Discuss Live Kansas Deer Hunt
Whitetail Deer
Good luck Pat, I leave for KS on Sunday morning. I think our timing is going to be spot on for the heat of the rut.
I`m glad to see your hunting a week later this year..suppose to cool off a little next week after 78 degree weather is sat and sunday..little guys are all I`m seeing right now..looking forward to watching your hunt as usual...good luck...No flying around this year...lol...."Debate free" C`mon Pat when was the last time one of your Kansas hunts was debate free...lol
Best of luck to you Pat. Kill a biggun.
If you have trouble finding one, give ole Travis a call. He's pretty dang good at flushing the big ones out. Kinda like a shorthair on a bobwhite. :^)
What kind of danger will you bring to yourself on this hunt.lol Good luck Pat. Mike
Snakes ought to be in bed already...
BS on the snakes, I hunt eastern colorado and they are still out, just saw a rattler crossing the road today on my way out!!! MAN I HATE SNAKES!!
I read where a toilet plunger works great as a grunt call.
Pat, I will be hitting the woods here in Kansas at the same time. Good luck. I think it will be good timing.
I'm presuming you've overnighted your bow and your boots to make sure they get there?
I don't think that hunt is going to be on the next DVD... LOL.
I know for Pat it was upsetting but if that was me I would have been about irate since it would have been a trip that I would have had to save up for sometime to go on. In addition, I know I would not be going on another one for sometime to come.
I bet you can guess where I would be shoving that plunger once the trip was over!!!
good luck. hey if you get one can we use the video on that broadhead ad and replace last year's kill?
Good luck and have fun.I was thinking about your Elk hunt today as some illegal ATV riders chased some Deer from me here in PA.
Well the winds laid down last night so hopefully you guys will have a good hunt this morning. I almost took the day off work myself to hunt today cause tomorrow is 30 to 40 MPH again...Hoping for a good report this eve...Kick ol Tater for me...good luck guys
If you truly want to kill a big buck then hunt stand #9!
Stand 2 and 5 please ;0) ......Jeff
Good luck Pat. Sure would love to see some photos of the 140" 8 point that was passed up. 140" is a dandy 8 point.
This is a legitamate question and not in any way meant to be antagonistic, but it seems that hunting with an outfitter greatly increases ones odds at harvesting a mature buck, is this true? I myself and some pretty saavy bowhunters here that are friends of mine don't have your kind of success. Sure we have killed a few nice ones over 20 + yrs of hunting but nothing like I see from your live hunts or other videos. I'm just trying to figure out if your successful that often, or if it's that easy? I'm afraid to the average Joe in Mass., Ohio,Arkansas, Texas, Mississippi, or ? that coming to Kansas almost assures one a shot at a monster buck, Thank you and Good luck.
"This is a legitamate question and not in any way meant to be antagonistic, but it seems that hunting with an outfitter greatly increases ones odds at harvesting a mature buck, is this true?"
It is not true if there are no mature bucks where you are hunting.
In addition, I think in the case of a whitetail deer hunt, the outfitter effects the outcome only a very small amount in terms of actually taking a deer. Obviously stand placement is a big part and you are paying for the outfitter to scout and locate good areas however, the actually kill is really in the hands of the bowhunter imo. And as mentioned, if the area doesn't hold good deer it doesn't much matter.
Full draw i agree with you 140" 8pt is dam nice...don't think I could pass one like that no matter where I was hunting.
Kurve you are right, the outfitter doesn't make the shot for you, and also if the area doesn't hold mature deer it doesn't matter. However going with an outfitter will "likely" increase your odds of seeing mature deer. You are essentially paying for the access to hunt a refuge. I think that what catkinson is getting at is that people are coming to states like Kansas with the expectation of seeing big deer behind every tree, and then going home disappointed. Where does this false impression come from?
skinny Indian~ I think you said it better than I.
Big difference between 15 hunters 1000 acres and 10 hunters for 5 days each on 5-6000 acres.
Pressure is the number one issue behind killing big deer.
First off, I'm offering my personal opinion to answer catkinson's questions, not bad mouthing outfitters, Pat, nor legal baiting.
