Back tag bill gets public hearing
Wisconsin
Back tags survived in the ALIS update bill signed Wednesday, but are targeted for elimination in another bill which is scheduled to receive a public hearing Tuesday in Madison (mentored hunting and higher fines for poached trophy deer, bear and elk, and some game fish also on the agenda).
Fight this one too, naz. Go against the DNR as they want it too.
Sky's falling.....dog and cats living i harmony...the humanity of it all.
I would like to see backtags gone or every outdoorsperson be forced to wear one. Its a good idea for everybody or nobody.
If they're required for deer hunters not only should every hunter and fishermen be forced to wear them but everyone should have to wear them everytime they step out of the house.
Keep them, very simple to wear, about as easy as tying your boot laces.
Get rid of them. What is the reason for them? Aren't we one of the last states requiring them?
Just tonite, I was illegal I guess , cause I had it on my heavy coat that I never actually put on in the stand? So every time you add or take off a layer you have to move you're back tag?
I have come to the realization that some here will pick a fight just because someone they don't care for posted on the forum.
Today your backtag is your license. I could care less one way or the other. There are just as many reasons to keep them as there are to get rid of them.
I like the ease of catching trespassers who wear them.
I have never lost one, never had on cause me to miss a deer or forgot to put it on.
+1 mike. And once again geitz's 8th grade response reinforces why i will never be a wbh member even tho the metal shack/gravel parking lot in clintonville is 7 miles from my property.
"Go against the DNR as they want it too."
As in, the DNR is one person, or hundreds (actually a lot more than that)? Care to name some names? It certainly isn't for the $, as if you read the fiscal estimate, you'll see it's actually a money maker.
"it's a good idea for everybody or nobody" - same thing (only a bit nicer than) a prolific poster once said here.
Read the fiscal estimate for law enforcement's take.
Also good comment from CC chair:
“I won’t support it because it failed at the spring hearings,” said Rob Bohmann, Chairman of the Wisconsin Conservation Congress. “A lot of private landowners like the back tags because if someone is trespassing, they can get a number.”
Chai Vang was caught because of a back tag number. Would he have been otherwise???
My family has owned a large track of land for 30 years, I realize it helped others but never has a backtag helped us catch trespassers. Could sure, but not worth the hassles to us. They area a pain plain and simple. (to us) I and my family will be contacting our legislatures to get rid of them. I have hunted Canada and the western US, other midwest states, did not need them nor do they want them. I lived through Chai Vang, spoke with the arresting officer. Don't need back tags for one extreme case. We can sight so many one incident extreme events and justify change. Maybe then we support Hillary's proposed forced gun recall since people have died with guns. Or lets keep them so those who are so attached to them and can't live without them wear them. Outdated, let them go.
I don't really care either way, I guess I'm going to go with the flow on this one.
I do know this:
Whether I'm in Canada hunting without one, or in Wisconsin with one, I don't break game laws.
Many people get their picture taken in the woods without knowing it these days. Some of them are malicious trespassers on private lands, Others are lost. I can see a back tag number coming in handy.
It is one more tradition being removed. Sad. I know that there are more cases made by getting the back tag number. I have never had a problem with them.
E registration, most local former registration stations around here are complaining about the new e registration. It has hurt some business and lost the information of who shooting and what is being shot.
No minimum hunting age. What's next?
I agree Smokey. No backtags, no registration, no accountability. Bizarre to say the least.
Since Dr. Kroll's "let's put the fun back in hunting," Wisconsin has shed tens of thousands of gun and bow hunters, but has a lot more crossbows in the woods.
Michigan has seen a loss of more than 65,000 hunters since its mentored program began. Perhaps crossbows are part of that, too, or it may just be the "baby boomers are getting older and we're not replacing enough of them" that we've been warned about for more than a decade.
Look for Wisconsin to follow Pennsylvania where crossbows increased the archery harvest enough to surpass the gun harvest in that state. Something will give thats for sure. Shortened seasons, reduced bag limits, and other possibilities are on the horizon.
"Since Dr. Kroll's "let's put the fun back in hunting," Wisconsin has shed tens of thousands of gun and bow hunters, but have a lot more crossbows in the woods."
Good attempt to blame the hunter loss on Kroll, even you don't believe that.
Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing backtags go away. Have caught several people trespassing/hunting/berry picking/morel hunting/fishing/ you name it on private land over the years and not once due to a backtag. I agree with the guy that said if hunters are required to wear them everyone enjoying the outdoors should also wear them.
