Deputies watched dogs 'eating rib cage' of Virginia woman, 22, during mauling, sheriff says
By Katherine Lam | FoxNews.com Published December 19, 2017
Deputies found a Virginia woman in the woods and saw her two pit bull dogs “eating [her] rib cage,” the sheriff said on Monday about the “grisly” mauling of the 22-year-old who was found dead after taking her pets for a walk.
Bethany Stephens, 22, was found about 8:20 p.m. Thursday in a wooded area in Goochland, WTVR reported. Her father discovered her body guarded by “two very large, brindle-colored pit bull dogs,” who were Stephens’ pets that friends said she loved.
“Let me cut right to the chase, the most important detail that we did not release because we were worried about the well-being of the family is that in the course of trying to capture the dogs early Friday morning...we turned and looked…I observed, as well as four other deputy sheriffs, the dogs eating the ribcage on the body,” Goochland County Sheriff James Agnew said in a news conference.
I'm a dog lover, for sure. It seems every time one of these instances comes up, people say, it's not the breed, it's their upbringing.
Well, every time a pit bull kills a little kid - sometimes a family brings a newborn child into the home only to get mauled to death in seconds. The response is exactly the same - we never saw it coming. He/she was so loving, never showed any signs of aggression.
In this case, their loving care provider ripped to shreds, and nobody knows how or why it was triggered. Not long ago, a guy I went to high school with was waiting for his young daughter to come running off the school bus. His pit killed his daughter as she was doing just that.
It's not the dog's fault - they do exactly what they were bred to do, and that is to fight and kill.
If you put yourself and children around these dogs, it's a disaster waiting to happen. They seem loving and sweet and protective, until their "attack" mechanism triggers on a child, or their owner.
A few years ago, when my dad was alive but in his 90's he saw a dog attacking his German Shepherd. He had the shepherd on a lead by the pond. My dad grabbed his 12 ga shotgun and went out the door. When he got close the dog started coming towards him. He shot it and in ran into the woods. He called me and I went up there and he told me what happened. I went down to the pond and the shepherd was dead. About 20 yards in the woods was a dead pit bull. We had never seen it before and have no idea where it came from
The case in Goochland, VA is fascinating for me because it's local and the sheriff did something unprecedented; he allowed the media to view crime scene video evidence almost immediately after the attack. He did that to quell the already mounting attacks that LE was "being lazy" in automatically blaming the dogs. The sheriff pulled some media members behind closed doors and let them watch video of the dogs consuming its owner.
One of her dogs had a history of aggression towards its former owner and Ms. Stephens went from raising them in her house to keeping them in a kennel where their only human contact was the walks she took them on. The fact that they ate her, well, that injects other factors into the conjecture of how badly wired or horribly kept they were. Probably never know the full story unless some sort of pathology comes back in the necropsy of the dogs.
My place in the mountains of Southern California backs up to the National Forest and there are tons of trails nearby that people from town and from down in the valley use. There is no leash law in the woods and people frequently let their dogs run free. I walk these trails frequently and in the last 5 years, have been attacked by pit bulls - completely unprovoked. One time I was chased into a tree. The other I fended the dog off with a large branch till its owner grabbed it. I'm tired of it. I open carry now whenever I'm in the woods and the 3rd time I get attacked by a pitbull, the dog will be shot if it gets too close. Period. I'm not going to be attacked.
My sister has two pitbulls and they're always talking about how the breed has such a bad rap... Their dog had a litter and all but one of them was put down for attacking someone or another dog. My parents took in a stray pitbull a couple years ago. A couple months later, they came home to the neighbor reporting that it and my brother's pitbulls had killed the neighbor's horse... ripped its jaw off while it was still alive. The breed are absolute killers.
When living in Ok. for several yrs I had my golden retrieve (one of the best all around bird dog that I have own) that came up missing with several others in the neighborhood, found out that they were stolen for dog fighting practice. Ever since then I have put the pit bull on my extermination list, no reason for one to own them just like keeping a load gun that some idiot will come along and pull the trigger. Heard every excuse from owners of pit bulls but never a good one, the gene factor is just breed to deep in them for doing harm.
where the defenders.........there were a few guys in the site a few years ago that were delusionally supportive of the breed and blamed the owners for training or the victims for not approach the dogs right. some real sickos.
Little story many years ago my wife had friends from work over for a bbq and they had little kids. First thing they do is head over to the kennels. I tell their father don't let the dogs out as they have not been around kids and they have been blooded better safe than sorry. Well you guessed it as soon as I went into the house the yahoo let's them out. Little baby on the patio let's go with a cry and dogs go into hunting mode. Still remember the horror on the mother's face as the dogs crossed the yard. Needless to say it was a little tense I yelled kennel up and they did. The breed treeing walker coon hounds
"I could do without is Chihuahua's" Me too, but a vicious Chihuahua isn't going to kill anyone over a few weeks old.
Pitts are built physically to kill. They all have the physical ability and unfortunately too many have the temperament. It may never be expressed, but when it is even an adult cannot physically overcome them.