Lower pressure on the properties Outfitters provide with their services improves deer sightings and opportunity. They control what is taken off the land and encourage trophy quality development.
Horn restrictions and game management on the managed properties play a big role in what hunters see.
And last but not least, baiting stations that concentrate and condition the deer around pre-set stands. This IMO is what makes hunters think they will find this caliber of deer all over Kansas like this hunt and other commercial operations advertise.
Pat, I hope you get a shot at the thick necked beast from last year, he was a hog!
"This is a legitamate question and not in any way meant to be antagonistic, but it seems that hunting with an outfitter greatly increases ones odds at harvesting a mature buck, is this true?"
Depends on what type of buck you are talking about. If you mean a 140 to 160 yeah sure, because that takes into account your 3 to 4 year old deer. The clients of the outfitters around me put down a lot of deer in that range, but if you are talking about putting down some 180's then no. You need to realize that these outfitters are running a business not a deer farm, they don't care if you take a 150, or a 200 inch deer, you paid and their happy. They have a lot of clients that come to hunt on a limited amount of ground. If they have 10 mature deer on their property they are going to sell 12 hunts, remember they are in it for the money.
People need to realize that there are not 180's living in every section of ground in KS. They are just in the areas that have very little pressure, this would include the privately own ground or leased ground that has been managed a lot more strictly than what the outfitters do. IMO if you pay for an outfitter, you are paying to have a good chance to kill a deer between 140 and 160.
I would like to see a "Live Kansas Hunt" done on public lands; what do you think? Something like this: This photo' is of a few guys quail huntin' and yellin' @ their bird dog..Here's some good video of a guy doin' a little fall turkey huntin'..Here's my nice fat Kansas forky, I'm guessing a solid "85 incher"..This nice buck was scared by my stand by a kid plinking on the river with his 22.Can't say enough about the friendly folks working @ the local Stop-n-Shop where I got a beverage after my hunt; those clerks there don't consider me simply a client, but a friend.. Good luck on your hunt..
Would using an outfitter and guide increase your odds over say, going into a place totally blind, unscouted, set your own stands, etc. for a 5-7 day hunt? I would certainly hope so. A DIY in those circumstances would be pretty tough.
Everybody here in Southern Minnesota has the Idea you drive down jump out of the truck crawl up a tree and shoot a 140 class buck. Is it that easy down there? Is there that much less pressure. They are going monday so I guess we will fiind out.
Compared to other eastern/northern states we do have less preassure but it is getting worse. No, you won't just jump out of your truck, climb a tree and shoot a 140, but a few lucky people this does happen to. You still have to put your time in out here. One thing that does help us here in kansas is that we have great genetics.
So I wonder what the success rate is for Kansas? Pope and young min bucks are the norm?
I would say thats not too far off. You gotta realize that a lot of the dumber 2.5 year old bucks that get shot here make pope and young due the good genetics that they carry.
hmm. getting kinda late tonite with no update... you guys thinking what I'm thinking/ (besides Pat was due for a snake attack?)
catkinson- read every detail of Pat's live hunts and you'll see the reason he kills big bucks. Unlike the average hunter, he passes up many deer that most folks would be thrilled to shoot. My husband is the same way- if a deer doesn't meet his standard (which is 150 class buck or better) he lets them walk. Most hunters just don't have that kind of discipline. I know I sure don't! Even if you're hunting with an outfitter on land that is being managed for trophy bucks, you still have to let a lot of good animals walk before dropping the string on that real heart throbber!
-Cheryl, wife of obsessive trophy buck hunter
Gross 164, Net 158 Great Buck
That's exactly true Cheryl. The average Kansas hunter will see maybe 2-3 really good bucks all year if he or she hunts really hard. This is "see" not "have in range". The average hunter here just isn't willing to wait if a decent 8 walks by.
160
Surprised the boots didn't come off and a two hour stalk commenced !
I'd say he's a 140 class scored as an eight point. He has good mass and tall tines, but not real wide. His ears are pinned back so it looks like his rack is beyond his ears, but I think if his ears were forward they'd extend to the outside of his antlers. I wouldn't pass him up though, that's for sure!
