Are going to end hunting for us all. My friend took this picture, outside a bar in Alpine, Wy. Dead cat, oozing blood, zoom in and see the beer can in it's mouth. Antis are not needed, they can just sit back and watch us destroy ourselves from within.
Some people need to act like not every kill is their first and they are 5 years old with a need to show and tell with the rest of the kindergarten class
My guess is the can is to keep the jaws from locking shut. A stick would have worked too. Also, not many people in WY would care. You posting the picture here is doing far more damage.
In the west people have a different view of a lion in most cases. Chit happens in all sports. I am more concerned about the disrespect for the country at major sports events like kneelers & those dispespecting the flag & our country.
I'll bet this isn't the only place this picture is posted. I'm even more sure my friend isn't the only one who took a picture of this event. Are you guys saying there are no kitty lovers in Wyoming? No antis? OK then, I'm the problem.
Blood does often come out of the mouth when an animal is harvested. It very well could be a once in a lifetime bucketlist hunt and the hunter is very proud of there success. Apparently happy enough to have a toast. Unfortunately its the anti's that make this seem offensive. We have to hide our success now to not go viral.
I see no issues either. I might avoid it if I were going to Jackson but unlikely many folks at the bar in Alpine think anything but positively about a legally harvested cat.
I find the title to this post more offensive myself. Your lack of decorum is just I find more offensive. If that is going to help end hunting were screwed anyway. No issue with the picture, not my choice but no issue.
Given that Alpine is basically a suburb of Jackson, you can be sure there are antis around. If this was Medicine Bow or Wheatland, not so much. With a lion hunting ban likely on the CO ballot in 2022, wouldn't be surprised if we see this photo again.
If by “respect” we mean treating the animal as something of Value, I’m on board. I make it a habit to treat anything that I am going to eat…. like it’s something I plan to eat. So yeah, I’m good with that.
But if the “value” that cat holds to the guy who killed it lies in the Attaboys… well, I guess you can’t say that he’s acting in conflict with his values/beliefs/purposes for having killed it.
But like when someone makes a great play in a football game. Seems like “time was”, the guy who had gotten the better of the other might even help the other guy up, rather than getting in his face with a bunch of trash talk or literally pounding his chest to call attention to himself.
Some days I kinda wish the CO’s could write people a ticket for Unsportsmanlike Conduct.
Nice cat. Likely not the greatest taxi pose, I'd want a bit more for my money..... But I'm sure they were there with lots of friends who wanted to shake his hand and buy a round. Hunter likely isn't even the one who put the can there. Unnecessary display? Yeah, probably. But it was a day to celebrate and revel.... a day they will remember their whole lives. Was an age the whole village would have been there. Don't even drink anymore, but I'da had a beer with those boys and bought em a couple.
Who stood up for cat hunting in CA? I'll bet good money WY will be the LAST place cat hunting is outlawed because those folks will stand up for it. With principled strength and strong words, non-compliance if nesseary. These are the people that told the wolfies to go pound sand, we aren't joining your stupid management program. They stood by their guns despite all the skirts over heads and now have the best wolf management plan in the country, hands down. But.... they're all a bunch of savages who will be the end of hunting. huh.
Again, why is WY going to be the last bastion? Maybe they are on to something.... telling snowflakes to wizz up a rope, sit down and STFU or go away might just work better than bowing down to them or asking them where it hurts like there's any way on earth to fix it. Compliance, acquiescence, submitting.... hiding like you are doing something wrong is a losing strategy pretty much every time. Because when you are finally "found" your actions say you've been doing something wrong. They attack at any weakness because they are based in cowardice. Based on being in a mob.
Look at this current "cancel culture" based on mobs and fear. How many have "saved" themselves by bowing to the mob with an apology? It only emboldens them, the accused still lose everything. Those who ignore them, even mock them and move on tend to survive. If you're going down..... much prefer to let em know it ain't gonna be without a fight and they aren't coming out unscathed.
Bethism: to a lady who says she doesn't want any trouble. "lady, you crave trouble.... you just don't want resistance" I don't have any tattoos... but if I was gonna get one it might just be that.....
I'd be terrified someone would steal my cat. I have a hard time leaving an animal in the field to go get a quad lol.
I've never really understood the "show a dead animal respect" thing. I mean I understand the human version, but even that does nothing for the dead person, it's more for the person's family. Use the animal properly, because otherwise it was a wasted killing. But respect stopped when you killed it. After that it's just a humanized emotional variant of something Disneyfied.
But showing respect is why some mount and register them in the list books. Animals so honored have not died in vain. It’s not about the hunter it’s about the hunted.
My biggest concern would be if he made a quick, clean kill. THAT is "respect" to the animal that actually matters. Everything else is just window dressing.
PECO, we might revisit this thread if the photo shows up on TV during the election campaign next year. Either way, lion and bobcat hunting are doomed in this state of it gets on the ballot The governor's ARA husband is strongly against cat hunting, and he recommends the appointments to the Wildlife Commission.
I always believed that Harvesting was bring in crops and Killing was for animals, this is the reason pc/cancel culture has effected our society. When I go hunting I go out for a kill, not taking a picker out to do a kill. Tying a killed deer to the hood or back finder was the only way to get it home back in the day, which reminds me a time a couple of gents from Chicago area had a Hereford tied to the hood think it was a deer, true event.
I don't see a problem with it. I would leave it in the bed of the truck but that's me. Corado has way bigger worries than a dead Wyoming cat with a beer can in its mouth.
Every picture posted or framed and hung is displayed. Every mount is a display of a dead animal. While it is about the animal it is about the hunters skill as well.
