the seasons based on biology. Unreal. Well I am too old and tired to worry about it. I will hunt with my recurve on my land.
If the commission allowed crossbows because of all the money that the manufacturers spend you surely don't think they will drop the buck limit which will cost them money. Won't happen.
As far as not allowing the crossbows in bow only counties what is the logic behind that. If there will not be a bigger deer kill in the other counties there will surely not be a bigger kill in the other counties. I would be interested to know how many of the commissioners bow hunt in the bow only counties. Hmmmm.
Wouldn't surprise me if they started selling extra tags just for crossbow. They are not worried about biology or bigger healthier deer herds all they are after is the root of all evil the almighty green back dollar it self that's just my opinion
You are right. all about the money. But I guess its a business too. I never thought I would ever see the day where WV did not have bow season. I know, I know many consider it a bow but I don't. But what do I know. I have $1500 acres to hunt on to hunt with what I want so I guess I shouldn't complain. I just have to manage my property for deer and not worry about the what the state does.
The xgun season is truly a slap in the face of bow hunters.
I don't like to talk politics but this "NEW Leader ship" that we have in House and the senate have under mined bow hunters, DNR officials and hunters in general in there last session. This is change that they can keep, I don't want it.
I don't know why they want to protect the bow only counties, unless some of the commissioners must own or lease land to hunt on in those counties. Sounds like a case of "do as I say, not as I do" with the commissioners.
What about bag limits for the xguns? Will it be the same as bow season or will it be more? Will the xgun users be able to tag out with there xguns and then pick up a real bow and keep on hunting?
The good ole days of "BOW HUNTING" are now gone.
I’ll try to explain this for babysaph because you seem to have a hard time following this.
1. The Commission didn’t allow the crossbows because of all the money backed manufacturers; the crossbows were made law by the legislature. The manufacturers certainly market their products but without looking at specific campaign financial statements it would be hard to say how much the money factor truly had. I suspect the reason legislation made it this year had a lot to do with a personal interest a.k.a. as a “pet project” and the change in “leadership” as Steel force mentioned.
2. As far as the logic for keeping the crossbows out of the bow only counties, the Commission actually chose to be more cautious and not liberalize those counties and subject them to a potential over harvest. I personally find it strange they didn’t consider this for the other 51 counties but I’m at least glad they protected those counties. I’d also like to think it is because they do recognize the crossbow is not a bow and why they didn’t open them for xbows. In any event, we should be glad the resource in those counties was protected rather than question motives.
There seems to be some implication that the Commissioners who may hunt in those counties got some kind of favor. Three of the 4 actual bow hunters on the Commission did not support the motion so what you are trying to imply doesn’t hold water.
Bennett, I would actually welcome the creation and selling of tags specific for crossbows. That way they can be counted and not ride the shirt tails of what bow hunters have been able to accomplish for 3 ½ decades.
Steel force, you asked the question about bag limits. It appears for this year crossbows will be able to use RB tags but they cannot double dip (can’t take 3 with a bow and 3 with xbow). Ink still isn’t dry on that because it is very confusing the way legislation was worded. It is something we will be keeping a close eye on to see what kinds of implications this will have on the resource.
The saddest part in all of this is how much politics has gotten into the practice of wildlife management which should be governed by science and not politics and personal agendas.
Again, sorry for the long post.
You are right I have a hard time understanding. You said the commissioners ignored the recommendations for the crossbow season as recommended by the DNR. So did the legislature dictate when the crossbow season would be or the commissioners? You made it sound like the commissioners staged it should be a season long crossbow season. Which is it? If the commissioners voted for a season long season then yes that is on them. If the legislature sets the season then why do we need the commissioners?
And if you don't think money was involved well then. Lol
How can there be an over harvest in just the bow only areas? Lol. It's ok for an over harvest in the other counties? I thought the crossbow followers said there would not be an over harvest. I may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer but you can't have it both ways. And the reason the commissioners don't want an over harvest in the bow only counties is because they hunt there. Duh. So there are only 4 game commissioners and 3 of the 4 voted to allow crossbows in the bow only areas? If they voted on it then they couldnt get a favor from the legislature since they set the seasons. I do agree that the seasons are not based on science. Since the commissioners are appointed they can not be voted out. Good ole boy politics. More of the same. And the effort of what Bowhunters have done has been wiped out anyway with the passage of crossbows., and here is the deal. If crossbows are bows they belong in the bow season. iif not then we have lost our bow only season. Talk about wiping out 3 1/2 decades of effort.
I don't know why I get so worked up about it.,no crossbows allowed on my land so no biggie. I am sorry for the rant.
I stand corrected. Apparently there are more than 4 commissioners. My bad.
Think about who you vote for. The same politicians that got crossbows blocked Sunday hunting legislation.
