QuietKat all-terrain e-bikes
Discuss the Bowsite Food Plot - 2008
Whitetail Deer
Contributors to this thread:
Pat Lefemine 30-May-08
JTV 30-May-08
lonewolf1985 30-May-08
glacier 30-May-08
BowSniper 30-May-08
Butternut40 30-May-08
JTV 30-May-08
Brad Gehman 30-May-08
JTV 30-May-08
Pat Lefemine 30-May-08
BowSniper 30-May-08
JTV 30-May-08
Mitch 30-May-08
Rob 30-May-08
3xcoverchange 30-May-08
Brad Gehman 31-May-08
Brad Gehman 31-May-08
leftee 31-May-08
Slickheadhunter 31-May-08
ridge runner 31-May-08
Brad Gehman 31-May-08
Brad Gehman 31-May-08
Tater 31-May-08
thewoods 31-May-08
Brad Gehman 31-May-08
Tater 31-May-08
LW 31-May-08
Brad Gehman 01-Jun-08
Brad Gehman 01-Jun-08
BowSniper 01-Jun-08
Brad Gehman 01-Jun-08
LW 02-Jun-08
Brad Gehman 03-Jun-08
joshuaf 03-Jun-08
Brad Gehman 03-Jun-08
Knife2sharp 03-Jun-08
LW 03-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 04-Jun-08
dmm/wolfskin 05-Jun-08
Pat Lefemine 05-Jun-08
BowSniper 05-Jun-08
Diamond Dave 05-Jun-08
Butternut40 06-Jun-08
Brad Gehman 06-Jun-08
Mitch 06-Jun-08
Butternut40 06-Jun-08
Shuteye 08-Jun-08
Tater 08-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 09-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 09-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 09-Jun-08
dmm/wolfskin 09-Jun-08
Mohican 09-Jun-08
Mohican 09-Jun-08
dmm/wolfskin 09-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 09-Jun-08
Foodplot 11-Jun-08
dmm/wolfskin 11-Jun-08
Phantom 11-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 12-Jun-08
Bow Crazy 12-Jun-08
dmm/wolfskin 12-Jun-08
Foodplot 12-Jun-08
Phantom 13-Jun-08
Foodplot 13-Jun-08
BowSniper 15-Jun-08
BowSniper 16-Jun-08
Foodplot 16-Jun-08
CRVB-QDMA 16-Jun-08
BowSniper 17-Jun-08
Foodplot 17-Jun-08
BowSniper 19-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 20-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 22-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 22-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 22-Jun-08
Slickheadhunter 22-Jun-08
Pat Lefemine 02-Sep-08
Jeff270 02-Sep-08
Mitch 02-Sep-08
Caribou 03-Sep-08
JTV 03-Sep-08
Slickheadhunter 03-Sep-08
Slickheadhunter 03-Sep-08
Slickheadhunter 03-Sep-08
RUPE 03-Sep-08
JTV 04-Sep-08
JTV 15-Sep-08
Foodplot 16-Sep-08
Foodplot 16-Sep-08
LW 27-Oct-08
Phantom 27-Oct-08
Shuteye 27-Oct-08
Slick Head Hunter 06-Nov-08
From: Pat Lefemine
30-May-08

Pat Lefemine's Link
The Bowsite.com Food Plot is Back! Discuss our results and longterm observations.

From: JTV
30-May-08
I just finished a complete reworking of 2 of my best clover plots....Spraying and tilling then a replant of clover.....I put in Imperial Whitetail clover in one and the good old "Monster Mix" in the other. I wanted to see which may work better, Ive used both before with good success ....I've got another I'm trying to ready but it is still way to wet and it clumps up quite a bit.....My other locations will get rape(Brassica) and forage turnip come late summer(I want to try "Winter Greens" this year in one)...those will be sprayed a least once/twice more to keep the weeds out before I plant.....Jeff

From: lonewolf1985
30-May-08
Interesting, I live in NW Ohio, land of the heavy clay ground, and have planted imperial clover for years and almost always get at least four years out of it. One year lack of rain halted the growth and I had to replant come fall, but that is not the seeds fault.

I have also tried monster mix and biologic in plots, and to be honest they looked great but the deer did not feed on them, they would walk right through them to to get to the four year old imperial clover that was on it's last leg.

