bad karma's Link
It actually feels like the press left of the dem's is Newtonian physics - an equal shift away opposite the Republicans. Especially the last 5-10 years.
Then again, I think of myself as a centrist, and there certainly appear to be fewer with that mentality than in the past... so maybe it just looks like the R is racing to the R and the L's are racing to the L since I'm just sitting here in the middle watching everyone run away... Ha!
At the very least, they will lose Independent voters, which essentially means suicide in the MidTerms.
You would have to be ignorant and blind to think this. H and W were far to the left of Ronald Reagan. The Party itself has been moving left since Ike. President Trump, who has zero allegiance to the Party, has moved to the right and thank God for that.
You are correct, bk, they have been there for a time and getting worse all the time. Every once in a while I see a video of Ried, Slick Willy and others saying the exact same thing that we currently say about immigration and other current issues from 20 years ago or more when they were actual Democrats instead of Soros- DemoncommiEs.
The Democrats are now what they claim to fear the most.
That's what is great about the constitution and how its words can be relevant over time IMO.
The "right" didn't move further right. The left simply moved farther left. When you are standing so far left...... EVERYTHING looks like it's to the right.....
So the tea party "movement" and modern R party/talking heads etc have not moved further right than say the R's 30 years ago? You don't think a week of suggested R ideals from say, the Right idealists version of the MSM (Fox News ;) - easy fellas) is further right than if you had a conversation with a staunch R in the 80's, 90's, or early 00's. It feels to me the Re-Koch-licans (only used that because folks often reference Sorros as the end all be all of Democrats so I opted to do that with the Koch's) are doing a similar turn as the D's. I may well be biased though, I've lived in the northeast my whole life, so my view of Republicans may be shaded by observing northeastern R's, thus perhaps is more left of average than a Republican from someplace else. Ill admit that for darn sure.
Overall, KS said it well. I'd suggest, additionally, that "we" read the constitution (and anything else) via the lens we possess. Heck that even goes for the Supreme court. Those folks (SCOTUS Justices) have WAY more knowledge of it than any of us on here, or just about anyone on earth (I hope), and as time goes on, their lens evolves, as do the decisions they make relative to the constitution. If we think anyone who votes D or R is evil, mentally ill, ignorant, etc... Then we see that trait in them. It's not more real overall than (extreme example to make a point, not trying to change the subject) saying David Duke endorsed President Trump thus President Trump is a racist. That's the sort of correlation related ridiculousness that causes issues... From both parties.
I guess for me, I'm just not a fan of extreme view angles. I think it distorts reality. I'm not that big a fan of black and white thinking either - same reason. On these big issue topics, I think second level thinking is far better than first... Are there times when those angles/views/approaches are correct? Sure, IE, the old if you walk into your house and someone is attacking your family is it ok to kill them even though killing is wrong, sort of question... Overall it just seems way to often, like we want to avoid nuanced views.
Why did Ms. Ocasio-Cortez do well? What issues motivated people to think we "want this person"?
I'm confident that if you talk to those voters, it's a lot more nuanced than "we want free stuff", for example.
It's also, my sense for why the D's wont do as well this fall as many people think. Rather than looking at real issues that motivated people who are independent to vote R in the last presidential election for example, they just want to yell and scream "President Trump stinks". Agree or disagree with that statement, that's not much of a platform. Especially when you could point to info like what's displayed in this AP article as a tip of the iceberg towards looking at other options to help the nation continue improving: https://apnews.com/57cdaed35a094075854e15b50ba24e9b/AP-FACT-CHECK:-Trump's-tax-'miracle,'-immigration-flip-flops, and push hard on actual issues.