"If you don't like pit bulls dont own one. "
You are aware that some lions and tigers also would never harm anyone or anything?
Pit Bulls are responsible for roughly 84% of dog attack fatalities. The next closest breed is rotties which are responsible for about 8% of fatalities. Pit's make up 6% of all breeds owned, but account for 84% of the fatalities. Terminate. Terminate with extreme prejudice.
You guys sound like a bunch of liberals. The first story posted is not about American Pit Bull Terriers. But then again the media call about 15 to 20 breeds pitbulls.
Those dogs were huge and were most likely Brazillian Mastiffs, the same breed that killed the girl out in SF years ago. That's what there pictures looked like to me.
The American pitbull population in the US is huge, you can't go by the percentage listed above since that's most likely from the AKC and they don't recognize the APT. Based on population and percentages of attack the APT is less than other breeds and I would guess it would be even less if they didn't lump in other breeds by mistake.
The percentages below show us the percentage of the breed involved in fatal attacks v. the population of the breed, for the last 30 years in the USA. Apx. 240,000 - 12 Fatal Attacks Chow Chow .005% Apx 800,000 - 67 Fatal Attacks German Shepherds .008375% Apx. 960,000 - 70 Fatal Attacks Rottweiler .00729% Apx. 128,000 - 18 Fatal Attacks Great Dane .01416% Apx. 114,000 - 14 Fatal Attacks Doberman .012288% Apx. 72,000 - 10 Fatal Attacks St Bernard .0139% Apx 5,000,000- 60 Fatal Attacks American Pit Bull Terrier .0012%
There have been over 400 fatal dog attacks since 1970 involving 30 different breeds. The majority were caused from unattended children that became victims. 268 fatal attacks occurred from negligence by parents of children up to the age of 7 years old. When taking into account all the circumstances involving fatal attacks there is no rational basis to ban or restrict a specific breed of dog. " Please Note: There are 4000 registered basenji's in the USA, and there have been 4 deaths by this breed. C2003 ACF. All Rights Reserved.
Poul Poulsen www.eurowaf.org American Canine Foundation
I think the biggest problem with the APT is that a lot of the owners are low lifes that shouldn't own a dog and don't raise the dog. These same people are the ones that have children that fill up our jails.
Michael Vick and his gangster thug buddies horribly abused 50 APT's. They took those dogs and all but two of them could be rehabilitated. That shows you what kind of dog breed they are.
There is ALWAYS a reason a dog bites. They don't just snap. There are some bad dogs that need to be put down. You need to be in charge, the pack leader otherwise the dog will take over. Little kids can be the pack leader and I've seen hundreds of APT's in NYC that a well adjusted and will never hurt anyone. I have seen plenty of doogs too that pull their owner around on the leash and if they are a large dog they are accidents waiting to happen.
The bottom line is that the experts say the APT is a great breed and the media says they are the devil. Take your pick.
And for those that say APT's wee bred to kill do a little research. They breed the dogs to fit other dogs in a small pit and they dogs were specifically breed NOT to bite humans since you have two dogs with their handlers in a small pit both fighting and hurting and you think those guys want a dangerous hurting dog that would turn on them? That's why they were called the nanny dog since they were so good with kids and the family.
Yes.....all dogs can bite. They have teeth. But comparing a Chihuahua to a Pit Bull is ludacris. Yes Chihuahua's are aggravating but it's like a firecracker is to an atomic bomb.
And if you want to hunt ducks, what kind of dog do you get. A Chihuahua? No.....try a Labrador, or a Chessie, or a Golden. Same if you are herding sheep or cattle. You don't buy a Setter. You get a Border Collie or any of the other herding breeds. Why? Because they are the breed that they are because they've been selectively bred WITH THE TRAITS BEST SUITED FOR THE JOB AT HAND.
A Pit Bull is no different. They've been selectively bred to KILL things. And not just their physical tools, such as their massive jaw muscles, but their MINDSET. This IMO is what makes them more dangerous than other dogs that go aggressive.
I have a friend who's an LEO. He's also a dog lover. He and his wife take in rescue dogs. Yet he will be the first to tell you that if they're called to a situation and there's a loose Pit Bull present they will not hesitate for a nano-second to shoot it.
Attached is a link to dog bite fatalities. Defend pit bulls all you want. I will be on guard every time I am near one. Every time.
We have trash, white trash that is moving into the development that borders mine. Every young couple seems to have at least on. They can barely control them when they walk them. When my wife are out walking, I ensure that my M&P Shield is accessible. As one owner said as the two dogs strained at their leash, "They're harmless". My response was "I'm not."
Pit bulls make up 6% of the dog population, and account for 84% of the dog relat d fatalities..... reminds me of a certain group of people who make up 13% of the population and are responsible for 50% of the murders
The statistic clearly show that pit bulls are the most dangerous dogs in the world. My own experience agrees. I've been around dogs of all breeds my entire life. I've been attacked by a dog once and it was a pit. I see no reason to own one of these dogs.