-Cheryl
140 would be a high guess, typical 8 point and his left brow tine is broke off as well. Ain't no thousand dollar deer.
Better hold on tight today--30 to 40 MPH winds...I would guess that 8 pointer would be close to 140..why did tater shoot him..tater leave them small bucks alone. he he
Thinking he would gross in the high 140's.
I'm guessing right at 140. Nice length, but a bit thin on mass. There's a bigger one out there for ya, Pat. Good luck!!
iowaPete
Gross low 150's, net high 140's.....Jeff
140 or so
As for Kansas..... Good luck. If you do not have access to private lands then you will have a very hard time. A very, very hard time.
i don't know what he scored but if i was dropping 4K to hunt kansas in mid november i'd be sitting all day EVERY DAY.
Bou,no doubt...shot a bruiser this year at 2:15
Only 3k if he doesn't tag out. Call me frugal if you like but not too sure I would be in that big of a hurry to get one.
144 7/8 net. I'm waiting for a 160 in Kansas for 4k and sitting all day everyday as well
I agree on the all day sit strategy. I hunted 9 days in Iowa last November, sitting all day, every day. Passed 10 bucks between 125-140 at 20 yards or less and 8 of them were between 10 am and 2 pm.
This time of year its really hard to justify taking off for 1/3 of your available daylight to get back/forth to camp for lunch or a rest. I used a full body harness and cinched it real tight to the tree whenever I started to doze off, that way I could catch a quick nap with no worries of waking up dead, hanging from a safety belt. I also had a one thermy full of coffee and one wide mouth job filled with hot soup.
Like 'Bou said, especially when its 4 grand for a 5 day hunt, I'm hanging all day.
Heck 4 G is cheap when you factor in our investment in travel,leases,food plot,landowner relations etc.
A busy whitetail guy can easily spend an annual sheep hunt on getting things the way he wants.
You two guys that guessed in the 180's weren't really serious were you?
Pat's gonna have problems with the wind...I heard 40+ MPH winds were out there today.....Jeff
We've been getting 40+ mph here in Oklahoma all day. Like Jeff said, it probably isn't a great day to sit in a treestand. Look like the winds will die down and it will be a little cooler tomorrow.
My guess is that Pat whacks a nice one sometime tomorrow.
im to used to our tiny coues deer here, have absolutely no field experience with easterns...just looks really big but look at what im lookin at.. either way nice buck, and yes i was way way off by lookin at yalls guesses that actually hunt them deer over there.
i often hunt all day, and by all day i mean i am in a tree from 30 minutes before sunrise and my feet don't touch the ground until it's stone dark. i don't bring any food and water in with me either on any of those days. don't want to pee....i am a bottler! (save the advice on that one) Nothing against Pat but i just don't get what the big deal is about going 12 hours witout food or water. I can sleep that long easily with drinking, eating, crapping, or peeing. the only thing that gets me out of a stand from an all day sit is sheer boredom! Which occurs often on pressured public land when you have not seen a deer in a few days. If i have a fawn hanging out by me i would sit there infatuated at the experience and probably not blink!
Don't you love text messaging on cell phones now? Great invention for bowhunters but terrible for teenagers.
That's the problem with late rut hunting here in Kansas if your trophy hunting, usually all but the big guys have broken racks. I've seen them bucks with nothing but brow tines and stubs left.
Hahaha Goerge Costanza Day hahaHAHAHA
Either good news or bad news.
if he does not get one now it will be back in december to fill out.
He is trying to match Magnus announcing the new broadhead. He is doing a good job. I actually got on line to see his buck before heading out into the woods this morning.
Me thinks on previous live hunts when there is no update for a day, something has happened.
Hmmmmmm...all is quiet on the western front.......Jeff
Hit one at last light, and waited till this morning to track??????
He ran into a Black Mamba :0( .....Jeff
He's messing with us. Mike
Anticipating that he hit one I would have to say they may be blood trailing..bloodtrail in that prairie grass at night is next to impossible..maybe he shot one then just backed out till this morning....
Maybe the rattlesnake he was playing with in CO during his elk hunt found him!
