Sleep Apnea Cpap, pack trip ?
General Topic
Contributors to this thread:
I have a question that maybe a couple of you can help me with. I have had severe sleep apnea most of my life. I use a Cpap sleep disorder machine. I am planning a elk hunt to Montana this coming fall. It is a pack in with horse and has a 75 pound limit. I have not questioned taking a battery etc. in yet and was hoping maybe a couple out there have an idea or have had to deal with this. I need my cpap machine but it needs power. I can run off battery with my invertor I have for camp here. Any thoughts or ideas? This is my first pack in trip. Thanks
Good luck on this problem Screwball. I have the same issue. I have hunted in camps with no electricity but was able to bring in a car battery and use my inverter. Other camps have had a generator and that works well also. I have a small travel battery for my CPAP but it will only last about a night and a half at best. It has to be charged again. I hate to do it, but there are times when I just have to go without the CPAP when on a pack in or float hunt. I have considered using a small solar charger but really do not think something that size would be able to generate enough power to charge a CPAP battery. Please let me know if you come up with a viable solution.
I have sleep apnea and due to sinus/allergy problems cannot use a cpap. I have been on 20 + hunting trips without one. Suggestion- I use one of those snoring mouthpieces you see on tv. Far from a total solution but you might try ones prior and see if it helps. My wife is happy they work against snoring immediately. Not as effective as a cpap but I have been using one daily for about 3-4 years. Works for me. Good luck !!!
I would be quite concerned about dying in my sleep at 11,000 feet if I had this issue.
Apnea has varying degrees of severity. Has your doctor told you that going without the machine is not an option?
You can turn the humidity heater off to extend battery life.
Have you looked into the fold out solar panels. I don't know if they would be able to charge the machine enough, but it's worth checking out.
I have a VPap machine, no, that is not a typo. Apparently I have several sleep disorders, and one of them (in addition to obstructive apnea) is central apnea - I asked my Dr. what that meant, and his answer didn't fill me full of confidence - apparently my brain just forgets to breath every once in a while. I've got 36 hrs of taped sleep and data. If you come up with anything let me know!
Love mine n really helps for a deeper sleep--- I have tried three mouth pieces $$$ n none helped--I don't think you will have a problem sleeping well after a day of elk hunting with out your Cpap--I don't have a battery solution -- I just do without when I have to--being its a medical excuse for having one, talk to the outfitter n he may make an exception for the weight limit n accommodate your need-- good luc
I recently forgot my cpap on an out of town trip and didnt sleep. I sat in a chair all night gasping for air every time I would doze off. I would be scared to attempt a high altitude hunt without it. For you guys that use a battery, how long can you go on a fully charged deep cycle battery?
Have you looked into 12v flasher batteries? They are small and light weight. 2 would give you 4-6 nights sleep. I'm sure your guide could arrange to switch out batteries during a mid hunt restocking of camp. Or bring 3 and put the others on a solar trickle charger. They also make lithium with 10a/hr ratings keep em warm in your sleeping bag and they would work even better. Lighter but more spendy.
Google flasher battery or vexilar battery
Being a dentist who practices dental sleep medicine, I'll have to agree with previous posters who suggested a MAD (mandibular advancement device) might help you. Although a CPAP is the "gold standard" for treating severe sleep apnea, I have treated patients with severe apnea sucessfuly who either can't or won't wear a CPAP. Some prefer not to travel with the CPAP and prefer to take their MAD on trips.
A dentist who practices dental sleep medicine should have some type of instrumentation in his office that will indicate if a MAD would be effective for you prior to actually fabricating the appliance.
Have you tried sleeping on your side? I'm a Cpap user and have found that I can sleep on my side without my machine. The problem is staying there. Try sleeping on your couch with your back against the back and make sure your head is in a straight line with your body. I have done it and found myself dreaming so I know I was getting good sleep.
Tape a golf ball to your back
have any of you tried Provent?
I was diagnosed with mild sleep apnea (10%) after a sleep study. I really didn't want to use the CPAP so for the heck of it ordered a mouthpiece I saw on TV, about $70. www.zquiet.com
It works great. I slept so well the first night I tried it that I slept through my alarm. My wife says I haven't snored since. I feel so much more rested during the day it's unbelievable. I even started dreaming nightly, which I hadn't done for years. I kill big deer, elk and moose now all the time! lol
I have moderate to extreme apnea depending on whether I am on my side or my back.