You mean those silly facts that pits account for over 80% of all dog bite fatalities? Or silly things like the fact that many insurance companies will not provide liability insurance for pit owners and if they do provide it you pay a higher premium? Or that silly dead woman just killed by her own pit bulls? Silly people must just imagine that pits are vicious.
Bowbender, do a little research on the site you posted since you've been duped. That site was created by a law firm specializing in suing owners in dog bite cases. Go see what dog experts say about the breed instead of sounding like the anti gun libs sound when they talk about the evil assault weapon. There are well over 5 million pitbulls that have never bitten or attacked anyone in this country. I still can't believe hunters and especially mostly conservatives will believe media bs.
The "evil assault weapon" cannot decide on it's own to kill or maim. Simple and irrefutable fact.
I was once confronted by a German Shepard and a Doberman that were in a pissed off state. The Doberman was someone's yard/guard dog because it actually came up in a friendly manner at first, then the Shepard appeared which was fairly wild and looked like it had been wandering the river bottoms for awhile, then both dogs went on attack.
We were coming back from an elk hunt in Sept and we (myself, dad, and brother) stopped off at dad's office for something when the dogs appeared. We were backs against the wall until we got inside. The Shepard lunged once and dad kicked it in the throat - didn't even phase it. I can only imagine the resolve a pit bull would have if it decided to attack...
Actually, Mint I did research and the other sites pretty much confirm the 6%/84% stats. Dog experts? No, they're apologists for the dogs behavior. You want pits? Fine. The city dwellers migrating out that seems to need at least two. Fine. Keep 'em in your yard, under control. When I walk or run, keep it on a short leash, under control. Not walking down the middle of the street with a 25' lead, so the dog can get to both sidewalks.
An assault weapon is an inanimate object. It requires user interface. It's not going to snap one day and go ape shit ballistic on some little kid. Or its owner. It's a not a living, breathing, sentient being that decides for whatever reason, it's going to eat the rib cage of it's owner.
That's your problem right there, a well trained socialized APT doesn't just decide for some reason to just go crazy. No dog does. Everyone of those fatalities when investigated can be explained. Most bites are from non neutered male dogs that have been chained up and not socialized or trained by their owners. They are the ones I blame and they are the ones that should be held accountable. Just like an owner of a firearm that stores or uses it in a unsafe manner. I'm not blaming the dog or firearm.
5,000,000 pits in the U. S. ? That about 1 pit per 60 people. I guess the town I live near defies the numbers with 1500 people and only two pits (owned by methheads).
Edited for big bear, forgot the zero. Regardless Of the numbers the only place I see pits is on the news. Like others I don’t think we should take away a right to own a pit but severe punishment for the owners of dog crimes.
If you worked in NYC you wouldn't think so. I'll see five APT a day easy. Go to the Bronx and Brooklyn and there is even more of them.
As for the dogs that ate the owner, already info is coming out that they went from inside dogs that were being cared for to being outside in a kennel in the cold, not being seen or fed for days on end. The necropsy will bring more information.
Here's the deal. Pits are bad news when they flip the switch. The reason they flip the switch is usually owner caused. Abuse, neglect or purposely wanting to bring out that bad side. You can ban pits but there are plenty of other breeds that can drop right into the role pits play with the crappy owners.
Tough call. I am no fan of pits, I see no use for them but I love freedom. Stiffer penalties for owners when dogs (any breed) go bad is about all I can come up with.
"a well trained socialized APT doesn't just decide for some reason to just go crazy. "
Oh, than it must be some other reason that most major insurance carriers either won't give you homeowners insurance or attach a surcharge to the policy. Funny, firearms don't fall under that consideration. If I choose to add riders to my policy for additional coverage that's one thing, but I'm not going to be denied coverage for owning a gun.
Once again, an AR15 is an inanimate object. It doesn't have a mind of it's own. And yes, pits have gone ape shit crazy and mauled or killed someone. And the owners excuse, he's gentle, he never showed any aggression, blah blah blah..... right up until the time he broke leash and mauled a kid or another dog. You post all you want, when pits are around, close by, I make sure either my XDm or Shield is as well.
Dangerous dogs. They are owned by anti-authority "Warriors." All animals are unpredictable. Many breeds are dangerous, but Pits, Cane Corso's, Neopoltians are the king of the dangerous canines. Bred to maul and maim till victim is dead. Some smart municiplaties have banned them outright, others mandatory liability insurance and muzzles. Mad Dog
The town I live in has a population of around 800 (Concrete, WA.) and I'd guess there's at least one pit bull for every 10 residents, and there's at least one of 'em loose per week in my neighborhood. I call 'em "Concrete Poodles".
Although I like dogs, I'm a cat lover and we have 2 (at the moment). Lost a very cool cat (Burmese) a number of years ago to a pair of loose dogs, and ever since my policy is if I see a dog on my property and it acts aggressive towards me or my cats, it's terminated. So far, so good, but always prepared.
It's as simple as this. What you or I do often impacts others. Dogs are the result of their raising, regardless of breeds. And, not all dogs are equal in breeding and capabilities to do harm.