Why on the hunt page does it say 11/11-11/17 but the dates you can click on end on the 15th?
Might just be that he is on the last leg of the hunt and would like to enjoy himself for a change. Not every one in Kansas gets a monster buck every year no matter what you pay.
Ron, I thought there was one behind every tree in Kansas, just like Iowa. ;)
There are but IA. has trees, Kansas don't.
OK Pat!!! We need an update.... I can't handle the suspense!
Hope things ended well.
Northwoods
I sense a new bloodtrail challange game in the making...
Well we certainly hope he is on the trail of a big deer in Kansas and not on the trail of his Samsonite after getting home.....
I'm sure he is begging for another day to hunt since the weather has been so bad. I can't say that I blame him.
Way to go guys! That will be a day to remember for a long time.
Sharpstick
Well well well....it was worth the wait..CONGRATS !!! Those are some nice critters. It's about time to break the jinx this year....Jeff
Three super bucks and a great hunt. Congrats to all you guys!!!!
3 bucks 3 arrows one day. Awesome!!
A little cooperation from the weather goes a long way. Congrats to all.
Pat,
You may not have any elk luck but, you never fail to get into some nice bucks in KS. Wow! 3 great bucks. Great job guys.
"Thursday night was party night" No wonder it took so long to get Thursdays hunt update!!
Great hunt. Congratulations on three super deer.
Awsome Hunts Congrats to all 3, on some super bucks
Now we know why Pat was late. Hangover! Congratulations to all 3 of ya. Mike
Wow, that must have been SOME party! No wonder it took so long for the update! :)
Wow, that must have been SOME party! No wonder it took so long for the update! :) COngrats Gentlemen!
Congrats Pat. I seems like you guys do not use grunt calls or rattle any. Is that the case and if so why is that. Thanks for bringing us the live hunts, I truely enjoy them!
Wow...wow...wow!!!
Almost as much fun as my buddy and I each getting a moose in the same week.
would have been more fun if one of those 3 deer had my arrow in them!!
Awesome! And to get it on video, double awesome! Congrats to all 3 of you guys.
Awesome. Nice job guys. That was great footage of a great day hunting.
When it rains it pours!!!!! Great job, great execution.
When it rains it pours!!!!! Great job, great execution.
Great job Pat and others. That's pretty sweet how things can change in a blink of an eye. That's why we all climb the stand even in the worst of times, not knowing when those season changing events might take place. Pat, I also wanted to ask, and I may be viewing the buck you took at the wrong angle or something but he appears to be a mainframed 6x6. Not that it is that big of a deal or anything but is there something that eliminates that from what you can see?
Well they say a picture is worth a thousand words ! That's three thousand words in one day ! Not much left to say except , A job extremely well done ! bearman,
What did they gross. I would guess 190s, 170s, and 160s. We don't see deer like that in Louisiana, what do you all think?????
Wow.
Who won the treestand challenge???
Northwoods
Awesome Pat and Gang. Great Video!! Congrat's!!
AWESOME Bucks! Congrats to All! Party On!
Congratulations guys!!!! What an awesome day!
Congrats to Pat & the others! 3 great bucks! Pat's buying the next round, and the next and the......
>>>>>------------->
Congratulations to all three of you on a job well done. That is one awesome buck you have there, Pat. Trkytrack
Congrats!!!
This is killing me....
Wow, great shooting both with the bow and the camera.
Pat
Another interesting hunt for us to go along on with you.Congrats on those three bucks-every one of them is super!Have you ever thought of displaying those mounts of yours at the UBC banquet?
138 on the guess the score buck.
ruger, most of us in Kansas don't see deer like that either!
well who's the winner????
it takes alot for me to be impressed and wow....I am impressed! Congratulations...what a day! What part of Kansas are you hunting?
Congratulations Pat on a great buck. Tough hunting this week in KS, very warm in the evenings. We went 4-4 on deer and shot my best to date.
XMan
Is it time for Beyond Adrenaline II yet?
Pat what did your buck score if you don't mind sharing?
Then get back out there please. I want to see the Caribou hunt.