Wyoming can be a little rough around the edges. Thats a big reason its a pretty cool State. No, displaying a cat like that isn't my thing but changing Wyoming into something its not, isn't my thing either. I wouldn't display the pic on the internet.
Maybe that cat had been terrorizing the “neighborhood” and/or picking off pets or hitting a lot of local livestock, and this was a way to get word out within the community that hey - “ding, dong, the witch is dead”?
Had that been the case, then seeing that might have done more to soothe nerves than ruffle feathers.
But that’s the trouble with doing things which you know darn well are going to disturb other people. Nothing lost by just being Polite about it. A picture like that, it’s too easy to judge; and cor that matter it wasn’t the hunter who took and posted that picture; he was inside - maybe being a horse’s ass and maybe having done the community a valuable service. Because even non-hunters don’t want large predators in THEIR back yards…..
There are many people in many areas who do not want cats killed for any reason. They don't care if an occasional yoga pants wearing soccer mom gets attacked while out jogging.
Mabye he was sponsored by the beer company .. I would say you just give that picture twice the number of views for posting it here…we run a lot of bear around here kill 15-30 a yr with dogs..I got a lot of pictures with Busch light cans around bears want to see?? And I don’t for one second believe that’s going to be what ends hunting for us..
I doubt if that picture (or this thread) is particularly harmful to lion hunting. Anyone who truly wants to be offended can simply go to YouTube and begin watching bloody lions fall out of trees, amidst dogs barking and hunters celebrating. I'm thinking the real issue for some is the beer can in this picture.
I don't know if this was addressed, but how do you know whether or not the hunter the killed the cat actually stuck the can in its mouth? Maybe the hunter was in celebrating & some @$$clown stumbled out of the bar and did it? Passing judgement on an issue seems to be a national pastime now.
This single picture is now far more viewed as a result of this thread but if the intention was to make a bigger point and prevent hundreds of others from gratuitously exposing carcasses and photos for the general public’s involuntary consumption then it is just collateral damage in a bigger cause and well worth it.
The fact one can go online and find something so seeing it in the back of a truck at a restaurant ok does not make seeing it at the restaurant the right or appropriate place to get a viewing of what may otherwise be searchable on line.
Go on most TV stations in WI right now and view the big buck board pictures. Almost every newspaper will have a picture of your harvests this past week and upcoming week. I stated this on a previous post about the sensitivity of today's city folks. The loss of reality of their food sources is a major issue. Everyone from farming to fishing, needs to embrace this fact and the thought of running and hiding as some of you suggest is not the answer.
Assuming the cat was killed by a hunter, my biggest problem with the photo is he isn't home caring for the hide and meat, instead of sitting in a bar. The blood, especially, is a lot easier to clean off the hair before it dries completely.
TD x2 I have never believed the way to fight PC culture was to become more PC. That is only creating the illusion to you that you aren’t at war anymore, but only because you’ve given them the very thing that they were at war about. Unless of course, you enjoy being PC.
I likely wouldn’t do the same thing myself. I generally prefer to enjoy my animal, look at it some, then load it on the back of my quad, snowmobile or truck and quietly go home and continue enjoying it with my boys or some close friends. Kind of fly under the radar so to speak. But if I did feel particularly silly one day and want to do something goofy I wouldn’t want to be ridiculed by my hunting compadres and I wouldn’t do the same if I saw someone else doing so as well.
It's wyoming for crying out loud not new york city...he probably got his beer tab paid. Sometimes I get annoyed with all this worrying about antis...if we lose our privileges to hunt it will have nothing to do with our pictures...it will be because we didn't fight back. We were too busy trying not to offend anyone. In the words of the great Jack lambert, some of you should start wearing skirts
Duvall, how about a strategy to "fight back" in a blue state when hunting issues are on the ballot and outside money from the coasts is funding the anti campaign by 10-1? Here in CO we fought back tooth and nail to keep bear hunting and trapping, and still lost those elections 70-30% And that was when CO was still "purple". Don't say "you didn't fight hard enough" unless you were here and involved in the campaigns, because otherwise you have no clue what you're talking about.
Some of you "pry it from my bloody hands" guys need to turn off the YouTube videos and look around at who truly controls the fate of hunting. And it ain't pickup truck drivin', tobacco spittin', "Happiness is a warm gutpile" wannabe tough guys pledging to fight to their last breath. If you believe that, I have a CO spring bear hunt to sell you.
Hunters make up 4% of the overall population. That's a fact. Who gives a s#it what the other 96% think of us right? The lion pic won't kill us. We display enough other offensive tasteless crap (to the average suburban voter) that this pic is like a grain of sand on the beach.
Lou, we went thru that same battle in Mass. - no more running hounds for bear, virtually no more trapping. And we likewise got out-spent and out-voted by miles. But every tasteless display costs us another vote and the antis didn't even have to spend a penny. Fighting smart means making the other guy pay for every dam' inch, not giving them free 'ammunition'.
This single picture is now far more viewed as a result of this thread but if the intention was to make a bigger point and prevent hundreds of others from gratuitously exposing carcasses and photos for the general public’s involuntary consumption then it is just collateral damage in a bigger cause and well worth it.
But showing respect is why some mount and register them in the list books. Animals so honored have not died in vain. It’s not about the hunter it’s about the hunted.
Some people need to act like not every kill is their first and they are 5 years old with a need to show and tell with the rest of the kindergarten class
Displaying animals like these idiots have done is just S T U P I D !!!! Doesn't matter how hard you fight if you have animals with blood and a beer can stuck in its mouth on display. You have 100 people drive by and see that and you'll have 100 people voting to ban hunting.
