Really need a hidden gps option for these cameras. As well as better cover cameras to be hidden. For when they are just dumping crap on baits.
However the DNR agent, should have given you direction, and who to report this too, assist you in the proper avenue, to have this investigated, and than complete a follow up call to you, to see how things go......
Its what a professional should do, and no one is that busy, with social media, its pretty easy to keep track of everything...
Heck I use to have to keep a memo book, that is when everything was hand written, and that is what I did during my LE career......
From the photo you posted? Did le positively id them from that same photo?
I am betting that this sheriff won't be getting any re-election contributions from anyone in your circle of friends. If you haven't already talked to the sheriff himself you should.
Most issues last several years have been these guys. Some issues by others. But when you are all over the place. Bound to run into a few jack wagons.
I am not the only one these guys harass. Another guy that use to hunt with them gets same treatment. Go out of their way to harass a land owner regularly. He is a great guy. Just dont want a box of barking dogs sitting at end of driveway. But that cannot be respected by these guys.
Yes, all my cameras are marked in plain sight as required by law. Then marked with my name in at least 2 other spots. Along with more hidden marks.
Now, I have been warned by a couple of people. They are planning to use xylitol on us. Already been watching for this, and carry at all times. Stuff to hopefully counter act it.
Finally did hear from my local warden yesterday. More of the same BS. One thing we both agreed on though. Is it is going to get worse before it gets better. That when contact is made with them regarding me. Is only going it rile them up. I'm ready for it though. One of my motivators for getting back in shape. Dropped 60lbs already this year! I'm in about the best shape of my life right now. Cardio not what it was when I was still an athlete. But I am stronger now than then. Both physically, and mentally ready for the coming battles!
Sad it has to come to this. But when the law fails you..................
The only thing I'm getting here is someone is stealing your cameras. Go file a theft complaint with the Sheriff's Office and if you know who did it and have the photo, give it to them.
Now...if they wont help you, talk to an immediate supervisor and ask why.
If that doesn't work talk to the Chief Deputy or the Sheriff himself and ask why there is no movement on your complaint.
Guys are right WDNR does not handle theft/trespass.
As far as the other "harassment" I'm not tracking. Sounds like a pissing match between several groups of hounders.
I'm speculating that both the wardens and the deputies have heard from not only you but the other "violators" you speak of on a fairly routine basis.
I'm also expecting that there is allot of "He said - she said" going on between the groups.
If you have solid undisputable evidence (photo) and you can identify the suspect there should be no reason LE would not help you.
These guys never call the law only run from it! Sheriff would handle the theft. Not only cameras, but the stumps as well. Stumps may not seem like much. But they are hard to find, and not cheap to buy. Need to find a good legal way to mark them. I know 4 of the ones taken last year are in use by these guys right now! The rest of the stuff would be handled by the wardens. The hunter harassment. Tampering with bait sites. Illegal dumping. (garbage at baits), Dumping of chemicals, Dumping broken glass, and nails on trials. A real laundry list of stuff with these guys.
Blows me away the FCC will give a citation, but not the DNR for the same thing. Should have been charged with that, and reckless endangerment!
Almost forgot the disorderly conduct. In a few hours I would bet my last dollar this will be broken. They go out of their way to harass and intimidate landowners, and the general public. Several tickets were not issued because landowners would not press charges. Because they are afraid of this guy! One person it's almost a daily occurrence. He will call me and complain. But wont call the sheriff. I really think he is scared too. They got a trespassing ticket right behind this guy a few days ago. Would think that would make them vacate area. Nope right back at it next day. Put in a couple new baits in that area last few days. One is literally 50ft from private property. If there is not some intent with that. Dont know what it is.
It is a well know fact. That every single bait these guys have is illegal. Nothing has been done about this. Little tickets not worth the time. But they add up fast. Besides it could also be a much larger ticket. Illegal bear harvest. How would you like to be hunting with them, and loose your bear because of an illegal bait!
