A constant barrage of what I call 'Sludge Reports', posted by troll who does not participate in any threads that exchange personal interest information, just attack with name calling anyone who does not go along with the belief we are on a one way track to hell.
Yet, life has improved measurably the last 18 months on many accounts, one being retirement will be much more secure for many.
So, when does all the bad crap start? Are protests really worse than in the 60s.
So far most of the predictions have been off from where I sit. In fact, a casual observer of this site would probably conclude we are a collection of fools.
So, after the requisite name calling, please answer the question. When or how long before collapse? Certainly it will happen some day, like at the end of the World. But, how about before then.
You see it and it starts with the removal of God. Abortion, mass murder, drugs, sex all common place.
Next is the identity politics. Hypenated americanism. Black-Americans, Hispanic-Americans etc. We are American or we aren't.
Multi Culturalism. We cannot survive as a society with many cultures.
Open borders. Without borders we are not a country.
Silencing of speech. When opposing views points are scorned or worse violently attacked ie antifa, it goes directly against our constitution. Likewise the MSM is not a "free" press. It is a propaganda machine. Precisely what the forefathers did not want.
There is no right or wrong, man or woman, history is being changed to be politically correct. Monuments toppled in the name of political correctness.
Capitalism, the greatest mechanism the world had ever seen for creating wealth is demonized. There is no alternative.
So, without God, unifying culture, borders, no right or wrong, no history and lack of wealth, we are doomed.
If you don't see it starting, I want to live where you do.
Some ebb, some flow.....just depends of the sequence of collective events. Bill O' used to say often with out rules or frameworks for the society to operate within, chaos will follow. That is a challenge for independent, moderate-minded folks who subscribe to the concept of live and let live....I'm ok, you're ok....freedom without rules....do whatever feels good. Although that sounds like a fun, utopian world, IMO it is just that....a non-attainable fantasy world. One could probably make an argument that would lead to a societal collapse faster than the outer extremes of far left and far right.....both of which function within a set of rules to keep things.
But I did predict Trump would win...........hehehehe
The one difference that shakes me a bit at this point, is the access to information without context. (That's not even close to suggesting censorship, it's suggesting responsibility) Heck, the desire to take in chunks of information, view them as gospel, while having literal disdain for the intricacies and gray areas created by contextual understanding. We can feed the snot out of our bias today, and often via vessels of information which look very "good" and which appear true, increasing our bias. That goes both political ways. And it makes it feel like there is way more tinfoil hat wearing than there was even 20 years ago. Example: I can hop on google and learn a LOT about building semi conductors over the next 30'. 20 years ago people would have recognized that those 30' gave me a very broad overview of semi conductors... Today, people think someone with a PhD in physics and an engineering masters degree who's spent 40 years building actual semi conductors know's less than they do - because they just googled it. Dunning-Kruger much? :)... I think we all will adapt to this speed of information and start to find methods of grounding and contextualization... right now though... It's a bit crazy.
If we, as a nation, are to fail... My suspicion is that it's going to be due to that, a belief that others are bad, horrible, nasty and evil because we are not willing to extend our gaze, and are lured to the comfort of what we think we know.
And that would be sad. Because our demise would be our own fault - no one else's.
I trust "us" though. So while I just droned on about a bunch of stuff... I think in the end, we will come through. The ability to bring different ideas and experiences to the table makes for a very creative, resilient and robust lot. America is great. It will go through ups and downs just as each of us does individually... But it will come through, stronger. That's what stress does, it makes things tougher.
The doomer attitude and dire predictions have always prevailed on the CF from my perspective. I’ve never fully understood it, either.
I think some of it is just typical old age grumpiness. I call it the “the good ol’ days syndrome”. Some people lament over days gone by as they age.
For me, and the people I hang with, life just keeps improving. We finally have the resources, time, and health to enjoy the fruits of years of labor. For example, I’m currently on my 7th day in elk camp, with no set schedule to leave. I’ll leave when I either fill my tag or the season ends. Life is as great as you make it.
Matt
Morality collapse under Trump.
Economic collapse under Bernie.
Little under 16 years....
The two biggest threats I think are (1) militarily from Russia and the growing danger from China. Imagine trying to force China off that island in the South China Sea? Or forcing Russia out of Crimea? (2) the weight of our national debt at some point collapsing the system.
I thought we were in very dangerous waters if Hillary won. I think Trump's win actually turned some things around. But a long term forecast is like predicting the weather. I think with Trump's win we are good for the near future (10 years)
Rigged election super delegates and the dumb azz Dems whine about Russia. At least a report said they were DXing the Super D's....
But just like Matt, and the people I hang with, I can look at my life and say it has consistently gotten better, year after year, and that good fortune seems to be immune to whatever party is in power and whatever dire predictions are being made.
And if things do go to hell, I've got lots of guns, ammo, and Mountain House.
It not "bad" until it gets worse than the 60s?
It will go like the frogs were cooked...... little freedoms lost because there are some who don't think people should be "free", they should do what's best for, well.... if they were honest about it.... "me"......
Hunting likely lost. 2nd amendment lost. Restrictions on the 1st if somebodies feeling get hurt. Identity politics over "American" culture. The domination of one ideology at the expense of the other. Fully socialized/federal industries, starting with medical which is half way there..... the push is already on for energy. "One World" allegiance over God and country. Debts coming due will force it all along.
I could see more financial/economic problems in the next 5, certainly 10 years. Fewer and fewer earners with more and more to be supported. Stock market already overvalued with paper worth more than actual production and profit. Property values in many ways unsustainable..... or at least until the next crash, when even more property will be consolidated to fewer people....
