First, overall, this pandemic could have been MUCH worse. Despite what some have claimed, world health organizations, medical agencies and researchers have been warning of this for decades. It was never IF this could happen, but WHEN. It very well could have been something more virulent and deadly. We have the chance to heed the wake-up call.
When you do have to go out to shop or run an errand, there is no traffic to hinder your travel. The chore is more efficient. People able to work from home who normally didn't, and employers who previously discouraged/forbid it, may find it a much better solution even after the crisis is over. Reduced travel on our roads has many, many benefits if it caries over long term.
In conjunction with the above, we have had a very demonstrable example of how much we collectively influence air quality worldwide, and by extension climate. The world, quite literally, got a brief breath of fresh air. Hopefully, after the crises, we can help rebuild the economy by building on efforts to continue to clean things up.
More related to our passionate pursuit; hunting seasons for the next couple of years will be affected - for some positively, and others probably not so much. Participation this year will be down (it already is for spring seasons) for a number reasons; financial, reluctance to make plans far enough in advance, possible continuing travel restrictions, etc. Wildlife populations in areas below objective, and those effected by hunters moving out of more restrictive areas to OTC, may get a bit of a head start to recovering, and less pressure. Significantly less pressure one year would carry over to higher populations the next. And for those of us who have chosen to live closer to the hunting opportunities we most covet, fewer hunters are a definite plus.
Any thoughts?
This is highly subjective to the area you hunt or fish. The area I turkey hunt has never seen more hunting pressure than this year. I disagree that participation is down as a whole, it has just moved around. Areas that maybe were hunted less are now being pounded and vice versa. I know in my part of the world there are just as many and in most cases more people hunting and fishing this spring.
I hope that, after a few decades of not being able to see their mountains and choking on soot-filled air, that developing nations around the world will start to weigh the pros and cons of industrialization and open their eyes to the benefits of pollution controls that industrialized nations have undertaken.
More so than that, I hope this fuels the debate about over-population of this planet and the harmful affect of too many mouths and too many butts. Pollution, increased energy need, loss of wild places, and the accelerated evolution and spread of contagious disease are all by-products of too many damn people.
This mess is a long way from Over, but the sooner it gets depoliticized, the better.
The crap some people are willing to believe....
It’s like Einstein said… “Only two things are infinite: the universe, and Human Stupidity. And I’m not so sure about the universe.“
We have definitely seen increases in hunting and fishing this spring (the number of people turkey scouting and talking about taking it up is pretty wild, and the number of folks fishing has been amazing overall (MA)). I like to have space to myself when doing those things, but, if this yields more people understanding that these activities have high value, and deserve protection - just like the environment we all cherish and the wildlife we chase (hence game laws etc). It's also seemed to push gun sales, both to historical gun owners like most of us, and folks who are new to guns. At least here, I've seen folks who, despite being told "you cant just go buy a gun here in MA"... I guess they didnt believe it, and were surprised at how hard it was to do. I think that will help improve the 2nd amendment debates in years to come.
Acutely, there is nothing good about people dying, being sick, and many losing livelihoods and possibly long term career directions.
But as someone noted, this is sure a great wake up call that the warnings of this very thing happening indeed need to be heeded, and that we need to use the time going forward not just to figure a vaccine out for this, but to broaden our strategies to find, snuff/fight future epidemics/pandemics.
My hope is that this also helps continue to push science education, but also humanities, so that we have people who are growing up learning to think, learning to seek out answers rigorously and question... basically, growing up learning to learn.
Hopefully good things happen as a result. It's bad. And if we can have good things come of it, that would be awesome.
I am hopeful that you are right and that the pressure in many areas goes down this year. It would be nice to see more critters reach another year of potential.
As for the over population.... So glad Trump instituted an immigration halt. Hope it lasts for many years to come.
And the Chinese GOVERNMENT can choke on a bag full of D’s. I feel sorry for the citizens.
What the frick happen to the DNC and becoming a socialist party, was in the Vietnam Nam war to fight against this from coming to our shores and here we are, 50K killed for nothing.
As far as hunting, going into this season as if it is my last hunt, just going to suck it in for every second in the field, especially coming off a knee replacement, nothing like youth that went by in a blink.
Good hunting and good health to everyone.