The guy already dodged 2 of the illegal bear kill tickets. Gave enough information on another. That any rookie could have followed up on and issued citations for. A LEO was even part of this kill!
Then there is the viscous dogs that will attack yours at any opportunity. Been warning people about this and most brush it off. One guy wishes he had listened. As his dogs were attacked in his yard last fall. His dogs being 100+ lbs gave a butt whopping. Still the guy never called the law. Friends with local warden, adn didnt even tell him! WHY? SCARED?
Then there is the poaching on fishing side too. Gave them the lakes they like to frequent to do this on. Because they never seen a warden in the area. Been out several times with them. When I was told . If you weren't here would be keeping these. Then I guess it's good I'm here.
I can back up every one of my statements with hard evidence. No he said she said crap. PROOF POSITIVE! They want the big tickets, not the little stuff.
I really hope the deputy I spoke with is as sincere as he sounded. Happens to hold the record for arrests in that county. Maybe he will give the right push to put a stop to this.
Right now I have to wonder if I don't have another snake in the grass. Found out these guys were out running the baits last night. So no doubt they will be running them this morning. Had a mutual friend call asking if I was hunting in morning and if he could go. Never heard a word from him after I said yes. A red flag went up right away. Since a few days ago this guy told me latest stuff was a good reason for him to stay out of woods. Makes one wonder a bit what his intent with that call was.
This is much bigger than just me with these guys. They are the bad apples we all talk about.
Kids are waiting on me better get off here!
Many of the issues you refer to come from lack of scouting. An established bear bait is very obvious. So why put a bait near an established bait. Unless of course you are hoping to play off that bait.
This is a full time job for some of us!
LE can id from that pic?
I understand you think you know who it is, but I'm seeing the back of a guy wearing a white shirt and maybe a hat, maybe not a hat, maybe brown hair.
I've had several experiences with trespassers, and pics of trespassers, and LE dealings because of trespassers. That said, if all I had for proof was the pic you posted of the back end of a guy (or gal) I wouldn't expect LE to be able to do very much with it. Is this the hold up with LE, are they saying they need more proof?
Believe me I feel your pain. I just got done burning my DNR customer ID number into 2 bait logs to replace the ones stolen last week. No cameras stolen, just the bait logs. The SOB's put their cap over the camera before going in and stealing the logs.
The only legal way I know of to mark the logs. Mine were on private land. Haven't had any more issues on public land, but the crazy part of the season is just starting.
Good luck!
Yup, I had four hollowed out bait stumps stolen 4 years ago. They also dumped bleach on one of the bait sites.
Yes, OH YES! Stumps. Last year had 7 stolen right off the bat. Same baits were gassed night of June 30th. Several cameras stolen from them last year as well. 3 stumps taken this year so far.
Guess where I found a couple of them!!! Not normal trees to be found around here so pretty distinctive.
I need to get a wood burner and do the same thing. Got a little generator that would work perfect for that. A deputy thought maybe sinking a nail or something might make them identifiable secretly. Not checked with warden, but I think that would be illegal. However, instead of stealing them. They would just be smashed instead.
I cannot come to grips with this mentality. I come across baits, cameras, stands all the time. Never do I see, or feel a need to mess with them. Just move along making a mental note. So I can avoid them in the future.
So much land out there to hunt. No reason we all cant share the woods!
If I were you I would be looking at more private land to lease or get permission to guide on. Personally I would be very leary of hunting with a guide that hunted on public land in Wisconsin because I know that there's a decent chance of being messed with by other hunters, berry pickers, etc.
Like I said there is millions of acres of land to hunt up here. I dont claim any of it. I only hunt a very small area in perspective. Plenty of other places to hunt. Really I don't understand your point. Because I am a guide. I should have to change spots every year. That does not make sense. Should that not apply to deer hunters then as well. I been deer hunting the same spot for 25yrs. Do I need to move? Got a few old boys that have been hunting deer where I bear hunt for 40yrs. We I see them next month. SHould I tell them they need to move. Because its not fair to others they are hunting same area year after year.
