Contributors to this thread:
just curious to the experiences you may have had with the rage Broadhead
Good through the ribs but if you clip any other bones they seem to slow pretty quick. Just from personal experience.
I have had excellent results with all the 2 blade models. I have never tried the 3 blade models as I don't like the design of them. Despite what some may tell you, Rage is a great broadhead and it's almost impossible for it to fail. If you are not shooting a moderately heavy arrow, I would go with the 1.5" 2 blade.
I started with rage 3 blade, didn't care for them. I now use two blade 2 inch 125's and they are devastating. They shoot the same as my field points. The accompanying photo is the entry hole on a buck I shot at three yds. Almost directly below me. The arrow entered just right of the spine, exited left of sternum, destroying lung and top left of heart with complete pass through.
Here's the exit wound from a Rage two blade. Yesterday's deer didn't go very far from the point of impact - maybe 35 paces.
As some may recall I'm a BIG expandable blade kinda guy!
NAP Spitfire and Rage 2 and 3 blade have all killed deer for me.
My experiences with Rage have been all positive and I have no complaints!
I shot 2 deer with a Rage. The 1st was like all the pictures you see posted with big hole and lots of blood. The 2nd made me throw them away and not look back. The Rage looked like a wrinkled beer can with bent ferrule, broken tip and missing blades. No where near durable enough for me. In today's world of easily tunable bows, I see no reason for Rages.
" In today's world of easily tunable bows, I see no reason for Rages."
Just because some people like mechanicals doesn't mean we can't tune a bow. I tune all my bows with Thunderheads and Snuffer SS's. I just prefer the huge cutting devastation of a large mechs.
Rage wont do anything a Zwickey Delta wouldnt. The difference being instead of paying 40 bucks for 3 rage, you can get 6 Zwickeys for about 24 bucks. Re-sharpen them and shoot them until you lose them. Unless your rig wont shoot a broadhead tipped arrow, makes no sense to me. By the way, Zwickey blades arent held on by eye glass screws either. All welded. To each there own.
I have read your last two posts. I am sorry you lost your deer....... here is a basic truth,and I might get flamed for telling you this, but maybe 36 yards, should have been within 20, or wait for another day.......
I had two guys this year, both shoot nice bears with the Rage 2 blade,,,,,,, both bears were shot at 9 to 11 steps,,,,,,,, the one shot from the ground went 10 steps and fell over, and the other went no more than 40 yards.......
both guys were using heavy arrows all fmjs'... both guys were shooting over 60lb bows
every outdoor show I see, most of the arrow is sticking out, way too much......
I would shoot a zwickey any day over the rage, but hey it is what it is......
I will be the first one to tell you I have lost deer on fixed head also...... it should grind your guts, and it is not fun, but it happens, and if anyone else tells you,, they never lost an animal, than they have not done much hunting.......
reevaluate your shot, know that maybe, you should be more patient, and wait for a closer shot.....
I do not care what your are shooting, a close shot is best.....
best of luck to you this fall,,,,, done baiting bears for guys I am off to the hunt....
keep a good attitude, respect the game and hunt fair chase
I have shot many. many deer with the NAp Spitfire and the Rage and have absolutely no complaints.
Let's face it ...all about shot placement and I don't care what broad head your using - I can kill a deer with a target point - period. And so can you!
I have experienced large blood trails and good penetration. I shoot a Mathews Switchback set at 64 pounds at a 30" draw.
Use what you like, that's up too you. Me - sold and have been sold on NAP and Rage for many, many years!
Is there another head in use that produces as much bad results? A lot of problems have come forward by a lot of people. I think some of their models are junk . I used thunderheads for years both 100 and 125 . Last year tried a 3 blade rage just to see how they would perform. I had a bad experience . Quarting away shot and the arrow deflected I couldn't believe what I saw never saw a arrow do what that one did. Went back to my thunderheads . One thing I can't understand is why are there so many models ? Which one is the one? It seems like they want you to try them all . As they make changes they should take the models with problems off the shelf.