And as stated above...... even having lost all that...... lots of folks will say "we're doing fine, nothing to worry about, life has never been better!"..... Well..... for me anyway.....
We’re going to lose hunting and the 2nd Amendment !!!
You sure think highly of the U.S.A. !!!!!!!
Again, likely not in my lifetime. But you'd have to be blind not to see the writing on the wall. Look at the changes in just the last 50 years. When I was a kid I could walk into the gun store and if I had the cash, buy pretty much any gun I wanted. Had 8 or 10 of MY OWN by the time I was 16. Handloaded for most of them. Walk in, pick up a couple lbs of powder and some primers and on my way. Seniors parking lot you could look out and count a dozen or more guns in the gun racks. Never an issue, never a problem. Not the guns nor the trucks that changed. The people. The future? I've heard some here float restrictions and yet more useless regulation to the 2nd. chip..... chip..... chip.....
Hunting 50 years ago. Take a week or two during hunting season off from school for a trip..... no problem. Never had protestors or even any organized anti-hunting groups that I was aware of. You could run hounds on cats, bears, pretty much anything you wanted to. Now in CA cat hunting AT ALL is illegal. Can no longer run hounds on bears. British Columbia bans grizzly hunts..... despite high numbers of bears. Caribou hunts cancelled outright. US polar bear hunts banned despite record number of bears...... cannot even import a legally taken bear. Wildlife biologists no longer in control...... real facts and science doesn't matter..... politics and "feelings" do.
What is it going to look like in the next 50 years? Better? Seriously? What world are you living in?
Again, it will be like boiling frogs..... you don't throw them into the boiling water..... you just start low and keep turning it up until they are boiling..... they never notice what happened..... likely said "nothing happening.... everything is fine, never been better!"
Anybody else ever actually try it?
“The USA is awesome..... It’s many of the people that I don’t think highly of”............ Isn’t the USA it’s PEOPLE ???? Or do you simply love the land... the ground you live on ?? What makes the USA awesome if it is not the people ???
We tend to romanticize those days because in many cases you were in a secluded bubble.
Sure you loved fishing in that old creek and picking a bunch of apples for Mom to make pie for the town social that weekend. How wonderful.
Except there was a lynching near that creek a few days earlier.
I’ll take modern progress coupled with timeless character traits any day over those “good ol days”
Heck.... you hate on quite a few guys here in the bowhunting community..... some of whom probably agree with you on 80-90% of your political views...
Nations do come and go. Some more quickly than others. Reasons differ as do how it happens, but it does happen.
Where the hell you been, brother? I hope your not just buzzzing the tower.
;)
Matt.
Hate??? I hate a very few people and those I admit I do it is all 100% personal.
WRT the "49%" If those 49% weren't actively trying to take something away from me that is mine..... my freedoms.... my property.....my lifestyle.... I'd have no issues with them. Smile, shake hands, have a nice day. Walk away. That's not the case. I am not trying to take anything from them or change them in any way. I could not care less about them or their views. Hope y'all have a nice life, be well and prosper. But leave me and mine alone.
WRT "the people ARE America" I completely disagree. The world is full of "people" and only these very few have built an "America". It is not the people who are exceptional, people are people and always have been. America is a human experiment in self governance. An experiment in personal freedom the world had never seen in a formal state and country. It is the framework and foundation that is America, starting with the bill of rights and the constitution as the bedrock. The first to narrowly define what the GOVERNMENTS powers were limited to....... any and all others left to the states and citizens.
Only under this system of encouraging freedom, independence and rugged individualism has such a country been built. Personal freedoms never before given to the common citizen from birth. Ownership of personal property, rights of free speech, the elitists and the common man (theoretically) held to the same equal laws. Opportunity..... risk, reward.... all of it.
American culture exists because of the American concept of freedom and rights and growing to LOVE those freedoms and rights. (kinda the opposite of hate...) They did not build an "America" anywhere else where that foundation did not exist. In fact all the failed cultures can be traced back to exactly the opposite. Look to a failed country and they will have a failed culture/morality.
People are people and Americans are inherently no better nor worse than what have existed on earth from the dawn of time. They have found exceptionalism in building a world and culture given a vehicle designed to allow them to do so. That vehicle is what is America.
What the leftists are trying to do is "fundamentally change America". Alter the design to suit them. Again, they are the aggressor, not me. Because they feel it would be more "fair" to make America into a socialist leaning if not a totally Socialist/Communist country. Take away freedoms, take away property. They want to change the foundation, destroy the foundation, the true things that make America..... America. You will find few to publicly admit it, but they don't like nor want America, they would rather have a France..... Although there are a few lately who feel they can be more open with their real goals. Sanders, Ocasio-Cortez, et al...... Hate America?..... I don't know, don't know their hearts. Anti-American..... yeah, I think a solid argument could be made.
I do see both sides, and at times worry deeply about our future. But, at the end of the day, I am optimistic. I do not believe this great nation will necessarily follow historical patterns.
This is one heck of an experiment, unlike any other. Our lack of a homogeneous people I see as a strength, not a weakness. We adapt and accept. This stems from how I see large communities of Amish where my farm is. Their very different culture peacefully coexists. We are a tolerant nation.
Yes, I obviously can be wrong. But if I did not think we had a brighter future I would quit participating in society today and let whatever take its own course.
Thanks again.
We may last until He comes again. I hope for the world's sake, we do.
You are are realists. The common enemy of every American.
The Rock
