Colorado need our help with wolves
General Topic
Contributors to this thread:
JSW 12-Dec-18
TheTone 12-Dec-18
JSW 12-Dec-18
trackman 12-Dec-18
wilhille 12-Dec-18
Franklin 12-Dec-18
mountainman 12-Dec-18
elkstabber 12-Dec-18
Jaquomo 12-Dec-18
elkmtngear 12-Dec-18
Orion 12-Dec-18
Tracker 12-Dec-18
Franklin 12-Dec-18
Treeline 12-Dec-18
Orion 12-Dec-18
Adventurewriter 12-Dec-18
Zbone 12-Dec-18
Bowhuntpig 13-Dec-18
YZF-88 13-Dec-18
standswittaknife 13-Dec-18
Native Okie 13-Dec-18
TrapperKayak 13-Dec-18
TrapperKayak 13-Dec-18
NoWiser 13-Dec-18
Ursman 13-Dec-18
Z Barebow 13-Dec-18
YZF-88 13-Dec-18
YZF-88 13-Dec-18
IdyllwildArcher 13-Dec-18
stealthycat 13-Dec-18
Stix 13-Dec-18
Franklin 14-Dec-18
JSW 14-Dec-18
WapitiBob 14-Dec-18
Surfbow 14-Dec-18
Treeline 14-Dec-18
Treeline 14-Dec-18
Orion 14-Dec-18
JSW 14-Dec-18
RogBow 14-Dec-18
Paul@thefort 14-Dec-18
WapitiBob 14-Dec-18
Stix 14-Dec-18
Paul@thefort 14-Dec-18
Orion 14-Dec-18
Surfbow 15-Dec-18
Stix 15-Dec-18
Zim 17-Dec-18
NoWiser 17-Dec-18
BB 17-Dec-18
Stix 17-Dec-18
Stix 17-Dec-18
ACB 17-Dec-18
Whocares 17-Dec-18
fisherick 17-Dec-18
From: JSW
12-Dec-18

JSW's Link
Every hunter who has, does or ever plans to hunt Colorado needs to step up and support organizations that are trying to keep wolves from eliminating our resources. Please check out the attached link and find a way to get involved. We are drastically outnumbered and out financed. We must do all we can to protect wild game in Colorado.

From: TheTone
12-Dec-18
I'd be careful getting involved in anything BGF/SFW.

I hope Colorado doesn't end up having to deal with a wolf issue, but I don't think BGF is the friend you're wanting for help.

From: JSW
12-Dec-18
I understand some people have issues with certain conservation organizations but we need to get past our differences when dealing with something as critical as this. Every effort must be made to keep wolves out of Colorado and I'm not seeing any other group doing much about it.

From: trackman
12-Dec-18
TheTone 2-x

From: wilhille
12-Dec-18
No thanks. Those guys are way more likely to eliminate hunting as we know it than wolves are.

From: Franklin
12-Dec-18
Throw some bait out there tainted with that legal weed and chill them out. Oh wait...that will give them the munchies.

This day and age contacting certain groups is worrisome. You basically giving them your information to do what they wish with. Investigate any and all groups you are supporting.

From: mountainman
12-Dec-18
Thanks for the info Jim. I get some folks don't like BGF/SFW. SFW has done some shady stuff. BUT, we are talking about unchecked wolf populations here.

From: elkstabber
12-Dec-18
It's hard to decide what is the greater threat.

From: Jaquomo
12-Dec-18
Back when the bear people were threatening to put an initiative on the ballot to ban spring bear hunting and all baiting, even in fall, they offered some compromises that would include fall baiting still permitted.. I remember Denny Behrens making an inpassioned public speech essentially daring them to put it on the ballot, no compromise. We lost that one 69-31% despite all the the so-called educational efforts.

Now the wolfies are threatening to put wolf reintroduction on the ballot, and Denny is here to "help" us again? This is an emotional issue in a (now) blue state. If it gets on the ballot in 2020 we're in trouble.

From: elkmtngear
12-Dec-18
Looks to me like they invited a bunch of folks up to the Ranch for a bbq, had a camcorder, and figured they could make some cash.

If it's only running on the "Farm and Ranch" channel...what's the point? I would guess 99 percent of Farmers and Ranchers would shoot a Wolf first, and ask questions later.

From: Orion
12-Dec-18
We need to keep SFW out of Colorado as much as the wolves. How about we tackle the bobcat issue first in January. There is a proposal to ban all hunting and trapping of bobcats, meeting is in Denver January 9th and 10th I believe. There is a post running in the Colorado forum with more info and the exact citizens proposal. We are in trouble fellas they are chipping away one animal at a time.

From: Tracker
12-Dec-18
Colofornia here we come.