Thought it was just me ;-)
Seriously, I think the bright side of this whole mess is how every aspect of society has come together to find a solution (for the most part). There is no D or R label to this problem, or the efforts to solve it. Hopefully, we can carry that over to other present and future problems. At least that's what I pray for. How this affects my hunting and fishing is way down on my list of truly important things in life.
Matt
Sheesh.
Helping kids with school is fun. I like math and deconstructing liberal teachings.
Unfortunately, I broke carpal bones in both wrists in a motocross incident so I’m out of action for another month. Really sucks!
This time of year we usually start traveling. We had campground reservations in Moab starting last week, and we usually leave at the beginning of June to head to northern Canada & Alaska for the summer. With all that getting cancelled, we'll save some money.
Small things, I know. But you got to look for something positive during this mess.
There is no such things as man made climate change. Its beyond dumb to even suggest it when you look at the cycles the world has went through without the influence of this many people. That is just the science of it. if you preach it, don't dismiss that scientific reality for your feelings or political agendas. So, there is nothing that needs to be changed or traded for in this country.
As far as developing countries, you take your family there and etch out a living like people in these countries are doing. Then tell us how they don't need to be developing their economies. The hypocrisy of some people blow my mind. Population control is great when its not mandated. How many of you preaching it actually practiced it within your families?
I couldn't help but bomb this thread with the science and reality we all know to be true. No matter what gets said and who says it. Sorry Boy's, you cant play both sides of the field to be the most intelligent. You have to give credence on what you propose and profess to believe versus reality and the way you live .
As to politics I dislike them. Too bad there isn’t the CF to get that off the hunting stuff!
The other side of that coin could be more people hunting and fishing locally. Another factor that could be interesting....Meat packing plants have been some of the hardest hit areas by the virus and some have had to shut down. While I don't anticipate any real food shortages in this country, if there is any slowdown in meat production and packing it could mean an increase in hunting, especially local hunting. It will be very interesting to see what numbers tell us after the seasons are over.
You just can’t argue with that kind of logic.
There are a lot of great thinkers on Bowsite. Some threads really go on for hundreds of posts and give a lot of insight (I do recall a great retirement thread). Then there are others that get torn apart by nay-sayers. I'll check back tomorrow on this one.
As a positive, I was thinking that as a hunting community this might help us all out. Sure, there might be more competition from new hunters but "our numbers" have been dwindling. If us old guys are really retiring from the sport like the numbers suggest, then maybe this is a way to bring in a new group. People who hunt to help sustain their families or help put food on the table. They may not be purists - they may carry a rifle, shotgun or bow. They may hunt small game or big game. They will make mistakes, miss or wound, they will make "un-ethical choices" based on lack of experience. They will be looking for guidance from us, not only in the woods but here online. So maybe, some of us will offer advice that will help them. So, I would say positive for this community is that our numbers might go up.
A second positive thing that I've learned is my wife and I can do this. I have been fortunate enough to keep my job (so far) through all of this. Working from home has actually saved me hundreds each month in gas and eating out (for lunch). My wife and I have tried to buy "local" which is a change for us (instead of the big box stores and online). So we're dong what we can to keep what's remained of the economy going with what we're allowed to do. She's got a pretty big "honey-do" list for me. And I have to say that even with that and being cooped up together for more than 6 weeks now things have been pretty good between us (which helps answer that nagging question of "can we spend a ton of time together after we both retire").
We've done a lot more eating in. Sure, not 100% of the time, we have ordered take-out a few times (my wife and kids more so than me; I've been exercising daily since before Christmas so I'm watching what I eat). That's been a blessing along with a challenge for my wife in answering the question of "what's for dinner?" Out of this, we also never really had "backup food" or a pantry. We've always just re-filled from the store weekly (my wife runs a home daycare so she spends a lot each week and we generally go through it). We've now seen the challenge of being able to find foods, so she has a few extra things set aside (far from hording; just spaghetti and sauce, some cans of soup, noodles, so so on). This is another positive. We have and we share if we see that people are in need. We've helped out family members who are struggling with unemployment (I don't want it to sound like we are well-off ourselves, but we're doing what we can). I never knew I could and still get by for my family. So that's another thing I've learned; another positive.
We also have learned that relationships with our friends and family are important. Checking in on each other and missing the time we spend together is something we all face. I have talked to my parents more now than before, just to make sure they are OK and they don't need anything. I think that will probably be one of the things that we do when restrictions start being lifted; have a gathering of friends over for a fire and some beers. Doing it through Zoom just isn't the same.