Lease land? You must be crazy. People hardly want to pay rates now. Even then there is no profit in what I do with bear. Now I got to crank up prices to try to find land to lease. Never seen a parcel for lease up this way either.
Even if most of my baits were on private. It would not matter. These guys would be all over them as well. SO nothing has been gained except a much larger expense.
If le can't identify from that pic alone (like Steve admitted) doesn't that seem like an explanation for le "not doing anything with this"? What do you people expect le to do with basically no proof?
Anyway, hope you get some resolution to this soon Steve; it sucks I'm sure.
When Steve and others he knows can identify the people from the pics, that is one heck of a starting point. Present the idiot with the pic telling him he's on camera and his reaction will be telling. To me, it sounds like the LEOs just don't want to deal with it.
Sadly, I think it just took a turn for the worse. Contact was made with them today, and the cameras came up. Among other things. So like other LEO's have already stated. Believe this will now go to another level. Funny part was they were caught in a flat lie.
Worse yet is it being well known these guys do not have a single legal bait. But, nothing has ever been done about it. I reminded a warden of this again yesterday. Asking him point blank have you even checked thier baits at all recently. NOPE!!!
Even worse is the rash of new baits that have been put out. In spots we argued about for years. I would not allow it because of the proximity to houses and private property. That's exactly where they are now. Scouting a few days ago. I found several of them. All I could say is WTF. Odds are very high dogs will be in those yards. They dont care though. Just like last winter when they blasted at a yote with a rifle from across the road directly at a house. While kids were outside playing as well. There were a couple of citations issued, but they dont care. Will keep right at it.
Good thing in a way is. That I know many of these landowners. They know I would never do this type of thing. However, if something were to happen. With my dogs ending up nearby. I have permission to do what is needed. Been told many times you do not need to call, or stop. Just go. ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! If my dogs or I end up where we dont wish to be. I will call, or stop every single time. At least this way they know it is me. If not call the law immediately! Most said they would not, but this year they are finally starting too.
I hope we are all wrong. That today's contact will keep them away. But after 3yrs of this crap. I highly doubt it! Really should not be that hard to catch them red handed with the proper help. Since they only mess with certain baits. The reason is they are less likely to be seen going to them. Other strings to get in must pass many homes where they would be easily seen. Which is good, at least I got some not being messed with at all!!
A starting point? What does that mean? Because a couple of guys think they can positively id a guy in a pic that means le should take their word for it and start writing tickets? Do you actually believe that? That's like me seeing someone speeding then getting upset at le when they won't take my word for it and write a ticket. Dumb
"Present the idiot with the pic telling him he's on camera and his reaction will be telling."
Telling? Again, what does that mean? So if Steve tells the guy he's on camera and shows him that pic and thinks he notices a "telling" reaction, I imagine you think le should write some tickets based on Steve's observation of the guy's reaction? More dumb
"To me, it sounds like the LEOs just don't want to deal with it."
After reading some of Steve's posts (including the last one) I don't blame them.
Sounds as if this is and has been a peeing match between 2 groups of guys that have probably been wasting le and the warden's time with silly petty crap for way too long, and le is probably tired of it. Much like when a couple of neighbors can't handle their own crap and keep calling the law out to mediate and babysit.
A peeing match constitutes two parties be involved. Well I stay as far away from them as possible. Don't steal from them, don't mess with their baits, dont gas their baits. Have surely not killed one of their dogs either. Or, block radio communication on a privately licensed channel. I surely dont drive 30 miles to hunt their backyard and cause problems. If it's a peeing match, guess I'm out of ammo.
Don't believe even half of what I'm saying. Come talk to some of these land owners. Who are being harassed almost on a daily basis this time of year. Some that wont make a call because they are afraid of these guys.
Dont believe their baits are all illegal. Check them out for yourself. I'll give you the GPS cords.
Don't believe the viscious dog thing. I can give you many names to verify that. But contact the only guy that lives on Stone Lake Rd. Who's dogs were attacked in his yard last year!!