Thanks for taking us with you Pat. I appreciate and enjoyed the trip very much. Great camera work as well as hunting skills. Congratulations to all. J
I would put him at 141 net.
Todd
Congrats guys--glad ya all closed the deal---with no controversy either. he he he..I missed my pig sunday morning..big 11 pointer...watched him for 20 minutes sunday night at 60 yards...this cold front will get them moving on the horns I hope...
Were the winners of the treestand challenge posted? I couldn't find them anywhere.
Pat, you REALLY like to keep us in suspense, don't ya?! :)
I think I'm one of the 3%, but I probably din;t resond quick enough. Still curious, though!
The suspense is killing me
I got the stands right, but I think I got morning/evening wrong. I'm keepin' my fingers crossed though! When will they spill the beans?
One item I have not seen mentioned here is the cost of the hunt. I wonder who here would pay $4,000 for a whitetail hunt? I am not being critical of this hunt but simply posing this question. I myself would be no. Maybe for an elk hunt.
I would say the owner of one of the most popular bow sites might want to. I don't think many really want to read about some one going out every night and coming back telling us about all the East Coast dinks he saw. Heck it might even be a tax write off. Great story and great deers.
Brown E - I would someday pay $4,000 for a trophy whitetail hunt with an opportunity like this. I'd never pay that much for an elk hunt though. Can't get this kind of opportunity on a big whitetail in many places. I can elk hunt backcountry with a good chance at a nice bull it seems like.
Different strokes for different folks I guess.
Northwoods
With the new regs going into effect next year, ya'll won't be comin' to KS much longer, better start looking for the next great hotspot. We'll be Oklahoma by 2010. :-(
This Hunt went as I would have expected. I have to ask, and I am not trying to ruffle any feathers, I really want to know. Was this hunt really worth $4000, well that plus license and travel fees? You see I have never made over $35,000 a year and an approximate 1/7 of my yearly gross income seems a bit much. How would a man justify it to his wife? Especially when she says, "You can hunt whitetails right here!" The years immediately following my open heart surgery this would have been a full 50% of my yearly income as I was restricted for working full time.I am sure there are plenty of bowhunters that have to scrape together the money just to buy the bare essentials of our sport. It would appear that hunting (at least for trophy bucks) is indeed becoming the rich. Those rich in money to pay others to find the big bucks, or those rich in time to find them where they are in their own "backyard." I truly do not mean this to be a debate. I'm asking a thorough question that I sincerely want to know the answer to. I'm not trying to stir the pot of class envy or anything like that. I know Pat probably filmed this and had sponsors pay for it or at least can defray the cost as a production expense of a video. I also understand Pat does this to promote our sport and for us to live vicariously through him. That still doesn't answer my questions and I'm curious and probably not the only one.
Congrats on a great hunt in a super area!
And it was fun following it.
Three questions: What was the criteria for determining "the best stands?"
Was it where the bucks were killed, where you had "the most action," or where the most bucks were seen?
My own two cents is that those two stands, within a long bow shot of each other seem like in the same place (from a map perspective.)
The other is: If you have a moment, what were the determining factors for choosing the stands, on the ground during that hunt?
Were there other stands close (in ranking, not physically) to 2 and 5?
C2, I think your questions, as valid as they may be, should not be in this post. I may not have the money to buy a HUMMER, but why should I critique someone who does?
Just because you or I don't have the money to spend on a hunt like this, shouldn't detract from those who do. An outfitted hunt is not a guarantee and clearly Pat put in his time on stand and most of all, had to make the shot count.
I don't think it's fair nor polite to comment like you did on this post...especially considering it's designated as DEBATE FREE.
Congratulations Pat and others. I thoroughly enjoyed reading about your hunt.
There is no critism implied in my questions.There is a point of view; but we all bring that along everytime we post. I'm trying to understand something.
"There is a point of view; but we all bring that along everytime we post"
Your absolutely right. And with that said, here's mine...
1) Any time you have to preface a comment with "I am not trying to ruffle any feathers", you should stop and ask yourself if you ARE actually ruffling feathers. Just because you don't intend to, doesn't mean you didn't do it.