Oh yeah - lastly. I'm so glad I cut-the-cord (DirectTV/Cable). I couldn't imagine paying $150/mo for TV with nothing to watch. So dropping that bill continues to pay dividends year after year.
There has been a bit more of a sense of unity. This hasn't approached the aftermath of 9/11 in how acute and pervasive this has been (still far too much in the way of politics), but I do feel more of a sense of unity and community than we've had for some time.
I've done more to connect with family and friends over the last month plus than I have for some time. More frequent calls, video chats with groups of friends who've never chatted before, etc are becoming part of the new norm. It's not just replacing the interactions we had before - it's actually going above and beyond that.
I have a greater appreciation for so much more than I have before. There's so much we take for granted - going to a restaurant, hosting a party, visiting a store, taking a trip, etc - that I not only miss, but have gained a new appreciation for.
Lastly, I'm glad that this situation has provided clarity on all of the individuals that keep this country and world running. Regardless of who gets a title of "essential," it's pretty clear that there are so many people and professions who don't get the respect and appreciation they deserve. Without them, it's pretty clear the whole system collapses.
I have an opinion that the overall “speed” of life in our culture moves at an unhealthy rate. Well it sure has forced a slow down in the last month. I think this opens up some time in people’s busy life schedules to think, reflect and reset a little. I’ve talked to many non-believers who were asking me about some of my opinions on certain scriptures because they were reading “some stuff” in their bibles. I think this sudden change has given people some time to think about their destination in life, or possibly even just the need for Jesus in a culture where we’ve just had it so darn well that it’s hard to feel a “need” for Jesus.
I also keep thinking, “man if you would have told me 6 months ago that in the new year virtually every family that lives together will once again sit together and eat dinner together around the table of home cooked meals, I would have told you, you’re nuts!” Of course this will be short lived, but hoping it provides some clarity in people’s lives and gives them a chance to reset.
Yes these are tough financial times, but virtually every generation has dealt with similar trials in their life, and we’ll get through it too. In hindsight I’m willing to bet many many good things will come from this.
On the positive, necessity is the mother of invention. I’m hoping that we learn something in our preparedness plans moving forward and are ready for the next pandemic.
WV- it takes a special person to say something that wrong and be that absolute. GF nailed it in his response.
What I see are people who slowed down to see things they’ve missed. Due to their beliefs, lifestyles, faith or lack of, etc.... What I’m also certain of that is a temporary change unless one has a change of heart.
GF, if you correlate my post to that, that’s on you. Not me. If Ziek sees climate change being affected by this, that’s on him. KS, if you think I’m so blatantly wrong, explain why. I said nothing but facts. Everyone of you guys has an idea of what others must give up to fit your narrative of a better world. Some how, without knowing for sure, I doubt that is happening. It’s just easier to talk like it is.
WV- respectfully, your statement is not "the science of it" or factual...but I'm not going to debate that with you here. It would be much more fun to discuss over a beer sometime.
I am thinking I need to buy some land for A drive in movie theater, trust me, they are coming back!
So lemme see if I’m tracking here.... Your argument is that because a warm period happened before when it was NOT caused by human activity, it could NOT POSSIBLY be the case that human activity is what’s causing it THIS time....
So if your truck gets stolen twice and the guy who was caught driving it has an airtight alibi for the last time.... then he obviously didn’t steal it this time.
You can’t pick and choose your facts to fit your political point of view, fellas. That’s not how Facts work; True is True, whether you LIKE it or not, and whether you BELIEVE it or not.
For example... A CO2-enriched air sample absorbs more heat than an unenriched sample when heated. Not “can”; DOES.
If you dig up and burn many millions of years’ worth of stored carbon over the space of just a couple hundred years, you get a rapid, corresponding increase in atmospheric CO2.
There is ZERO doubt that both of those statements are ENTIRELY True and Correct. And not because I say so. Both CAN be measured; both HAVE been measured. And documented. Ad nauseum.
Do you really need to sit inside your new gas-fired oven to figure out whether it gets hot in there when you turn it on? Because, you know, the old one was electric...
Are you make this point to all the global warming alarmist that buy the AlGore, AOC propaganda that are telling us the world is going to end in 12 years and New York and LA are going to be underwater if we don't stop this and that?
Man has an effect on the climate. Not even close to the level the left pretends.
