Rotator Cuff Surgery Healing
Wisconsin
Just curious about this,...has anyone on this forum had rotator cuff surgery and how did your healing go? How did it affect your shooting a bow?
After an injury in early February I am scheduled for left should surgery in a week. The surgeon says I probably will not be able to draw a bow this fall; my PCP says I might (with emphasis on "might") be able to shoot a lightweight bow (40 - 45 lbs.) by mid-October.
I, of course, hope the surgeon is wrong. I do not like the idea that I may miss this year's bowhunting. If you have had this surgery, what were your experiences? How did you deal with it? What happened? How did the healing go? Any comments/info you would care to share?
Case,
I'm a 25 year old who had reconstructive labrum and rotator cuff surgery at 20 years old(College baseball pitcher), needless to say career ending injury, but needed the operation to do everyday life and compete again. Never got back to 100%.
I attended PT for 4 months, 3 times a week, with strength exercises to do on the off days with elastic bands and eventually light dumbbells. PT started roughly 4 weeks post surgery. After the mandatory PT, i was provided further strength exercises to continue building strength back in the shoulder. It was a long recovery and is one that I am sure age, strength, severity of damage and each persons body handles differently. Healing was 4 arthroscopic sites and basically was explained to me that the shoulder muscles, cartilage, tendons went from 20 years of wear and tear back to newborn status.
At the time in college I didn't bow hunt, but did upland hunt and was told to not discharge a shotgun against the shoulder for a solid year. I did shoot several magazines out of a handgun roughly 6 months after the surgery with fatigue.
To this day, there are some days where the shoulder does bother me for whatever reason. I've been bowhunting now for the last year and the previous 2 years I would target shoot because I didn't have access to huntable land until I moved. If it matters I am 6'4 220lbs and shoot a 60lb draw, because i can pull that back 95% of the time without difficulty. That 5% of the time just seems like the inner shoulder misfires and you have to muscle through the draw back (terminology you might understand after the surgery). Still on quest to shoot my first deer! I am able to shoot handguns, rifles and shotguns without pain, other than general soreness if a lot of rounds are fired. I do bruise easier, i have noticed after shooting quite a bit.
Hope this helps, any other questions or comments don't hesitate to ask.
Thanks for the PM, you know who you are. That's quite a story about your wife's healing, glad to hear she has made the recovery she has. Again, thanks.
I had injury to both shoulders years apart. Never surgery. The first time they tried a few things in PT but could never figure out what to do so it went untreated. I could not even lift a carton of milk. I went from 70 lb. recurve to 50 lb compound the next fall and slowly regained use but never back to old self. With the second injury the physician first told me I needed surgery but I spoke with the Therapist before surgery and he said I did not need surgery and he worked on me until it was fixed and working properly again. He said the first injury should have had the same treatment but since it had not had that it added to second injury. Therapist diagnosed it as an impingement not RC damage.
I injured my right should and I never had it attended to, but it took forever to heal. I wasn't able to use it all for a week and it was very slow healing after that. Anything with a shoulder, I can really feel for a person.
Good Luck
Too many variables to give you a for sure answer, is it a small, medium, or large tear? What level of involvement, Supraspinatus only or subscapularis involvement as well? No 2 tears are the same, if it is a small tear without labrum or bicep involvement you have an ok chance; and it's also good it was an acute tear and not a chronic issue, generally acute tears with surgery perform better than chronic. Long story short small tear with good surgeon it's not that unlikely you could be shooting a lower draw weight this fall, medium or massive tear would be tough, but still not completely impossible. I had a patient last fall with a medium tear in early May and did end up bowhunting the rut with a 50# draw weight. Get a good surgeon, a solid PT, and kick ass in rehab and see what happens. You'll know by end of June or Julyish if you are ready to pick up a bow. Any more specific questions feel free to PM me.
I had a bike accident 4th of July week back in 2003. I destroyed pretty much all the tendons and ligaments in my right (bow arm) shoulder after going over the handlebars. Had reconstructive surgery the next day. I killed an elk with my regular bow the second week of September. Hurt like Hell but I was able to sight in and fill my tag.
A few years ago I had surgery in the other shoulder for torn labrum and ground off acromion process in early March. I was shooting my regular hunting bow by bow season again with some pain.
