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A sign of things to come

There is a movement nationwide to have non hunters join their state’s fish and game departments. I can’t think of a legal why they shouldn’t be allowed to but this is one way you’re going to see the hunter culture eroded in the decades to come. To me the “culture” is brand new and I come from a family that fished a little bit no hunting. Rednecks eat squirrels, ‘possum, raccoons and roadkill. The pursuit of game has given me so much satisfaction and opened up new experiences for me. I met a guy on the closing day of season last year who shot a 15 point spectacular buck in Vermont. He’d been chasing it since he got his first photo of it in 2019. 4 seasons. He hadn’t shot a deer in 4 years. He got up in the hills near Mount Snow and said he hiked up and down about 8 miles a day with his 30-06. Those experiences in America are uncommon and becoming fewer by the decade. There is a sad nostalgia about the loss of many of these hunting opportunities but there are also more opportunities too great in number to experience. I drove by a spot I’ve been meaning to hunt yesterday and it is totally cleared for development. I wish I could’ve hunted it while it was there. Now it’s gravel. Still- there’s thousands of acres out there to experience and I’m hoping my kids learn to love it like I have.

No habitat ,no hunting.......period.

BD...unless this state develops similar laws to connecticut where there are no setbacks for bowhunters, as long as you have written permission from the landowner you can sit where ever you like on the property, pretty soon we are going to have nowhere to hunt. I wont hold my breath that that is ever going to happen in this state.

Noob, I too grew up in a family that neither hunted or fished. my brother and I had to teach ourselves through trial and error (mostly error) until we could find mentors along the way. it was a very painful way to go through it, but 'smooth sails never made a skilled sailor,' right?

Heavy post noob, and I tend to agree with all you wrote. I'm still mourning the site of many perk test holes in one of my all time best locations which soon will be many homes I'm sure.

Habitat protection is huge. No habitat, no fish, no animals... But even more important, no chance for future people to love wild spaces if they can not access them. And that's really sad.

Make room for low income housing so the hords of illegals have a nice and free home.

Dont say it isn't so. And here's a whopper. 320k spent on a program to teach our grade schoolers sensitivity to things they didn't know existed.

We are cutting down the woods along with our cultural roots .

The common sense crop is likely to fail again this year. Enjoy the chaos .

"Lots of time and money" those are the ones that think they know best and are ruining the new England states. This is nothing new folks. They have been running a game plan for quite a while. Time to load up the truck and move to ...... Anywhere they won't move to.

First bulldoze a dirt road into a beautiful piece of wildlife habitat. Then cut all the trees. Discover a lot of gravel so dig and truck it out. Some of the ground too wet ; no problem, it can be made to perc. One thing 's for certain: when the houses are built that land is lost to the animals who called it home and the bow hunter who called it his honey hole. I'm sure if the deer living in those woods could talk they would call it deconstruction.

Be smart. Move to a place where it is accepted and encouraged. Other states have such a bounty of outdoor activities it will blow your mind. You just have to have the courage to make the move.

A piece of land that I've hunted on for over 25 years will now be 200 unit condos. I knew it was coming and there's nothing to stop it. Good memories there.

Looks like you might’ve been tickling the setback Noob, a situation that I remember well. Maybe those developers saved you a ticket. Or at least a run-in with an indignant McMansion dweller.

In 6 yrs I'll have 30yrs in the laborers. I know where I b goin

Money, power ,more money , more power...Who needs swamps and hardwood ridges when we can have yet another mall with its enormous parking lot rimmed with litter? In any kind of economic foot race the natural world always gets screwed . Combine Disney- like anti hunting sentiment with the ubiquitous threat of development and it paints a dark picture for my grand children 's hunting future. Hunting is already part of the fabric of their lives .

Where you goin Lunker? Hunting?