Been using the Rage 2 blade basically since they came out. LOVE THEM, killed over 20 deer with them, and almost everyone of those deer dropped within sight of my stand. Most were pass thru's as well.
Huge entry holes, in fact, I have twice been questioned by the registration station people to confirm it was a "bow kill", and not a "firearms kill" due to thee wound size.
This is what is confusing. The performance that Dampland and others experienced is what everyone is looking for. At the same time there is a enough people that have had problems that make you question there effectivness. Could be certain models like their 3 blade don't work as well as the two blade or its the tip design , not sure.
Like I've said before on hear, watch it with those mechanicals on those misty cold or damp and cold day's. They will freeze up and not open.
I've never shot them but have heard an awful lot of bad. My brother shot them for a couple years and had bad experiences and threw them all away. I have another friend who did the same. I do see a lot of poor penetration with them on the hunting shows as well.
I use the 2-blades...Awesome!! I've had zero problems with failures.
I've shot 4 deer since switching to the Rage 2-blades and all were easy tracks.
I will echo what was stated earlier on this thread...shot placement and patience!! The tip of the arrow won't do it's job if we don't do ours.
I do think there are definitely situations where a rage will cost you an animal due to poor penetration
My guess is the folks with problems, are those taking bad angle shots, trying to force the arrow through bone, shoulder blades, etc.
I only shoot quartering away or broadside, and the ONLY time I didn't get good penetration was when my bow string struck my thick coat, causing my aim to be off, and I hit the deer in the shoulder/leg bone.
Otherwise, zip, smack, Dead!
That's good Dampland!! However there are many examples of perfect hits with rages and poor penetration. One only needs to turn on the outdoor channel to see them. Very common
i just don't understand the 2 blade concept. The 2" cutting distance sounds great but it is NOT a diameter number its linear. It is cutting on one plane, for example if you hit a touch too far back and the blades are vertical on impact its a gut shot missing the lungs. The blades could be cutting 4" and its still just a gut shot. 3 and 4 blades all day. All those "good shot" rage pics we see of huge holes look great. But its the marginal or poor shots where we need broadhead performance. Fred Bear said "the 4 blade is like shooting them twice!"
"That's good Dampland!! However there are many examples of perfect hits with rages and poor penetration. One only needs to turn on the outdoor channel to see them. Very common"
The majority of the "pros" on tv are shooting light arrows and or poundage. Not a good combination for a large cut head. If you really pay attention there are quite a few fixed blade shooters on tv not getting passthroughs either. I first tried Rage heads in 2007, I actually was fully convinced that they would be junk. But I was really impressed and have killed many animals with them.
I'm a satisfied Rage user no mechanical failures yet. I will say more people use rages then any other so you will hear and see more about them good and bad. Everyone makes some really good points on here. My hunting buddy shot(Muzzy) a doe saturday night after finding it he had put a good hit on it, but it wasn't a rage blood trail is all i can say. We were on all fours several times, it was a clean kill deer only went 80 yards. I'm sure we all have heard good stories both ways..Me I just have to keep practicing in season then practice some more!!
"I will say more people use rages then any other so you will hear and see more about them good and bad."
Are you sure about that? Could you please provide the research source you got that stat from?
I don't want to see this thread get into a debate, as I doubt that was the original intent of the o.p. He did appear to be looking for information though, on people's experiences with them. There are a lot of other mechanical brands out there that people are using. Whether you look on bowsite or AT, you will see this. Bottomline, you have to put the arrow in the right spot to allow the broadhead to do its work.