No one can predict what a dog they do not own or, a dog they do own, but hasn't had proper discipline and training, will do, to someone. No dogs are immune. However, I truly believe that any dog breed, if handled properly and trained well, offers it's master no threat at all. None. Because a dog is bred to respond to their master. If they themselves are their master, due to ignorant owners, then they are a dangerous dog to EVERYONE. And, like all things that involve irresponsible people, are just a variable in bad situations.
I also know that a dog feels no obligations towards anyone that isn't it's master. So, a responsible dog owner doesn't allow their dog to be around uncontrolled situations without their supervision and unwavering physical control. A properly trained dog will not do anything, to displease its master. So, if you frequent yourself around dog owners that do not have complete control over their animal, be prepared by not putting yourself in harms way.
That's the way I handle it. Because I promise, if any dog, yours, mine, the POTUS bites me, I'm going to KILL it dead. With zero remorse. I hold the people as responsible as the dog in most cases. And, I see no reason to have a dog, that is beyond physical realms to control. So, dust the pits, the mastiff's, any dog that offers real harm if they "lose" it. Based mostly on the fact that their owners simply are not responsible enough to own them. Because they are the responsible person here and should be held accountable for their choices. If they can live with that, that's fine. But, they had better hope my family and I can too.
I am not a pit bull fan. Neither do I condemn the breed or any other.
My daughter had one that was half pit half lab and one of the best dogs I ever saw. There is no doubt in my mind he saved her from harm a time or two when she was in college. He was allowed to die because an incompetent vet did not treat him as she said she would. She let him suffer over 12 hours although my daughter authorized treatment. Did manage to send a bill and demand payment anyway When my daughter took him to a new vet, they tried but it was too late. That vet was upset at the other one because of lack of treatment. The 12 hours would have made all the difference in the world he said. Cato never bothered the chickens, sheep, our dogs or anything else we had when he came to visit, (except when I'd turn him and my bluetick hound loose on a coon, they worked well together).
On the other hand, I have a dog that wanders 3 or 4 miles to another home to visit sometimes. Those folks just got a pit bull pup a few months ago. It barks at me when I go to get Max and I am watchful of it, their other dogs bark also but don't worry me at all. The difference? They named that dog after a "medical strain of marijuana". That and being a red nosed pit does put me on alert. There is the prejudice coming forth.
I had to put a dog choke noose on a pit and take it to the vet after it killed the family's other pit bull. It took about 4 of us to hold that thing down at the vet with the noose on so the vet could euthanize it.... It was SCARY strong.....
Most of the stray aggressive dogs we go on are pit bulls. If you have to shoot one.... Keep shooting...... I've seen them soak up a lot of .223..........
Well this white trash Hoosier antiauthority guy owns a well trained pitbull and could care less what anyone on here thinks.......it's all in how you train the animal. Seems like this entire forum is a bunch of pompous elite know it all's who bash anyone that disagrees with them. I thought as an avid bowhunter this would be a fun forum to join and talk hunting and other topics, boy was I wrong. Deleting my membership after this post, good riddance.
Anyone should be able to own any dog they like. I'm in the camp of if your dog injures someone then you as the owner should be charged with assault. If your dog kills someone then you should be charged with murder. Your dog kills another dog, then you get charged with destruction of property, etc. Pretty simple. If you want to own a dangerous breed then take responsibility for it. I'm a freedom loving conservative who feels people should have the freedom to do what they like and take ownership for those decisions.
There are so many "breeds" of pit bulls because a great many of them cannot be kept under control on their own property. "the owners fault" is a piss poor excuse. I've had em come through a chain link fence at my dogs while my wife was walking them. Our GSP still has some scars and if not for being the faster dog would be dead. When the owners were confronted the dog was "missing". They stashed it with other family (this was not the first incident with this dog) so the police could not confiscate the dog and put it down. All they did is make it some other neighborhood's problem.
"it's all in how you train the animal." BS. "Deleting my membership after this post, good riddance." You're on the CF sunshine, not the BGF. Everybody has an opinion and your's isn't special just for being you. If you can debate with some facts other than "my dog is ok because I trained it so well" I'd love to hear it. But if this is all it takes to make a person quit a forum...... maybe a not the kind you're looking for.....
"don't want a pit bull don't own one" 100% wrong. Have never owned one yet have been threatened and attacked by them several times. Someone else owned them, every time. Of course folks feel their dog is a good dog or the best dog. Folks feel the same about their bows and trucks too. Funny how many times it's members of the family of these things that gets maimed or killed though.....
There are many breeds that are or can be aggressive. Few have the the ability or genetic makeup to drive the attack to the death.... man, or beast. That is what these are bred for and have been for a long long time.
This is a breed that is so prolific (see above) in some form or another it is not going to be "outlawed", next to impossible. But I'm 100% for Brotsky's proposal..... the owners be held responsible for anything and EVERYTHING their dog does. Right down to assault and murder.