I've become pretty pessimistic about the future of the human race. We keep claiming that we are coming up with "solutions" to mitigate the effects of billions of humans on our planet, but all of those ideas continue to push us further and further from the natural world. Unless we can realize that we are part of the natural world, and live in a way that reflects that knowledge, which I don't believe will happen, we will eventually go extint like the majority of species that came before us. And right before it all ends people will still be pointing fingers at whomever they have been told is to blame. Is that bleak enough, lol?

Take a look at what's happening in Washington. Colorado is not far behind.

I've come to grips with the fact that I may have to resort to poaching before I die due to the direction hunting and conservation is going. Although I'm hopeful my state will be one of the last to fall.

My thoughts regarding humans is a bit stronger than HFC posted. Most humans suck. I used to think most were good. Not anymore. There is a reason I moved, and it wasn't just for the great hunting.

Well... I could go anywhere , if I didn't mind saying goodbye to the few people I call family .

It's possible that my home becomes motorized...

Right on Pi. That’s a major concern going forward. Simply moving to a place where it’s accepted and encouraged doesn’t always work anymore. I’ve had a place in NH since ‘02. The amount of posted land now is incredible. urban sprawl. So many out of staters have bought properties and land and posted it all. Land that families have hunted for years is now closed off. The natives are not happy.

Urban sprawl for more humans, but cut the trees that create oxygen. Hsfc is 100 percent correct

Proline, I hear ya. Problem is that out-of-staters bring their politics and value systems with them to the country; then want to impose them on others. I've tried as best I can to create my own little world around me. This has helped to some extent. I seldom leave home and then only to hunt , fish, visit family and friends and gas up the car. I maintain a busy solitude. Einstein implored us to understand the impermanence of all things. That 's true, but I'm happier ignoring that fact even though the woods all around me is being "developed" as a reminder. I'm convinced that a more primitive type of spirituality is important (at least for me) on an earth we are chewing up under the name of progress. Land , woods and the animals therein are sacred.

See this rite here is the number one issue hunters should be fighting . Hunters as a whole should be standing together and fighting for land and the sport we love . But instead we fight amongst each other over hunting spots or you can’t hunt here or how dare you shoot a spike horn . People need to wake up and think

^ young grasshopper is spot on. As a group hunter need to come together grow a set and put their foot down to all of this nonsense and BS that the govt is trying to push on everyone.

Land preservation and habitat health are the most important things to me. Frankly, I'd be okay if I couldn't hunt or fish, but there was green space that couldn't be built or destroyed. I prefer both options, but the space being healthy and well is of higher value.

Will, I'd be bat shit crazy if I couldn't hunt.

There will always be development. The bigger threat is non hunters making decisions concerning hunting. This is part of the strategy. Management decisions based on emotions rather than biology.

We will continue to develop until earth is no longer hospitable to human life. Water will be diverted to desserts for golf courses and millions of green back yards, cancer rates will continue to rise, concrete will be laid preventing the earth from cycling carbon properly and changing the way water flows across the landscape, that's all the tip of the iceberg. It might be 100 years or 1000's of years, but humans are screwed on this planet.

This all boils down to there being too many people in the world. Every single person that is in this forum lives in a house, on land, that someone used to hunt on. Dont blame development, thats not the problem, and you would be a hypocrite to do so if you live in anything but a shelter in the woods. People need places to live, and as long as the population keeps increasing, so will the need for housing. All you can do as a human being is just dont have an excessive amount of children. You can also live in "communal development" like a multi-family home or a condo complex as this means less development per person. I have zero desire to do that, i want to live on 50 acres of my own in my own home. So yes, Im part of the problem, just like everyone else. Makes it tough to complain. If it bothers you enough, just move somewhere else until the urban sprawl catches you again.

You're absolutely right, bwb. I'm also part of the problem, if you want to look at it that way. The more I look at it, the more I think it's not a problem. If deer had our brains and thumbs they would proliferate their species until they created their own demise as well, any species would.