From: Franklin
12-Dec-18
Tracker sadly nailed it. I do not live in Colorado but it is my preferred western state to hunt. My fear it is indeed turning into California....hell they elected a turd burglar as Governor. Homeless people are flocking to the state and in certain areas housing and costs are skyrocketing.

It just feels like Colorado is experiencing what Californian`s went through 15 years ago. I would be more than willing to contribute to a solid vetted force to help save it.

From: Treeline
12-Dec-18
Colorado has been severely Californicated over the last 30 years. Really sucks that all the refugees from that sinking state come here because they are pissed about how effed up it has been and then immediately start calling for the same BS they left to be Imposed on their new home.

From: Orion
12-Dec-18
Apparently this proposal came from a veterinarian in Telluride.

12-Dec-18
Lou is right if it gets on the ballot I hate to say it all over but the crying....and I don't even think it would be as close as the bear shellacking...

From: Zbone
12-Dec-18
Maybe the wolves will eat some yuppies...8^) Sorry, couldn't help myself...8^)

From: Bowhuntpig
13-Dec-18
Interesting idea..

From: YZF-88
13-Dec-18
SFW/BGF is a very, very slippery slope folks.

13-Dec-18
Can’t support this money hungry group..

From: Native Okie
13-Dec-18
My neighbor when I lived in Colorado was and still is a high ranking big game biologist for the state. I talked to him about the wolf issue and he told me two things. USFW has never located a species that was not previously native to an are (ie Mexican Gray Wolf) and additionaly he noted they don’t have the means/ resources to manage the resource.

From: TrapperKayak
13-Dec-18
"Homeless people are flocking to the state..." How, on foot? Hitchhiking? In vans chock full of refuges? Wolves in sheeps clothing? The state is getting too full of both people and predators... I have a chance to hunt elk there this fall. I am wondering if I should. It might be my one last chance to have a decent hunt, before it all goes to hell there, which it is currently in the process of. Before the wolves arrive, because they will. They are there already, two legged ones.

From: TrapperKayak
13-Dec-18
"...additionaly he noted they don’t have the means/ resources to manage the resource.." With all that weed revenue pouring in now, it won't be long before the Libtards have enough dough to make it happen.

From: NoWiser
13-Dec-18
BGF is a greater threat to hunting than wolves ever will be. You'd have to be out of your mind to donate to this organization.

From: Ursman
13-Dec-18
What is wrong with supporting BGF? What have they done or haven’t done?

From: Z Barebow
13-Dec-18
Ursman- Look to Utah. Do some research on their annual banquet and Don Peay. Literally a "wolf in sheeps clothing". I would trust them as far as I can throw them.

From: YZF-88
13-Dec-18
Remember SFW and BGF are one in the same. Their priority is funding themselves via state wildlife welfare. Look at how they scammed Utah into paying them a substantial amount of money to lobby keeping wolves out of Utah....twice!!! BTW, wolves aren’t in Utah. For every dollar they get, pennies are actually used for improving habitat. Odds are it will be a habitat improvement that would benifit a landowner or the high dollar clients guides cater. Said clients buy premium tags every year via auction. Utah also pays them handsomely via raffle ticket sales from the Hunt expo since they are not required to spend all the money on conservation projects. Most of it covers “administrative fees”. Conversely RMEF would’ve given it all back!!!!

Their banquets are always full though. Not many people know what they are actually supporting.

From: YZF-88
13-Dec-18
They'll fight for auction and landowner tags (at the expense of average hunters of course). Zero financial transparency. Their primary source of revenue is from selling tags via raffles (tags taken from the draws for the peasants). Utah has done nothing but fund and facilitate their spread. Do some research on the shady method they secured the rights to the Hunt Expo when RMEF has a substantially better offer.

Your a fisherman? Do some research on Utah stream access and their stance.

You don’t like wolves? Do some research on how they didn’t help in Wyoming/Montana...and then took credit for others work.

13-Dec-18
1. I cannot support SFW. I don't agree with what they've done in UT and their lack of transparency with funds originating with wildlife is alarming.

2. If wolves ever get a foothold in CO (and by many reports, they're already there), their numbers will skyrocket due to the large elk herds there.

3. While it'll probably be a net-loss of elk numbers in many areas, there could actually be a benefit to public land hunters as a consequence of wolves following the large herds onto private land and breaking them up/pushing them into more rugged areas.

Wolves go where the elk are and every hunting season in many areas of CO, the elk migrate onto private lands (as they do in many other states) and form large herds to avoid public land hunting pressure. When elk are pressured by wolves, they break up and move and this could actually help some of the OTC hunting areas (for public land hunters, that is).

I do believe there would be a net loss of tags though, especially cow tags, if wolves got a foot hold in CO.