Now I have tried couple other products from Imperial and not had as much luck. Winter greens came up great and thick but deer never touched it until almost Febuary, and season is closed then, that is when they really hit it hard, after the plants were exposed to extreme cold weather and turned to sugar.

I tried imperial pure attraction last year, and didnt like the results. This year I have the trusted imperial clover and a plot of extreme. hope for the best

So what I am saying is for me, I will plant the imperial clover that I know the deer will like and feed heavy on, compared to a plot that looks good, but the deer wont eat.

JMO

Jeff

From: glacier
30-May-08
Your plot is demonstrating something very common... What the deer hit the heaviest will soon be destroyed... It is hard to find that balance between something with longevity and something that will still attract game!

From: BowSniper
30-May-08
Really liked your detailed information with year by year results!

Last year the farmer where I hunt (eastern shore maryland) planted rape over all his corn fields after harvest, and it came up bushy and green. But even with some deep freezes we had, the deer never seemed to pay it much interest. A bunch of the 2% intermixed turnips got pulled up, but the rape was ignored.

The drought last year killed off most of my other food plot attempts, though I had some chicory come up late fall that got hammered! Its sometimes hard to tell if the deer are getting the crops or if weather/soil is just hurting growth, so i use a 2'x2' chickenwire protective cage in each field to maintain the "control standard". I had some chicory safe under a cage, and when I moved the cage the chicory was found and devoured in a couple days!!

This year I made sure to kill the hell out of the native grasses with round-up before doing any planting. Many passes with a truck mounted sprayer. The farmer disc'ed the soil, and then I ran a few passes dragging a heavy chain link fence. Seed was broadcast on top right before a rain.

This year I am also trying something new with the seed mixes. A lot of seed mixes are clover/chicory or clover/alfalfa with the clover part being the far greater portion like 85/15. So this year, I bought an extra pound of chicory and alfalfa in the pure seed, and jacked-up the factory ratio to get closer to a 50/50 mix. We'll see how that does, and see if chicory or alfalfa is the better mix booster. I also put out Tecomate "buck beans" on one end of a field to test that out. Everything planted on April 5th and 19th, so with the 4.7" of rain we had in May should have good growth to study this year.

Does anyone else think the recommended coverage for each bag is too thin? I never get nearly as much area covered per bag as the label says. But if I am putting laying it down too heavy its probably better than too light I guess.

From: Butternut40
30-May-08
Pat, thanks for bringing back the foodplot update. I missed it. This weekend I will be working on my two plots. One has a big dead tree that fell in it. The tree needs to be removed and the clover mowed. The other plot I sprayed a couple of weeks ago and will disk it and plant a brassica mix.

The monster mix looks good (clover and chicory?)

From: JTV
30-May-08
With clover/alfalfa I dont think you can over plant it on a plot. However, with brassica(rape) and forage turnip I believe you can...it will stunt its growth...I am going to put (for the first time I read the planting instructions....LOL...)the correct amount down with the late summer planting of the rape/turnip blend and not over seed.......Jeff

From: Brad Gehman
30-May-08
Pat, I have not seen anyone ever use annual ryegrass as a companion planting with clover. Almost guarantees a grassy plot. IMO, big mistake.

From: JTV
30-May-08
I will not use rye grass as a mixture, I dont want it near any of my clover plots.......Jeff

From: Pat Lefemine
30-May-08
Thanks Brad,

This is what I was told by a good friend who used to own an internet food plot company in Michigan. His reasoning was that Imperial Clover was extremely slow growing and because I had red clay soil, it would be baked to death in its' first summer. Adding a light companion planting of ryegrass sheltered the young clover through the hot winter months.

He told me I only needed to do that for a spring planting. It worked great the first year I did it, it protected the clover and the second year I had an awesome plot.

I really think my grass problem is due to the plot getting hammered and the grass moving into the barren fertile soil. I have tried a plot back home without the companion planting and it failed miserably.

From: BowSniper
30-May-08
Pat - did you ever try the "arrest" herbicide over the clover plots to kill the grass (and hopefully not th rest of the food plot)?? That is the Whitetail Institute recommended product, but I have not yet tried it.