Just so much more that is very easily verified by talking to others that are affected!
Want to talk about the illegal deer baiting and stands? Or how about the poaching of fish as well.
This is a lot bigger than I have been telling you!!
So then the LEO confronts the person and shows the person they have a pic of them where the cameras were stolen. It'll be damn obvious to the LE if that is the person or not from how they react. Again, this is the Eagle River/St Germain area. What else do they have to do there?
"No, I do not expect a ticket from a pic that cannot provide proof positive ID to a jury. But, I do expect the law to do it's job, and at least investigate. "
Yep, they can take that pic with them and just tell the guy he's been identified by others, show the pic, and then he'll start spouting his side of the story. LEOs have worked off far less. But, it will come to bloodshead with nothing being done.
And preacher, not everyone that disagrees with you is Ron believe it or not, even if they call you preacher. ;-) Apparently you are like a few others here that are so obsessed with Ron you try and tell yourself he is here in disguise and you're actually talking to him on this forum. Personally I didn't find Ron to be quite as awesome as you did, although he was pretty great. You must admit, anyone that can twist someone's mind to the point that they obsess about him 24/7 definitely has some skills. I would love to know if it's going to take medication to help you get over this or if you're gonna kick it on your own, so if you could report back when/if you get healthy again that would be great thanks.
Back when I was in the 8th grade. We were living in Crestview. A small berg that part of Racine. On the very north most part of town. My best friend was a year older. Being he was now a high schooler, We did not hang out as much. It wasnt cool I guess. I had taken up with a couple of guys with a like interest. Rode bikes all over hell back then. These guys liked to ride, so we rode. Was told by some they were bad news. Never seen any of that. We just rode our bikes. Nothing more, and never anything that was wrong. What I didnt know is I was being played.
Then one day a knock came to the door. It was the crestview police. I was being arrested! Got hauled off and thrown into secure juvenile lockup for 9 solid days! I mean secure. Locked in small cell all for but a couple hours a day. Then into a very small room. Basically the size of 4 cells squared. My windows view was of the big clock downtown. Still to this day see that clock clear as a bell.
Now I had done nothing wrong. But was arrested for Burglary of my best friends house!!! I did not do it!! The police did not believe one bit of it. They had a witness. Which was then backed up by the one of these 2 guys. The lacke of the pair. The witness was the neighbor lady. She had seen 2 kids running away from the scene into the woods from a distance. All she could see to identify. Was the kid in the back. He had blonde hair. That was it. That was enough for the arrest. There was NO OTHER EVIDENCE!! Now the other kid they had dead to rights. Had his shoe prints in the basement, and finger prints all over the house. Presuring him for the ID of his partner. He gave them my name. Trying to protect his friend. That if convicted was going away for a long time because of his record.
He stuck to his story, as did I. My father believed me. Stood up for me like most fathers would. Hired a family attorney. Who also hired an investigator. Police were told it had to be this other kid. We had the same build, and of course both blonde hair! Right to jury trial we went. I remeber thinking why is this other kid here? He came to the trial for some reason. Finally his buddy with hard evidence against took the stand. My lawyer started in in him. Started to break him down. Tripped him up, and caught him in the lie. Just as he screwed up, and let it out. The other kid burst in screaming and yelling at him. With threats for revealing the truth. The other kid was then arrested in the court room. The case against me was obviously dismissed.
My name was cleared, but it did not matter one bit. Not only did I instantly become an outcast. So did my entire family. We were actually forced for the most part to move. Literally nobody would tale to us. Threats were still made. Not even my best friend would speak to me. So about 3 weeks into my freshman year we moved to Mukwonago for a fresh start. That's were it probably worked out. Far better school than the Gimore JR high, and of course Horlick High. A far superior football team. Where I ended up all conference. Had coaches that made a huge impact. Years later 9 of us became track coaches. 3 of us by some twist of fate ended up here, and coaching together. So in the end it really was for the best.