(I'm not trying to start a "Pres. Trump" rally in the thread. I realize in 2 nano seconds someone with a R view could take their lens and go find stuff to dispute the article. That's not the point. The article presents a bunch of examples that could be better points to push forward on for Democrats vs simply saying don't vote for any R's because Pres. Trump is an R)
My only point on the main article this thread was based on, was that it seems R's and D's are rocketing away from each other and are not looking for well thought out answers or methods to improve things for all of us here in the US. If the D's keep trying to rocket left, they are going to keep losing the Center... I don't disagree with much of what's said regarding the D's... I just feel it's happened the other way as well.
Happy to agree to disagree on whether that's true or not.
" guess for me, I'm just not a fan of extreme view angles"
What JTV said. Liberalism and statism is radically extreme. Conservatism is where common sense meets individual liberty.
Again, trying to navigate a ship back on course when it had been turning left for years is not moving more "right" than it was to begin with. The course has changed little, none of it I can think of is really further "right". The biggest difference a left leaning "centrist" may see is conservatives are tired of sitting on their hands and quietly watching the ship sailing off towards the shoals, sailing the course the left has chosen. Consevatives have become more engaged. But the course itself has changed little, if anything it has edged left, not right. Gay marriage, legalizing pot..... a whole host of issues that would have been none starters in the 80's. You would have been seen as insane to even bring the subjects up, much less have an honest discussion on them.
There is a reason Trump won and Shillery lost. A reason congress was won back. Why local governments have swung. Only thing really changed is the level of activity of the "silent majority".
support of a socialist and socialism is a losing proposition ... mic drop !!
Obviously Russia hacking into our election system in 2016, was meaningless to these folks, because, inspite of that fact, they went to Russia and sold their souls to them. Its a shameful act and a betrayal to our democracy and its citizens.
I'm with Glunt.
they've had a sad decade, it looks to be getting worse
The kids (liberals) benefit from all the responsible stuff happening around them they ignore but still yell (ice cream!!!!) every time its time to decide on a place to stop and eat and spend most of the trip not knowing where they are, where we are headed or how we got this far. Luckily we caught them and put them in the back seat before they drove us off a cliff. Hopefully we can get some repairs done, fill up on gas and oil, vacuum the french fries and candy wrappers out, and put some miles on in the right direction before they jump behind the wheel again.
It's gotten SO bad that it's now at the point where they could be staring into the rising morning sun and will swear to you that they're looking west.
Most of todays Republicans from MA would hardly qualify as actual MA Democrats of 30 years ago, I know, I grew up and lived there into my 40s. I was a conservative Democrat until the party left me. Then I was a Republican until I realized that they were all pansies and also moving to the left!
The political spectrum has anarchy, not movie stuff, but true anarchy, no government just a bunch of free people working things out together on the far right wall, and all the isms, communism, socialism, facism, Marxism, all the totalitarian control on the far left wall. If we place a mark dead center between the two and call that centrist we have a framework but we MUST remember that position is actually LEFT of the true center.
The founders of America wanted to be as far to the right, have as much individual freedom, as possible but recognized the need for some government. They decided to have a small limited government to take care of the very few and well limited (or enumerated) things that a central government should be good at. ALL the rest was rightfully left to the people or the states to sort out. That position, that actual center if you will, is well to the right of the physical "center" we spoke of.
To me, the place where we actually started is the center. So right is to the right of that, closer to anarchy. Anything to the left of the start point is obviously closer and closer to all the 'isms' on the left. Many people are far to the left of either center and that is why we have so many people, ignorant people, who behave like facists while naming themselves ANTIFA, (anti-facist)! They have no knowledge of our history, our political system, or the origin of our political or life phylosophy. In short, the left has succeeded in divorcing the people it indoctrinates from their own history, and therefore, their future.
Our challenge is to educate them before this nation comes to blows with itself.
I have my guess as as to which one gets the better result from platitudes.
Putin hates America. Wants our allies to be fragmented and wants us in a trade war. Hasn’t he gotten what he wants out of trump?
One thought: If stupid Kim Jong Un can completely dupe Trump, just imagine what Vladimir Putin can do to him.
The US is in trouble. The GOP is complicit.