From: JTV
30-May-08
I have and it works Ok......Jeff

From: Mitch
30-May-08
Pat, If you wanted a nurse crop I would have used oats. It will shade the clover and won't compete with the clover next year. For your plot to be successful I would spray it with POAST next spring. If you don't, the grass will out compete your clover and you will have a problem with a grassy field again. Good luck!

From: Rob
30-May-08
You can also use Select to get rid of the grass and fescue without hurting your clover. I sprayed mine last week and will be checking it in a few days to see the results. I use Ladino clover and red clover in my plots. Buy the seed at the farm store and have clover for several years. Deer really seem to love it as does the turkeys and bunnies. I also put out a wildlife mix the State gives out that has a mix of grain sorghum (which the deer love better than most stuff) milo, and millet. These 3 usually grow very well and lots of birds as well as most all types of wildlife make good use of.

Good Luck, Rob

30-May-08
Pat, You should be using a small grain like winter rye (or wheat or oats) not rye grass as nurse crop. Never use grass with clover. Small grains will establish quickly and give clover time to establish. When the grain is gone you will have a great clover field. You should get that soil test done and get the lime a fertilzer perfect. Lime pays it does not cost.

From: Brad Gehman
31-May-08
As Mitch said, use Poast for grasses. FAR cheaper than the packaged stuff from Whitetail Institute.

From: Brad Gehman
31-May-08

Brad Gehman's Link
Pat, here is a link to a plot we made, no till for the most part, in northern PA over the last several years. Check it out.

It takes good weed/grass suppression to get one cleaned up, followed by some crop rotation.

From: leftee
31-May-08
Pat, You might want to try about 12 rows of corn around your Monster Mix and see what happens.An annual pain but very good results and big deer enter more readily in daylight. Very nice thread.

31-May-08
I also like the food plot update,I originaly planted my first one in 2004(Imperial Clover),and lasted through 2007.The deer loved it but I didnt have an overgrazing problem because I planted mine in the northern tip of New Hampshire and the deer population isnt nearly as large as it is down in the southern part of the state. The biggest problem I had was keeping the clover mowed down,It grew like mad and every three to four weeks I had to mow it.All I have to mow my half acre is a 21" push mower with a bag,and with the clover at 18" to 20" high it would take me 8 to 10 hours.From my observations and photos I had about 8 deer that I know of and through the filming of deer from a neighbor 4 more that I never saw.4 of them were big bucks that I never even knew existed,of the four bucks two were well over 200lbs. I re-planted the Imperial clover plot this spring and Im hoping for rain.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b5d938b3127ccecbf29e80b34700000016108QaOWjZu2aA9vPgY

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b5d938b3127ccecbf23535f33f00000016108QaOWjZu2aA9vPgY

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b5d938b3127ccecbf26790f3b300000016108QaOWjZu2aA9vPgY

From: ridge runner
31-May-08
The Ryegrass that Pat is using is an annual. It will grow only in the year it is planted and not come back next year. There are a number of grass seed mixtures that have annual tetraploid rye in them (same thing) provides quick ground cover to let.

Only concern I have abut companion cropping with clover is that competition from the companion crop be it oats rye whatever can limit establishment of the more desirable clover. I have seen numerous hay crop plantings fail because the competition from the companion crop did not allow for adequate establishment of the clover or alfalfa (especially in more arid areas). Poor establishment leaves spaces in the stand which quickly get filled with undersirable weeds which outcompete the clover. There is a ready abundance of weed seeds in the soil waiting to take available space.

Another option I would consider is planting a pure stand of the clover. Plant population is the most important factor in weed competition so make sure seeding rate is adequate. If a companion crop is used seeding rate of the companion crop is extremely important as to much will impact clover establishment.

From: Brad Gehman
31-May-08
Ridge, yes, it is an annual, but it will seed out and reseed itself.

I have found that seeding on the heavy side is far better than seeding at the rates suggested on these seed mixes. The suggested seeding rates are for a "perfect world" scenario, which most of us never have.

From: Brad Gehman
31-May-08
Actually, in the QDMA food plot book, it says to never use annual ryegrass in any food plot where you intend to plant other crops due to the difficulty controlling it. It is a heavy reseeder. You will probably need multiple applications of Roundup to kill it out.

Yes, use winter rye in fall for a companion crop or oats in the spring, but never annual or perennial ryegrass.