Arrested, locked up, disgraced, made an outcast. From an ID at a distance based on hair color alone. This lady did not know me. Like I know my former partners. Now am I 100% sure this pic is him. NO! There is that .oo1% chance of reasonable doubt. I could be wrong. Really dont believe so. But I could be. But still there is enough for an investigation. Especially with all the other crap, and the hard evidence that supports it.
I know it's quite the story. A bit hard to believe. Still really don't believe myself that it happened. But it did. If you have trouble with it. Fell free to verify it. Call the family lawyers. Tell them I said it was ok to verify it. Marjan Kmiec was the lawyer. His son Steve also a lawyer he could verify as well. Maybe legal reasons would prevent it. But, my friend Eric Hatiaja. Would not be bound by these legal aspects. He might recall it happening 30+ years ago. Ask him, again I said it was ok. Many of you might have heard of him. We both became guides. His is Big Fish Guide service out of Milwaukee. My good friend Shane Brossman of Brossman's meat market in Racine could verify it as well. One of the very few that stuck by me.
Perhaps a bit too personal, but you can see by this example. How a solid partial ID can be enough for a conviction.
Nice read Steve. I hope you have a banner year with the bears. I know how hard you work for your clients and that guiding bears is not a money maker.
Kind of hoping these jack wagons do something stupid this next week. Got some southern boys coming to train for the week. Different mentality that dont deal well with BS. I should share some pics with y'all. (working on my southern drawl, LOL) They called couple hours ago at halfway mark. Said we are over our limit on dogs hope it's ok. Got me scrambling setting up extra houses and such. They are bringing 17!!! OHHHH BOY!!!! WIth mine that is 28 in my yard for the week!!! Funny thing is, IT WILL BE QUIET AS A CHURCH!! Would not think so, but it will be. Will also be a whole lot of fun. A lot of work on my end the word understatement does no justice to!!
Good thing though, I made a new friend. Going to let the neighbors know about me before I talk to them. Although I do everything to stay away from there. First time I ever had a dog end up in those houses though. If a bear we are pursuing goes across that road. It is never near those houses. Never even stays up that way even. Normally just blow right down into the worst hell hole in area!
Guests even said after I cam back to them. People really dont like that guy do they, LOL
Also we have a lot of nice bears in Iron, near Amasa, and in Baraga, so your posts are very somewhat skeptical,,,,,,, well whatever...
You are right about one thing, the hunting up here is poor, stay home........
Just put a bid in for a year round home up here, too crowded by 70.....
stay well
I do know waht you are talking about though. Like deer or any other critter. Population pockets I guess is the best summary. The number of MI guys coming to WI does say an aweful lot. Cant think of town right now. East of me hour or so. South Iron Moutian area. Sold 30 licenses June 30 alone. More in one day than the total. Just got off phone with buddy from keewenaw. More of the same stuff. Seems the border counties have better numbers. Talked to buudy from Trout creek couple days ago. Not one bear in yard yet this year. Same for his neighbor Blue Ridge Outfitters I believe is the name.
In a way much the same here with deer. Real tough to find even a P&Y buck around here. Real easy to do south of me though.
My door is always open!
Mike F's Link
"I was over talking with my bear bait dealer this afternoon and he informed me Rod Coronado is up in our neck of the woods now.
For those of you that aren't real familiar with Coronado, here's his bio."
Here is a link to some of his background
Whats real funny is the guys causing issues. Are now telling people I'm stealing there cameras. The one was just ranting to a friend of mine about it. Could not even keep his story straight during the rant. Out of town for a month, but did this and that. Here the last few weeks. Then havent being seeing any bear while hunting. HMMMM how you doing this if out of town. Dummies!!
I don't have a bear tag this year but makes me feel like loading up the truck with a bunch of bait pails and the 4 wheeler and just go 'trolling' around on the forest roads.
Nice comments Jim. I agree that a bear hitting your bait could just as easily hit theirs and visa versa, so unless one location offered much better security (wind ect.)both parties could benefit from baits in proximity to each other.