Just last night I was getting dressed in the field for the woods. I put my safety vest on with the back tag pinned to the back of it. Then I put my binocular harnass on and the thing got caught on my backtag! I had to take my safety vest off to get the thing from strangeling me! Then When I got in the woods I realized that I was probably illegal anyway because I had put my hood on my jacket and it was probably covering the back tag. Next year I think I'm just going to say the heck with it and not wear one wether it's legal or not, I've never been checked while bowhunting and if I do get checked I guess I'll just pay the fine and chalk it up to a hunting expense.
Would Vang have been caught without a backtag - yes! I also believe that was a time that we still had backtag numbers that were big enough that you could actually read the number form more than 5' away. The numbers now are so small you need to be right on top of the person to read them and they are also so long most people can't remember them even if they can read them.
I've yet to hear a valid reason that if it's so essential for deer hunters to wear one why not every other hunter and fisherman be required to wear them? Coon hunters don't need to wear them and they are notorious for trespassing. Around me river fishermen and also well known to trespass a lot when trying to get to the river, why aren't they required to wear one?
Glad this hearing is on Tuesday. Handy, now I can stick around and support eliminating back tags, along with the mentored hunting bill.
Naz, you never miss a chance to bash Dr Kroll, do you?
Naz, are you trying to tie Dr Kroll and crossbows together? You certainly stood up for crossbows while the issue was ongoing, now you have bemoaned them in two different threads. Maybe you should have read it before you voted for it.
I stood up for crossbows???? Recall saying what do I care if my neighbor (who shoots a deer every year) uses a bow or crossbow, but unlike some (including a well-known crossbow opponent who, incredibly, admitted to owning three crossbows), I've never owned one or even shot one, and have no desire to.
James Kroll was and is a proponent of crossbows (and is a crossbow user himself), even stating that they'd be good for kids to get them into hunting.
I have the same no. every year Kinda neat
Back tags. I be collected them over the years. Have every back tag for gun from 1942. Till present. I the 70 s. They said deer or bear. Every leg tag from 1920 on. In the twenties hunting was every other year. Have every bow tag from 1965 and tag on. And every hunting regulation from 1897 on. Our first official state run season. Just a passion collecting them. Also. Have a few. Party tags from the 50 s n 60s. Anybody. Remember ????when it took 4 people to apply for a tag. In the late 50s and early 60s. You had to go stand in line at the court house we are very spoiled. Save the tags. Also in 1928 1930 and 1932, you had a button u put on your hat??????any body. Have any old tags they want to sell call me also looking for any old hunting photos.
Tack driver. Cool. I have all of mine from over the years and even one archery back tag signed by Fred Bear.
Awesome guys. Too often tradition is simply tossed. Times change, we hear.
The back tag bill is not about money (read the fiscal estimate, back tags make the DNR more money than they cost to print), and for those that say it's a hassle, really? Noisy? Not with a decent holder.
Whatever happens, will happen. I didn't protest e-registration and won't be protesting this, youth hunt age, etc. However, I think in order to put the fun back in hunting, legislators (or more likely, those behind the scenes with an axe to grind) need to back off on some of these annual "let's fix what's not broken" issues. Wait, maybe they can back off after passing an "old-timer" hunt weekend (allowing guys/gals of a certain age, say 80 and over, to use firearms to hunt deer during the youth/"old-timer" weekend). I say that because I know many guys —including my 86-year-old dad — who've quit because it's simply too cold and slippery for them come the November hunt. They've long since paid their dues. We're losing more baby boomers than we're gaining in mentored youths.
How about having some sort of tag for those that collect them (for a couple bucks) and the proposal being for those that do not want the bother? The sky is still there (did not fall)despite elimination of the need to put your bow in a container and elimination of the need to tote a deer or turkey to town to check in with the state. We DID NOT all turn into poachers. I really enjoyed phoning in the buck I shot in early November instead of having to take the thing down, put it into the truck and go to town after the proper business decided to open or drive 14 miles for one that was open.
Hear ya, surely helps some folks, esp. in areas where it's a long drive to a station, and it's fun to check the weekly updates on the harvest.
Wouldn't buy a "collector's back tag" just as I no longer go to a DNR Service Station to ask for the collector stamps that used to be required for inland trout, Great Lakes Salmon/Trout, pheasants, ducks and wild turkey, signed and attached to a neat paper license that folded in your wallet (not the plastic crap with the "stamp privilege" today). Another tradition lost. The sky hasn't fallen. Only hunter numbers.
"Only hunter numbers." How have the changes in the game registration procedures influenced hunter numbers? Several years ago I had as many as 19 different farms to hunt on...now I'm down to five or six...if there ARE fewer hunters I'm not seeing it. Just more competition.