From: Tater
31-May-08
I would go with the above advice to shitcan the annual ryegrass. Its not the large of an attractant anyway. You would be much better off using a cereal or forage rye, like "elbon rye". Last yr. I planted Durana Clover mixed with chicory. I just laid those on top of a tilled seedbed,Rolled them it. Before sowing the clover and chicory. I planted 50lb of oats+50lb of elbon rye,+ some soybeans and winter peas and lightly disked them in. This may seem like to much seed but it isnt, if you have alot of deer. The soybeans and peas come up and provided an instant highly attactive Kill plot. They were demoloshed pretty fast. The rye and oats came up and provided grazing all winter long and took the pressure off my young clover. The oats froze on out late, opening up the canopy for my clover so it could take off this spring. My clover is anywhere from 24-36" tall right now. I got a poor stand of chicory except where to went with about a 3x seeding rate.

Durana clover is a newly developed variety and its awesome.

From: thewoods
31-May-08
Tater, How big of an area was that and what time of year did you plant.I am doing one like this this fall.

From: Brad Gehman
31-May-08
I used the Patriot clover last year, "sister" to the Durana. Good results so far.

From: Tater
31-May-08
I planted several plots of diff. sizes a total of 8 acres with the largest being 3 acres. I havent been up to my place in about a month. It is absolutely amazing how much that clover has grown in a month. It has filled in all of the thin spots. I am going to mow it in about a month when I am sure all the turkeys are off the nest.

From: LW
31-May-08
I will use oats as a companion to starting a clover/chicory plot in the fall. As said above, it works great as a fall attractant up to the point of several continuous days of heavy freeze. This gives the clover and chicory time to get their roots established and the next spring they will take off and the oats will be gone. This works so well I use it regularly.

From: Brad Gehman
01-Jun-08
Pat, have you ever considered using brassicas for one of your plots? Pretty good draw in upstate PA. I use them in my plots, which are just east of you and the deer love them. Rape and Purple Top tunips, or use the Imperial WinterGreens. I've used both mixes and have had great success with them. Using an annual like brassicas allows you to really clean up a plot, with multiple sprayings of Roundup. Once one portion of a plot has been in annuals for a couple years, then plant a perennial in that side of the plot, and clean up the other side using annuals.

Very effective.

From: Brad Gehman
01-Jun-08

Brad Gehman's embedded Photo
Brad Gehman's embedded Photo
Brassica in top half of plot, clover in lower half.

From: BowSniper
01-Jun-08
Has anyone ever overseeded by broadcasting an annual into an active clover plot? Would be nice to put an annual into the same piece of land that lasts later into the bow season. Thoughts?

From: Brad Gehman
01-Jun-08
I did that with rape one year. It did not take real well, but, it could be done. I think you'd have to mow the clover fairly low so the seed would have a chance to get down to soil. Plus, really put it on fairly heavy.

From: LW
02-Jun-08

LW's embedded Photo
LW's embedded Photo
This is a picture of the food plot directly behind my home. It is half Imperial, and half an off the shelf ladino. This is a night time picture that I thought I would share because the heads make it look like it snowed.

I don't know if I agree with some of the above comments. I have had Imperial last as long as any other brand, and I think there is some truth, maybe not enough to support the marketing expense, that deer may prefer it more. You can definitely see a big difference in leaf size, and the camera aimed at the Imperial side does get more pictures. There are so many variables to plots that a sample of Pat's results can not be used to justify any conclusions, other than what is going on in regards to his property. I have installed plots that were too small and the deer destroyed them leaving nothing but weeds and grass, yet, initially I concluded it was a poor product. I think a very common mistake is plots are usually too small in size. On my own property, I would never install less than 2 acres in clover. Experiment to find what works with all of the variables unique to your parcel. Good luck!

From: Brad Gehman
03-Jun-08
The use of exclusion cages helps evaluate just what is going on.

You are correct about how it all relates to a specific property. One of his plots could be closer to a main bedding area than the other, thus, it will get used far more as it is easy pickings.

I planted buckwheat in 2 very small plots not 400 yds apart a few years ago. The one was 4 ft tall in July, the other, was demolished. It was very close to bedding.