Higher taxes and less freedom won't create a way to adjust the climate.
My comment about future predictions was sarcastic. I guess it went over your head. If you believe predictive scientific models are worthless then please refrain from watching any weather forecast before heading out on your next hunting trip. Seriously, try to keep up.
It sure does seem like the people making these so call "predictive scientific models" sure get a lot of grants from our tax dollars and make a hell of living predicting future doom for them to study.
Obviously the natural world has many more variables than a man made mathematical model. But the scientific method and mathematical models are essential tools to our understanding of our surroundings. Even the ones that are wrong tell us something useful.
Did you go to OU or just wear the cap around? Nice pic of you sitting a mile behind the 2017 deer. Hey, didn’t you make fun of someone last week about that. Yep, you’re that guy.
But on the bright side (back to the OP)...you don’t have to be “that guy” in the future even if the model predicts you will be. What a tool.
Nothing is more comical then a car salesman telling a plumber how to think about plumbing.
It may also make people realize that politicians are the LAST people we should have in charge of health and economic issues.
Guys.... Forget arguing about the accuracy of the models as far as predicting when this or that calamity will befall the planet . The point is that the disagreements about the models are about WHEN.
NOT “If”
When.
And these are big-ass problems. Believe it or not.
No doubt there are studies out there that shows people are much more likely to buy into things more readily when there is financial gain in it for them. Just looking at your LinkedIn profile it obvious you made a career out protecting the environment from what these models say might be an issue down the road. Lots of companies and individual have to pay lots of money to companies similar to yours to make sure they stay on right side of government regulations put into place by either politicians or political appointed employees based off of science models as you said are similar to an extended weather forecast. Only with many more variables and a timeline much long that 14 days.
Lots of tools that have bought into a one hell of racket. They deserve a Green New Deal.
What are these drastic change that climatologists are asking you to make? If the light switch works at your house where is your drastic change? Didn’t drastically change antelope hunting with wind turbines in the background.
So your grand conspiracy is that the vast majority of climatologists/scientist agree that man made CO2 is cause overall average temps for the earth and they are all taking bank under the table to benefit themselves. But yet you hang your flatbrim on the few scientist with data paid for by fossil fuel companies/lobby that say climate change is not happening. Or even worse you don’t really have an educated opinion as yours is given to you from 7-9pm every night by some loud mouth on tv. I have read some of the dissenting scientific research on climate change, which is fairly small in comparison to magnitudes more data saying that the earth is increasing average yearly temps, yet most of it is funded by fossil fuel once you do a little digging. That’s the money trail to keep an eye on.
So you looked at my LinkedIn and made some assumptions. First, never got a grant from the government ever. Second, never worked for the epa in any form. I mostly sit across from the table of the USFWS and USACE as a representative of energy companies. Third, never even remotely worked on climate change but I do read and get my science info from the source. Try it sometime instead of having right wing talking heads tell you your opinion that you regurgitate here. Lastly, if you are trying to use my education and career choice as a negative on me have at it. I spent most of my life in the woods hunting. I want give back to the woods and wildlife I greatly enjoy. So I choose to study wildlife biology and work with endangered species. Enjoy what I do everyday and am proud of what I do.
You want to end all natural resource or environmental regulations. Great, let’s start with Colorado and end all wildlife and big game regulations. Specifically, let’s deregulate elk, deer, and sheep hunting. Kill as many as you want, by any means 24/7/365. Lets deregulation the things you put value in first. Then maybe those elk,deer,and sheep end up on the Endangered Species Act list then I can consult with the USFWS on those species too. Let’s go for that deregulation platform but you go first.
I got nothing to hide about my education or career. What about you? Since I don’t creep on you as you did me, didn’t you say you work in payday loans and check cashing or something on a forum the other day. Honestly, I don’t know what you do. But should you be casting stones? I mean I asked you if you graduated from OU which you proudly show in every photo as your lucky hat. Since you throw falsehoods out about me I won’t do that to you. Where is it you work? Did you go to OU? What have you done to give back to the wildlife around you and the habitats you walk through?
I guess there was no brighter side after all with you as unfortunately, my model was right. You are still “that guy.”
I guess that’s logical....
Oh, and keep trusting and relying on China. You can definitely leave me out of that one too!
"You can't fix stupid."
So we needed a "pandemic" to reconnect with friends and loved ones? Apparently the so called lessons we learned after 9/11 haven't stuck. BTW, how the hell do you reconnect? Email, text, Facetime......