I agree with lame cowndip,hunting numbers in most of the areas has increased. If Numbers are alarmingly down its primarily on private posted land for the obvious reasons. I know many hunters age 40 and up who have QUIT do to the increased pressure on the public land and the areas they were hunting. These are folks who have hunted for years,there tired of all the "new age" hunting pc agenda thats over crowding many of the public areas and less hunt able game.
This so called study about "boomers" is deeply flawed in this respect,private land vs public. Hunt the public areas in Juneau,Jackson,Monroe,Clark counties and you will understand,hunter numbers are way up on the public. You spend more time avoiding hunters than scouting hunting for game.
If numbers are as low as they are "warning" deer in public areas would dying of old age and numbers would be out of site. Neither which is happening.
As far as back tag I can and will go either way.Never had a problem with wearing them before and didn't really think or care if other states have them or not.
When you buy Patron's Liscence you don't get physical stamps but you can have them sent to you after the season (or at least it used to be that way I haven't bought one in several years). Why can't they do that if you want to collect them? I bet within 10 years there wouldn't be more than a handful of people still wanting the backtag.
Caught a trespasser this afternoon while coming down the driveway on the tractor. They guy was walking down the driveway and told me he was tracking a deer. No blood trail no nothing to indicate he was tracking a deer. He knows the number to the house and cell number, no missed calls on either phone.
I think he was sneaking in to sit in one of my stands. I called the local sheriff and they handled the situation. Did he have his backtag on, yes. Would I have caught him without it? Yes. The sad thing is that it is only a county offense and nothing more.
Tack Driver, Just curious what something like this one is worth? It was my fathers so I don't want to sell it but just curious as to it's worth.
Didn't say or even imply registration changes have anything to do with hunt numbers (and it's too early to tell what impact the change will have, anyway, even on deer numbers). You're right, loss of access certainly has played a role, as have many other things. More than a million different individuals purchased licenses allowing gun or bow deer hunting during a recent five-year period. Just under 400K hunters purchased a license every year during a seven-year period. That shows there's a lot of annual flux for one reason or another. Things like a health issue, job change, baby due or just arrived, CWD fear/loss of interest due to, loss of a hunt camp tradition, favored hunting spot or spouse or hunting mentor, etc. Many other possibilities. Not everyone is as passionate as all of us.
Never understood doing something just because that is the way we have always done it. The definition of insanity. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. If you don't try things one never knows what things may be like.
I wear one, its on my pack. I don't pay really any attention to it until I pull a carcass tag out. But, most of the time I'm hunting, I guess I'm illegal because I have a tree stand on my back, or my heavy jacket that I put on up in the tree. My pack ends up sitting on the back of my stand while in it. So, I do wear it, most times you cant see it. I'm not moving it from my shirt to my stand, to my heavy jacket, and then the reverse coming out of the woods. So, I just decided to not pay attention to it, but its on?
I am not a big fan of doing something just because of "tradition". When I was growing up I lived on a farm in SW Pennsylvania. Have to go in the middle of the night? Winter was such fun...walk 50 yards out to the privvy. We got rid of it when we got indoor plumbing...glad to get rid of that "tradition". Get up in the morning and stoke the coal-fired furnace..got gas heat and no more (including the dust when we got a delivery of coal). Another "tradition out the door". Someone showed a license plate from 1977...that was still the days of the "party tag". If you favored hunting alone you were out of the picture when it came to antlerless tags. Glad that one is out the door. I grew up in a state where you only filled YOUR tag and I still believe that the whole party hunting thing needs to go as well. So, yes..the whole thing of doing things because of an archaic "tradition"...not a fan. I DO wear the thing. It is on my catquiver and the thing has holes in it because of the license plate. Again-just my $.02-LC
Years back We played backtag poker? You had to get in advance, quite fun along with rest of deer camp. Most of guys are gone to happy hunting grounds. Traditions are great
Naz, unless crossbow hunting was something called for by Kroll in the DTR, his personal preferences have no bearing on the discussion. Just another bomb thrown by you in your tireless efforts to discredit him and Gov Walker.
Hunt legal and we all win.
Lame crown dip check your private messages,thanks.
Redchub, we plated backtag poker also. I won a number of years in a row till they realized I worked at a sporting goods store and when a really good number came up I would buy my tag with that number on it!
I can see both sides of the issue. …………. Good luck deer hunting.
"Hunt legal and we all win." Ignoring the bomb throwing accusation? Good choice as you have far too many on these pages to try and say otherwise.
