Shots fired! Shots fired! WoW!!!
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Actual police cam Chase scene with officer returning gun fire from inside cruiser thru his own windshield. Ejects his empty clip exiting the car and reload in foot pursuit again shots fired! WoW! Broad daylight shoot out. Deserves hazardous duty combat pay bonus and couple extra weeks vacation. And new windshield.
Wow! Glad the officer is safe, and brave!
Man, don't know if shooting through your own windshield is standard procedure, but I guess he had to do what he had to do...Not sure how effective that would be though...seems to have all worked out...
I think the officer hit Home with his first barrage of shots. Car slowed considerably.
Damn beat me to it. Crazy shootout.
I've taken a few vehicle oriented self-defense/CQB classes. Shooting into and out of windows is covered fairly extensively - how to position yourself, how to draw, ballistic impacts, etc. But all of that is done while stationary and not while driving! Pretty crazy footage!
Damn beat me to it. Crazy shootout.
Anybody want to sign up and join us ??? That Officer is a bad ass hero. That’s what can happen at work every day when we strap on a bullet proof vest and hit the streets.
Not sure my take on it, right now I disagree with the action taken...
from the article it sounds like they were pursuing 2 known men with lengthy criminal histories and were wanted for questioning for a murder investigation and driving like they're probably guilty of said murder and shooting in public, I'd say they did the right thing pursuing and returning fire, but that did look like a lot of possibilities for unintended consequences, glad it worked out for the officers and general public.....too bad the police only "got" one of them and the other will likely be back out on the streets someday, of course he'll be reformed.
We have trained in shooting through car windows and windshields...... Not a lot because you have to find junk cars and haul them to a range to do it.... but we have done it. Normally we don’t shoot from a moving vehicle..... but under those circumstances where he’s being fired upon he did what he had to do...... No different than if he was standing in the middle of the street being fired upon..... Let the armchair quarterbacks fire away !!!!!!
Jeff,
Obviously you know better than most of us, but the perps were suspected of murder, were firing at the officer and driving at high speed. All of this endangered not only the officer, but the public at large.
As just a civilian, it appears to me the officer made a tough decision but had the training and skill to do what worked.
Again, no disrespect as I admit to zero knowledge and training in this but the results could not have worked out any better for the officer and the nearby public.
I was writing at the same time as BB.
I guess it's that there are more dynamics involved shooting while driving as often, the human brain doesn't multi-task very well. Standing and shooting or even running and shooting, the scenery doesn't change as rapidly as it does when moving down the road at 45 mph or faster.
But just because I may disagree doesn't mean he didn't act appropriately.
He looked like he multi tasked pretty damned good to me !!!
You get very little powder blowback shooting through the front windshield compared to firing out the window while moving.
Just a couple of undocumenteds getting Documented. Great job!
Yes BEAR, it worked out. This time...
Had he hit a 5 yr old eating ice cream, well, good luck with that.
I'm glad it worked out for the good guys. I think the officer was a little lucky when the pursuit ended and he pulled up to the suspect vehicle. He had to re-clip and put the clip in backwards. The perp(s) could have jumped out in those precious seconds (~9-10 sec) and returned fire at the officer as he had to re-clip correctly, get out, jack one in and return fire. I was on the edge of my seat watching that a few times.
They don't get paid NEAR enough! But then again, anyone who chooses this kind of work is not doing it for the money.
The two suspects were wanted on murder and vehicle theft charges from that morning...
HDE..... It’s no different than if he was standing in the middle of an intersection getting shot at..... If someone is shooting at you.... shoot back for God’s sake.... If he were standing in the middle of the street returning fire.... It’s possible for something very bad to happen...... With that in mind.... what would you have him do ?? Not return fire ??? Armchair quarterback away........!!!!
Some of you criticized me for calling the Florida Officer Scot Peterson a COWARD.......... Maybe some of you would have rather had Scot Peterson trying to apprehend those murder suspects.........
I saw that too JL. Glad it worked out for him, just bad luck being empty when the truck stopped.
I think I would have went with the left handed shots instead of shooting thru the windshield.
Big Bear, when you train shooting thru glass, do those shots end up anywhere close to your intended target? Just curious how effective that technique is.
Matt
For Oklahoma Highway Patrol shooting through the window is SOP. Here is a good video from 2 years ago. Take notice of the insurance shots ;). In Oklahoma we don’t like to leave things up to a lawyer.
I think the laws of physics dictates that shots fired thru a windshield from inside will deflect high due to the angle of the windshield. How steep the angle is, the caliber of the bullet, whether it's a hollow point or FMJ, etc... are all variables that will change the POI.
Hopefully the officer was trained to account for all those variables, otherwise his actions were a bit cowboy-ish, IMO. I'm glad it worked out for the good guy. And I hope I'm never put in the position to make those same decisions. I have nothing but admiration and respect for LEOs.
