Turkeyhunter's Link
Turkeyhunter's Link
Not a "safari" fan (and wouldn't be even if a millionaire), but I'd rather see legal "hunts" than the poaching that is rampant in Africa. This one, obviously, was not a positive.
The photo of the dentist with bow and a lion here (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3177303/PICTURED-American-dentist-passion-hunting-killed-Cecil-Lion-bow-arrow-Zimbabwe.html) says it's not the same lion. Does mention how he's shot most of the P&Y animals with "bow" yet one has to wonder, bow or crossbow?
And RC, only you would mention the separate crossbow license.
When I explained how many " hunters " hunted Africa compared to the total # of hunters in the US , that calmed them down .
To many hunters out there have lost sight on why the started hunting to begind with .
Really, how different is it from the bison hunts in Wyoming for animals that wander out of Yellowstone?
The two Zimbabwean men appeared at the Hwange magistrate’s court on Wednesday, according to the Associated Press. They were charged with poaching offenses and for not having the required hunting permit, according to the BBC, which reported that the men were granted bail of $1,000 each and ordered to appear in court again next week.
Palmer shot Cecil with a bow and arrow, injuring it, according to an account detailed by non-governmental group, Zimbabwe Conservation Task Force. After tracking the 13-year-old lion for about 40 hours, Palmer is alleged to have killed the animal with a gun."
Baiting, poaching and crappy shot placement. It's going to be a tall order to put a positive spin on this.
Crappy shot placement was most probably not done intentionally, unless this guy has a history of intentionally wounding animals (maybe that is how he keeps his taxidermy bill down?).
Is anyone inferring that following up a wounded animal and trying to dispatch it with a rifle is cruel, inhumane or illegal?
To each his own but before I formed any opinions, I'd want to know more about the facts before using statements by conservationists of whom I knew nothing about.
He paid 54k for a lion hunt and I would imagine there would be a huge trophy fee on top of it. He went to a game farm and a lion walked into his bait. He shot it. I guess I would not condemn him based on these facts. We are assuming he knew of Cecil and that the guide lured the lion out.
If I hired an outfitter to go on a sheep hunt(some places require a guide). He packs me in miles into the wilderness and without my knowledge, crosses over into a wildlife refuge. I shoot my sheep. Did I poach? By definition, yes but did I intentionally poach, no. I had no knowledge the animal was off limits.
If this is the situation, I feel sorry for the guy. His life and family is being ruined for something not intended.
I'm not a fan of these hunts, to each their own. I personally don't shoot what I don't eat like big cats, elephants, rhinos and bear(I guess you can swallow bear breakfast sausages fried in a gallon of bacon grease with your nose pinched).
There is still a lot to be heard in this case.
I am sure ethical hunters will have to answer questions as this progresses.
All I have to say is that this was not a hunt, a canned shoot and it will give hunting a black eye for sure.
SCI Suspends Membership of Hunter and Professional Hunter Involved in Death of Cecil
Washington, D.C. – Safari Club International (SCI) supports a full and thorough investigation of the circumstances surrounding the death of Cecil the lion in Zimbabwe. SCI has imposed immediate emergency membership suspensions of both the involved hunter and his guide/professional hunter, and they will remain in place pending the outcome of an investigation.
Safari Club International condemns unlawful and unethical hunting practices. SCI supports only legal hunting practices and those who comply with all applicable hunting rules and regulations, and SCI believes that those who intentionally take wildlife illegally should be prosecuted and punished to the maximum extent allowed by law.
Safari Club International is a 501(c)4 corporation, has approximately 47,000 members worldwide, many of whom also hunt worldwide. Safari Club's missions include the conservation of wildlife, protection of the hunter’s rights, and education of the public concerning hunting and its use as a conservation and management tool.
Another article I found I don't know if someone has posted this already
I recall watching fair chase hunts for big cats years ago where they had trackers and a professional guide along. They spot and stalked the cats. They appeared to be fair chase at the time.
Dragging a dead animal behind a vehicle to lure the cats out of the preserve is beyond unethical.
