Summit Treestands
Bill introduced to allow airbows
Michigan
Contributors to this thread:
keith 31-Oct-17
Jon Stewart 31-Oct-17
BIG BEAR 31-Oct-17
Jon Stewart 31-Oct-17
keith 31-Oct-17
BIG BEAR 31-Oct-17
jerrynocam 31-Oct-17
buckhammer 31-Oct-17
Jon Stewart 31-Oct-17
BIG BEAR 31-Oct-17
Missouribreaks 02-Nov-17
BIG BEAR 02-Nov-17
keith 02-Nov-17
BIG BEAR 02-Nov-17
jerrynocam 02-Nov-17
BIG BEAR 02-Nov-17
happygolucky 03-Nov-17
Jon Stewart 03-Nov-17
BIG BEAR 03-Nov-17
keith 03-Nov-17
BIG BEAR 03-Nov-17
happygolucky 03-Nov-17
Hammer 03-Nov-17
ground hunter 03-Nov-17
Missouribreaks 04-Nov-17
keith 06-Nov-17
happygolucky 07-Nov-17
Missouribreaks 08-Nov-17
happygolucky 08-Nov-17
Missouribreaks 08-Nov-17
happygolucky 08-Nov-17
ground hunter 09-Nov-17
killinstuff 12-Nov-17
ground hunter 12-Nov-17
luckyleo 12-Nov-17
Missouribreaks 13-Nov-17
From: keith
31-Oct-17
House Bill 5180: Permit air bows for hunting during firearms season Introduced by Rep. Beau LaFave (R) on October 25, 2017 To permit the use of pneumatic air bows to hunt game during any open season in which a firearm may be used. These devices are like crossbows but use compressed air to drive an arrow.

From: Jon Stewart
31-Oct-17
They have been around for about 20 years and since the crossbow was such a big hit the air gun was brought back to the fore front. The DNR is doing its best to ruin hunting. It will be allowed because it means possibly more income for the government.

We are our own worst enemy folks.

From: BIG BEAR
31-Oct-17
Why would anyone use one of those instead of a rifle or shotgun...... ??

From: Jon Stewart
31-Oct-17
Big Bear you could ask the same thing about a crossbow. It also has a stock, scope, trigger and the string is held back and locked. Like or dis-like what I say but archery season is in the tank. It will never be the same the way the DNR is handling hunting seasons. The farmers shooting any sex deer with rifles in October is just another nail in the archery coffin. And now a rifle that shoots arrows.

From: keith
31-Oct-17
Just because they shoot an arrow, they are calling them a bow. These things don't even have strings or limbs.

From: BIG BEAR
31-Oct-17
Jon.... No one would have bought a crossbow either if they were only allowed in gun season where they belong..... They only bought them because they can use them in archery season... The bill is only for gun season.... As the crossbow bill should have been.

From: jerrynocam
31-Oct-17
I would worry they are using this as a gateway to get it in our other seasons. It seems like it wouldn’t be to big of stretch that they then get it in the muzzleloader season and you know what’s next.

From: buckhammer
31-Oct-17
Jon........your post are spot on. My feelings exactly. For those of us that have been around forever and a day we can clearly see that the best days of deer hunting are behind us.

From: Jon Stewart
31-Oct-17
jerrynocam: I feel the same way. If you remember the crossbow was for the disabled only. That was a foot in the door for where it is at now. The gun hunters, (and I hunt with a gun) generally hate our long hunting season and this is a move into the archery season.

These folks in Lansing are really screwing up archery season.

From: BIG BEAR
31-Oct-17
The gun hunters are also the ones who lobbied the NRC to make does off limits in the U.P.,,,,,,,

02-Nov-17
Due to the beloved crossbow, real bowhunting is already in a steep downward spiral in Michigan. What difference at this point does the air weapon make?

Bowhunting as defined by the P&Y Club, is becoming a lost art in the USA, especially so in Michigan. It is over, hunters have spoken. The rest makes no difference.

From: BIG BEAR
02-Nov-17
Most of my buddies have given up their bows and now use crossbows....

From: keith
02-Nov-17
Some years back, I was talking with a crossbow advocate. I asked him, if crossbows are allowed in the archery season, will any future restrictions be first on the crossbow?

He said, "Absolutely".

Next thing you know, we can't hunt does in the U.P.

From: BIG BEAR
02-Nov-17
You can't use crossbows in the late archery season in the UP.... I propose that we do away with crossbows in the early season too in trade to get back shooting does with bows across the U.P.

From: jerrynocam
02-Nov-17
As Xbows become even more sophisticated and more popular I believe the next thing will be shorter seasons.

From: BIG BEAR
02-Nov-17
Yep..... I'm serious..... I'm so pissed off at the doe thing in the UP....... Where is the Michigan Bowhunters on this.... ?? If gun hunters have pushed the NRC to make does off limits in the UP because they feel that crossbows are too easy and too many deer will get killed..... Then the Michigan Bowhunters should be at every NRC meeting saying..... OK..... Let's make crossbows off limits in archery season in the UP so we can get back to Bowhunters being able to harvest some does....