By the way Naz, isn't it you who believes the majority of hunters will break the law if given a chance?
Never said or implied that Mike. Did say that wardens I've talked to all over the state say they only catch a fraction of the violations they know are going on. Also have talked to hunters all over the state who hear multiple very early and very late (before and after hours) shots come the gun deer season, so I know it's not just my area.
Have said nothing to try to discredit Gov. Walker. Did not agree with James Kroll as the right choice for Deer Trustee. Gary Alt would have been better (among others). Kroll, from Texas, is a proponent of high fence hunting, buy-sell-trade deer (commercial), automated feeders, crossbows and more that I don't believe jives well with the Wisconsin scene. That's my opinion — and I've heard much the same from many, many other hunters.
Naz, any word on these bills?
Best regards,
Kevin
As Mike F said above - I have come to the realization that some here will pick a fight just because someone they don't care for posted on the forum. Today your backtag is your license. I could care less one way or the other. There are just as many reasons to keep them as there are to get rid of them.
I like the ease of catching trespassers who wear them.
I've caught trespassers on trail cameras do to back tag numbers. I'm good either way but I lean on the keep them side.
Zinger +1......... now going back to the hunt, should be back around the first week of Christmas.......
good luck everyone....... be safe
LOL at “tradition” when backtags are gone (can’t be soon enough) I’ll bet the DNR wont mind one bit if the “traditionalists” continue to wear old backtags from years gone by or print out a number you like on your home printer and wear it for the sake of “Tradition”. This is a win win. Those tired of the stupid backtag can go without the dumb number on our backs and the traditionalists can still enjoy their “tradition”. Everybody gets what they want this way. Since backtags will still be around for 2016, I plan to experiment next year by not wearing mine at all. I will place it inside my pack and have it with me but I don’t plan to wear it ever. I’ll bet all goes well and nobody is harmed by my peaceful protest to a dumb rule.
"Since backtags will still be around for 2016, I plan to experiment next year by not wearing mine at all. I will place it inside my pack and have it with me but I don’t plan to wear it ever. I’ll bet all goes well and nobody is harmed by my peaceful protest to a dumb rule. "
Violating on purpose? Well, that'll show them.
happy, I to plan on not wearing the noise making, get in the way PITA backtag next year either. There are a lot of people on this site who admit that they are illegal by placing the tag on their back pack or on their jacket then putting a safety harrnass on over it.
Exactly. Im done wearing it and I dont care who knows. I will carry it on my person but Im done wearing it on my coat. I will just be a year ahead of the curve in regards to no longer wearing it.
"Backtags must be displayed where they can be clearly seen in the center of the back on the outermost garment. Note: the backtag number must not be hidden by a coat hood or pack, displayed upside down or be marked up in any manner." DNR Hunting regs 2015
I interpret that to mean: Shirt, jacket, safety harness, day pack, etc.
Many years ago this was a big push in enforcement. If we had our tree stands on our backs as we usually did back then it was a violation since the tag could not be seen. After that year they baked off. Who puts their tag on a treestand?
Not a big thing IMO.
Helped a buddy drag one out today so I figured I would grab my rifle and take it with me. So that means I got to put two big holes in my brand new jacket I bought for my Oklahoma hunt in a couple weeks.
Good to know that we as hunters get to choose what laws we want to follow and just violate on the laws we don't like. We already know runngunRC has done that with baiting laws too. The fine wasn't enough to deter him from additional violating. No wonder people were concerned over xbows, tags going away, and call in registration in regard to how those will add to more violations. Seems hunters are known as violators and flagrant ones at that. Kudos to all those who do follow the laws and don't violate!
I've been weary of punching holes in my gear for years now, as well as the noise against the tree. I have been wearing the tag on my catquiver for quite a while as it is on my back in the designated place. These holes DID NOT come from any of my hunts in Wyoming, Montana, Alberta, Ontario, or North Dakota. Archaic and tiresome...
Happy is spot on, I agree that we should do away with back tags but, as long as it's the law I will follow it. As far as I'm concerned zinger and run n gun and who ever else refuses to follow regs are no better than poachers. I'm sure you could ask someone who is baiting deer illegally and they could give you a speech about why they they it should be legal so they just do it anyway. You shouldn't pick and choose what laws you want to follow I guess maybe that's just me and my way of thinking, I know I lost all respect for those who openly violate.
So none of you speed on your way to the woods? Or switch lanes without singeling? Or flip the hood from your camo jacket up over your orange hat when it gets windy out?