From: joshuaf
03-Jun-08
I believe that a large component of Imperial Whitetail Clover is Berseem Clover, which is an annual clover, not a perennial clover. Seems to me that one of the whole rationales for planting a clover plot is that it should keep coming back for several years, at least. It seems a little disingenous to me, personally, that a company would market as some great clover product, a mix that had a large amount of annual clover seeds in it. I have planted Berseem Clover, by the way, and it came up quick, grew vigorously, and died out quickly at the first frost. The deer didn't seem to hit it all that hard, especially compared to some of my other clovers and chicory especially. My guess would be that it is the "other" seeds in the mix that are coming back for several years and the deer are really preferring, with the Berseem Clover being used more as "filler" and as a "quick-grow" visual stimulant the first year. This is all speculation on my part, as I have never planted Imperial Whitetail Clover, and never will. I'm pretty sure that you can get 90%+ of the seeds in that mix from any reputable, large seed dealer such as Welter Seed in Iowa and make the mix yourself. Heck, even my local grain mill/seed dealer carries a variety of good clover seeds.

There is no question that there is huge markup on the Imperial Whitetail products, particularly their herbicides. Compare their grass herbicide Arrest with the "industry" name product Poast or Poast Plus. Same exact active ingredient and concentration, yet Arrest sells for $138.45 for 1 gallon while I found one place selling Poast Plus for $149.95 for 2.5 gallons - more than twice the amount of herbicide for barely more money.

Read the labels, make your own seed mix and buy the cheaper brand of herbicide (same stuff) and have money left over to put back in your pocket, or to buy more seed and make bigger food plots.

By the way, Pat, this is a nice feature, I love reading about food plots. I do think you may have problems with that rye grass, though, annual or not. You might consider "frost seeding" some clover into that plot next March and letting it get a head start by being able to use all the spring moisture/rains that will come, and you may not find it necessary to disc, till and replant the whole crop.

From: Brad Gehman
03-Jun-08
Joshua, the Berseem clover is a "nurse" crop of sorts for the actual WI Advantage clover. It is also the "filler" that is cheap, and they make a ton of money on that "filler". You are correct, mix your own. Like above, the Durana clover seems to be working very well for those that have used it. Expensive, in a sense, but, from reports, very long lasting.

I believe it was you that had the great success in SE Ohio with the "spray and throw" method? Great work. Shows what a little outside the box thinking will do. Been doing it myself for a number of years.

From: Knife2sharp
03-Jun-08
You, Pat, ever consider something like a Wildlife Buffet for your plot?

From: LW
03-Jun-08
I believe they mostly use a Ladino, and the Berseem is a quick filler to help with weed control. A good ladino takes time to establish roots-if planted in the spring it does not look full until fall growth, and same with a fall planting, it is not ready until next spring. Most guys are impatient and think it is not growing, so a filler is probably used. BTW, I use a seed store ladino white, medium red, and other clovers I mix plus oats usually for my own. Much less expensive, but if I ever shoot the WR on it, you can bet it will go up in price:)

04-Jun-08
I really thought this topic would receive alot more responses,I find food plots very rewarding myself.If I had a large tract of land I would do alot more of it.

From: dmm/wolfskin
05-Jun-08
Rye grass will choke out and take over a plot over the years. Oats, wheat or barley would be better than rye grass in clover. jmo. Mike

From: Pat Lefemine
05-Jun-08
Just and FYI

The grass that keeps creeping in and killing my clover plot is not ryegrass, it is the surrounding grass. I've not experienced the problems you are warning about with my companion planting of annual ryegrass.

From: BowSniper
05-Jun-08
What fertilizer do you recommend for these clover/chicory or clover/alfalfa deer food plots? Its not supposed to have any nitrogen, right?

How do you spread the stuff? I was thinking maybe getting a liquid mix and releasing it out of an ATV sprayer.

From: Diamond Dave
05-Jun-08
I have found that rye grass is a very good attractant for deer in the area where I hunt in NW Wisconsin. On a couple plots we have field rye. It seeds out every year and in August we disk it in and by opening bow in mid September, it is tender and lush and the deer love it. I also love that it easy to maintain and re-seeds itself. As the others that have posted, we also have great luck with clover (if the rains come) and brassica/turnip mixes for later in the season.

From: Butternut40
06-Jun-08
Diamond Dave you are right on about the rye. I have a plot similar. One is clover with winter wheat. The winter wheat seeds out provides a great cover crop for the clover. Also have a winter rye plot that does the same thing you mentioned only this has a brassica plot as a companion.