From: happygolucky
03-Nov-17
Unfortunately with xbows, it always was about the money and the money won. In WI, the hunters voted them down multiple times and then the Legislature approved the motion to move forward with a 96-0 vote in favor. At the initial meetings, the representatives of many groups voted against the bill. Three months later, every single representative voted in favor of them. The money obviously flowed down another level.

I would vote against letting airbows into any season as that would simply be a precursor to them getting pushed into the archery season. Money won once and it will win again.

BIG BEAR - I agree with more doe tags being needed in the UP. I also want to see us be able to use our combo tags for does too like we used to be able to do.

From: Jon Stewart
03-Nov-17
BigBear: The MBH stays on top most of the hunting issues concerning the bow and arrow. Right now they are in the middle of the DMAP issue. We as hunters also have also have to step forward by contacting Lansing ourselves. Your MBH rep is Steve Downing and can be contacted at stevedowning11@gmail.com. I would get ahold of him on this and see if anything is going on concerning the MBH addressing your issue.

It is pretty much common knowledge that most gun hunters hate our long archery season and have so for a long time. The crossbow and soon to be air gun allows the gun hunter to hunt early season (Oct 1st). Sad to say but this DNR has all but ruined archery hunting as we knew it with all these early gun seasons and now the possible DMAP season for farmers, which means the farmer can use a rifle for ANY deer (buck or doe) in early Oct. The farmer will be tossing lead your way soon once this bill is passed . I am not sure if the DNR thought of this but the DMAP could turn farmers into big game guides. They can assign (no charge for the tag) a kill permit (DMAP tag) to someone and then charge them a trespass fee to hunt their land. Wonder if the DNR has thought of this?

We are in trouble in many ways.

From: BIG BEAR
03-Nov-17
Yes Happy.... being able to shoot a doe anywhere in the UP during archery season is what I'm talking about..... not doe permits...... I talked to a lady DNR whitetail biologist about it.... She confirmed that the UP Whitetails lobbied the NRC to push to outlaw does for archers...... and that it had nothing to do with what was best for the deer according to the biologists......

From: keith
03-Nov-17
The last I heard, there will not be a change in the archery doe regs until 2020, if then. By that time, the same group will again be lobbying for the closure of archery season after muzzleloader season. And/or because the elimination of archery doe hunting, the b/d ratio will be off and they will push for APR's or one buck only.

As far as I'm concerned, these "hunters" that push for unneeded restrictions are worse than anti-hunters.

From: BIG BEAR
03-Nov-17
It makes me consider selling my property.....

From: happygolucky
03-Nov-17
Yeah, I gotcha BB - understood and agree.

The DMAP thing is really scary and stupid. I pray that one never passes.

From: Hammer
03-Nov-17
I say use whatever weapon a hunter wants during gun season but not during archery!!

03-Nov-17
well I think baiting is a joke,,,,,, I think crossbows, belong in the gun season,,,,,, I think more chain saws are needed,,,,,, but what I think makes no difference, but I do let my feelings known,,,,,,,,

Most gun hunters, hunt both seasons now,,,, that is a fact, ,,,,,,,,,, as far as killing does, if the biologist believe the herd can handle it, than I am for it,,,,, I can only talk about the UP, I never have hunted the lower....... One point that is missing, is a quote from John Ozoga, who I respect immensenly,,,," in the north, you can not stockpile deer"

04-Nov-17
Only one thing to blame...Hunters! They are the one's purchasing crossbows and leaving real bowhunting in droves. It is NOT about the money, it is about former bowhunters leaving bowhunting for the crossbow and crossbow hunting. Hunter's have the choice, however they are endorsing and buying crossbows in very large numbers. Even "Happy" endorses the use of crossbows, and yes it will eventually lead to less opportunity. Common sense fellas, common sense.

From: keith
06-Nov-17
ground hunter + 1

From: happygolucky
07-Nov-17
"Even "Happy" endorses the use of crossbows, and yes it will eventually lead to less opportunity. "

No Missouribreaks, I do not endorse the use of crossbows during archery season. I voted against them multiple times in WI as I have told you multiple times in WI threads. However, because they are here to stay, I have just learned to live with them and not live my life in constant negativity. Unlike you, I am still able to enjoy peace and solace when I hunt.

I have a friend, who is 65. I hunted at his camp in Menominee for 9 years. He had a quintuple heart bypass around 5 years ago and was forced to migrate to an xbow by his doctors. He was always successful with a compound. I have another friend who is in his mid 50s. He has terrible Rheumatoid Arthritis and converted to an xbow too due to the pain in his shoulders and elbows. He converted from trad gear. His son is 12 and very slender and not very strong and has not been able to become proficient with a compound yet. Therefore, he uses an xbow but hopes to be using his compound next season. The father and son have an open invite to hunt at my camp. I welcome them with open arms. I have chosen to not lose friendships over what weapons my friends shoot. Those are not endorsements for xbows in the archery season. I treat friendships with higher regards than hunting weapons.