I bet there are a whole bunch of laws that you technically break everyday without either knowing it or without caring that you're breaking them. Me not wearing a backtag does not affect anyone at all. I'm on private property, not that it matters because you can't read the little numbers on my tag anyway, and I'm not trespassing. It doesn't give me an advantage like baiting or hunting before or after hours does it? It's a completely victimless "crime".
If you lost respect for us because of this then it sounds like Smokey should also lose your respect because it sounds like he's covered it up with a treestand in years past. Heck I bet you just lost respect for the majority of deer hunters because at onetime or another I bet they've had something cover up their tag or ignored another hunting law, heck I bet you have also!
"It's a completely victimless "crime". "
I'm wondering who it hurts if I don't attach one of those tag things to my deer. What really is the purpose of going through that extra time to do that. They are a pain to punch out and then attach to the deer. Seems like a victimless crime. Perhaps I'll choose to not follow that law seeing we all get to pick and choose what laws we wish to follow. Who would this silent protest hurt? And really, what is the difference between 2 gallons and 3 gallons of corn? Seems like some arbitrary number someone came up with. How would an etra 1/2 gallon or whole gallon of corn affect anyone. Seems like a victimless crime to me also.
Once again, kudos to all those who follow the law and don't purposely violate.
FREEDOM!
Oh an your silly guilt trip doesn't work on me. Like I said, I will carry it with me but no longer wear it. Free at last. Whine if you must.
Happy, not tagging the deer (and then not registering it since you didn't tag it) means you still have a tag to shoot another deer and that the DNR doesn't know you shot it to make future decisions on quotas. doe tags, etc. BIG DIFFERENCE! More bait means you don't have to re-bait as often which means you stand a better chance of shooting a deer - again big difference. SO those aren't really victomless are they?
Not wearing a tag doesn't allow me to shoot an extra deer, not get the kill information to the DNR, nor does it make it more likely to shoot a deer. Tell me again who or what I'm harming???
Zinger, I never said I had it covered up, just that we usually had our stands on our back.
I made sure my backtag was visible.
Smokey, I didn't mean to call you out, more just to point out that many of us cover it or do something illegal with it quite often.
Let's all be honest. Who here has been illegal with their backtag in their years of hunting? Who put a backpack over it while walking to their stand?Who put it on their backpack and then hung the pack in the tree by them? Who put a climber stand on their back and walked in without putting the tag on the stand? Who has had their hood inadvertanly cover their tag? According to some that makes you a poacher because you did something so hanous as not displaying your backtag correctly.
Zinger, got it and we're cool, you are right about things though. Most people break a law or two over time. Some even say they are only bending the law, no such thing. Follow or break.
I try to follow the law and if I feel the law is wrong I work to have it changed. But I am sure if I gave it a lot of thought I maybe drove 56 in a 55 ;-)
Heck I'll be honest there have been times I'm late to the woods and I might even go 57 or 58 on the highway! :-) Or 80!
What ever happened at the hearing. Did it pass? are the stupid backtags done away with yet?
RC-
Passed with one minor change. Convicted big game violators and trespassers will be required to wear a blaze pink backtag for the rest of their life!
LOL
lets see, if the people in prisons had to wear them, the ACLU would be all over it,,,,,, get rid of them
That hearing was for public comment. Next, I believe it will have to pass the executive committee before it goes to the entire Assembly for a vote. Then, on to the Senate.
Dumb rule, I hope they get rid of it.
If I owned my own private land I'd want the law to stay in effect. Just for trespassers. Your cameras won't catch them all but they will catch some. And having to wear one will deter at least a couple people from trespassing. It's never bothered me to wear one because it's all I've ever known. I just make sure it's on whatever is my outermost layer while I am in the act of hunting. And if I have an opportunity at a target animal on the way to my stand and my pack is covering my tag,.,.,. That deer is going down if I can make it happen. If they pass the law saying I don't have to wear one I think the first few times may feel a little odd,(like something is missing). But it wouldn't take long to get used to and I'd probably be happier without it. Right now- I present it as much as possible. It's really not that big of a deal. If the rule changes- I'll keep it in my pocket. Again no big deal.
I own private land. Don't want back tags. Have trespassers, don't need tags. I hate them. Sunday, had it on my pack. Climbed down to check on family. Was coming back so left stuff in stand hanging. Halfway out 1 mile realized STUPID backtag was on my pack. Back to my stand get STUPID tag and go back out. Took coat off to put tag on. Oops that is a violation also as I was now hunting without my blaze orange on. Even for the time it took I was illegal also. And yes a game warden told me even doing that is a violation a couple years ago. SO due to the stupid back tag I was illegal twice at least in that half hour.