From: Brad Gehman
06-Jun-08
Are we all talking about the same things?

Ryegrass and rye (winter rye) are very different animals.

From: Mitch
06-Jun-08
Pat, Could you post a close up photo of the grass? It might be Japanese Stilt Grass. If it is you are in for a rough time of cleaning up your plot. Mitch

From: Butternut40
06-Jun-08
Brad I'm talking winter rye.

From Albert Lea Seeds - Winter rye is a very winter hardy annual resembling wheat. Grows 5 feet tall when mature. Establishes quickly. The rye can be grazed repeatedly. Use it for ground cover, erosion control, weed suppresion, or a cover crop for a grass and/or legume. Can achieve 18% protein.

Annual Ryegrass

A quick, vigorous all summer pasture or hay grass which can be seeded into cold ground first thing in the spring and keep coming all summer. Good for thickening thin alfalfa stands. Consider this an annual and not winter hardy.

From: Shuteye
08-Jun-08
I have one half acre plot that I have planted in various crops for quite a few years. In February I disked it good then ran over it with a cultipacker. Then I planted a bag of Imperial White tail clover that was supposed to plant an acre. Then I ran over it with the cultipacker again. It came up great but I noticed a week ago that some other stuff was coming up through the clover. I mowed it with the mower set fairly high. The clover now looks great. The same time I planted the Imperial I also did another plot about the same time only I didn't cultipack it and used Ladino clover. Not one single seed came up. The cultipacker belongs to a farmer that owns land next to my woods that is about three miles from my house. The cultipacker hooks behind a disc so I didn't want to drag it three miles down a paved road. I think that was the difference with the seeds coming up. I had heard that freezing and thawing would work the seeds in but it didn't work for me. I will plant the unsuccessul plot and a coupld others in late August since I have had great success doing that.

From: Tater
08-Jun-08

Tater's embedded Photo
Tater's embedded Photo
Here is a pic of the durana clover with mature elbon rye.

09-Jun-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
DO deer acually eat rye? I dont believe the deer here in NH have even seen rye.I have returned from my camp in noerthern NH and the seedings have started to sprout very evenly,and all looks well.

09-Jun-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Pictures a little dark,perhaps this one.

09-Jun-08
I cant wait to see it in two weeks! Im like a kid at christmas time.

From: dmm/wolfskin
09-Jun-08
Deer will eat annual rye grass but it reseed itself and get thicker as the years goes by. I think it would be better by itself. Mike

From: Mohican
09-Jun-08

Mohican's embedded Photo
Mohican's embedded Photo
I have had great success with Durana and this year I am planting Eagle Brand Soybeans, which are a forage soybean as well as roundup ready.

From: Mohican
09-Jun-08
The picture above is of my 2008 Durana clover field. This was a week after the initial mowing in late May. This plot was reseeded over my original one acre clover foodplot which consisted of 1/4 acre plots each of whitetail institute, frigid forage, BioLogic and Antler King products. I highly recommend the Durana over all the other types. It will take a yer to establish itself and is easy to maintain by just mowing.

From: dmm/wolfskin
09-Jun-08
Looks good. Some forget the mowing part. Mike

09-Jun-08
Hey Mohican do you use a mower with a bagger or do you leave the clippings?

From: Foodplot
11-Jun-08
Looks like you need to take better care of the Imperial clover.I have been planting imperial clover since the early 90's.That is the only clover I will plant for the deer.My best plot is Alfalfa.

From: dmm/wolfskin
11-Jun-08
You know we had some roundup Alfalfa out a few years ago but the environmentalist got it ban. Mike

From: Phantom
11-Jun-08
Have mowed my Imperial Clover three times this spring and wow has it thickened up as a result. A great plot.

12-Jun-08
Mowing is the hard part...I need to get a tow behind mower for my atv.

From: Bow Crazy
12-Jun-08
I read an article, not sure where, about spaying Roundup on an exsisting alfalfa/clover field. I had a friend try it with much success. He used 25% (I think) of the Roundup, did it in the spring as the alf/clv/weeds were coming up. He said it did turn the alf/clv brown but it all came back weed free after the next good rain. My friend passed away last year so I can't ask him.

Anyone else hear of this?