08-Nov-17
Call it what you want. You said in another post you plan to use one at some point, will that be in the archery season..... you voted against?

Lots of closet crossbow users I believe.

From: happygolucky
08-Nov-17
You are wrong again Mb. I said that if I ever became disabled to the point where I could no longer use my compound, I would then convert to an xbow because I love being in the woods. I would do that versus not hunting. If you remember too, I also stated that I plan to buy a longbow this winter to try trad hunting because I think the trad guys really rock. Please try to keep your facts in line . You can always provide a link where I have said to the contrary but I know you won't have one.

As a guy from Montana, you sure make your way around all the states boards just trying to stir up crap. I see you got put in your place on the BGF in the "wheels" thread where the compound guys are arguing with the trad guys. Pat also put you in your place in the BGF when you started a thread complaining about a dad who posted a picture of his young kid's 1st ever deer kill because it was with an xbow. I know you don't like me because I don't hate people who use xbows and you do. As I said, I value friendships more than hunting weapons.

My son (also a compound bow hunter) and I have great times in the woods and value the memories we make together. We are still able to get out of hunting what we love regardless of what weapon other people use. I'm sorry you are no longer able to enjoy hunting. For the record, my son and I will be participating in the MI gun season too. He killed a deer with his gun last year and I am proud of any kill he makes regardless of his weapon. We both enjoy hunting with guns too.

08-Nov-17
Good luck to both of you Happy.

From: happygolucky
08-Nov-17
Good luck to you too Mb if you are still hunting.

To me, IMHO, the guys who really have a right to be upset over xbows being added to archery season, are the trad guys. Their hunting world was changed forever in the 70s when compounds hit the landscape. There were exponentially more hunters added and exponentially more kills. Now you add another highly more proficient weapon in their season and they should be upset.

I sure hope the latest gadgets are not even allowed into gun season. Once they get a foothold there, the NRA can throw money around to get them moved wherever they want them.

09-Nov-17
For the young hunters, up to lets say 14, no problem,,,, for those disabled or over 65 well of course,,,,,, only state who had it right is KY........ xbows are not the problem, well than how come they are not legal in the UP during the late season,,,,, we all know why,,,,,

I like the long bow, have no issues with the compound, you have to shoot it, and practice with it,,,, also I am a big backer of the compound, because without it, our bowhunting organizations would be weaker, we would not have the seasons we have, the compound allowed a lot of people to bowhunt.......lots of contributions also to the Pittman Robertson act....

The airbow is a joke, and I would not even allow it, during the gun season, want to hunt the gun season, shoot a gun

From: killinstuff
12-Nov-17
Being a longbow guy I could care less about airbows, crossbows or any other weapon. The world didn't change when compounds became popular or when crossbows grabbed hold. The only thing that changed was peoples perception of what the other guy was doing. And why guys worry so much abut the other guy is beyond me. If anything, it's baiting that changed deer hunting, not weapon choice. There are just as many targets walking around in the woods as there was in the 70's but guys don't know how to truly hunt. Todays hunter hunts for the right tree first and then dumps bait expecting deer to commit suicide for a beet. A whole generation has grown up thinking that's deer hunting and are not able to do it any other way. That's fine by me too because I don't worry about the other guy. The nice thing about bow hunting is that it isn't a team sport. Other hunters have ZERO influence on my success or failure. I guess complaining and blaming others is WAY easier than figuring out how t kill stuff.

I was out bad hunting yesterday and came across 5 tent blinds and two tree stands with fair size bait piles all guarded by a trail cam set up on or just off trails guys have been walking and running their dogs on since Sept 15th. And those are the guys trying to kill deer that you all are worried about??? Or maybe it's some of the same guys who are complaining about not killing deer. I'm not worried one bit if you hunt like that. Oh, and I'm the guy on your camera with plaid stormy kromer hat, the Brittney sniffing your bait is Tucker and the Pointer is Tober. Good Luck.

12-Nov-17
well killin stuff I am also a long bow guy, but if it did not matter, why then are xbows not allowed in the late season in the UP..... I also agree with you, can you imagine no baiting,,,,, I come across so many baits, I do not worry about it, but shake my heads at some of the set ups,,,,, oh well if the hunter is having fun, what do I care,,,,

I will say, what the most important thing is HABITAT, and without that we have nothing,,,,,,,,

lots of deer this year, another mild winter would be nice..... I have been on a lot of cameras, and my dogs name is chase........

From: luckyleo
12-Nov-17
In my opinion crossbows have killed the archery season here in Michigan. It takes no practice or skill to pick up a crossbow pull the trigger and be proficient with it. It took archery season and flooded it with gun hunters who Just pull the trigger. Guys that where just to lazy to pick up a bow and practice! That’s my two cents!

13-Nov-17
Pretty much Leo.

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