Not saying everyone will have the same luck but don't consider yourself out of luck.
grossklw - I sent you a PM
I had surgery on my left shoulder in July 2002. This was not scoped and more of an open repair. Within a few days it got red and sore (more than it had been). I called the orthopedic people and they said that this was natural just keep an eye on it. The next day I'd had enough and went to see my GP. His eyes got real big, said to go have a blood draw and come back to the hospital the next day. I was home for fifteen minutes (took a half hour to get home from River Falls). My wife answered the phone and came to me and said that was the Doctor and they wanted me back there NOW. Turned out I had been infected with 5 different strains of staph and they had to go to the CDC in Atlanta to find out what they were dealing with. I was in the hospital for the next three weeks having 5 or 6 more surgeries for debridement. I was on high-test antibiotics (oral and injected) for the next three months and had a PIC line installed to inject antibiotics that ended up about 2 inches from my heart. I was sick for almost a year as my lungs filled up with clots during the winter. I also had my other shoulder scoped three years ago-that one was a piece of cake compared to the first one. I did learn to knit some hats during the healing. Make SURE you do whatever exercises the PT people give you. This is why I have very little sympathy for guys that complain that their shoulder is a little sore so they'll have to go to a shoulder-fired instrument. I can shoot a bow in the mid-fifties for draw weight and it has been plenty to take down two bull moose. Again-my $.02-LC
My father asked me to post this for since he can't respond. "would you tell them that he should not allow the surgeon to climb the beep muscle ( to allow for more motion ) . It will decrease his strength by close to 60 percent. I have had 5 shoulder surgeries & allowing the surgeon to do that was a big mistake. Lost strength & range of motion. Other surgeries went fine"
I had surgery mid December and I'm shooting my bow fine already. For whatever reason this go around having the labrum and rotator cuff repaired hurt more than the others though. Still not 100% strength wise. Have full range of motion but fast movements hurt. Stability will get there.
The response to this thread has been cautionary, informative, and encouraging. It seems there have been a variety of situations encountered with a variety of medical resolutions by guys of all ages. The BIG message I have gotten here and in PMs is to follow the PT schedule exactly and, perhaps, somewhat aggressively. Right now I'm thinking, "damm good advice. I should listen to the voices of experience!"
More comments to come, I hope. Thanks to everyone.
I'll add one more perspective. My wife is a cna in a rehab center. She says "if it's the arm you hold the bow up with, strength and ability to hold the weight of the bow up for the time you draw will be your only issue. I.e. Mind over matter. Work hard to build the muscle in that shoulder.
If you draw back with your left arm, pain may also be associated with the process. Again, it's still (with This long between now and hunting season) mind over matter."
By then you will be healed enough that fear of further injury will not be an issue. If you can nut up and have the stamina to hold your bow up, you'll be fine. You may have to draw a lighter weight but you'll be good to go by then. Remember, it only takes #35 to kill a deer.
I did my rehab religiously and bordered on too much. Let your body when to ease up. That's what I did. Also, I was also cautious to do it right and slow. Not fast and wrong. For me it helped greatly to have access to all the tools, weight, bands, pulleys etc right at work. That made it extra easy.
Take it with a grain of salt, or a few, but some preach the benefits of deer antler velvet spray. Apparently, it aids with the healing process. Good luck on the recovery, and listen to your body.
It all depends on how bad the tear and what muscle is involved. I tore the supraspinatus, I think total tear patched with a prolene graft. They would have used cadaver parts but had not asked my permission before surgery so they could not do that. I also had near total tear in one of the other rc muscles, plus total tear of the bicep that had retracted. It was months since the injury before I had surgery because I was being told it was not muscle tears until they finally did an MRI. I was in one of the Mayo hospitals when a Mayo Clinic doctor came to see me for another problem. I asked him about my shoulder. He said take your shirt off and from 5 feet away he knew it was torn which is when the MRI was ordered. It has been more than 10 years and I still have pain in that shoulder ALL THE TIME. If I hold my arm out front like to change the volume on the car radio I have to get it done in a couple of seconds or the pain gets to be too much. I am pretty sure I had a re-tear during PT but never went back for another MRI. It is what it is. I can use the arm pretty normally down low but anything horizontal or above is tough and painful.
Good luck, I hope your tear is an easy one to repair.
Wishing the best for a fast recovery!