Maybe someone could try a test area in one of their food plots. It maybe too late in the year though.

BC

From: dmm/wolfskin
12-Jun-08
Yes I have heard that alfalfa can handle a low rate of RR. Mike

From: Foodplot
12-Jun-08
I f you will notice the Imperial plot did the best.But it was not taken care of.Why not go back and plant imperial clover and take care of the plot?

From: Phantom
13-Jun-08
Alfalfa/clover mix try Slay herbicide.

From: Foodplot
13-Jun-08
I would stay away from the Alfalfa and clover mix.The clover will take over the Alfalfa.I looks good the first year before the clover takes it over.

From: BowSniper
15-Jun-08
Anyone got a good picture of alfalfa in a food plot?

From: BowSniper
16-Jun-08
Or a picture of Buck Beans? I've seeded and got stuff growing, but its hard to tell the weeds from the plants sometimes!

From: Foodplot
16-Jun-08
Alfalfa will have a long stem with branches comming off of it.It sort of looks like clover when it first comes up.Your ground has to be taken good care of to grow Alfalfa.I am bailing mine this week.

From: CRVB-QDMA
16-Jun-08
Based on all the interest in food plots, I wanted to make sure everyone was aware of the Quality Deer Management Association (QDMA). I volunteer with the Connecticut River Valley Branch of the QDMA in CT and one of the major planks that we do many of our free seminars around is developing and maintaining food plots. QDMA is a national organization so if you're interested in attending a future QDMA seminar or other branch event, go to www.QDMA.com and click on your state and see what's happening with future events. In addition, WHIP (Wildlife Habitant Incentive Program), which is sponsored by the Dept of Agriculture, has opened it's application process again to provide financial assistnace to landowners who are interested in developing their property further for wildlife restoration. You can send me an email at crvb-qdma@sbcglobal.net for more info on either topic. Thanks, Ron

From: BowSniper
17-Jun-08
Earlier in this thread guys were talking about the use of POAST in lieu of the more expensive herbicides like Slay and Arrest. Is that stuff safe for clover, chicory, alfalfa, and buck beans?

From: Foodplot
17-Jun-08
I use Select on clover and Alfalfa for the grasses.

From: BowSniper
19-Jun-08

BowSniper's embedded Photo
BowSniper's embedded Photo
Here is a food plot that I planted in clover, alfalfa, and chicory on April 1st. Not sure if I see any alfalfa in the field, and next visit I plan to spray a post-emergence selective grass killer over the plot.

The good news is that the chicory under the cage was growing HUGE, which is encouraging when you consider the deer must be eating the rest of the same stuff down everywhere else!

So I moved the cage, and set a trail camera up to see if the deer come back to eat the high stuff now that they can reach it.

20-Jun-08
Im going up north and will post a picture of my plot that I planted this spring,It will be 4 weeks tomorrow.

22-Jun-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Looks very good after 4 weeks,I did notice something odd,there are three corn stalks growing in different spots.

22-Jun-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo

22-Jun-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo

22-Jun-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo

From: Pat Lefemine
02-Sep-08

Pat Lefemine's Link
We just updated the feature with our summer checkup and check out what we caught that night on our trail cam! This is PA and that is one of the largest bucks we've ever seen on this property.

From: Jeff270
02-Sep-08
Since the start of antler restrictions the bucks where we hunt have been improving steadily. Best thing they ever did in my book

Jeff

From: Mitch
02-Sep-08
Pat, Try spraying your small plot with POAST. That should kill the grass and hopefully release your clover. Good luck. Mitch

From: Caribou
03-Sep-08
You might want to go to your local ASC office wild life Div and check on what programs they offer. I was provided with ten thousand dollars that allowed me to lime fert. and plant 35 ac. of small grain. I always use feed wheat as a cover crop and white and red clover as my base crop. A local farmer cut and rolled the wheat in the pulp stage for his cows. With seed and fert. cost going thru the roof you are better off buying your seed from your farm store. I also use generic round up that costs half as much. The wheat I have found does not freeze out and provides the deer with good feed most of the winter and spring. The clover is great all summer but when frost hits the growing is over. We have so many deer it is impossible to plant other crops. I also was able to buy chesnut, hazle nut and chinkey nut trees form the state at 35 cents each. We have planted 600 trees in the last 2 years on our farm. My farm is 750 ac that we do not farm, but use only as a bow hunting farm. Five hundered ac. of forest and 250 ac of open land.