J.R., there are 7 commissioners on the panel. Yea or nay vote and it was asked that all in favor say yea. 4 voted yea. That meant it passed. Its a simple vote. 3 commissioners did not vote yea.
The commissioners job is an unpaid position and has no financial benefits.
I agree with what Sundaynwv said also
Will the 2016 spring gobbler season stay the same number of weeks, thus having it close earlier than it does now? I have always liked late season gobbler hunting.
Pass Through, I am with you. It hit me yesterday that I will be loosing "my" favorite week to hunt. When it sank in, it was not a good feeling.
Unpaid, appointed positions, and they can override the "advice" of trained well educated professionals on issues involving our states wildlife!
I for one am starting to think this is an issue that needs to be corrected!
Commissioners should not be political favors and in some cases they are not.I would rather see it as a paid position with some transparency.
I am trying to understand this. So the legislature says there needs to be a crossbow season. Is that correct? Do they dictate how long the season must be? The way I read it was the DNR wanted a month long season but that was overruled by the commissioners. Is that correct? If there is no required length to the season then the commissioners wanted the lengthy crossbow season it seems. I really am ignorant on how things work. Why don't they just let the DNR set the seasons since they know more about it?
Because the DNR represent every citizen whether hunter or not. The commissioner's are supposed to represent the voices of the hunters and fishermen. Is it right? Probably not totally but, probably the best system unless, they do as they just did and over rule the biology of the resource.
JR, while Crossbows may not be the thing that is popular on this forum, it must have been thought to represent the most voices or, be for the best good due to being passed into legislation by our state legislature. They have to answer to their constitutes. Representing different or negatively for the masses means they get outed come election time.
I too hate losing the last week if we do. It is usually the best week for finding lone gobblers and killing them. All the while being alone in the woods.
I don't think they need paid to do their job. However, I think the biologists should get the last answer, not an appointed position.
God Bless fellas
think about what happened if got 7 commissioners who represent all sportsman and 4 are in favor of crossbow and 3 against,, majority rules... no rocket science here,,, if the other 3 take no vote on issue that may be smarter then voting against them making others mad, as those 3 may want same guys to help them on other issues they want passed,, say one buck limit etc,,, hope that makes sense....
makes perfect sense. What makes no sense is that they go against the advice of the DNR. Sounds like lots of politics. A no vote appears to have the same results as a vote against it. I say vote for the issues as you see fit and take them on a one on one bases. However I am not naive enough to think that will ever happen. Good ole boy politics. JMO.
Great thing about America everyone has the freedom of choice and can make their own decisions.
I agree JR. Totally. This is just Proof that Politics have no real role in wildlife biology other than serving the agendas of those in charge.
Totally ignore the NWTF and the WV DNR's concerns about not moving the Spring Turkey season up, while completely going along with the majority for a concurrent crossbow season. I sense a real push for another agenda shortly. Ain't it grand.
I guess 1 good thing is that with the new changes as far as the crossbows and the earlier gobbler season is we will finally find out how they will effect the numbers compared to past seasons. Hopefully the data will be used to adjust in the right direction. The DNR will get the data and bring it to the commission and they can make adjustments.
Just hope the legislators stay out of it.
With the crossbow season the same time as bow season what tags will they have? Will they be able to shoot two buck and a doe also?
I believe the entire limit during archery/crossbow season is three, one of which must be a doe. Some counties have a limit of 2. They are concurrent and use the same bag limit.
Yes they can kill the same number of deer we can as I understand it. If the DNR doesn't think there will be more deer killed then we'll .... I already know several hunters over here that have never bow hunted but have bought crossbows.
Wow, people are going out and buying hunting equipment to participate in this new opportunity. Wonder where that money goes? People who have never participated in archery before are getting involved, sounds awful.
James
U missed the point. It's not archery. And if it is why is it not allowed in the bowhunting only counties? I don't mind people being involved just shoot a bow during bow season And a crossbow in crossbow season and a gun in gun season. We were all worried about the deer numbers but I guess the commissioners are not. Oh well. I Just bought 625 more acress and it is bowhunting only. Lol.
but it is not archery/ crossbow season. They are two different seasons they just happen to run at the same time. why would they not have their own tags? Are they going to check them in as an archery kill? If so why can't they hunt in the four bowhunting only counties?
so....my question is....will there be a x-gun season limit AND a archery season limit? it appears that this was not very well thought out. LOL anyway, the slobs and out of state gang are gonna LOVE this.
I can see it now, a bi-pod mounted x-gun sitting on top of the beer cooler that's sitting on the front rack of the trusty ol 4-wheeler.
...and a yearling spike on the back rack of the trusty ol 4-wheeler.