Matt
Worth the risk ?? It’s a shit sandwich..... That Officer will be criticized from the left and from the right no matter what he did...... Those guys were wanted for murder...... They were shooting at the Police..... Where did all 30 some rounds they fired at the Police go ??? What should the Police have done armchair quarterbacks ??? Continue to chase and let them continue to fire rounds until they ran out of ammunition ???? Let them go to murder more people ???
That cop risked his life to get close enough to that vehicle to take them out.....
Matt...... His technique worked.... you said you would have shot with his off hand..... We train shooting with our off hand.... It’s very inaccurate.... He was in a horrible situation.....
What if that Officer had not brought that pursuit to an end........ and that fleeing vehicle ran a red light and killed HDE’s hypothetical 5 year old eating ice cream ?? Like I said...... no matter what he did he will be criticized by the left and by the right...... I’d rather be criticized for trying to do the right thing like he did than to do nothing like Scot Peterson did........
Grey ghost the hope is the first few shots clear the glass for a hole to shoot through.
On a side note, these two guys look like dreamers.
Matt,
Remember, the cowboys won, just like the last time;)
Big Bear,
Please don't take my comments as criticism of the LEO. He did what he thought was necessary, and it worked out for him. I have absolutely no idea how I'd react in the same situation.
That said, I couldn't help thinking about the old cliche' "no car can outrun a police radio" as I watched the video. Do you think keeping a safe distance behind until additional support arrived would have been more or less responsible thing to do? Or, does that question fall under the "who the hell knows?" category?
Matt
Matt...... the moment the occupants of that car began firing back at the Police....... It became paramount to stop that car.... Maintaining a visual distance is still close enough for the suspects to continue shooting..... And it’s very difficult to maintain a visual distance in traffic....
It was risky but letting two guys like that escape carries a lot of risk as well. Glad it worked out and if I'm ever up against some guys like that I would be fine having a cop like that in my corner.
"" I think the laws of physics dictates that shots fired thru a windshield from inside will deflect high due to the angle of the windshield. How steep the angle is, the caliber of the bullet, whether it's a hollow point or FMJ, etc... are all variables that will change the POI. ""
I'm thinking however very slight, the rounds would deflect downward because of the angle of the windshield??? It's kinda like skipping stones when you were little except it's 180 degrees upside down. The stone is the bullet and the water surface is the windshield. Good question though. Any physics majors out there??
Good job on the LEO’s part. I can see another unit joined in and who knows how many were behind this officer. Looks like he also waited until he had a clear target before he fired. As for putting in his magazine backwards, I think he realized it very quickly and corrected it fast. Outstanding to see something turn out positive for the good guys.
The round surprisingly deflects upward slightly shooting through from the inside of the car..... downward slightly shooting through a windshield from outside the car....... he got close enough that it didn’t matter.....
"I'm thinking however very slight, the rounds would deflect downward because of the angle of the windshield???"
Matt
Holy smokes! What a badass!
What happened to the LVPD SUV that jumped into the chase part way through the video? They were closer to the bad guys than was the officer in the video. Yet there's no sign of the SUV in the last :30 or so.
As for why more LE vehicles didn't get involved, I would think it's because after that SUV jumped in, the bad guys started making lots of turns, which would have made heading them off a LOT harder.
I get the same reaction when the untrained civilian with little to domain knowledge comments on the military. Please just say thank you and be glad that the good guy returns home to his family. I know too many who were not so lucky. Armchair quarterbacking is harmless but misconveyed conjecture is fodder for those that oppose those that wear the blue.
What happened to the LVPD SUV that jumped into the chase part way through the video? "
He took the left lane and got hung up in traffic at about the 2:30 mark in the video. The original LEO took the far right lane and was able to close the gap quickly.
Matt
One of the reasons the perps slowed down is because the left rear tire on their vehicle got whacked. You can see that right at the end.
Upon further review, you can see there was also a 2nd SUV which jumped into the chase and it looks like a LVPD car got involved as well.
I am wondering if that Officers ears will ever stop ringing from firing that many shots from inside the car?
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I am also wondering how permanent the damage to his ears is ?
I am also amazed how mostly calm that Officer was. I am betting it wasn't his first time at bat.
That was intense! Glad the LEO made it out safely.
That guy put it all on the line...his life, his job, his possible future and freedom doing what he did. He is a badass and deserves a medal....but very likely doesn't think so himself. typical 2nd guessers coming out of the woodwork now.... you disgust me.
What would get me pissed is some group like the ACLU or La Raza comes out and plays the excessive force card.
It wasn't just the officer who remained cool. The LVPD woman who was handling his call never got even a bit excited. She remained calm and professional the entire time.
Notice how she did not want to use lethal force. I salute her for that, yet, the guy was on drugs. This is another example IMHO where LE is being too cautious because of blowback.
I wish I could find the video I mentioned before where the officer was shot multiple times confronting a dirt bag he instructed to remove his hands from his pockets and to stop several times. This episode could have ended as badly. again IMO.