From: JTV
03-Sep-08
Rain....I need rain....we havnt had a noticable rain fall for over 20 days right now....I am hoping we get leftovers from Gustav here in NW Indiana. My clover has been holding its own and needs a good drenching. The chickory has been nibbled on fairly well, but the best is the Imperial Whitetail clover. It has been hit hard and is still there. I have my annuals in and I have been doing a rain dance for the last 10 days.....every storm splits and misses......we need rain real bad......Jeff

03-Sep-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Lower half of the field planted with whitetail clover and the upper half with whitetail alfa rack(clover,alfalfa,chicory)

03-Sep-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo

03-Sep-08

Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo
Slickheadhunter's embedded Photo

From: RUPE
03-Sep-08
Pat, I know there is travel involved for you, but why would you plant the Tecomate which has a lower usage rating than Buck Forage Oats?

Have thought about a forage soybean and field corn for more food along with the BFO for diversity? That way you take pressure off all of the different plants.

The beans would be hit early taking pressure off the Buck Forage Oats and then the corn would provide some cover security for the deer and another food source for later in the season.

I know the plot size is limited, but a 25%, 25%, 50% split might work.

From: JTV
04-Sep-08
Yea !!...we have rain !! After a long 20+ days with out.....Gustav meets NW Indiana.....Jeff

From: JTV
15-Sep-08
Ike meets NW Indiana....ouch!!...this one hurt....we actually received more rain than Huston did !! Depending on location there was around 10 - 12inches that came down around here......Jeff

From: Foodplot
16-Sep-08
Seems to me you really liked the Imperial clover.Sounds like you are not giving it enough care.I have imperial plots that last 5 years.The deer love imperial clover.

From: Foodplot
16-Sep-08
Seems to me you really liked the Imperial clover.Sounds like you are not giving it enough care.I have imperial plots that last 5 years.The deer love imperial clover.

From: LW
27-Oct-08
Pat,

Great job on your harvests, beautiful animals. I agree that PA's antler restrictions are the main cause of herd improvements. But, what you did on only 30 acres is proof that guys with smaller parcels, cooperative neighbors, and a state willing to enact some common sense regulations can have a decent shot at a wall hanger.

Congrats again and good informational thread. Thanks for sharing!

From: Phantom
27-Oct-08
Planted WT Institute alpha rack {clover, chicory, alfalfa} last August 07. This year it did well and the deer were on it all spring and then went to the natural foods in the woods this summer. I also planted WT Winter greens, beassica and rape etc in August 08.

I can tell you as of today with 2 acres of winter green, 3 acres of rape and winter rye, and 1 acre of the Alpha rack mix, the alpha rack is holding more {3 to 1} the number of deer. {15-20 per night} I may look at planting more clover next year in place of the wintergreen and rape. It has been easy to maintain and lasts for several years. I aerated it this late fall prior to fall rains and it seemed to help, along with adding Potash to prep the roots for winter. I am impressed so far with the Alpha,clover,chicory mix based on the deers preference.

From: Shuteye
27-Oct-08
I have about a half acre of Imperial clover in one spot and another half acre of Imperial clover in another spot. This is all in one field. The rest of the field is about 5 acres and was grown up in weeds. I have kept it mowed with my bush hog all summer. the imperial clover looks great and the deer are hammering it. I was watching the field last Friday and had three bucks and nine does in the field. the bucks actually rubbed and scraped right next to my tree stand. This is in Delaware and I killed a huge doe. I noticed that a lot of the deer were feeding out where I had mowed the weeds.

Then this morning I shot two more does and they too were out in the field where I had kept the weeds mowed. I went to investigate what it was that they were eating that was so tempting. It was Imperial clover that I had there about 6 years ago and just let it grow up and made new plots. Even though there are weeds, there were nice patches of clover and the deer all seem to love it. My neighbor has cut his 86 acres of soy beans and there is a strip of woods between his field and mine. The strip of woods is mine and is normally loaded with deer.

06-Nov-08
The apples really draw them in,when the apples are on the ground the deer will walk through my Imperial Clover to get to them.I planted ten apple trees along side my driveway,still waiting for them to bloom and bear fruit.

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