WausauDug, The number of blades has nothing to do with good or bad blood. If 2 blades werent getting the job done, the Zwickey eskimo, Ace, bear razorhead etc... would have never stood the test of time like they have. A properly constructed razor sharp 2 blade kills very efficiently. Just dont confuse "properly constructed" with Rage.
retro the two blade broadhead is insufficient w/ most archers for many reasons - me included. And more than two blades has everything to do w/ it. Its cutting on a single plane instead of a 3rd or 4th blade diameter and there is no getting around it. The Eskimo and Razorhead are fine heads w/ good shoot placement, much like my grandfather shooting deer in the heads w/ a 22. Now that were out of the 50's, we can shoot another blade concept. I can't believe people will buy a 50's style head "2 blade" strap an operation system to it "mechanical" and wonder what happened when Murphy's law kicks in. I'm guessing this thread was started for this very issue. In real hunting situations for the average guy that hunts on weekends we just don't always get the perfect shot.
You cant change history. And with 2 blades your not talking about history back to the 50's, your talking about history back to the dawn of the bow. Todays "blade concepts" are designed to take the money out of your wallet, instead of the life out of a game animal. People are suckers for marketing and hype. If your telling me in todays "modern world" that the logic behind shooting a large multi blade head is because most people cant hit where they are aiming, therefore they need the extra blades in the non-vital area to recover the animal, thats ridiculous. Non vital is non vital whether you have 2 blades or 10. In the lungs, number of blades makes no difference.
I agree Retro, the cost of the blades now days is crazy. If you guys want to pay that much for something your may loose or wreck on your first shot, go for it. I will stick with my Muzzy 125's and my Zwicky's.
For the antiRage guys, riddle me this. How is it that I have shot deer with Slick tricks, original Snuffers, Muzzy original/MX3, Snuffer SS, Montecs, Thunderheads, Rocky Mountain Blitz,Stingers and Buzzcuts, Spitfires, and Grim Reapers. All 3 or more blade heads and the bloodtrails were never as big nor the damage as devastating as with the 2 blade mechanicals I have shot.
Some have been close, but not as consistently devastating as the Rage and NAP Bloodrunner or even the RM Gator. I am a broadhead junkie so I love to shoot ALL kinds of heads. But for those that argue that mechs are inferior, they really are clueless. That said everyone needs to shoot what gives them the most confidence.
Mechanicals are inferior because they have a much greater chance of failure. That doesn't mean you will personally experience a failure, but the odds are much greater than with a fixed blade head.
"Mechanicals are inferior because they have a much greater chance of failure."
I really don't see the odds of the head failing being any higher than other mechanical things I use. Like my bow, or climbing treestand, vehicle to get to the hunt and so on. If I do my part as far as maintenance and such, my mechanical items usually never fail.
my dog and I won't go on any more rage trails. Over 20 and we found 3.
Bowmania
Why would anybody want there blades to have to open mechanically? I like my blades ready for business while my bow is in my lap. Call me crazy but I also like my blades welded on versus screwed on with an eyeglass screw. You can definitely kill whitetails with junk heads, no doubt about it. I love the fact that some of the best performing and most durable broadheads are actually the cheapest. Of course when you buy these heads, they dont come in fancy packaging and you wont see them on the outhouse channel endorsed by the "experts" who will endorse anything that puts freebies in there pocket. Shot lots of heads over the years as many of you. Ive come to the conclusion that simple is better. One piece, all welded, file sharpened. Shoot what you want, its your money.
I have always loved this quote from a prolific poster from the Big Game Forum:
Boubound - "When your hunt of a lifetime hinges on your equipment, don't use equipment with hinges"
retro,welded blades break pretty easily. If you are really looking for a solid head check into the VPA heads.
Rut, Ive heard nothing but good things about the VPA heads. Havent had the chance to try them yet. Which heads have you had the welds fail on?
I've had welds break on Snuffers and on Hell Razors. The Hellrazor not a real big deal as it was into a target. The Snuffer broke when shot into a deer, the head hit only ribs and was mangled.
You'll hear stellar reviews on mechanical broad heads from many folks, while some will blast the heads for any number of reasons.
When we make a poor shot or are unable to retrieve a wounded animal, many folks feel the need to blame someone or something - after all, it couldn't have been the shooter! Had to be the equipment or a branch or any number of other excuses..... personal favorite - "jumped the string" Because it's a new shooter using a mechanical - well of course...had to be the broad head.