Would it be ok if it was a hog or deer? Dog box in the way looks like.I wouldn't do this but I'm not triggered by it in rural Wyoming either.Probably a young guy not as wise as us.
Displaying animals like these idiots have done is just S T U P I D !!!! Doesn't matter how hard you fight if you have animals with blood and a beer can stuck in its mouth on display. You have 100 people drive by and see that and you'll have 100 people voting to ban hunting.
I don't know the deal with the beer can in the mouth thing.....a one-off, 20 second photo op or it stayed that way for the drive???
WRT to having your animals showing IMO isn't a big deal at all. In fact....in the small places I lived, it was normal...and still is in northern Michigan. Very common to see an animal in the bed, on the bed, on a roof rack if a small car or van, and especially on a hitch cargo carrier, etc. I'd hate to live in a town or area where you would get critter-shamed for driving back home with an animal on the cargo carrier or in the truck bed or somewhere it could be seen. It might not be PC in the big/blue cities/states....but in my experience, anywhere hunting is very popular or a way of life...it's normal ops. Hopefully that tradition never changes.
Hell they post them in the local newspaper in my neck of the woods every Wednesday… whole insert full of dead animals in back of pickup trucks, on cars, dog boxes. Only problem I see is their isn’t 4 or 5 cats there .. Then again I guess I’m to far back in the sticks
Lou, Wyoming is not Colorado and will never be. At any given time during a hunting season in Wyoming one might see countless number of animals in the back of trucks, no one cares and many will stop and say nice job. Looks like the cat is on a dog box by the way.
Looking forward to seeing our local mt lion guide with some nice big cats on his truck parked right on the main road into Laramie this winter.
I only see a bunch of ass clowns on this thread, not you Lou.
"Wyoming is not Colorado and will never be." I wouldn't bet on that. You may be right though, Wyoming may never be Colorado but it very well be the next California. Wyoming is the least populated state. It won't take very many more libs to move in flip it.
I guess we shall see. I bet winter will be the limiting factor though. I'll take the bet though. I live in a liberal county and town, actually we have quite a few very conservative folks here too. Only the hardy survive our winters and I just don't see Californians being so hardy. Always the chance to be wrong though.
Mt lions in the back of a truck seems to be a NR issue, we don't care I guess.
No offense PECO, don't mean to come off as one of the ass clowns but maybe I am.
Wytex, I sure understand, and even though Alpine is a suburb of Jackson, whatever happens there (as far as reaction) is likely a one-off for the rest of the state. I guess my point is that those of us in referendum states are a little more sensitive to this stuff, since it is used against us in election campaigns. But in 2022 they already have plenty of great material to use against lion hunting that will turn the stomachs of urban voters who control our elections. A photo like this is just a sprinkle on the donut.
If it makes it to the ballot, and the huggers have promised to do so after the Commission told them to pound sand, lion and bobcat hunting will be banned in CO. And it won't be the "antis" who do it. It will be the suburban golf dads, soccer moms, and mall chicks who aren't against hunting per se, unless they have to vote on a certain type of hunting that appears distasteful or "unsporting" from the media ads shoved under their noses.
Some of these non hunting voters already call hunters "Bubbas". That does not help our cause, pictures such as this confirms their suspicions, and earns our negative title.
"Some of these non hunting voters already call hunters "Bubbas". That does not help our cause, pictures such as this confirms their suspicions, and earns our negative title."
so what do we do? we post the picture here...so even more people cans see it, and then proceed to call each other bubbas, ass clowns, tobacco spittin rubes. like i said, we don't need to worry about anyone else, we'll gladly eat our own. when there is only one hunter left, they can brag to everyone about how ethical they are.
And you know what, if this Bubba image is what we want hunters to be, perhaps it is time to end it. As a hunter of 56 years, what we have evolved into is sometimes disgusting, even to me. I can only imagine how the non hunting voters feel as we ask for their support.
Amen Breaks. The abject ignorance is not only on display in the picture it’s on display by the responses of acceptance and support. This thread is pretty freaking sad if this a cross section of bow hunters.
PDDA (Public displays of dead animals) MAY have no impact on how hunters are viewed at all. It's guaranteed, however, that opting not to PDDA will not create a negative impact. So remove the risk and show some discretion. There is nothing to lose and maybe we gain a bit by not creating an issue.
Ego aside, what is the motivation for not using discretion. How important is it really to you that some stranger finds out you filled your tag by being forced to look at your bloody carcass? Is that type of "validation" really what you need?
Missouribreaks- do you recommend kicking them out hunting camps too?
Or would it be better to engage them and listen to their perspective. I think they are ass clowns based on one photo. I'll admit I'm making a lot of assumptions based on one snapshot in time. Maybe it would be better if I went into the bar, bought them a beer, listened to the kick ass story about the hunt, and then ask why they displayed the cat and put a beer can in it's mouth. Maybe there would be an opportunity to discuss many of the things on this thread. Or maybe I find out my assumptions were all wrong. Maybe we both walk away with a better understanding of each others perspective.
Funny, on the WI page, the topic of in person registration of deer is common. Often, the reason given for wishing it was still around is because it was a great place to see the deer on display.
In Wisconsin, you once legally had to have a portion of the deer exposed while driving. For futuristic, and similar reasons to this discussion, that law ended a few years ago.