Mouthpieces were recently approved for the treatment of apnea. I had one made by a dentist and while it isn't as effective as a CPAP it does knock my apnea and snoring back to being minor (or whatever the category is).
I also sleep longer with it (mouthpiece) than I do with a CPAP (but arguably I haven't given the CPAP its fair/long term shot).
Big Dan on here has Sleep Apnea... Maybe he will chime in...I also have moderate sleep apnea,and use a Cpap Machine, haven't tried a mouth piece, but I've never been on a Pack in Trip....
A deep cycle battery will last 4 nites but that is not an option on a pack-in. I just use Tylenol PM and it works fine
I have "moderately severe" sleep apnea and use a CPAP. I would like to get the dental appliance as well but have been told they run from $3-5K. How much did you guys pay for yours?
I have severe sleep apnea that requires the use of a Bipap auto advanced machine, that uses more juice than a Cpap machine. I have used it with a 12 volt battery and inverter, which is the best option if they can get it to camp and there is generator power to recharge it daily. Another option, which I tried, is an online company called The Battery Geeks. They will sell or rent a rechargeable battery pack with a small roll up solar panel for recharging. They claim with a Cpap machine the battery will last 10-12 hours. I rented the package, but because my Bipap machine, even without the humidifier, uses so much juice, I only got 3.5 hours until the battery pack died. If it does in fact work with a Cpap machine it's a great option. Because it did not work for me I was able to return the package and get a full refund. Good luck!
Recurve, in my area devices range from 1,200 to 2,500 depending on the appliance. If you won't or can't wear your CPAP your sleep doc can write you prescription for a MAD. Medical insurance is supposed to cover the appliance in this case.
Any updates since the original post on this topic?
I backpack hunt. My apnea isnt terrible and i can sleep ok without cpap at home but the first few days at elevation seem to exacerbate it. So i bought the attached gear. Resmed Air Mini and Medistrom batteries. Air Mini is 11oz and batteries are 20 oz each. A battery will last 3 nights at 5-6 hrs sleep. Total setup is 3lb 12 oz with hose and mask. Less with only one battery. The Air Mini is considerably louder than your normal machine but it is tolerable for me.
10x42 binos for size reference. This setup is not cheap, just like everything else in the lightweight world. Air Mini is $600 and batteries are $330 each.
I have the same setup as Aluminum rain does and it works . I submitted to insurance and they paid a certain percent of the total package. I also have a foldable solar panel that will fully charge the battery in a day. (except if you are on Kodiak this year rained everyday).
Insurance and used my HSA to pay the rest.
My wife uses a CPAP. I bought a different power supply for it. (One that plugs into cig lighter) It is so she can use it in our camper on battery (12V) This is more efficient than using an invertor. I am thinking you could use a small deep cycle battery with this setup. (similar to what you would use for an ice fishing depthfinder)
Just did a pack in wall tent elk hunt with a guy in our party with a Cpap…..he charged his batteries off a generator they had in camp. He wasn`t about to chance a system he wasn`t familiar with 10 miles in at high elevation.
Most camps have some form of a generator, it not find a way to get a tiny portable up there.
for anyone with central apnea, I have found that breathing exercises do help my central apnea. This is not a medical endorsement, but just something I have found; almost by accident.
https://zquiet.com/
Get one and try it. My cpap works better but this mouthpiece works pretty dang well. Like 80% as well. No batteries required. Get one and try it at home first. Money back guarantee. I still have mine and take it on every camping trip.
I tried about 4-5 head straps and mouthpieces before trying this one. This was the only one that worked.
I knew it was working for 2 reasons: first, my wife said I stopped snoring and breathed better. And second, I noticed that every morning when I woke up before using it my muscles hurt. Within 3 days of starting the zquiet , 90% reduction in that.
Lastly, I use it in combination with a breathe rite nose strip.
Find out if you have obstructive or central SA. Big difference--at least it was for me. Ten years ago I was diagnosed with off-the-scale severe SA, but no machine would work. The doctor said my SA was "perfectly normal for a 500# man," but I'm 6'-3" and 185#!