JR, you really missed the point. It wasn't the DNR that set the new season. It was the commissioner's. God Bless
Agree wv bownut. I think they can substitute the crossbow for the bow. We now have no bowhunting only
I know that wv mountaineer. The dnr suggested one thing and the commissioners did their own thing. . I already knew that
On my property no crossbows allowed. Lol.
Welcome to West Virginia.......What a sad day indeed...I knew it would happen since we are dealing with money and this state loves to sell its hunting heritage off to the highest bidder,,,, What a joke. One day it will all be gone, what will they do to generate money then??
I have been following this thread since it started and understand the emotions involved. However, is it just me or are there some holes in the story? Can someone please share the sticky notes, the back story, the missing tidbits that are not well known or being left out. When 2+2=3 something is up. Who attended the commission meeting and can share how it all went down?
I'm sure you are right Wvmule. There is more to the story but the bottom line is our commissioners and legislature allowed crossbows in our bow season. That is something that the bowhunters used to fight tooth and nail. Things are changing and everone wants things the easy way. Our whole country is like that.,it is a sad day that we now do not have a bowhunting season in WV. It is up to us private landowners to police our own land and not allow them on our property. I will do my part. My girl friend asked me why I get so pissed about it. She is right because I'm getting old and have my own land so it really doesn't effect me. It just gets my blood pressure up. But if we all give in,well you can see what happens. Kids now will be started out hunting with the crossbow and will not get interested in bowhunting, I can't wait to see all the crossbows in the archery in the school shoots.
Well - my hope is that with keeping it a separate season from bow season- that if the harvest goes overboard then they will shorten crossbow season - I guess only time will tell on that, but I won't hold my breath on it!
No matter what the issue is - it is like things must be given away instead of earned or acheived.
Scary part is - I just saw an article where they say its only a matter of time before crossbows will be allowed in the 4 bow only counties.
I blame it all on Gobbler! LOL I bet he was biting his lip during that meeting!
They need to keep it a separate season. But by having the bag limit of three for archery or crossbow that does not seem like it is separate. I'm sure there is a "reason" behind not having it in the four bowhunting only counties (probably a deal was made). If it was because of overharvest then it should not be allowed in Jackson county either, because the liberal doe seasons have decimated our deer heard here as well.
I agree with yoy wv bownut.,they can run it concurrent with our season and still call it a separate season but I'm not buying it. As it stands we now have no bow only season. Pretty sad.
Based on the new formula, the spring gobbler season will open any time from April 15 to April 21. Next year it will open on April 18. I'd like to see W.Va. consider going to a five-week season so that the hunt extends into latter May. There isn't much pressure at all at that time and it would provide additional hunting opportunity for those who like being out there when hens are on the nest and gobblers still prowl. The Md. season runs April 18 through May 23 every year and it has not been to the detriment of the turkey population, even though the harvests in Garrett and Allegany counties is usually higher than the harvests in nearby W.Va. counties such as Mineral and Hampshire.
Can I use my crossbow during muzzleloader season?
James
In our part of the state, Mason county, a week earlier turkey season is good. I know it is bad for other counties.
The other bad part of turkey hunting in Mason county is the numbers are extremely low, coyotes are taking over. Deer numbers are way down also.
http://www.wvgazette.com/article/20150509/GZ07/150509253/1187
do we have a definite answer on bow season or crossbow season bag limits?
I agree hookman, I hunt Mason Co. also. So far this season, I've seen one gobbler and he was staying 60+ yards back in the woods. Been a tough season.
I ask again can I hunt with my crossbow during muzzleloader season? Does anyone know?
James
Well can you hunt with your compound during mz season. I think you can. Since they are saying a compound is a regular bow (they are allowed in our bow season) then I would say yes. If not then it would mean the commissioners allowed a special season for them which is exactly the same as our bow season. Guess we will have to wait til the new regs come out. I was wondering if I could ground hog hunt or turkey hunt with one.
You are not allowed to substitute a bow for a muzzleloader. That is why I am asking.
James
Well then I would say no.
yes you can use a crossbow during muzzlegun, just like you could use a bow. you cant shoot one with a bow and check it with a muzzlegun stamp.
I hope this helps clear some questions up.
James
Here is the answer as of this season on my question about substituting a bow or crossbow for a muzzleloader. You can not substitute, you may hunt if seasons are concurrent.
It is on the 2nd page.
James
the question was can you hunt with a crossbow during muzzlegun...you did not ask if you could substitute.
since the state made crossbow season concurrent with archery season, you may crossbow hunt during muzzlegun season. like you posted though, you cant substitute a xbow for muzzlegun.
Wonder why you can't substitute a crossbow for a mz?
Never understood that rule.
its like substiuting hannah davis for rosie odonnell, the two are nothing alike.
I think I could kill a deer with an inline mz easier than a bow.