Here's what I have learned:
1. When a governor can decide what is essential and what is not, and then refuses to release the criteria in which is was determined, you no longer have a governor but a king. BTW, our governor's former cabinet making business was allowed to remain open while other's were deemed non essential. It was eventually closed.
2. When people comply so willingly to egregious infractions on their freedoms, they are no longer citizens but subjects.
3. When 1-800 numbers are established to rat on your neighbors for "non-compliance" you have a society reminiscent of pre-1991 eastern Europe.
4. A governor using the national guard to "appropriate" unused ventilators from rural hospitals and if they don't get them back he will personally pay for them. No one blinks an eye.
5. Basic necessities become unavailable.
6. People arrested for violating quarantine orders, while we're releasing sex offenders from prison, who within 10 days are arrested for the same type of offense.
7. $6T in fiat money, just pulled outta thin air. No one asks how or where is the money coming from. Only "I didn't get my check yet."
I am fortunate. I'm able to work from home. My wife is a nurse, still going into the hospital every day. My son is doing his college classes online from home. We've been having a good time.
The bright side, the silver lining? Our federal, state and local governments found out just how easily and readily we relinquish our liberties for security. And we do it without question.
BTW, 2020/21 flu season is only five short months away. Are you ready, subject?
Just wait until “The Dems” get their hands on some of that “Absolute” authority and immunity from questioning or prosecution that your boy is working so hard to establish as legal precedents.
Whyizzit that Power is so much more fun when we believe that the people who have it are on “our” side?
So just a thought: Maybe we don’t want to give The Donald anything that we wouldn’t trust AOC with?
From the flu. Slightly more virulent, somewhat higher mortality rate in the ALREADY AT RISK. And you're afraid of dying. From the flu. Call your doctor for a prescription for Growacet.
When the State tells you it's safe to go to Home Depot to buy a sponge but dangerous to go and buy flowers at a florist, it's not about your health.
When the State shuts down millions of private businesses but doesn’t lay off a single government employee, it's not about your health.
When the State bans dentists because it's unsafe, but deems an abortion visit is safe, it's not about your health.
When the State prevents you from buying cucumber seeds because it's dangerous, but allows in-person lottery ticket sales, it's not about your health.
When the State tells you it's dangerous to go golf alone, fish alone, or be in a motor boat alone, but the Governor can get his stage makeup done, and hair done for 5 TV appearances a week, it's not about your health.
When the state puts you IN a jail cell for walking in a park with your child because it’s too dangerous, but lets criminals OUT of jail cells for their health, it’s not about YOUR health!
When the state tells you it’s too dangerous to get treated by a doctor of chiropractic or have physical therapy treatments yet deems a liquor store essential, it’s not about your health!
When the State lets you go to the grocery store or hardware store but is demanding mail-in voting, IT'S NOT ABOUT YOUR HEALTH.
WAKE UP PEOPLE — If you think this is all about your health you’re mistaken! Please open your eyes! Stop being lead like blind sheep.
Bowbender- damn right I worry that my body could have a bad reaction to COVID. I also have 2 adult kids with asthma and 2 with autoimmune issues. If I’m not concerned for my health then I’m concerned for theirs. I also have parents in their 70s. Damn right this concerns me. This is not the flu and it is 10X more deadly but keep getting your medical advice from Limbaugh. Next time skip the doctor and go right to the EIB network for treatment.
Other medical experts were saying that very thing. Let the virus run through the young people. It will run its course and die down. Instead we chose to shut the entire country down.
Keeping sick people at home is quarantine. Keeping healthy people at home is tyranny.
I’m done here - taking my son to the river for some crappie, white bass and walleye fishing.
I get the inconsistency you are talking about Old School. However, I think it is a prudent reaction to try to slow down the spread by minimizing social interaction. I guarantee you its much tougher to define "essential worker" vs criticizing the definition. Maybe you should run for governor so you can call the shots. But I'm making this political when you said "State" at least 5 times in your post. Good luck with fishing. I hope you catch a stringer full.
OP...there is always a bright side. Maybe we will plan better and focus effort/money into preparation for the next pandemic. I know I have put a serious dent in my wife's honey do list so that should free me up for this fall for elk and deer hunting...that's a positive.
I always tend to look at what I can do, personally, to help rather than what can I force others to do for the "greater good".