Pope and Young Video
General Topic
Contributors to this thread:
BOHNTR 19-Jul-21
EmbryOklahoma 19-Jul-21
Iowabowhunter 19-Jul-21
copperman 19-Jul-21
Pat Bischoff 19-Jul-21
RK 19-Jul-21
pav 20-Jul-21
Pat Lefemine 20-Jul-21
APauls 20-Jul-21
Bou'bound 20-Jul-21
Brotsky 20-Jul-21
jstephens61 20-Jul-21
jstephens61 20-Jul-21
sticksender 20-Jul-21
RD 20-Jul-21
[email protected] 20-Jul-21
APauls 20-Jul-21
Nick Muche 20-Jul-21
[email protected] 20-Jul-21
mountainman 20-Jul-21
Owl 20-Jul-21
TREESTANDWOLF 20-Jul-21
SDHNTR(home) 20-Jul-21
Buffalo1 20-Jul-21
Tonybear61 20-Jul-21
Matt Palmquist 20-Jul-21
Jaquomo 21-Jul-21
EmbryOklahoma 21-Jul-21
Matt Palmquist 21-Jul-21
SIP 21-Jul-21
mountainman 21-Jul-21
Novembermadman 21-Jul-21
APauls 21-Jul-21
LINK 21-Jul-21
Dale06 21-Jul-21
SIP 21-Jul-21
Owl 21-Jul-21
Matt Palmquist 21-Jul-21
Owl 22-Jul-21
Matt Palmquist 22-Jul-21
Owl 22-Jul-21
Bou'bound 24-Jul-21
Ernie Santana 27-Jul-21
From: BOHNTR
19-Jul-21

BOHNTR's Link
Here is Pope and Young’s new ‘rebranding’ promotional video that was shown all week at the convention. Hope you enjoy!

19-Jul-21
I like it. Now, how do WE reach the masses of bow hunters out there that think the club is simply a record book? Million dollar question, huh?

19-Jul-21
Good video, just curious how did P&Y react to the threat of closing tens of thousands of acres of public land to NR hunters in Alaska?

From: copperman
19-Jul-21
great video

From: Pat Bischoff
19-Jul-21
Love it!

From: RK
19-Jul-21
Good video

Iowa details?

From: pav
20-Jul-21
Nice!

From: Pat Lefemine
20-Jul-21
Excellent video. Really captures the essence of bowhunting with a good mix of old vs new.

From: APauls
20-Jul-21
Great video, very inspiring.

If I had a criticism, it would only be one. If the aim of the video is to get every average bowhunter to become a part of the groundswell (as I believe it was) I would want to make it easier for those people to picture themselves as a part of the solution. The video was 90% made up of "elite" sitka/kuiu clad bowhunters. Lots of really expensive game being hunted on there, and not too much "average" for the avg American/Canadian hunter to identify with. I would fear the average blue collar bowhunter might see that video and not assume they belong.

I am sure P&Y marketing staff are much smarter than myself and thought about that and dismissed that in favour of their traditional audience, but for my gut that would be my only concern. What is the main purpose of the video and build around that purpose. Maybe I misidentified the main purpose as well. I know I feel like I have worked very hard in my life and although I feel very "blue collar" I know I have opportunities most do not. Having said that, I felt like the people in the video are from a level "beyond me."

All in all, very well done, and does want to make me get behind them. I do believe when it comes to scoring organizations etc there is an inherent "aristocratic" nature there that you're fighting and whether that comes over from Europe I don't know, but there is some of that built-in-bias that I think you'll always be combatting to get at the avg guy. So if that is the goal it needs to be in every vein of marketing efforts.

From: Bou'bound
20-Jul-21
Top notch for sure. Well done. 6.5 minutes to too long for most venues and vehicles to convey the message. They need a 2 minute version. our lives have become multi-tasking soundbite opportunities and you need to make your point fast or people move on.

From: Brotsky
20-Jul-21
Great video! Very happy to see that the two best looking bowhunters in my house got some screen time! :)

Rick, that is the best question, and I feel like the board is working very hard to address that. My personal feeling is that it needs to be done at a grass roots level. The absolute best thing about PnY is the people in it. Everyone that was at convention last week will attest to that I'm sure. What we need to do as a club is bring that convention feel to bowhunters everywhere. We have the members that will do it, they have told me they are willing to do it. We just need to make it happen.

20-Jul-21
APauls, You nailed the whole conundrum is a very cogent concise paragraph.

And I’m guessing a very high percentage of blue collar hunters would agree that the club appears snobby or elitist.

There is also a real problem with a high percentage of hunters having low hunting standards with regards to fair chase and most other hunting ethics.

Unfortunately the fact is we have a lot of slob hunters. I hope someone proves me wrong in that observation.

From: jstephens61
20-Jul-21
APauls, everyone dreams. We dream of sheep hunts, big bears and giant moose. We dream of shooting 160” whitetails, but not every dream comes true. That doesn’t make them any less important. Not many guys in my area wear Sitka, a few do including me. I consider myself a average bowhunter. To me, the video shows North American game that we’ve all dreamed about being taken by archers.

From: jstephens61
20-Jul-21

From: sticksender
20-Jul-21
Great video, hope it does some good.