"I think the bottom line is is that pits just do the worst when they attack, more so than the other breeds." True, but the real problem is that a lot of pitbull owners should not own them since they have no concept of what owner a powerful dog entails. They think he or she is human and has feelings like they do. They don't understand that a dog is a dog and you need to be in control and be the pack leader. Believe me the worst thing that ever happened to the breed is that they got very popular. Would I recommend them to someone? Depends on the person and how responsible they are.
I have a fresh pit bull story that made me chuckle today. I was checking traps this afternoon, (yeah, I should have gotten on it this morning but didn't, never mind why). Most of the short line I have out I can check from the truck just driving around the field. I pull up to one set and there firmly held by a perfect front paw pad catch is a red nose critter and it ain't Rudolf. Not a big pit bull but still big enough. It is skinny, you can count it's ribs but it does have a collar. I think first of this thread and second of a story my uncle used to tell of catching a huge German Shepard 40 years ago and being afraid they couldn't release it (they did no problem).
I ease up to this pit talking to it, it never makes a sound. It sniffs my hand and just looks plain pitiful. I think about using the catch pole, but really didn't want to choke it down since it wasn't acting aggressive. So I grab my coat (why didn't I wear the heavier one today!), put it around the dog's head and managed to hold the coat around it while I press down on the coil spring levers enough to release the foot. Examined the foot, no injury, petted the dog and headed back to the truck. The dog followed me and really acted like I ought to give it a ride, but when I went back to remake the set, it decided it didn't want to hang around.
My record of never trapping a dog that I couldn't release remains intact. This was one of the easiest canines I ever let loose for which I am grateful, it behaved like a lady (or gentleman, I didn't check). In fact, I can think of only one other that was easier. I just hope whoever owns it (no name on the collar), feeds it before it does get in trouble.
Salagi, even the most ardent supporter of banning the breed(s) does not deny that many of these dogs are not a menace and can be quite friendly. The problem is that it is impossible to predict when and how they will revert to their nature and become a danger to someone or something. When/if they do they have the ability to kill.
I don't know Henry, to hear some of the ones on here all pits are cold blooded killers and to others they are are perfectly sweet and innocent.
When I mentioned that the only dog so far to bite me was a hound (her name was Sybil and it was not too long after the movie came out so the name seemed appropriate to me), and that hounds were trained to kill, I was told it was a silly statement. Didn't seem silly at the time Sybil was gnawing on me and every hound worth it's salt is indeed trained to kill. End of Sybil's story is her owner (my grandfather who never knew she had bit me), got rid of her because she did act aggressive towards his grandkids and great grandkids.
I mentioned that years ago German Shepherds were considered the mean breed (remember when they were called German Police Dogs?). Later it was the dobermans followed by rottweilers. People began to breed up strains that weren't aggressive and now most of them are considered fine pets, safe around children and all that.
We are seeing the same thing with pit bulls, (using the generic term for those breeds). As a medical first responder, volunteer fireman, and a reserve deputy, I have run into both kinds. I've also demanded that people shut the Chihuahuas up before I would render aid. It's mighty hard to take a blood pressure while having to dodge those ankle biters. You know they won't kill you unless they hit a vein, but I'd still like to have only one dog bite thank you.
I'll most likely never own a pit myself, but neither will I condemn everyone that owns one. It's not all in the owners, but a lot of the blame does lie there.
The friendliest, most gentle dog to strangers I have ever seen besides my current lab, was a Rot named Bully. He was so gentle. Wasn't scared or coward to anyone. Would come right to you wagging his whole rear end wanting petted. Even if you were a complete stranger. He really loved kids the most because they would pet him forever. However, his owner trained him well from a weaned pup, stayed around him when kids were around, and watched them as much as he did the dog. He died of old age without me ever hearing him bark. Many of the Shepard's are the same way now. However, some are still heavy into the old breeding lines. So, you have to watch where you get them if you want a more gentle dog by birth.
Great, honest opinions. I have known some pleasant ones that friends have owned (and, yes, they ARE ALL anti-authority types or just dopey I-LOVE-ALL ANIMALS-IRRESPECTIVE women) . As A kid, I lived in a neighborhood with an inordinate amount of dogs (90% of homes) and we also had packs of feral dogs that would cruise thru town sometimes usually just passing thru. I got bitten and attacked quite often because I loved dogs and tried to pet them. I got attacked by a few Shepards and A Rottweiler and a big ass great Dane on different occassions and quickly rolled up in to a ball To protect my vitals and face. All of those dogs ran me down and bite me a few times until I was down, then just stood guard over me. Pit bulls keep going. That's the difference. Mad Dog
There was a guy jogging out on a country road near here a few years ago that was killed by cane corsos right on the road. I believe the owners were charged with murder.....
And an elderly man in Detroit was severely mauled by a pack of pits on his own porch.... If I remember correctly he lost his hands but survived......
I had to shoot a Rot once at work..... It was running around a neighborhood and scared a lady back into her own house.... When I got there and located it the dog charged me full tilt with very bad intentions..... I yelled at it and started backing up but it didn't slow down. I fired a couple of shots from the hip and hit it in the leg which stopped the charge..... We called in an animal control guy with a catch stick and he came out and gathered it up and it was euthanized..... the owners were charged with misdemeanors for letting the dog get out.....