Finally, I ran into a doctor who explained that central SA comes from brain signals, not an airway obstruction, and can't always be fixed with a machine. Since then I've done OK by sleeping on my side--even after retiring to a 7,300' town in the mountains.
Of course, YMMV. Don't assume my approach will work for you unless you get experienced, competent medical advice! My original doctors used a one-size-fits-all, strap-a-machine-on-him-and-send-him-down-the-road approach.
Wow, does this bring back memories. I went on my elk hunt in the Bob Marshall Wilderness. No motors, electric etc. but we smuggled in my set up. 10 hours horse ride into camp. Took cpap, deep cell marine battery and it worked. You'll laugh but the biggest problem was the cold at night the moisture in the humidifier condensed. LOL got a few hours of sleep a night. I now have a smaller portable unit and use a solar charger for battery in back country or at our camp in northern WI. Great hunt it was beautiful. Learned what the words "Oh Purple Mountain Majesty", means. I stooped on my horse in awe of the beauty. I did harvest a 6x7 bull first morning scored around 320".
What about compressed Breathing Oxygen and a mask.
When at extreme altitudes, we would sometimes go on O2 And just barely crack open the Valve while sleeping to alleviate Cheyne Stokes breathing due to extreme altitude.
Sometimes C.S. Wasn’t an issue but when it showed up it’s dangerous
Not sure how that works a cpap forces the air into you. It has pressure settings. Totally changed my life.
Yeah it isn’t positive pressure And isn’t Cpap But the goal is to get O2 to the brain and body And O2 bottle doesn’t need power
Not perfect but a viable option
I work in an oral surgery office which fits and sells mandibular advancement devices. I got one and my snoring stopped. I feel more rested (my wife does too). Very often insurance pays for one if you have had a sleep study and don’t/can’t use CPAP OR BIPAP. All it does is pull your lower jaw forward to keep your tongue away from your sofT palate. Worth investigating.
I’m going to to give the zquiet one a try. I hate my Cpap! I do sleep better most of the time but some nights it’s a total nightmare. I used to do a lot of backpacking and backpack hunting trips, not anymore. I’m pretty sure my sleep apnea is airway restricted especially since I know I’m 50 lbs overweight. One of my goals is to lose the weight and hopefully that will help as well.
for anyone with central apnea, I have found that breathing exercises do help my central apnea. This is not a medical endorsement, but just something I have found; almost by accident.
I’ve got severe sleep apnea and am on bipap. I have to use it. I’ve had to change how I hunt because I’ve got to have access to electricity at night usually with a battery and inverter.
This is not an uncommon problem. Talk to your outfitter. Chances are he’s probably had to deal with it before and may have a solution. Maybe he can prepack a small generator and battery in before u get there ?
I’ve got severe sleep apnea and am on bipap. I have to use it. I’ve had to change how I hunt because I’ve got to have access to electricity at night usually with a battery and inverter.
This is not an uncommon problem. Talk to your outfitter. Chances are he’s probably had to deal with it before and may have a solution. Maybe he can prepack a small generator and battery in before u get there ?
Butcherboy. If your nasal passages get at all clogged use the zquiet with the breath rite nasal strips. The combination works well for me
Zequiet IS a mandibular advancement device. Lots cheaper than a dentist if it works for you.
For those of you that use solar panels for recharging batteries while off the grid, which solar panel and batteries do you use?
Thanks tx, I’m going to give it a try. Yes, my nasal passages are always plugged in the morning. Another rough night with the Cpap is going to drive me crazy!
I use the nasal strip with my CPAP too. Tried with and without and works better with
I don't have sleep apnea, but this thread got me thinking about that Inspire device I'm regularly hearing about on the radio.
I checked out their website, but didn't see anything about cost, which made me suspect it would be quite expensive. The site says it's often covered by insurance.
Further web searchs came up with costs in the $30-40K range, so insurance would have to play a big part. And no, I have nothing to do with Inspire.
Good Luck to all with your planned hunts.
If it's obstructive sleep apnea and a serious issue, they do MMA surgery to help with it. To some people this may seem like a crazy option but I'd recommend looking into it with an oral surgeon. The surgery is becoming more common and after about a 1 month recovery time it often times will no longer require CPAP and your energy should increase. Just something to consider as I didn't even know this was an option until about 5 years ago.