If this guy and his guide broke the laws then the laws of the land should come down swift and hard on all parties involved.
He should also not be able to hide because he live in the US. We should hand him over and let the chips fall where they may.
Turkeyhunter's Link
He's probably in hiding and lawyered-up.
Either way we should let the investigative process let the facts of this case reach the light of day.
I'll reserve judgement until then.
This is a good blog link. If he's convicted of poaching or some other crime it will be interesting to me to see how he accepts it.
There is another side to this story and I will most definitely be reserving judgment until it is heard.
Yes, if the drag were done within park boundaries I assume it would be illegal. Many other assumptions could be made. Ill withhold judgement until far more facts are out.
This is a poaching case. its too bad, because this guy, has caused a lot of damage,,,,,,,
Hunting in Africa, saves animals, brings in money for the economy, and feeds people,,,,,,
This selfish act, puts a lot of future efforts in jeopardy ........
You have to wonder now, fair or not, about his Pope and Young Entrys
He
Lots of great questions. Not knowing the laws of the land down there I can't say if it was legal or not.
Ethics are a funny thing, we are all entitled to our opinions and at the end of the day we must each live with the decisions that we make.
Is it ethical to hunt bears over bait or with the use of dogs? I believe it is.
It is ethical to hunt deer over crops? Sure.
Do I believe it is ethical to hunt over bait for deer? If it is legal where you hunt, sure.
One thing is for sure this really gives hunters a black eye...
Definitely a negative for hunters. If it is found that this guy broke the law then he should be punished.
Stagetek, while it is lot of money, it is not exorbitant nor unusual for hunters in some exotic areas to spend amounts like this.
Agreed!
All I really know is that at least half of what we are hearing is probably far from the truth. I also know that probably none of us and certainly very few of the people crying foul know what is and is not legal in that 'park' or where the cat was killed.
As far as dragging bait (scent) thru the park goes, if it actually happened I have no clue if it is legal or not there so it is just another rumor to me at this time. I bet just about every one of us has dragged a scent line at one time or another. I have done it for bear, deer, wolf, fox, yote, and probably other critters over the years.
I think SCI may have been a little premature in pulling his membership unless they have access to more reliable information than we do.
South farm, are you always judge and jury? How much of the facts do you know?
I tried to do a federal court search on him but it does not appear that normal folks are allowed to do that.
The following is not my words, they are from facebook, I could not have come up with this good comparison.
**Warning** Be mad at me if you want for what I am about to write, but I do not fit into the mold of political correctness, and never will.
Cecil the Lion from Zimbabwe was killed unjustly by a foreigner who shouldn't of been there. Cecil was suppose to be protected by Zimbabwe's National Park Patrol. Killer receives death threats from people all over the US. People who stand up for Cecil are called loving.
Kate the Human from the US was killed unjustly by a foreigner who shouldn't of been there. Kate was supposed to be protected by US border patrol. No death threats around the US. People who stand up for Kate are called racist bigots.
Right now there are US citizens looking at this photo, looking back and forth at the pictures from left, to right. Right now someone's eyes are tearing like Jimmy Kimmel's did. As their eyes fill up with water, it is because they can't help but focusing at the picture to the right, and feel no emotion to the left picture. This is the reality of our current situation. This is what we are up against....
1- Lets talk, text, blog... about something, even if I don't know what I am talking about. That's fun.
2- I don't need to think, work, or do anything for anyone but me, someone else is supposed to worry about everyone else.
Those ideas can flourish when It is considered politically incorrect to correct someone when they are wrong. The solution to someone doing something "stupid" is to require a warning be displayed to inform everyone that they shouldn't do something.
Something even worse is when congress decides a specific law need to be passed to "solve that problem". Someday there will be a law that all tires need the warning "do not put toes or feet under or near".
I work in I.T. and hears all kinds of excuses for people how did something that anyone spending 10 seconds thinking about it, wouldn't have done. Often the excuse is something along the lines if "it let me do that" or "it didn't stop me from doing it".
Sorry for the rant. But boy, my chest feels lighter.