To answer the question accurately, most registration stations were: Bars Gas Stations Sporting good stores WDNR offices were open for registration also. Most went to bars, gas stations etc, many of the registration stations in this area never checked the deer just handed out the tags. Even when they cut does ears to verify harvest and so they could not be registered over and over they would hand you the scissors. Registration was a joke. Some will claim otherwise but it was and very inconvenient. Many even had a horn stretcher for short spikes. Bars were lined with vehicles, and dead deer on them daily and nightly. Maybe not in the suburbs but come to rural WI. And there is not much for suburbs in WI.
Horn stretchers? As a proponent of in person registration at least as an option the biggest benefit other than more accurate harvest data was hunter recruitment and retention. A kid being congratulated by anyone and everyone at a registration station no matter what they harvested has an impact. I still remember registering my first deer, a doe, and the excitement from strangers for my accomplishment.
Folks, we have to look at big picture. Not bowhunters, rifle hunters or even the fine residents of Wyoming. Those mentioned might occupy 10% of the population. We can all be part of the “mutual admiration society “ and see nothing wrong with it.
It is the 90% who don’t hunt and see this that matter. And to them, this pic makes us look like a bunch of Elmer Fudds and they will vote based upon emotion.
I am currently fighting this on a local level. (My city is in process of ending our urban bowhunt) If/when this pic hits social media, the keyboard warriors are going to have a field day.
A horn stretcher was usually a ball peen hammer or the like to dent the skull some. I never have needed someone else to make me fill fulfilled for my accomplishments, going to the registration station was a pain for many. Chest thumping, oh yeah like having a lion on your truck with a beer can in its mouth. Registration stations never created accurate harvest records. That is a fallacy created by some, for some.
This is so funny. I looked at the photo and wondered why the assumed hunter wasn’t caring for his trophy. You bitches take it to a different level. Sad that.
GG, you're right. In the grand scheme, this photo is pretty much irrelevant. We hunters have already screwed the pooch with our image to the general public when the antis decide to shove it under voters noses in election campaigns. We produce all the material they need. The EVP/COO of HSUS was laughing when he told me this.
I'm really interested in how hunters will try to counter the "Ban Cat Hunting" election campaign. Especially since CPW will be prohibited from taking a stance.
Lou, it’s easy. Display pics of a vegan jogger with 4500 stitches from a young rogue cat, who was hungry. We both know it’s happened here in Colorado. Why don’t we show those pics?
Looking at the picture, where was this cat supposed to be hidden? The dog box takes up the whole truck box. And why label where they are parked a bar, so many of little towns in my great state of WY, the only place serving food is a bar. Many times after a hunt I have been at a bar eating, not drinking. I don't understand the beer can in the mouth. But anyone who has a problem with this picture is an ass clown! Lets be proud of our accomplishments, screw the libs!
Oh yeah also, the hunter has take the lion to the WY G&F within a designated number of hours for a tooth extraction, maybe the beer can helps the extraction. Guess he should have used something else.
OK a little more. I love living in a little community where if you park any where on main street with a dead animal in your vehicle, whether bar, gas station, quick stop, grocery store, people swarm up to see your kill and want to know where, how, when and slap you on the back or give you a hug. And that includes our non hunters.
You guys are looking at this from the wrong perspective. Do ya ever wonder what the deer that is strapped to the hood is thinking? Just remember...once ya go buck, ya never go back!
Deadeye, that's how my little CO mountain community is too. Our community manager posted FB pics of her husband with his elk a couple days ago, and nobody was offended. We can go into a bar or restaurant in camo (or orange) and won't be the only ones. Neighbors greet us with, "Get your elk?". We can ride ATVs to the restaurant for breakfast. Fresh lion tracks in the snow under my deck on Friday morning.
Unfortunately, voters on the Front Range control the future of our hunting at the ballot box. Lucky you don't have that problem in WY. We're only about 8 miles away. If we secede, will you take us?
"I love living in a little community where if you park any where on main street with a dead animal in your vehicle, whether bar, gas station, quick stop, grocery store, people swarm up to see your kill and want to know where, how, when and slap you on the back or give you a hug."
Point made. Different people get validation for their results in different places. That's what makes this issue somewhat divisive.
In any event, when we have hunters who do not understand the emotions behind ballot box game management, we are in real trouble as a group. Let's see how the next ten years go.
Gee...when I kill a deer the first thing I do is gut it and then try and get the body heat out of the carcass ASAP. To do that I cut a branch and prop the chest cavity open and then I sit there reflecting on the hunt and watch the steam rise as the heat dissipates. That stick will remain there until the carcass is cooled, sometimes not until I get the deer back home and hanging in my barn.
Another Wyomingite that has zero issues with the photo. I do find it ironic that it was the OP that chose to post a pic that was taken by a friend, then start a thread to complain about that photo. The hunter didn't take the photo, nor did he ask to have it posted on social media. All he did was stop, have a beer and lunch, and then gets called an Ass Clown and told he's the reason hunting will end for all of us. SMH.
I'll agree there are certain things that probably aren't fit for public consumption, but that cat in the back of a pickup ain't one of them. Based on some of the comments posted on this thread, I suppose some people here think every hunter should carry a hacksaw with them when they go hunting. That way we can saw off antlers so nobody can see them sticking up. You know, so we don't offend anyone.
"IMO the reason the antis have any power at all is because we hunters give it."
^...this X10. If anything ALL like-minded hunters, fishermen and outdoors folks should go on the offense against any anti-(pick any outdoor activity). Especially call out the media who either incorrectly or intentionally invent a news story to peddle or stoke an anti agenda. Between all the hunters, all the fishermen/women and all the other pro-outdoors folks pooling together....that is a strong army to go after the anti-whatever and the media.