While some deer tend to drop in an effort to project themselves into a leap...maybe we should be taking that into consideration.
The kill zone on a whitetail isn't much bigger then a paper plate -
Make the shot with good shot placement and it's a dead deer. That simple.
Shoot the plate - kill the deer.....
"Make the shot with good shot placement and it's a dead deer. That simple. "
Yep!
Bigwoods -
See your a "odds" kinda guy!
Here's a thought...
Bowhunting is simply a game of "odds". What are the odds you'll see a deer, what are the odds you'll get up on time? What are the odds that you wont fall from your treestand... the odds someone isn't already in your spot and on and on and on!
Based upon my years of experience with mechanical broad heads and never a failure.... the odds are..pretty good I'll stick with em!
I personally feel if your not shooting them - your doing yourself a disservice - but like retro says...it's your money!
Rut, Was the snuffer a stainless? Never heard of that happening on a deer with the old originals.
The Snuffer was one of the Magnus made originals. When I said something about it to my uncle who is older than me, he said that is why he quit using them. It didn't deter me as I kept shooting them for a few years after that. Never had it happen again, did have a few tips curl though.
Anyone ever use a Swacker? Results?
My buddy arrowed a mature doe a couple weekends ago with a swacker. It was slightly quartering away and he double lunged it. The arrow struck the opposite leg just below the shoulder and busted it. The deer only went 40 yards. I was impressed but any broadhead would have killed that deer with the shot placement. I personally shoot a rage and have had good luck with them. I really don't think there is a "bad" broadhead on the market today as long as you hit them in the right place. Like others have stated, a broadhead is most important when a marginal hit is made and I think rage does the most damage. They are probably not the best when it comes to hitting bone however.
A little of topic but I didn't want to start a new thread. this is my 12 yr old sons first season bow hunting. He shoots 40lbs. Is it better for him to use a fixed blade or expandable due to such a low draw weight? Two blade rages work great for me but I shoot 72lbs. I am concerned about penetration with him only shooting 40lbs. Any advice is appreciated.
fixed for sure, My son shoots 36# and shot a buck w/ Hellrazors last year and I was very impressed.
Fixed. Mechanicals need more kinetic energy. Something that has a sharpened edge on the back side (bottom) too will help with a lower poundage setup.
Crusader,
I've always heard that with bow weight under 50 pounds, that a person should Not use expandables, regardless if Rage or any other brand.
THose lower bow weights need fixed.
Thankfully I shoot 70#, so I can use Rages.
and Good luck to your son!
Thanks fellas, heading to get the hellrazors now. I'm sitting him in the my older sons stand on our first night if the wind is right. I sure hope he shows the older one up.! It would be nice bragging rights for him.
I like both holes with my fb hellrazors or montecs. Muzzys are great also. I will never allow any expandable on my place. Like a frisbee hitting a tpost.
My wife's bow was 46lbs, and had complete penetration on every animal, and very short recovery, using zwickey eskimos.
Had to gut a few deer with a zwickey delta, when I left knife back at camp. try that with an expandable.
you anti-expandable people are hilarious. You are so determined to hate them. People now reasoning that you can't GUT OUT a deer with an expandable as the reason not to use them? LOL , how about just don't forget your fricking knife at camp dummies!
Some people are just damn determined to convince you it is night out, even though they actually have their head up their own behind.
Same mentality as the crossbow haters.
I say, if it is legal, and it works successfully for you, than go for it.
This is my first year hunting with rage 2-blade rear deploying expandables. I haven't taken a shot yet but I am frustrated with difficulty keeping them closed, even with the shock collar. One of then was just plain impossible to get in the closed position with the band provided, almost as though there was something off with the location/depth of the little notch on the blade. I ended up just using an orthodontic band around the middle of the blade and that works. I don't think it will cause any issues with blades deploying, but it is irritating.
No personal experience shooting expandables but I have seen an eland, warthog and waterbuck lost by two guys who used them on an African hunt. Had an outfitter in Colorado refuse to let a guy in our party use them while hunting with him. I have far too many 3 blade Muzzy's to think about changing at this point.
