Thanks for the update.
Dogs and traps would still work for you. If you want a hide for the wall, you can always go to Canada or west.
If that's the case, we could most likely pursue them how ever, and when ever we want? Would the feds really care to try and catch someone taking wolves. Think they have bigger fish to fry. They leave easy to find Marijuana dispensaries alone in Denver, LA, Vegas, ect... can't imagine it'd be very cost effective for them to stake out the north woods for a wolf hunter.
Maybe we are better off without a season, as fivers said- a season would likely be to limited.
I ask because it's the same reasoning as the wolf legislation.
If people "take things into their own hands" the population may be reduced, but wolves will NEVER be taken of the Endangered Species list by the Feds because the number are lower and there will be no population information like we have now.
Remember that the reason for this legislation is to try and force the Congress and the President to act and remove wolves from the Endangered species list. If it works, we will be back on track to have a season and resume where we left off a few years ago. If it doesn't and they don't act we will have shot ourselves in the foot.
My brother came back from elk hunting in Montana and he said all he heard while he was out there was how bad the wolves were. I don't elk hunt and many of you do and know a lot about wolves in ID, MT, WY, etc. Perhaps you could explain how the situation has improved by states taking a similar stance to what this bill proposes.
What troubles me is there is no wolf season with this bill. According to Skook, SSS will be the only way to take a wolf?! AND if you cannot hunt them legally, is the thinking that SSS will exponentially rise because you cannot be prosecuted? There will have to be a lot of SSS to make any kind of dent in the wolf population.
Will I be able to take wolf management into my own hands legally? I hunt right in the middle of a caution zone because of numerous dog depredation incidents by a very aggressive pack. In fact, I can show you a wolf rendezvous site and this pack historically has been around well before the "reintroduction" of wolves in WI. Will I be able to shoot a wolf that I see while deer hunting, or set out a trap, or put out a carcass and sit over it? What exactly can I do? It sounds like state authorities could do nothing, however federal authorities could.
What a mess...
This law is just a way for the state to say "screw you then if you're not going to play by the rules and turn management over to us and let us set our own appropriate and much needed rules then we are not going to enforce your rules that are forced upon us".
Hopefully once the Feds see that the state is no longer going to enforce laws that have been for forced upon us they will be reasonable and turn over management to the state. The idea being that at least if the state is involved with management that will be better than no management at all.
It worked out west and hopefully it will work here too.
I say let's give it a whirl.
If the state will not demonstrate it can enforce laws to ensure the safety of a minimum population of wolves, why would a reasonable Federal Judge allow wolves to come off the endangered species list? With these bills it seams we are shooting ourselves in the foot. Why provide ammunition for the pro wolf supporters to present to a Federal Judge.
As long as midwest wolves remain on a Federal Endangered Species list, the Feds will not turn wolf management over to State control, period. Who is running the Federal Government now? Call your Senators and Congressmen.
Sagittarius, the state already demonstrated that it can enforce laws that will ensure the safety of a minimum population of wolves back when we had a strictly controlled successful hunting and trapping season 3 years in a row.
The current laws that the state is being forced to enforce do not ensure the safety of a minimum population but rather they ensure that the wolf population will remain out of control and way above any benchmark established for delisting.
I might not have all the facts exactly correct but I believe when this same thing happened in Wyoming, the state passed a similar law and when the Feds saw they were playing hardball, Wyoming then had to present their proposed management plan and when it was deemed acceptable, the Feds delisted the wolves.
The same process should work in Wisconsin, Minnesota and Michigan.
More food for thought...if these bills become law as they are written now the state will not be able to spend $$$ (beyond making payments under the endangered resources program to persons applying for reimbursement for damage caused by wolves) for any type of wolf management. This means the state must immediately cease any sort of wolf population study, cannot pay to protect wolves, cannot spend $$$ to establish or administer a wolf season, cannot pay to print a wolf license or tag, and cannot pay anyone on the state payroll to print, advertise, or enforce wolf season hunting laws.
Therefore, since Wisconsin will not be allowed to spend $$$ on a wolf program of any type, the state will be unable to create any sort of wolf management plan (this means no hunting season).
The antis are likely to realize this, take the issue back to court, and argue listing should remain in place because Wisconsin does not have the financial means to create or to effectively manage a wolf management plan. All the antis have to do is cite state law, that would prove we do not have a management plan. Then they would argue, since Wisconsin does not have an effective plan to manage wolves, wolves are completely unprotected and therefore should remain on the ESL.
If AB712 and SB602 become law, those who would like to see a wolf season in Wisconsin may have just provided the means by which the antis can produce the opposite effect.
There is nothing saying that WI can't reinstate funding for the program once the Feds decide to give the State control after the bills pass at the State level first. If we don't pass ours first, nothing will happen until there are wolf populations established all through WI, OH, IL, IN, MN and IA....and that will never happen.
"The season runs Oct. 1 to Dec. 31 in most hunt areas in northwest Wyoming where wolves are designated as trophy game animals and hunters have the responsibility to follow the appropriate regulations and monitor the harvest quota to know if their hunt area has been closed. Where wolves are designated as predatory animals in Wyoming, there is no harvest quota and hunters may take wolves year-round, but must report the take to Game and Fish."
Wolves were delisted in 2011.
"Following five harvest seasons, Montana's known minimum wolf population is a stable 536 wolves in 126 packs."
So WI has more wolves than Montana and no season? A person can harvest up to 5 wolves, but you must buy separate license for each.
The western states don't have as many wolves as the great lakes states but yet they were able to get it done probably as a result of the less liberal political climate and governors who were willing to stand up for what's right.
The same thing should be possible in the Great Lakes States...
Isn't there a clause in the proposed state law that would repeal the law if wolves are delisted by the feds? If not, I wouldn't think it would be that big of a deal to repeal it.
I hope the legislation works and Congress finally acts but if not, we will have shot ourselves in the foot.
Why would delisting have to happen immediately? It did not happen immediately in Wyoming and it took them a while to have their management plan approved and then the wolves were delisted.
I would expect that the process would take some time and don't see any reason why it would have to happen immediately.
Also, I don't know why this would have any negative effect on the legislation that is being proposed at the federal level to delist wolves. Those who are working on that effort can continue toward delisting. When the legislative hearings are conducted it might actually help the situation knowing that Wisconsin is serious and has already passed the state law. Some might say "We better hurry up and delist wolves so that Wisconsin will adopt an acceptable wolf management plan because currently there is nothing".
I see this as Wisconsin taking control of it's own destiny. The feds want the wolves managed but they aren't going to do it, instead they force it on the state and it is basically an unfunded mandate. The state finally says "if you're not going to let us manage the wolves, we're not going to do your dirty work for you at our expense". The feds want the wolves managed and the state wants them delisted. The feds will not delist them until the state has an approved management plan that guarantees protection and prevents extirpation. The feds get what they want and the state gets what it wants. Except the feds have to accept that some wolves are finally going to die...
If Congress would get off their dead ass the issue would be solved......