^^^ yep. And that's why we lose elections 70-30%. We hunters (4%) are joined by SOME fishermen (17% of the population fishes and some are anti huntiing, but the majority are also hunters), that gives us at best, 20% of the voting public. And that assumes no fishermen hunt, and vice versa. Realistically we probably have 10% of the overall voting public.
We can all join together and fight like hell, but the math isn't in our favor.
And another gem from azelkhntr about how to put pressure on CPW, when he has absolutely no clue what goes on with CPW or the lobbying groups from both sides. BTW, a boycott was already tried a few years ago when NR prices were raised. NR participation increased. Yeah, that works.... And we miss you on the CO forum. You were on such an amazing roll!
Jaq....I think your numbers may be off? There is some great info in this DOI release that could be used in pro-hunting/fishing/outdoors ads and commercials.
""New 5-Year Report Shows 101.6 Million Americans Participated in Hunting, Fishing & Wildlife Activities
U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service Survey Preliminary Findings Show Importance of Increasing Access to Public Lands
WASHINGTON - The U.S. Department of the Interior announced a new report by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service that shows that 101.6 million Americans—40 percent of the U.S. population 16 years old and older—participated in wildlife-related activities in 2016, such as hunting, fishing, and wildlife-watching.
The survey illustrates gains in wildlife watching—particularly around the home—and fishing, with moderate declines in the number of hunters nationally. The findings reflect a continued interest in engaging in the outdoors. These activities are drivers behind an economic powerhouse, where participants spent $156 billion—the most in the last 25 years, adjusted for inflation.
“This report absolutely underscores the need to increase public access to public lands across the United States,” said U.S. Secretary of the Interior Ryan Zinke. “Hunting and fishing are a part of the American heritage. As a kid who grew up hunting and fishing on public lands who later took my own kids out on the same land, I know how important it is to expand access for future generations. Many folks east of the Mississippi River rely on friends with large acreages or pay high rates for hunting and fishing clubs. This makes access to wildlife refuges and other public lands more important."
On his first day in office, Secretary Zinke reversed an order that would have banned lead ammo and tackle on National Wildlife Refuge lands, and he began the process of expanding hunting and fishing opportunities on public lands across the Department.
In August, the Secretary announced a proposal to expand of hunting and fishing opportunities at 10 national wildlife refuges, and he announced the initial stages of a plan to acquire land to make the Bureau of Land Management Sabinoso Wilderness Area accessible for the first time ever to hunters, hikers, and wildlife watchers.
In addition, Secretary Zinke recently made recommendations to President Trump on 27 national monuments that call for changes to some that, while still protecting the land, would also protect and expand public access to that land for citizens who want to hunt, fish, and hike and experience the joy and beauty of these special places.
The survey, the 13th in a series conducted nearly every five years since 1955, shows that the most substantial increases in participation involve wildlife-watching—observing and photographing wildlife. The report indicates these activities surged 20 percent from 2011 to 2016, from 71.8 million to 86 million participants during that time. Expenditures by wildlife watchers also rose sharply—28 percent—between 2011 and 2016, from $59.1 billion to $75.9 billion. Around-the-home wildlife-watching increased 18 percent from 2011, from 68.6 million in 2011 to 81.1 million participants in 2016. More modest gains were made for away-from-home wildlife watchers: 5 percent increase from 2011 to 2016, from 22.5 million to 23 million participants.
More Americans also went fishing. The report indicates an 8 percent increase in angling participation since 2011, from 33.1 million anglers to 35.8 million in 2016. The greatest increases in participation—10 percent—were seen in the Great Lakes area. Total expenditures by anglers nationwide rose 2 percent from 2011 to 2016, from $45 billion to $46.1 billion.
Hunting participation dropped by about 2 million participants, but still remained strong at 11.5 million hunters. Total expenditures by hunters declined 29 percent from 2011 to 2016, from $36.3 billion to $25.6 billion. However, expenditures for related items such as taxidermy and camping equipment experienced a 27-percent uptick, and hunting trip-related expenses increased 15 percent.
Regarding the decrease in participation in hunting, Zinke said: “Hunters and anglers are at the backbone of American conservation, so the more sportsmen and women we have, the better off our wildlife will be. Some of our wildlife refuges have great mentored hunting programs. I'd like to see these programs replicated and expanded across the country, and reach into areas where kids don't traditionally get the opportunity to hunt, fish, and connect with wildlife. Some of my best family time growing up and raising my own kids was hunting an elk, enjoying a pheasant, or reeling in a rainbow. These are the memories and traditions I want to share with future generations."
“No one does more for our wildlife and or wild places than hunters. Any decline in hunting numbers, real or perceived, is of great concern since hunting provides the lion’s share of funding for nationwide conservation work thanks to excise taxes on firearms, ammunition, and archery equipment that garner more than $1.6 annually,” said David Allen, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation president and CEO. “The RMEF remains committed to growing and ensuring the future of our hunting heritage as well as elk, other wildlife and their habitat.”
This year’s survey also gathered two new categories of data: archery and target shooting. Findings show there are more than 32 million target shooters using firearms and 12.4 million people engaged in archery, not including hunting.
“Hunters and anglers form the foundation of wildlife conservation in the United States, consistently generating more funding for habitat and wildlife management than any other source,” said U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service Principal Deputy Director Greg Sheehan. “Industry, federal, and state fish and wildlife agency initiatives that focus on hunter and angler recruitment, retention and reactivation are crucial to sustaining these conservation dollars and ensuring the next generation of wildlife enthusiasts have the opportunity, access, and awareness to pursue these time-honored American traditions.”