That's what they're genetically wired to do. They also have the physical TOOLS to get the job done. That's what they are. If you need to pull a loaded beer wagon you get a Clydesdale, not a Shetland pony. If you need something dead and ripped to shreds you get a Pitbull, not a Golden Retriever.
Freeglee is just a troll. He says ridiculous stuff just to get you guys wound up and when he succeeds (which is often), it satisfies his insane urge to screw with people. Stop replying to him and he'll go away.
What problems ??? It killed the owners other dog and the owner requested that it be put down ...... Should they have kept it in the house with their kids ?? Adopted it out to a loving family ??? The owners called 911 and requested help because they couldn't get the dogs separated.........
Sorry about that. Pretty much everyone on here agrees that a big dog like a Pit Bull or a Rottweiler needs to be put down if it attacks humans or other animals........
Police Officers are the ones that usually end up dealing with it...... We don't usually think of Animal Control Officer as part of our job when we signed up for the job...... but it is. There's no training for it so we simply rely on our firearms training and common sense and wing it..........
BB, I would say the same for a little dog. Biting dogs shouldn't be tolerated at all.
My brother has a Pit also. That dog is fuqn crazy and should be shot. It has never bitten anyone that I know of yet, and protects the family, but go near the house or my brother's car while he is inside and you swear the dog will come through a window at you. Very scary dog.
Working in a service industry, I encounter all types of dogs. I've only had one or two ankle biters grab my pant leg, and one mutt came at me looking to rip my leg up, but that one had a muzzle on. Still scared the crap out of me when it came around my truck. Owner knew it was a biter, but didn't seem to mind it scaring people. Plenty of others have locked up the dogs before I enter the house, which I appreciate. Except I love dogs and want to pet them all, I feel insulted when they don't like me. LOL.
Our city pound is full of pit bulls..... Imagine your brothers dog going bat shit crazy and then imagine walking into our pound with lots of them going bat shit crazy and the walkway is only a few feet wide between the cages.... It's a very uneasy feeling walking in there....
That video of the 4 year old getting mauled to death posted by WW occurred less than 3 miles from where I work........
I'll take big bear's experience with dogs as gospel. I think what Brunse meant was the evil beast could have hurt all of you guys trying to "humanely" put him down, but as you said, other than a rural area where you could walk him out back and put one between his eyes, it's not as easy as ya think. And YES! THEY HAVE RETARD STRENGTH FOR THEIR SIZE. I also have an older neighbor who worked for the City Dept. Of Health investigatIing dog bites. He's seen it all. He's not a fan of ANY dog..He's seen the lovable family beagle that was having a bad day disfigure a little girl. Saint Bernards were doing bad shit in the 1970s and 80s. That being said, he says the exponential growth in pit, bulls, Staffs, Presa Canarios, Cane corals, and Neopoltians was a game changer. It's Nolo Contendre! These dogs are BAD news. Much greater damage and many more incidents. Bottom line, people don't watch their kids, forget about their dogs. Being in the residential service business, I've had way too many instances of nasty dogs being "put away in the back room or backyard" and then their dopey kid let's them out and their on you. Had a 2o minute Mexican standoff with a big female Rhodesian Ridgeback in a luxury kitchen (the homeowner after he came home: "of shit..I thought I locked her upstairs. I can't believe she didn't bite you!). I didn't even have a knife or tool, but I decided I would give her my left arm (your weaker arm...thats what we we trained to do in The State Guard) grab her rear leg and start body slamming her on the granite counter top, radiator, thru the plate glass window. It would have been bloody for both of us, but she was gonna pay too!. I tried good cop bad cop...talking sweet, talking very loud deep and gruff. She would come no closer than 3 feet baring teeth, snarling. If I tried to back up she would follow, but she wouldn't back up.when I went forward either. Finally, my helper walked by a window and I pounded on it. He looked in. I said go ring the doorbell a dog is up here. So, about 30 second later, the bell rings, she takes off, I boogie around the granite island, pull open the basement door and HERE SHE COME TO GET MY ASS I just slam the door and she's going CRAZY on the other side...WHEW!! close call after that I ALWAYS carry a big heavy mag lite and a nice knife on my side. Ain't gonna be a defenseless victim... Mad Dog
Haven't read all the responses but simply put pit bulls are designed and have been bred to do one thing. Fight other dogs. Not protect like many breeds like the well known German breeds, but to fight and kill. Now I would kill any dog attacking someone, but would be especially quick to kill a pit bull. Thankfully none live near me. It doesn't help I admit that a goodly percentage of their owners are trash, but the breed is badly flawed no matter who owns them. An Akita is overly protective and thus dangerous, a pit ball is simply a killer.
I throw the bullshit flag on those that claim it is all in the handling of the breed and little to do with the fighting temperament bred into it. There's no military, security, or LE force in the world that wouldn't use that tenacious and powerful breed if it could be predictably controlled.