I have sleep apnea. Its a pain in the heiney. I had to have three sleep tests to determine what all my problem was. Test was the worst thing. I told them i cant sleep on my back and only sleep on my side. Dr. said i could sleep on my side in test. Nope, wouldnt allow it at test location. Damn near died there. Seen some funny lights and believe i was fading away. I now sleep with a res med device. Do not really care for it. It is a bipap. It does its job. When hunting season rolls around and i'm in the woods, i use Breath right and Niquil. Stops the snoring and helps keep the passages open. In the last couple of years, some fairly notorious archers in our state have passed away in their sleep on hunts. Do not know if this has anything to do with it but suspect it might. That brings to one of my own observations. You can chime in and tell us if it happens to you. When you stop breathing and your brain starts to realize your f'ed, it creates some god awful nightmares to send a bolt of Adrenalin through you and wake your butt up. Heart pounding way to wake up. So all those people that say " yeah, he passed away peacefully in his sleep" can be assured that no he died in some nasty way. For those of you who do not have this, if you ever wake up in the middle of the night looking at the ceiling wondering why your awake, put your hand on your heart and see what its doing. Might be racing. Theirs your sign.
I have sleep apnea. Its a pain in the heiney. I had to have three sleep tests to determine what all my problem was. Test was the worst thing. I told them i cant sleep on my back and only sleep on my side. Dr. said i could sleep on my side in test. Nope, wouldnt allow it at test location. Damn near died there. Seen some funny lights and believe i was fading away. I now sleep with a res med device. Do not really care for it. It is a bipap. It does its job. When hunting season rolls around and i'm in the woods, i use Breath right and Niquil. Stops the snoring and helps keep the passages open. In the last couple of years, some fairly notorious archers in our state have passed away in their sleep on hunts. Do not know if this has anything to do with it but suspect it might. That brings to one of my own observations. You can chime in and tell us if it happens to you. When you stop breathing and your brain starts to realize your f'ed, it creates some god awful nightmares to send a bolt of Adrenalin through you and wake your butt up. Heart pounding way to wake up. So all those people that say " yeah, he passed away peacefully in his sleep" can be assured that no he died in some nasty way. For those of you who do not have this, if you ever wake up in the middle of the night looking at the ceiling wondering why your awake, put your hand on your heart and see what its doing. Might be racing. Theirs your sign.
The sleep test stinks! Felt like C3PO with all the wires stuck everywhere. I can’t sleep on my back either. Always on my side and stomach. After my test they told me I was having about 10-15 interruptions an hour. Not too bad and was told I could do a cpap or a mouth piece. I should have tried a mouthpiece first as the cheaper option.
I'm at 80-90 interruptions per hour. Thats why I'm cranky at times.
Holy smokes! That’s a lot! My dad and one of my sister’s have sleep apnea as well. I think my pops was about 65-70 per hour. I don’t know what my sister’s was.
I can top that. 117 per hour. If not for the cpap doctors said I would stroke out in 8 years. I was always a snorer, my claim to fame was I woke up my grandparents while camping to campers away, they were in a hard-shell camper. I fell asleep in a conversation with my wife. She said time to go in again, I did not qualify 20 years earlier. It has changed my life in may ways, more energy, easier to control weight, way less grumpy.
I’ve had sleep apnea for years. Only thing I can suggest is get a chair designed for turkey or predator hunting which is almost like sitting on the ground except you have a backrest. Cut the legs off to where you are sitting on the ground. This will work if you can sleep in a reclining position. Mine is pretty severe and if my electricity goes out for some reason I can sleep pretty well in a recliner. Good luck !
Am i the only one that has terrible dreams?
Griz, It's interesting that you had nightmares as sleep apnea keeps you from entering REM sleep which is when you dream. So most people with sleep apnea do not dream at all or dream very little. Many who go on CPAP notice the return of dreams which means the treatment is working. Before I was on CPAP I would suddenly startle awake, sweating and heart racing similar to what you describe. It was what I would imagine a panic attack was like. It happens because your body becomes hypoxic from lack of oxygen then your blood pressure and heart rate increase in response. My guess is that your nightmares were fleeting seconds of thought as your body awakened as it was starved for oxygen. Just my guess.
Surprise nobody has brought up the Inspira treatment I see on TV .Would love to know how that works and be able to get rid of cpap all together