Dan, that's a very good point. In addition to housing, each person needs food and energy, both of which take up space to generate... The guy in me who likes to say inappropriate stuff for funnies now notes: Vasectomies and condoms = more deer hunting land in 30 years, so snip and cover gents!

BWB, I was having so much fun blaming others for habitat destruction and you wrecked it. LOL

I'm not so sure development was the original topic. It was the individual in them. #peoplesuc.com

I’m not sure I had an original topic other than I e been injured for a month and I’m going a little crazy. I’m not complaining about development, but it is and will be a constant factor for hunters in the next 50 years (and beyond). Hey 100 years ago it was probably lousy habitat too. The whole state was a farm field.

I’m not sure I had an original topic other than I e been injured for a month and I’m going a little crazy. I’m not complaining about development, but it is and will be a constant factor for hunters in the next 50 years (and beyond). Hey 100 years ago it was probably lousy habitat too. The whole state was a farm field.

The computer was weird today, so I'm dropping back in to see if the Internet is working. It is, Yay!

Noob - that's very true. If any of you are ever out in my homeland (Petersham), about 3 miles south of route 2 on route 32, Harvard U has it's school of forestry. They have a cool museum, which contains super cool dioramas showing how the landscape looked basically from the first settlers through when the dioramas were built - which was, at the most recent, the 70's, but may have been a bit earlier. So it's missing a little of the modern forest landscape, but wholly smokes its super cool to see the progression from forested in full, to zero forest, to a forest fairly similar to what we have today. Worth checking out, plus you could take a hike in the Quabbin or go fishing or something.

Here is a web site about them: https://harvardforest.fas.harvard.edu/dioramas

Ironically, perhaps, that progression to farm field came with massive over hunting for food or market and environmental degradation... Then the North American Model of Conservation came along and huge positive changes occurred. And that has been an epic win. Couple that to environmental protection taking off in like the late 60's/early 70's and the difference is huge.

We have issues, but in many ways when it comes to environmental health and hunting broadly, at least for a majority (NOT ALL) critters we hunt, this is probably the greatest time frame anyone reading this web page has ever lived through. The numbers would sure suggest that.

(Yes, in specific locations or instances that may not be accurate - I'm talking very broadly).

The whole thing sucks. It seems like such an impossible task to actually make a difference now a days. I feel so guilty so being part of the problem and not trying to solve anything but the other half of me just wants to watch out for myself and make the best of this one life i have now. Every day i just get closer and closer to being a homesteader in the middle of nowhere.

We need a new inland city . A Nuclear haven. Call it Greenland or something.

There is plenty of room in our country but no one wants to move there.

I looked at a place down here the other day… 235 acres… 4 bed house. Needs some work. Taxes…. 1675…. Per year

Don’t get me wrong. We have developments going up in a lot of places… but still plenty of woods and places that won’t be houses.

Like mud huts with dirt floors ?

I got 2 acres... Wife gave em to me.

MAPA - snake infested swamp land doesnt count :) Dan - little things make ripples. One person, doing one thing, may not change much. But it may lead to other people ultimately adjusting. It's long, slow, tedious, but it helps. Hell, look at this thread, weirdly your post yesterday made me feel better. Even the pessimistic aspects of it. You just framed that issue really well and helped me think about it better. Thank you for that.

See - you just made the world a teeny tiny bit better... And that's a win.

Haha I'll take it Will!

Arrownoob VT has been a tough battle to be part of (and I'm directly involved in several around the country). I've been impressed by how the community has rallied. We had record engagement with our action alerts, our social media posts were shared hundreds of time, and I know dozens and dozens of hunters who have made direct contact with their VT senators. While it resulted in some major changes to the bill, it still ultimately passed. Now we pick up the battle once again, this time in the house. We'll see what happens.

A Gene Hill quote seems appropriate with regard to land development /habitat loss. "When the landmarks go they take the history of the land with them , and the ghosts of all the men gone before must find us in another place." Good that we still have other places.

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