“I praise Secretary Zinke for his support of hunting and land access. The hunting and shooting sports community is grateful for an Administration that recognizes the economic, recreational, and traditional values of hunting and target shooting," said John Frampton, President and CEO of the Council to Advance Hunting and the Shooting Sports. "Although the numbers of hunters have declined, we are optimistic they will rebound as a result of Secretary Zinke's leadership, state wildlife agencies, non-government organizations, and industries working together. Hunting in this country is not only part of our national heritage, it is an important to our country’s economy, as indicated by the expenditures in the survey.”
As a partnership effort with states and national conservation organizations, the survey has become one of the most important sources of information on fish and wildlife recreation in the United States. Federal, state, and private organizations use this detailed information to manage wildlife, market products, and look for trends. Conducted by the U.S. Bureau of the Census, the survey is based on a 22,416-household sample surveyed through computer-assisted telephone and in-person interviews.
For more information about the survey and to view the preliminary report, please visit https://wsfrprograms.fws.gov/Subpages/NationalSurvey/National_Survey.htm""
I don't care if you have to put your animal in a vehicle to get it home. Hell, I turned around last week in Arkansas to go back and congratulate a guy who had a nice buck in the back of his truck. He was stopping by his friends house, not at a bar, and there was no beer can in it's mouth. I don't care if you stop to get some lunch. ALL I am saying is stopping at a bar and putting a beer can in it's mouth does not give hunters a good image. As Jaq has stated a number of times already, it's about the voters, and they outnumber us. Some of you can't grasp that simple concept. Cali people leaving by hoards to places like Wyoming. Guess what, they vote. And if you don't see a difference between putting a stick in the chest to spread the body cavity open, and putting a beer can in it's mouth at the bar. Well, I can't help you. One more time, this does not look good to the home team.
Colorado lost spring bear hunting, baiting, and using dogs to bear hunt. The vote was 70% in favor of the ban. I wouldn't call 70/30 a wash. The ban on mountain lion hunting will be a bigger slaughter.
Colorado Initiative 10 (1992) Result Votes Percentage Approved Yes 1,054,032 69.70% No 458,260 30.30%
This ended spring bear hunting, baiting, and hunting bears with hounds.
JL, note "wildlife activities" is the key. The numbers I was using are adults of voting age who fish, out of the 35 million who fished one time. But you can't add 1+1 because the majority of hunters also fished one day per year. We also can't count on wllildlife watchers who neither fish or hunt to be on our side, because those are primarily the "nonhunting voters" we keep talking about, who are easily swayed by emotional media ads.
Colorado Parks and Wildlife did a major multi-year TV campaign called "Hug a Hunter", which detailed all the contributions hunters make to wildlife conservation. Polls continue to show that the majority of voters support "hunting", especially for food, but are strongly against what they perceive as "trophy hunting", which includes bears and cats. We shall see when this comes to another vote here in 2022, because voters already told us what they think of bear hunting, loud and clear.
Azelhuntr, from your posts on the CO forum, you must do a hell of a lot of walking.
If it's a voter thing....then as I see it, if a person has a history of not liking hunting or fishing....then a one off photo isn't going to change their mind. You can say...well, they can use that pic of a dead cat, deer, fish or whatever to stoke the flames and sway the fence-sitters to vote their way. They can come to any hunting and fishing site and lift the hero pics we post to use for their agenda. Are we now going to ban posting our hero pics on Bowsite because some anti group might use it in their anti ad? When do ya stop cowering to the anti agenda creep?
We need to be less offensive to non hunters so that our sport and way of life can continue with the next generation who shows very little interest in our sport and way of life.
It may be difficult to convert a voter who already has their mind set, but do not forget that every day more potential voters are born. Their mind is neutral on hunting, until they learn otherwise.
To the point above the anti-hunters in the pro hunters are probably always going to be about a wash and a small minority they represent are the tails of the curve
that’s the problem the bulge in the middle or people who don’t have any skin in the game aren’t overly emotional about it and may just check a boxBased on some stupid little irrelevant Datapoint
Maybe they are swayed such as being offended by a hunter or maybe by appreciating that a hunter help them change a flat tire
the point is that group doesn’t need much of a reason to side with us or against us so it makes it even more important that we don’t let some stupid little action sway them the wrong direction
this will never be a fact based agenda or fight and hunters will never come close to matching the number of non-hunters so please be considerate of the middle population
In the end it’s the silent ones that will determine our fate not the ones marching with signs and pictures of dead animals on their placards
JL, I agree with you. We're on the same page. The huge majority of voters are "fence sitters", who either don't care one way or the other, or approve of some kinds of hunting. Every poll shows this.
There is plenty of material out there for the antis to use. That's exactly what Mike Markarian EVP/COO of HSUS told me when I interviewed him for an article. But we also talked about "hero pics" vs. the distasteful pics and videos that the antis believe will turn the stomachs of voters, which we provide for them at no cost. Plenty of that out there too, and that's what we saw in the ads in the two CO elections where we got destroyed. The future of hunting is entirely in the hands of the ambivalent "fence sitters".
BTW, he also told me that when they get around to putting bowhunting on the ballot in CA or OR as test states, the amount of gory material they have to use in the ads is mind-blowing (he didn't know I was a hunter) and all provided free of charge. He was laughing when he said "hunters do this to themselves".