Probably in 2005, or 2006, I lived in a duplex and let my labs out to go to the bathroom in our front yard which was un-fenced, so I'd just go out with them and make sure they didn't roam off. A loose Pit-bull from several houses down heard their collars jingle and turned and B-lined it to my yard and was posturing with my dogs and acting aggressive. I grabbed my dogs and pulled them into my house; having a 80lb lab in each hand I couldn't shut the door and the pit followed me into my house. I grabbed my 12 gauge and before I could even load it for whatever reason the pit left. I hate those god damn dogs!
Several years after that my friend who lived in a pretty homogeneous neighborhood of welfare recipients and will probably never be gentrified, had a loose pit come into his yard and he had a bunch of kids playing out back. He is the type of guy who, if he has his pants on, he also has a .45 on him (Dan Wesson, bobtail; pretty bad ass gun). He shot the dog in the snout and it came out it's lower jaw and then hit it's leg. Miraculously the dog survived. Unfortunately the owner of the dog lived a few houses down and was a pretty high up M3 gang member. He was cleared by the police for a justifiable shooting, however they informed him who owned the dogs and that they couldn't really protect him, and told him to "keep your guns loaded". He received a bunch of dirty looks and minor vandalism over the next coming days, but nothing terrible happened. He ultimately just abandoned the home and moved out of the neighborhood (this was during the financial crisis and he was way underwater on his home; like half). Moral of that story is make sure it's worth it to blast a pit-bull, because you might need to blast a person later, or worse blasted yourself.
Three weeks ago on my sheep hunt we camped in cyclone wire fenced property in the mojave desert. Coming in at night we had a pit bull chase us for over a mile. We were on a dirt road going slow towing a trailer. There were a few houses around out there but I was told they were feral. That’s a reciepe for a disaster.
"Grey Ghost.... Surely you are joking about eliminating J.R.T.? Best squirrel dog around."
Yeah, it was mostly a joke.
Although, I do think JRTs do have one of the overall worst dispositions when it comes to interacting with other dogs, and people other than their owners. If you put their temperament into a larger and stronger body, they'd be far worse than pit bulls, IMO. Of course, there are exceptions, just like any breed.
My experience with pits is they are much like horses, in that they can sense fear, and they are great at creating fear. Once they sense it, it's all over. The one and only time a pit ever attacked one of my Goldens, I was so enraged I didn't have time to be fearful. I literally pick him up by his neck and threw him off of my dog, then went after him like a crazy man. I got one last hard kick into his ribs, before he tucked tail and ran off.
A couple weeks ago I was in Cabela's and a lady came by with two JRTs in her cart. They were so cute. I asked her if I could pet them and said sure. They were two years old and the sweetest dogs you can imagine. I told her I had never seen such well behaved JRTs and she said, "They better behave." She said it wasn't easy but she spent a lot of time with them, other people and other dogs. She said they were really smart and easy to house train. I have a friend that I fish with and he has 5 JRTs and they are all friendly except one. That one is okay once he finds out you don't want trouble. One thing I will say is for such a small dog they can kill a full grown groundhog in nothing flat. One dog, dead ground hog. Excellent squirrel dogs as mentioned above.
Never mind, I found the answer. It has changed since I lived there.
" A leashed dog may be used as an aid in locating and recovering wounded big game wildlife, except for black bears, with the purchase of an annual tracking permit. Tracking permits can be purchased for $40.00 from any Colorado Parks and Wildlife Office by the dog handler. Prior to using the permit, the dog handler must notify a Colorado Parks and Wildlife Office and provide the following information: the dog handler’s name, hunter’s name (if different than the handler), hunter’s CID number, location of use, species to recover, and time of use. "
I had a male beagle that was excellent for tracking wounded deer. One neighbor used to borrow him and he was very good at finding the deer. I think there are laws pertaining to that now but I don't think there was that law back in the day.
Did you read the link? Guy gets a dog five days earlier, then drops it off and his Grandmothers house locked behind a fence where they let the granddaughter play unsupervised. Talk about a disaster waiting to happen and idiots like him are one of the reasons why there are so many stories like this.
It is not the individual dog's fault. Ever. But pits and some of their mixes can, and a much higher percentage of the time over any other breed do, cause death due to their attacks. Second place is not even close.
Millions of people make stupid choices with regard to pets. The stupid choices made by some pitbull owners is the only subset that ends up costing a significant number of innocent people their lives on a regular basis.
Don’t get my wrong I’m not saying we should ban pit ownership or even regulate it. I just don’t understand how anyone can argue that pits aren’t the most dangerous breed and aren’t very unstable dogs. If dog owners were charged with murder1 every time this happened honest folks wouldn’t chance a pit, of course most don’t all ready.... I don’t see any difference in owning a pit and a domesticated wolf, neither can be trusted.
Watch the videos in those links and you get a small glimpse into the killing power of a pit. I’m not even going to talk about the little girl, that’s just horrific. The older couple though the women was no doubt torn to shreds and her husbands coat was ripped to pieces in seconds. Im glad I live in the country where my only neighbors within 3 miles are relatives.