2) You actually went beyond asking a question when you made statements like: "It would appear that hunting (at least for trophy bucks) is indeed becoming the rich. Those rich in money to pay others to find the big bucks, or those rich in time to find them where they are in their own "backyard." "
Like I said, I cannot (and likely will not ever) afford a hunt like that, but I'm all about listening to and learning from those who can.
Your question was - "Was this hunt really worth $4000, well that plus license and travel fees?"
Given the fact that Pat has done this hunt for several years now and came back excited about this year's experience, I would guess that you can pretty safely answer your own question.
I'll shut up now :)
goosie, when you consider the other motives behind Pat doing it, video production, DVD sales, Sponsor promotion, etc. that can explain going back year after year. Everyone knows taking trophy bucks on video sells DVDs. Why did you feel you have to argue with me when the thread is listed as debate free? I asked questions. In this politically correct, defensive world we now occupy asking a question is considered a criticism when it is only a question. I wasn't asking for an arguement just the answers to the questions I had.
"Why did you feel you have to argue with me when the thread is listed as debate free?"
Only because I get sick of hearing all the negative talk on these boards. The baited vs nonbaited, guided vs non-guided, traditional vs wheelie bows, x-bow vs vertical bows, etc etc. I guess I just think that there should be more support and less negativity and I'll admit it if I'm wrong but I perceived your reply as an attempt to get a negative opinion across in a polite way.
C2, This is a business for Pat. A business that we get to view and it don't cost us as viewers a penny. No want wants to watch a 2nd rate hunt and I'm guessing that the money he pays for this is so you and me can enjoy it. He has been going to Cimmeron for many years now and each time he comes back with a great buck and great story for us viewers. This area he hunts is not fenced but does have great deer. If they were charge let's say $500 a hunt they wouldn't have these bucks because every one and their brother would be hunting them down there.
The resident bow hunters in Kansas are taking good deer,jump over to the Kansas site and you can see. For us residents it just takes a little longer and we have all year to locate them and this is not a luxury that most NR can afford. I assure you hunting Kansas is no gimy. The area he hunts is wide open and trees are few and far between and getting one under your stand is not that easy. My hat is off to these guys.
The value of the hunt is all relative to the value that each individual places on the experience. It will be diff. for everyone.
c2
your post is irrelevant. what the heck difference does the cost of pat's hunt relative to YOUR income make?
some guys hunt polar bear for $30,000 and that would be 80% of your salary, or elephant at 170% of your salary. should they not do it because you can't afford it?
OK the point is missed completely. I give up.
Nothimg comes free in this day and time. Money makes the world go around. You must work hard for the things you want. I don't think Pat had a silver spoon in his mouth when he left his parents home. Mike
If I had an extra 4000 dollars to spend on a hunt, espescially a hunt these guys just went on, SEEYA !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ps( am saving right now). looked like a great expierience.
Its funny how some people will criticize others on how they are spending their money. I always roll my eyes when guys complain about not getting on some private land that is posted when they drive a new $40,000 pick up every other year, or when someone criticizes a person spending their savings on a hunt of a lifetime who just got back from a vacation in the Bahama's, etc. People spend their money in different ways, make their money in different ways, and have different values. While it is somewhat sad that hunting is getting so expensive, I know my family spends at least $4,000 a year on our hunting property and cabin.... some people just chose to spend that on a one week hunt.
Some day I'd love to go on a hunt like this. I guess I'll just have to work hard and make the choice to save the money to do it.
Northwoods
I wasn't criticizing I was asking questions. How do you justify this to the wife and such. Like I asked before, why is it questions are considered criticism?
I don't have to justify it to my wife. See has no problem that I go. She actually just talked me into going on a cougar hunt in January as long as I take my 12yr old son with me.
C2,
The only way you can justify a hunt like this is if your medical illness would prevent any future hunts and you wanted to get the big one before you met the master hunter in the sky :)
or
You worked an extra job to make a few extra bucks and saved up for a few years and explicitely told your wife that you are doing this for your dream hunt.
Your right, good quality guided hunts are big $, sometimes it involves a little creativity, perfect timing and great execution to convince the wife.
XMan