From: stealthycat
13-Dec-18
I don't like doing things illegally, but hunters can kill a LOT of wolves .... they just need to decide to do it

From: Stix
13-Dec-18
Wolves cannot be reintroduced anywhere without USFWS approval. This was by US district court order. Colorado has already been studied by the USFWS (us fish & wildlife service) and found to be incompatible with wolf reintrduction due to population densities. Even with a ballot initiative to reintroduce wolves, it cant and wont happen. This is just another fear post by the slimes of Big Game Forever, a group founded by sheep herders, argriculture groups, and private landowners to tie the hands of Colorado Parks & Wildlife biologists to benefit these groups for profits.

This thread should read "Colorado needs help due to slime ball Big Game Forever group trying to turn wildlife into $$$$ for special interest groups and away from public land hunters"

Anyone who subscribes to BGF slime is not a sportsman.

From: Franklin
14-Dec-18
I just read....hopefully it`s not old....but in Boulder they have a date you MUST certify your assault weapon by. Liberal policies have consequences. Colorado was in dire financial straits and had to legalize pot. Disgraced Mayor of Chitcongo Rahm Emanuel wants to legalize weed and casino gambling to pay for government Pensions because the city is broke.

So a city that is riddled with corruption, crime, murder and gangs is now going to legalize weed and gambling. What`s next....prostitution and pedophilia.

Liberal policies are destroying our way of life and society in general.

From: JSW
14-Dec-18
Wow, I didn't expect quite so much hate. If BGF is so bad, who else is there? I don't see any other group taking this on. Show me a better option and I will support it. I have no connection to BGF. Make no mistake, wolves are coming to Colorado. They are the perfect tool to end hunting. The pro wolf advocates don't give a shit about wildlife. They only care about ending hunting. The wolf debate has never been about wolves. It's always been about controlling human behavior. That includes stopping hunting and ranching. Will we do anything about it? I guess we'll just spend all our time arguing about who will fight the fight while they destroy our way of life.

From: WapitiBob
14-Dec-18
What's bgf done besides lobby against the Simpson Tester rider, which is why ID and MT are hunting wolves, and separate hunters from their money?

Has he stopped even ONE wolf from being introduced? Anywhere? Got a hunting season passed?

From: Surfbow
14-Dec-18
"The wolf debate has never been about wolves. It's always been about controlling human behavior. That includes stopping hunting and ranching."

Just like wolves ended all the hunting and ranching in Wyoming, Montana, and Idaho? I'm not on the pro-wolf for Colorado by any stretch, but some of the fear-mongering sound bytes from the anti-wolf crowd are ridiculously extreme...BGF isn't getting my support

From: Treeline
14-Dec-18
Jim, what about P&Y?

Can we do anything from the P&Y platform?

What about B&C or even SCI? Any leverage or help from that quarter?

I have seen some interesting information regarding NA wolves DNA recently that could be great ammo for Conservation groups and against the Federal listing of Threatened or Endangered Species anywhere. Basically, from a DNA perspective, all NA wolves are the same species with varying amounts of Coyote DNA mixed in - not separate, distinct species. This needs a big tent approach to stop - hunters, trappers, ranchers, and even the dreaded “wildlife watchers”.

Wolves will severely reduce big game populations and detrimentally impact livestock. Wildlife watchers will be impacted by the loss of big game to watch (even though they pay nothing to support it). This will, in turn, reduce hunting opportunities, reduce hunter numbers, reduce revenue to state G&F agencies and increase taxes to pay for the damages.

From: Treeline
14-Dec-18
BTW there are already wolves in NW CO. So far, local solutions have been keeping the numbers in check.

From: Orion
14-Dec-18
Pope and young won't do anything just like they didn't in Idaho, Wyoming, or Montana. They will deflect it saying it's a state issue and has nothing to do with their club.

From: JSW
14-Dec-18
Ryan, Good to see you are the local expert on P&Y. Here's the reality. P&Y doesn't have the resources to fund an anti wolf campaign. What we can do is get our members and other bowhunters involved. We can help with the problem but it's not possible to take the lead on it. It has to come from within the state or from an organization with more money. I'm still waiting for someone to give me a better option than BGF. At least they are doing something. I stand by my statement that wolf introduction is completely about controlling human behavior. Elk and moose herds have been decimated in the states around Yellowstone. Opportunities have been lost. Simply look at the number of tags issued today compared to 20 years ago.

From: RogBow
14-Dec-18
Treeline, "local solutions".

Badass, love it.

From: Paul@thefort
14-Dec-18
I doubt that very many opinions can be changed through various media channels concern any possible wolf reintroduction in Colorado. Look at all of the money the CPW spends on Hug A Hunter and still the majority of Colorado's population still does not have a clue on who support wildlife in Colorado. The majority still believes it is their General State Tax money and income from Wild Life Watching.

From: WapitiBob
14-Dec-18
The Feds don't care what Colorado thinks. If it was a state decision there wouldn't be a wolf problem.