Really mint? A news article out of South Africa from 2016. That’s what you’ve got, Lmao . I never said a Lab hasn’t killed a person. I’m sure someone has died tripping over a poodle and hitting a coffee table. Ha
According to the news articles 25 breeds are considered "pit bulls" and only one breed is considered a "lab".
Most canine experts agree that blaming the breed is wrong.
Looking at the people that have labs compared to a lot of the owners that have "pitbulls" and you will see a variance in the data. A lot of pitbulls are owned by people that are irresponsible shouldn't have any dog. a lot of white trash and thugs, the Bronx is full of pitbulls and every year NYC puts to sleep thousands of them.
You guys believing everything you read and hear from the same media you say is biased against conservatives is too much. Big Bear, I'm surprised by you being a police officer and seeing how the media portrays you guys especially.
Read the article I attached. Here are some excerpts.
Animal control officers across the country have told the ASPCA that when they alert the media to a dog attack, news outlets respond that they have no interest in reporting on the incident unless it involved a pit bull. A quantitative study by the National Canine Resource Council of dog-bite reportage in a four-day period proves that anti-pit bull bias in the media is more than just a theory — it’s a fact. August 18, 2007 — A Labrador mix attacked a 70-year-old man, sending him to the hospital in critical condition. Police officers arrived at the scene and the dog was shot after charging the officers. This incident was reported in one article in the local paper. August 19, 2007 — A 16-month-old child received fatal head and neck injuries after being attacked by a mixed-breed dog.This attack was reported on twice by the local paper. August 20, 2007 — A six-year-old boy was hospitalized after having his ear torn off and receiving a severe bite to the head by a medium-sized, mixed-breed dog. This incident was reported in one article in the local paper. August 21, 2007 — A 59-year-old woman was attacked in her home by two pit bulls and was hospitalized with severe, but not fatal, injuries. This attack was reported in over 230 articles in national and international newspapers, as well as major television news networks including CNN, MSNBC and Fox.
Mint. Dude. The Staff, APB terrier et al may be "the most courageous dog alive" As we used to read in the backs of hunting magazines They are WITHOUT PEER for their ferocity, tenacity, bang for the buck. They are WAR DOGS! I have hunted wild boar with them, they are UFC pooches! I have known a dozen pretty well, rescued 2 over the years. I lived with them on a few farms and the racetrack. I loved Sheena & Brutus as much as my childhood pets! THEY are kick ass dogs. No doubt! That being said, they have THAT FACTOR the 95% of the other breeds dont: They fight and maul and rip till the bitter end. Just think about that next time your 5 yr old neighbor is in the yard. My father who handled thoroughbred racehorses & was around cats, dogs, monkeys, ferrets, cattle his whole life told me : "YOU CAN NEVER TRUST ANY ANIMAL 100%" today, most PITS are owned by anti-authority LOSERS
The owners ARE to blame, but how are YOU going to 'Splain the lid whose needs plastic surgery? Mad dog
Mint.... all I can tell you is that the 85% fatality rate being pit bulls is pretty much on par with the percentage of problems we have with dogs where I work.... in my not so scientific estimate... 85% of the dog runs we go on are involving pit bulls....
So what if the pit bull owners are thugs and white trash. If those people owned beagles..... the beagles for the most part couldn't kill anyone.... The Thugs own pit bulls BECAUSE they are capable of killing people..... They are the most bad ass guard dog on the planet.... Even law abiding people in the ghetto get pit bulls because they can protect their property like few other dogs can.....
The bottom line is the pit bull is capable of killing an adult human.... if that was not a FACT..... Then it wouldn't matter who owned one.... The capability of the breed to KILL humans is the SINGLE most important factor as to why they are responsible for 85% of fatal dog attacks.....
Big Bear, a lab can kill a human easily also. I worked for a kennel growing up. A golden almost killed a biker that broke into the office. That is my whole point, any large dog isa danger and must be treated as such. Rotties, Dobermans, boxers, german shepards, labs etc all need to be controlled and raised the proper way. First and foremost they are canines. That is all I am saying and what most experts say. Should most people own pitbulls, hell no. These are the same people that won't control their pia kids and let them rule the house. Act that way with a pitbull and you are heading for trouble. Most people aren't capable of being a pack leader it seems and need to stick with more gentle breeds. More of the wussification of America.
“Looking at the people that have labs compared to a lot of the owners that have "pitbulls" and you will see a variance in the data. A lot of pitbulls are owned by people that are irresponsible shouldn't have any dog. a lot of white trash and thugs, the Bronx is full of pitbulls and every year NYC puts to sleep thousands of them.”
“Most canine experts agree that blaming the breed is wrong.”
Are the same people in the first quote the experts in the second quote?
With you 100% BB& spade. Mint, that's a real stretch! I rather fight off two bad ass goldens or labs than one average pit. I use that term "wussification of America" a lot too, but trying to protect humans and, usually kids from getting mauled , disfigured and killed doesn't meet wussy status to me. B.B. great point with the beagles. Mad Dog