An outfitter in Maine will not even take you out if you're using expendable's - he's had bad luck on bear with them. My rages head here in Wisconsin just last year, opened in flight and ended up with a deer lost with no blood trail - the Guarantee on the package is phony as you have to send in the defective head. If I could have sent in the head I would have recovered the deer. I went back to my Snuffers, the best head you can get.
I used them on my 2015 buck. Worked great. Hypo's 100gr
I have also practiced with them closed, open, one blade, no O ring....etc hit right where I aim.
I also shoot fixed blade just fine so no worries for me if I get a guide/camp that has issues with them.
Gut out your deer......2 blade would work I guess but the replaceable 3 or 4 blades you might have an issue.
BillB... when the o-rings dry out you play with the blades more then that can happen. I bought a pack of o-rings and replaced mind and no longer have the issue.
I've shot thunderheads and Muzzy's for over 25 years. Only once have I failed to pass thru a deer. This year, I caved to curiosity and bought two 3-packs of 100 grain hypodermics on the advice of a family member and the owner of the archery shop I call home.
So far I've killed 2 deer with the Rage and had 2 similar experiences in that neither made it more than 75 yards and had the biggest entry wounds I've ever caused.
Where they differed, was that one was a passthru and the other wasn't. The first was a perfect double lung shot that produced a blood trail one would expect.
The second, however, went in at a steeper angle, hit the opposite shoulder blade, and bounced back. When the doe whirled and ran off, it looked exactly like the crappy shot, "cutaway" scenes on hunting shows. It spooked me so I backed out until morning.
When I began tracking, I was immediately worried. No hair and no blood in the first 50 yards!!! Since she was heading for a clump of willows when I last saw her, I walked over and there she was, laying in an appalling pool of blood! Obviously dead before I hung up my bow after the shot.
So, my only possible complaint about the head itself is that I honestly believe the muzzy would have found a way through that off shoulder.....giving me a blood trail to follow.
PS I resharpened both heads and they are back in my quiver. It took awhile to work out the tiny nicks in the blade but they seem at least as sharp as when they came out of the blister pack.
Shot my first deer with an NAP Kill Zone MAXX this weekend. Shot fixed blades forever and finally switched. I wont be switching back. The whole was incredible and the blood trail was by far the best I've ever had.
dampland, I think after 60+ years of bowhunting, I'm allowed a few dumb mistakes. A dumb mistake that I never made, was switching to expandables.
" A dumb mistake that I never made, was switching to expandables."
Well that would mean you aren't qualified to comment on this thread then.
Ok, so with good shot placement, any broadhead will do the trick. I think I am safe to say we can all agree on that. Now, what about a bad shot? I feel like the larger cutting diameter of an expandable gives me the best opportunity of doing more damage more quickly. Also, I think a non pass thru, wich is seemingly more common with expandables will do greater damage when moving around inside the animal, thus resulting in a quicker death. So take away the good shot and think about the bad shot, would you still want the quick clean pass thru of a fixed blade or the devastation of an expandable?
rutnut, your right, I guess I'm not qualified.
Crusader that would be true but doesn't happen because your not getting the penetration. A 4" diameter broadhead sounds great too but won't do diddly if you only get 2" of penetration.
I feel more confident that a fixed blade will give far better results when bone is contacted. It is amazing the number of non passthroughs you see on TV with the hoity toity people and their free expandables. That said, when they do get a passthrough, the hole is pretty devastating. Comes down to confidence I guess.
The whole idea is to have a broadhead that makes 2 holes. Not one.
Yep...that's the idea...but it doesn't always happen...mech head or fixed!
"It is amazing the number of non passthroughs you see on TV with the hoity toity people and their free expandables.
In all fairness I see a lot of non passthroughs from fixed blades on hunting shows also. I think a lot of the TV "pro" hunters shoot light arrows for more speed. Not an ideal situation for expandables or fixed blades.