Jaq.....knowing these animal extremist groups like HSUS are locked and loaded.....wouldn't it make sense for the hunting/fishing advocates and like organizations to go on the offense? The first thing that I could see as an offensive strike is to find out what states do not have a state constitutional amendment that guarantees the right to hunting and fishing. Believe it or not...there are states that don't have that. To me....that's a good place to start. Get the law on our side. This is a 2017 map and article so it might be dated some. It does give an idea of what things are looking like. This is another issue the national organizations (RMEF, DU, NRA, etc) should be doing for their members.
"Posted by John McAdams
May 30, 2017 Share On Facebook This simple map shows which states have a Constitutional Right to Hunt and Fish as of the 2016 election. Map Key:
RED = Constitutional Right to Hunt and Fish BLUE = Constitutional Right to Fish YELLOW = Legislation on Constitutional Right to Hunt and Fish is pending
Voters in Kansas and Indiana both approved amendments guaranteeing sportsmen and women a constitutional right to hunt and fish this year. This brings the number of states with such language in their constitutions up to 22.
At this time, Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, Georgia, Idaho, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, Minnesota, Montana, Nebraska, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas, Vermont, Virginia, Wisconsin and Wyoming all also have a right to hunt and fish guaranteed in the state constitution.
The state constitutions in California and Rhode Island both guarantee a right to fish, but not to hunt.
Illinois, Michigan, New Jersey, and New York all have pending legislation which would enshrine a constitutional right to hunt and fish in those states. Nevada also passed legislation to amend the state constitution with similar language in 2015, it must first be approved by the state legislature in 2017 and by the voters in 2018 before it goes into effect.
Language guaranteeing citizens a constitutional right to hunt and fish is an important measure protecting our national heritage from assault by anti-hunting organizations. If your state does not have a constitutional right to hunt and fish, I strongly urge you to contact your elected representatives and tell them to support such a measure."
If I remember the CO "vote" on bears..... a sizable number of HUNTERS, (or so called...) were publicly for the ban. Including a good number of Fashionable Fisherpersons following the lead of their fearless (or somethingless) leader. And another yuge number sat on their azzes at home. No energy for it. Apathayyy. Political correctness. Biden voters. =D
WY OTOH is in the middle of excommunicating a turncoat senator. Best of luck running for governor with your anti-hunting gun banning husband. And if anyone found out you voted for any kind of ban on hunting pretty much anything, it might earn you a trip to the train station with a wolf tied around your neck.....
I understand the "outnumbered" situation, believe me. But when the politicians lose their, um, respect for their constituents and no longer have any.... respect.... for them, that's when things go bad fast. Those who could pound on doors and make some noise simply did not. Was a time when quiet polite manners were effective, status quo, this is how we've always done it establishment. Now that just means you can be overlooked without penalty or payment for doing so. Hell, many just quit and walk away rather than voice their anger. It's just another "oh well..." moment for them.
Right to hunt and fish doesn't guarantee the right to hunt and fish for everything with every method. It's really just a symbolic, feel good gesture. Bowhunting could be banned, for instance, but the right to hunt with a gun would still satisfy the "right".
What is more important is for referendum states to remove all hunting and fishing related issues from voters, and instead kept in the DNR/CPW for biologists and policy makers to decide (bad as that may be). Some Republicans in CO have tried to do that but the Dem majorities keep shooting it down.
"Right to hunt and fish doesn't guarantee the right to hunt and fish for everything with every method. It's really just a symbolic, feel good gesture."
"What is more important is for referendum states to remove all hunting and fishing related issues from voters, and instead kept in the DNR/CPW for biologists and policy makers to decide (bad as that may be). Some Republicans in CO have tried to do that but the Dem majorities keep shooting it down."
That is a double-edged sword idea. Yes, some policy/rule making should belong with the DNR's. Michigan passed that a few years ago making the DNR the fish and game policy making authority. However, when the DNR/F&G becomes the sole source for making policy, the recourse is difficult for anyone who does not like the policy implemented and wants to get it changed. What happens is special interest groups with personal agendas infiltrate or lobby the DNR/F&G to implement the policy that benefits the special interest group at the expense or peril of others. I seen this happen in Michigan. We have a Natural Resource Commission made up of civilian individuals appt'd by the Gov. They serve by terms. They make non-binding policy recommendations to the DNR. The DNR usually signs off on the NRC recommendation. The NRC does the dirty work for the DNR and seems to be political in nature. They get lobbied heavily by special interest groups pushing agendas. Some of these agendas are social agendas and not biological ones. I have underlying suspicions if the agenda being pushed benefits the NRC member, it might influence their vote.
Point being in all of the above.....be careful what you ask for. If all policy making is delegated to your DNR/F&G/CPW......that can be good to protect outdoor activities, but IMO there has to be a check and balance in there somewhere.
Agree on checks and balances. But in some states, the other side is a citizen initiative to change the constitution, which is not difficult with big Coast money funding it and hiring signature gatherers.
We talk about a requiring a supermajority for referendums, or constitutional amendments at the least. Hasn't happened. Even so we still would have lost bear hunting and trapping.
About my post... guy is probably a rancher, the rodeo sticker on back window makes me think so. Some local has a little fun at his favorite watering hole and has his fifteen minutes of fame with his buddies... long comes somebody taking pics of something that is none of his business and hence we have an issue with ethics, where God knows on Bowsite everybody has a strong opinion. Never would have known the poor choice in beer the cat had if someone just minded their own business. Lou, if Karen chews tabacker count me in! scentman
"Need to stop gun hunting before they get around to bows. "
I disagree - there are less bow hunters, more fragmentation in our ranks, and the bunny-huggers especially hate that animals 'die slowly blahblahblah.' Even some gun-only hunters dislike bow hunting. We are the *-easiest-* targets.