From: Stix
14-Dec-18
Wolves are not coming to Colorado. That's a fear tactic bgf and the slime crew are preaching. As I said, USFWS is in charge of all wolf re-introduction due to their federal protection. That is by court order. They do the trapping and rlocation. That is by court order. They survey all potential relocation areas. That is by court order. They surveyed Colorado and ot didn't abide by the court ordered qualifications due to human population density and it isn't part of the Mexican Grey wolves original population area. That is by court order. If Colorado passes a ballot initiative to introduce wolves, where will they get them at? They cant send a crew into an area to retrieve them, no state will allow it. It's federal law.

Please don't propagate the slimes fear tactics on this site. Of course you may be part of the slime that's propagating this misinformation.

Wolves will not be introduced in Colorado.

From: Paul@thefort
14-Dec-18
Steve, that is my understanding also. Paul

From: Orion
14-Dec-18
Thanks for reiterating my point Jim. Like I said Pope and Young as a club will not get involved.

From: Surfbow
15-Dec-18
"If Colorado passes a ballot initiative to introduce wolves, where will they get them at?" Oh, that's easy, the wolf 'rescue' places will just 'accidentally' leave some gates open, like the Mexican wolf that got loose and was running around Florissant last week...

From: Stix
15-Dec-18
BGF has been propagating this crap for years, trying to instill fear as a way to boost their membership numbers.

At one time, their "leaders" called the North American Model of Wildlife Conservation "socialism".

They dont believe wildlife are owned by the collective people of the state, but by the private landowners with whom they reside on.

BGF likes to see these ballot initiative 's because it strengthens their position to give full control of wildlife to land owners and out of the hands of state biologists. That's why they took an all or nothing stance on the spring bear and trapping issues. It's like they intentionally bombed any compromise to get it on the ballot to further infuriate sportsmen.

It's all about greed and $$$ folks. They are an enemy of public lands and public land hunters.

From: Zim
17-Dec-18
Not sure how many of these news links work any more. BGF/SFW's corruption goes back 15 years and some of these links are probably 10. I used these to catch the eye of Phoenix TV station KTVK back when SFW made their first play to snatch Arizona's best public trophy tags to auction away. Reputation is something you earn:

http://kutv.com/news/local/allegations-of-corruption-surround-utah-hungtin-and-conservation-expo https://www.cascwild.org/don-peay-the-man-who-would-be-king-baron/ http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/conservationist/2012/03/group-founder-declares-north-american-hunting-model-%E2%80%9Csocialism%E2%80%9D http://www.standard.net/Recreation/2016/02/10/Transparency-still-debated-around-2016-Western-Hunting-and-Conservation-Expo.html http://www.mtbullypulpit.org/2012/06/pox-on-fox.html http://www.thewildlifenews.com/2013/03/19/did-don-peays-organization-essentially-buy-utah-division-of-wildlife/ http://westernvaluesproject.org/taxpayer-dollars-down-the-drain-utah-group-favors-privatized-hunting-energy-industry-over-hunters-anglers/ http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/02/us/auctions-introduce-market-forces-to-conservation-but-hunters-cry-foul.html?smid=pl-share&_r=2 http://missoulian.com/news/opinion/columnists/group-seeking-privatized-wildlife-spreading-misinformation/article_dfb5fe10-8570-11e1-99d1-0019bb2963f4.html https://howlingforjustice.wordpress.com/2013/03/03/urgent-sfw-founder-requests-taxpayer-money-to-lobby-for-wolf-delisting/ http://www.themudflats.net/archives/25891 https://www.facebook.com/pages/Arizona-Sportsmen-Against-Hb-2072/274702462612489

From: NoWiser
17-Dec-18
"I'm still waiting for someone to give me a better option than BGF."

Doing absolutely nothing is a better option than giving BGF a single penny. An even better option would be to take that money and donate it to RMEF instead.

From: BB
17-Dec-18

BB's embedded Photo
BB's embedded Photo
They say a picture speaks a 1000 words!

Merry Christmas to all of you! BB

From: Stix
17-Dec-18
Sportsmans Alliance, Backcountry Hunters & Anglers, and especially tour state bowhunting organization are all better choices.

From: Stix
17-Dec-18
Your state bowhunting organization

From: ACB
17-Dec-18
Not sure if anyone on this thread has said this , but I have it from a good source that some in Colorado division of wildlife support bringing in the wolves. So you are fighting that also .

From: Whocares
17-Dec-18
That picture is classic, Bill! By the way, we probably have a few extra wolves in northern Minnesota. They woke me up as I was "watching" Monday night football in my recliner last Monday, howling just below my house! Kinda neat but there definitely are too many.

From: fisherick
17-Dec-18
Dear Colorado DFW, BGF, CSTWC, I am done with your over inflated non resident fees and game population lies, your on your own.

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