Had a rotator cuff surgery about 2001. I think it was spring. I was shooting by fall about 64# by fall. I was about 49 years old. Hurt the same shoulder this past September, ironically I was telling a friend about the surgery and I was now about 98-100%. As a way to demonstrate my point I swung my arm around in a circle. Note to self - showing off is not a good idea. Shoulder got sore and stayed sore. Missed archery season because I really like my bow and didn't want to get a different one or a crossbow. Shoulder was diagnosed as adhesive capsulitis (sp?). Got a steroid shot a few weeks ago and have to stick to my exercises.
Three years ago climbing treestand slip that resulted in a complete rotator cuff detach right shoulder. Had surgery end of March, and could pull 60lb bow in September. Good PT is key.
Is an MRI the only way to diagnose a rotator cuff tear?
Good question South F - maybe there's a medical pro who can answer that for us laymen.
Not necessarily. For the most part we have a series of special tests that give us a pretty clear idea if we have at least a partial tear. MRI is great for showing the level of tear as well as which muscles are for sure involved. Easiest thing to look for in your day to day life after an acute injury is the shoulder shrug. Look in a mirror, try and lift your arm over your head, if you notice your shoulder hikes way up; that's at least a decent indicator something happened with your top RTC muscle, a visit to the PT or orthopedist should be in order. In my opinion and I'm about as anti surgery as a DPT can get, but usually people do very well with an acute tear post surgically, chronically is a separate issue if the muscle has already retracted.
Two other things for you guys to stir your brains about, an MRI is great for pictures but doesn't always correlate to the clinical presentation. If I were to perform 100 MRIs on 60 year old males, 50 of them will show a cuff tear and roughly 10 of those will say they have shoulder pain or any dysfunction at all. Many many people get along just fine with a full thickness massive tear. Your cuff can not "heal" itself, once a tear always a tear; however with proper rehab a lot of times we can strengthen the rest of the cuff to help make up for inactive portion and people get along extremely well functionally. Other times surgery is simply required as the tear is either too massive or we can't get the rest of the cuff to overcome the strength deficits.
Not really related but an MRI for low back pain is the same. 60% of you have a herniated disc on an MRI, 20% of you actually have pain. Good example, back hurts so patient gets an MRI, herniated disc at L4/5, doc goes in and fuses or does a microdiscectomy. Patient comes out of surgery and has worse pain, well clearly our "slipped disc" that everyone obsesses over had absolutely nothing to do with your pain, and now we have a wasted 30k dollar surgery, 5k MRI, and a long rehab that is probably going to be a sh%* show. MRIs are images, not necessarily an indication of patient dysfunction.
$5k for an MRI?? Yikes! Maybe my shoulder doesn't hurt after-all...probably just my imagination playing tricks on me.
Certain hospital systems will charge that but that is on the high end I would say, most will be consIderably lower. It's not the just the image you're paying for...radiology reports are not cheap
2007 rotator then 2010 same rotator (done building), took 4.5mos for both of them before even pulling a bow, got a BowTrainer for the first one and the best dollars spent; still hunting with the recurve, the compound have problems with it. Patients and time with smart rehab is the best Rx.
jjs-why is the compound more challenging than the recurve?
Speaking about lower back pain. I had lower back pain since around 1972. (too much power weightlifting) Diagnosed with compressed L5/S1. Mayo doctors in 1977 said hold off surgery as long as possible because treatment options improve every year. Last year some sort of miracle happened because that pain finally quit with no intervention. Only thing that changed is that since around 2009 I have been loosing weight. I have to believe that was at least partly responsible for the improvement.
Fun fact about losing weight, just with simple walking your joints have to absorb anywhere from 3-5x your body weight, and when running can be anywhere from 8-10X!! So a 10 lb weight loss equates to 30-50 lbs your body no longer has to deal with just to walk from point A to B. And that is not overly surprising Jeff, a LOT of times (as in most) low back pain will resolve with no intervention at all, no chiro, no PT, and certainly no MRI or MD visit.
To resurrect an old thread & offer an update.....