I have to say I envy those of you who live in non-referendum states. One less worry. 'Pure democracy' at its damnedest.
As an example, if there is no longer a cougar season in a state, you have NO constitutional right to hunt for cougar. As Jaq stated, the right to hunt and fish was a feel good move, but has gums, not teeth. I suggest we work hard at getting the non hunting voters, and the voters to be, to view hunting in a somewhat favorable light. Like it or not, hunters are told when they can hunt, and what they can hunt. There is no right to do as we please.
“This pic would not have been an issue if you had not made it one.” Exactly.
KSflatlander, obviously our opinion of what constitutes stupid stuff differs greatly. I’d argue that the one looking for attention was the one that posted the photo in the first place.
KS, yes I am open to both sides of the debate... some things go without saying. I am not going to be the guy that walks in that joint and berates the hunter... see where I am coming from? That cowboy's don't give two hoots what you or anybody says about that cat, and that is not going to change to soon... everybody does not see things the same way you might... this is one rabbit hole that just keeps on getting dug. Scentman
This post has elicited 170 comments prior to mine, on a website that has traffic from thousands of visitors daily, and is available to anyone in the world with the internet. I'd say that this thread is a far bigger problem than the fact that a hunter in small town WYOMING had a critter in the truck bed at the local watering hole.
In fact, these situations are still normal in rural America. Lots of places have contests and rewards for stopping in with their harvest, and it isn't uncommon for folks to drive down the highways with their harvest proudly displayed, and guess what, people in those parts of the world don't look at this as abnormal or detestable because its part of their lives and they understand that eating meat inherently means death, blood, etc.
With the first post and the title of this thread, I figured we'd surely see a poacher, wanton waste, etc., but alas, it is just a harvested cat in the back of a truck. We need to get a grip as a "group" and stop acting like a dead animal is going to be the cause of our ruin, because that is how the anti's want us to live - scared of the result of our hunt.
“This post has elicited 170 comments prior to mine, on a website that has traffic from thousands of visitors daily, and is available to anyone in the world with the internet. I'd say that this thread is a far bigger problem than the fact that a hunter in small town WYOMING had a critter in the truck bed at the local watering hole.“
Sure if your into treating symptoms and not root causes.
I have that sticker on the back window of my truck, even though I was raised to hate UW with every fiber of my being. But since I spend so much time in WY with "greenie" plates, I figure its cheap insurance.
Corax, ugh my face is red right now... the closest I pay attention to college football is UB Bulls, that's in Buffalo NY! lol He still could be a rancher, prolly a skoal sticker on that rig somewhere.
Wyoming population is low, it wouldn't take a billion-person influx to change the politics. That's TWO Senate seats.
Wyoming population - 578,759 (2019) For comparison, 6 *counties* in Massachusetts have that many or more. The top 15 counties in California have more. As do the largest 9 counties in New York, 6 largest in NJ etc. etc.
The link PECO posted does nothing to support his contention that Californians are coming to Wyoming in "hoards". It's nothing more than a generic travel guide. I'm pretty confident California has one for every other state, as do most states. Keep in mind that just because someone moves here doesn't mean we're being overtaken by antis. Granted it's a small sample size, but the people I know that have moved here from California have one thing in common...they hunt. A good friend works at the local Sportsman's Warehouse and he's had numerous new transplants, not just from California, come in looking to purchase firearms and bows. According to a recent report, Wyoming had the third lowest population growth (0.23%) over the last decade. People come and go. My best friend, who lived here for decades, married his old high school sweetheart after they reconnected. She moved here, and after one winter and spring, she had had enough of the cold and wind. That is not an isolated incident. I saw the same thing happen over and over with people I was stationed with here. When they either retired, or their enlistment was up, they had full intentions of making Wyoming their home, and they would have except for one minor detail. Their significant other said "not only no, but hell no"! As wytex points out, there are reasons Wyoming's population has remained small.
All that said, Wyomingite's aren't going to change our lifestyle, or who we are. We're not going to rub people's faces in it, but we damn sure aren't going to hide who or what we are, and act like we're ashamed of it, just so we don't hurt someone's feelings. If we did, we'd still be having wolves shoved down our throats, and rodeos would be a thing of the past.
For what it is worth … I find American beer very offensive. I know this might offend some, but here’s a pic of a bowkilled booner. Taking out this old Tom opened up a good hunting area for one of the younger cats that was getting in trouble around town. AND, the kitty meat was the first to disappear at our wildlife dinner. I’m somewhere in the middle on this one. Don’t think we need to hide what we do, but I’m not a fan of childish happy dances.
For what it is worth … I find American beer very offensive. I know this might offend some, but here’s a pic of a bowkilled booner. Taking out this old Tom opened up a good hunting area for one of the younger cats that was getting in trouble around town. AND, the kitty meat was the first to disappear at our wildlife dinner. I’m somewhere in the middle on this one. Don’t think we need to hide what we do, but I’m not a fan of childish happy dances.
Is there a season on anti-hunters in your state? if the answer is yes, do you have a draw system and over the counter tags available? what are the bag limits in your area? Can you send me in the right direction without giving up your honey hole location? I was wondering what would be the best tactic? Trails, rubs, scrape lines, watering holes :)
"You can tell a man by the truck he drives" We all fall under some genre of that statement... whether the shoe fits or not, I believe that humor needs to be taken in context... nothing personal, just humor. scentman