Lesson to be learned.......... From what she wrote..... She was dispatched to a man throwing stuff out of a third floor window along with 3 other officers........ But she responded to the call alone with her dog............
That is a run that we at our department would never go into without 2 or more Officers..... If you arrived first.... you would wait for your backup before going into the building........
Answer those types of runs alone...... and eventually this type of bad thing will happen..... She’s lucky to be alive..........
Also..... I can’t say that I’ve heard of a female dog being used as a Police K9........ It’s probably an off breed dog trained in narcotics only..... not aggression............
I don’t care what kind of drugs he was on.... if he was fighting one of our K9 Officers..... our dog would have ripped him to shreads..... Those dogs are SCARY strong......
Yes. I just don't understand Jeff why he waited so long. It sure looked like help was slow in arriving. Officer kept his cool with all of his blood spilling.
Are you instructed to warn that many times. The guy was not deaf, he was looking at the officer. I am afraid I would have fired earlier, out of fear no doubt.
Thanks for finding it.
Do you mean that by not having a taser, you would have had a firearm? You would not have given a non-compliant guy an order several times without having a weapon of some kind at the ready, or at least I would hope?
Jeff, after several attempts, does the officer have the right to shoot if they have fear? I would think so. Not trying to start a fight, but if you believe that civie had the right to shoot in FL, this officer does also IMO.
That Officer was responding to a call of a subject trying to snatch groceries from people. The man he tried to stop met the description........ Even if he had his gun drawn,, He probably still would have gotten shot....... It was a scary no win situation........ That could have happened to any Officer in America on any given day.
The only thing he might have done differently is kept an eye on him from his scout car until backup arrived......... The suspect might have been less apt to shoot at the Police if there were more Officers there.....
The Officer can’t shoot at that man just for having his hands hidden Frank..... There was no report of the subject being armed..... If the Officer shoots before seeing a weapon and it turns out the suspect is unarmed..... Then the cop just shot an unarmed man. If it was a report of an armed robbery.... it’s a whole different scenario.........
Do you guys carry at work Jeff ??
Thanks Chris. That does stink. The Officer did not have a chance. Certainly keeps an officer on edge!
I critique his actions as spot on. Held back until he got them in an acceptable situation to return force. To me this was text book and job well done.
MN is not prosecuting the two officers who shot a teen that ran from them with a loaded gun in his hand. Announced today.
The loss of life is always tragic, but this is the right decision. Took a long time for the decision to be made, and the family disagrees, but what do you expect when disobeying a lawful command with a firearm in possession?
Hopefully leaders in these troubled communities can use this to teach proper behavior. Probably not, unfortunately.
Are your guys at work required to carry Jeff,, Or do you carry your own gun. ?? Do they carry Tasers ? (With an S)......
For what it’s worth..... Tasers can still work if the prongs stick in clothing and not the skin.....
OK, no disrespect here, but I cannot get this out of my mind.
Let's say I am an officer in my 40s plus and have this situation. No backup is available to wait for.
The guy will not stop, and keeps his hands in his pockets refusing to comply. My reflexes are not as quick as some 20 year old.
I have to wait until he makes a move before I am allowed to respond? No way! I would say to bump him with my car, but an officer was just disciplined for that.
Again no disrespect, but failure to comply to a lawful command and resisting are serious infractions, possibly a felony. I am witnessing felonious behavior and again I can take no serious action for my safety?
I disagree. And even if he did not have a gun, any prosecutor who would push a case against an officer in this situation who warned several times, needs a new career.
You remember the NY case with the guy selling contraband cigarettes? The officers were not prosecuted because of his failure to comply and resisting. That guy did not have a gun, and his hands were visible. This situation is ten times worse IMHO.
The officer survived, but my bet is he will never be the same again. Chris, I understand what policy is, but I question the policy. I admit I am ignorant, but how can you encourage officers to do what is right if they have to wait to be attacked first? Think about our discussion regarding SYG. If I thought someone was going to make a move on me, I am not waiting, and have not.
Again, not wanting to offend anyone, but it is tough right now to recruit cadets. Maybe these types of policies contribute to the challenge of attracting candidates?
Frank....... One must always look at the totality of the circumstances............
What were the Officers dispatched on ??? Was there a mention of any weapons ?? In this case,, No......
Is the subject committing a crime by ignoring the Officers commands ?? Yes......
But not to the level of shooting the suspect for not showing his hands..... Is there an outside possibility the suspect does not understand English ?? Is deaf ?? Mentally challenged ???
This is the inherent every day danger of being a Police Officer...... Make a wrong decision and possibly kill an innocent person.... Or end up dead.....
Thanks Chris. Just doesn't seem fair, but I understand what you are saying. I know I am arm chair quarterbacking, I know a couple of students who are reconsidering their LE career choice. I do not blame them to be honest.
I guess I would be unemployed and in prison because I would have at least fired the taser. Good thing I am just a teacher!