First of all, thanks to all who sent PMs, their well wishes, opinions & stories & advice. The last five weeks have been a challenging learning experience! I did have the rotator cuff surgery on March 27,... I won't bore anyone with all the medical terminology,...let's just say major repairs were done to a massive tear and it seems as if all went well,...at least that's what the surgeon said. I did start physical therapy last week and I believe this is going to be a long road to travel. The hardest thing though is that I want to start using my left arm & shoulder and I have to constantly keep reminding myself not to do so. I am wearing and will be wearing a special sling and "pillow" sort of brace for another few weeks. This sling & the brace pretty much prevent much use & movement of the arm, but it seems I keep trying to find ways to work around them,...something I know I should not do. I gotta get it through my thick skull to let my shoulder heal at its own pace and don't push it! My PT guy says that's the worst thing I could do at this time. Those of you who have been down this or a similar road probably know all too well about this. Right now time to heal & think about recovery for the fall. My PT guy & the doc both said "maybe" when I said my goal was to be able to draw a bow by October. That's my goal and I'm sticking to it! I'll keep you posted from time to time on the healing & when I make my first attempt. A buddy near Wausau offered a 17# bow to start with, and then someone from Dane Co. wants me to try his kid's 25# fiberglass model. I guess we'll see what's appropriate at the time. Thanks for taking the time to read this & we'll be in touch.
I just had surgery on my left shoulder rotor cuff April 5th Dr. repaired two tears and cleaned up my AC joint it takes 12 weeks for rotor cuff to heal up but dr said it might be a year before complete healing I'm on my third week of P.T. I'll have P.T. through Aug. twice a week then down to once a week Dr. said no bow hunting this season not sure on next neither I'm 56 so will be healing a little slower than a younger person.
Both of you guys...I hope the healing goes well. As one that has been through both shoulders I can tell you that patience is key. You WILL NOT heal as well as you'd like but stick with it.
my son was just gifted his aunts pink Mathews. That leaves his bear apprentice available for this fall. It is adjustable from 25 up to 50 lbs. either one of you guys are welcome to try it and see if it will work. (To borrow) the nice thing about it is you can start it at 25 and work your way up. Arrows will be included. Field points only cause he's going to need his qads. Just let me know if you want to use it and I'll send it out. It's going to my nephew next year so I'd need it back sometime after the season.
Thanks for the offer Crusader Dad And thank you lame crowndip for the kind words
YES! Fran X 2!
These sorts of comments show the better side of this forum, refreshing to see!
And of course, my own words of thanks.
Hoping for the best to all traveling down this recovery road. Gotta make sure we heal well to avoid the crossbow curse!
Tweed, the compound was getting a nerve effect (electric shock) down to the grip which cause in dropping the bow, bow shop owner was a little upset when it happen to his new Matthews. Didn't have a problem with the recurve but ended up with the ulna nerve getting rewrap which lesson the problem 80%, I assume with the recurve I shoot with a bent arm instead of straight with the compound. The Dr wanted to replace the elbow but I nix that for being restricted at 15# max, maybe when I am 80 I'll do it, give me 15 yrs before I'm there.
I hope you all are recovering well and behaving! I know people who messed themselves up by doing too much.
Take Care!
Hope both you guy's heal real quick . Love the golden year's . Great offer on the bow's guy's . I also have one if anyone needs .
Great News!
Eight (plus) weeks now post rotator cuff surgery and my Physical Therapist has moved my PT from just "mobility exercises" into "mobility AND strength rebuilding exercises." Every time I see him I tell him, "My goal is to be able to shoot a bow by the fall season." He's tired of hearing that! For a while he and my surgeon, when I said that, replied, "yeah, maybe." Today he nodded affirmatively and said, "you just might make it." I sure hope so!
Anyone else out there struggling with a physical situation?
woodsdweller - how is your foot doing?
Fran - how is your shoulder healing?
Good healing to all with an infirmity!
(P.S. - I hear it so often, "What about a cross bow?" Even people that know me, they just don't understand, a bowhunter does NOT want to use a crossbow! They just do not seem to realize a bow and a crossbow are two different sorts of experiences. And they do not compare!)
I'm glad to hear you're doing well. Now you'll have no excuse not to cast a line or two when you visit us at the end of June! Unless your shoulder can't handle lifting 15 inch crappies:-)
Great news Case. Keep up the PT and you'll make it.
Thanks for asking, Last Weds I got out of my sling been doing PT twice a week and exercises at home its going good trying not to do things around the house/yard but that's another issue..lol But for the most part of healing its good it does take 12 weeks to heal before I can do any over head work with the arm...learning that the patients part of this is very hard to conquer bad thing about this I just picked up a new boat this spring and wont be able to use it till beginning of July.....but my main goal is not to do anything to hurt the shoulder again..
I am glad to hear that you are doing well Bill. I hope it continues.
What a bunch of old decrepit guys on here. :) I’m Glad you are all recovering well. I just got out of my sling today for left arm Bicep Tendon Repair. Should be shooting again by Fourth of July. Thankfully no rotator cuff issues like I had with the right shoulder a year ago. It was a year until I was 100% again. I was able to shoot a bow 3 months after surgery, no major tears just cleanup of a few small ones and bicep tendon repair. I did use an evil crossbow but at least it was a recurve :) I had to call my neighbor to clean my turkey for me though.
Boy Craig......wearing the sling and carrying the huge xbow must've been a pain in the rear. Did you use a bi-pod?
From stick and string to a crossbow. I'm happy your doing well and getting out. Congrats on the bird CraigL
Just got home from the hospital. Had a 35% meniscus tear taken care of. A relatively easy procedure and recovery period. Was last minute decision but with Manitoba bear and then a South Africa trip coming up, it was time to s#%t or get off the pot.
Capt - good luck on the healing, and of course on your planned hunting trips.
If I may, a word of advice,...listen to your PT guy. Mine said to me, "Slow down on what you're doing. Just do only what I tell you,...the number of reps & sets,...no more. Don't be stupid, you can undo what the surgeon did!"
Heal well.
Capt - good luck on the healing, and of course on your planned hunting trips.
If I may, a word of advice,...listen to your PT guy. Mine said to me, "Slow down on what you're doing. Just do only what I tell you,...the number of reps & sets,...no more. Don't be stupid, you can undo what the surgeon did!"
Heal well.
CaptMike, good luck to you and I hope you have good recovery. Two years ago I had meniscus tear fixed. I was told it would take almost a year for full recovery. I did what the PT as told and that helped but it seemed to take a full year for recovery.
Now the bad part. Not long after I felt I was recovered I tore meniscus again. Sometimes it hurts like...
I cannot afford to have anything done with it so I have to live with it. Insurance covered most of the surgery but I still had to pay out about $2500. Now I hardly can scrape up $25 no was I could do $2500.
Is this the Golden years? I haven't even heard back from the Doc on the MRI on my back. Those meniscus repairs only seem to last 2 or 3 years. Mine did & then came the new knee & now that seems to clunk a bit. The back has forced me to slow down so maybe it will last longer. Shoulders are making crunchy noises now. I had one redone a while back maybe 10 years or more. Now they just cut them out & put them back in backwards. Yeah it hurts to get old but there will be plenty of time to rest when i'm dead.
Thanks guys. Yes, an elderly friend of mine told me, getting old is not for sissy's.
Smokey, my out of pocket was very similar, a few hundred under $3,000. That you tore yours again really sucks.
Nausea was gone after a nap so went through the PT I was given. I was going to try getting out on Lake Michigan tomorrow but Doc, physical therapist and high winds have changed that. For the better, I am sure!
Capt, Case, Smokey & Albino - I've been knocking on wood. Had shoulder problems a few years back, but no surgery required. My knees are what's giving me problems now. Snap, crackle, pop every time I get up from a chair and now more while walking. I've entered the geezer era I guess.
Good to hear Bill! I'm betting on you! BC
I had both shoulders done, one in 2012 and the other one done just this past February. I have gained about 80 % strength and movement back in my left arm and still am recovering with my right arm. I can shoot a 45 lbs compound but not many times. It still hurts and I have a bad case of the shakes. When I shoot my longbow I can't reach full draw yet. But I am working on it.
Shoulder guys - how was sleeping for the first few weeks after the surgery? Good luck on the continued progress.
Sucked big time ,I had to sleep in my recliner. It was the worst recovery of any surgeries I have ever had, and I have had a few.
I've been told that there is nothing more painful than the shoulder repair thing. That may well be right-when my left one was infected (post op and may have picked that up in the OR) I needed five more surgeries for debridement. After the last surgery I woke up and almost was screaming in pain. I asked the Doc later why the immense pain and what he told me is this-"Since this is probably the last surgery I reached in the wound and went down under the skin down to the shoulder blade in the back and down to your nipple in the front looking for a pocket of infection". I wish the best of luck to anyone that has a rotator cuff surgery.