I've been to a couple of conventions, and never met a snob. In fact, far from it....P&Y people at all levels or "status" seem to go out of their way to encourage their fellow bowhunters, with no judgement as to whether you've killed only a whitetail doe or gotten a super slam. That's the main reason I'm a member.....because I've found that the dedicated bowhunting folks involved with P&Y are simply great people.

From: RD
20-Jul-21
APauls, I think your assessment is right on, I've belonged to P&Y since 1981 and attended every convention from 1993 in Mpls to the one in Pheonix, I thinks six years ago and while this video to me was inspirational to me I don't think it will do much for newcomers.

20-Jul-21
Many folks start their journey at a very different place than they end.

Most hard core fly fishers likely started fishing with a worm under a bobber on a lake shore.

"Slob hunters" are certainly out there but often a product of what they were taught and what they perceive as normal. In those ranks are plenty of smart folks who transition out of that as they learn and grow

Not that there's anything wrong with a worm under a bobber, I down a few myself sometimes.

From: APauls
20-Jul-21
I think I may have misworded in my response what the video consists of vs the perception of what the video consists of, but I think you get my drift. It's just a perception game, and unfortunately the age old saying usually holds true in that perception is reality.

Jim - nearly every Canadian kid dreams of playing in the NHL (OK I am broad brushing here I know), but if I was starting a club for all hockey players to be a part of I would want my video to include a lot of beer league, and kids league type stuff because that's where the majority of hockey players are at this point in time. If all they see is NHL players on the video they assume this is a club for hockey players, but not the kind of player they are. I'd want the timbits kids in there that don't pay to go, and I'd want the juniors players, the NHL boys and the beer leaguers showing that everyone belongs. The whole journey.

But please don't let this detract from a really great video.

From: Nick Muche
20-Jul-21
Great Video, Looks like 27-29 species were shown, which is a good thing since P&Y cares about your right to hunt all of them. I'd guess some who watched this video became even more motivated to find a way to hunt in some of the places shown that may be a bit above average with regards to your every day bowhunter. I loved how many arrows it showed going through critters. P&Y is a fantastic organization and if you are a bowhunter you should be a member, but if it takes a video that you must relate to in order for you to join, maybe supporting bowhunting as a whole isn't for you.

20-Jul-21
Nicely done, sent the right message. Length ok. Comment. At the end stated, "take a stand with Pope and Young". Needed one more statement added on, ie, . " Join Pope and Young!" Add the PY website.

From: mountainman
20-Jul-21
I got to see it initially at the convention. I thought it was very well done. Any video dripping with that much bowhunting is pretty awesome in my book. To echo what Nick said. P&Y is great. Sitting in a room with 800 other people that really love bowhunting is a pretty cool feeling.

From: Owl
20-Jul-21
Beautifully shot and well edited. I think it represents the club exceptionally well. The OP states it is a 'rebranding' video. I don't think it is helpful to judge it as a recruiting tool.

20-Jul-21
Very good presentation and description of the P&Y Club.

I would be great to have a "shorter version" for the masses on Social Media because as we know, their attention span is about 5 seconds!

Great job

From: SDHNTR(home)
20-Jul-21
Great video. I, for one, thoroughly enjoyed it, but this vid shouldn’t be about me. I’m already a proud member!

If we are doling out constructive criticism, however, I agree it’s a bit too long. Attention needs to be captured in the first minute, not the 5 1/2 more afterwards. Especially among the younger set raised on the internet. I also felt like it was catering more to the existing Pope and Young demographic. The over 40-50-+ crowd and maybe their young kids. The vid has an older, more traditional, feel to it. Nothing wrong with that, but I think it could use some fresher characters more relevant to the Millennial generation. While I understand and appreciate our bowhunting forefathers greatly, the younger crowd may not. They want to see someone who looks like them. Perhaps even someone they identify with from Social Media. Unfortunately not some black and white clips of some old guy with a stick in his hand. If the intent is to foster new membership, I think the clip could also use some modernization and a more “hip” feel to it. I didn’t see one flat brim! (Refreshing to me! But maybe not what sells these days).

From: Buffalo1
20-Jul-21
Very well done. The video offers a challenge for every bowhunter to do his/her part in preserving and promoting the sport of bowhunting, regardless of socio-economic level or type of camo worn. Preserving and protecting can best be done through a united effort - Pope & Young Club.

From: Tonybear61
20-Jul-21
Good promo for an old organization. However, I do need to echo other comments about coming off as too elite. 20+ species but for the most part all-male big game, expensive trips for the common bowhunter.

We know some of bowhunting heroes and current P & Y members take female big game (when allowed) small game, fish, birds with archery equipment. P &Y has no records program for those. Perhaps they should. Also think about partnerships with the other hunting(species specific), bowfishing groups who have similar methods of take among their members.

P &Y has been around as long as I have , hope they are still around long after I am gone.

20-Jul-21
Muche x2... very well stated!

From: Jaquomo
21-Jul-21
P&Y is a fantastic organization, but doesn't reach the average bowhunter. Those of us who are passionate care about the future of bowhunting. But according to Deer and Deer Hunting, there are roughly 4.2 million bowhunters who aren't P&Y members. They care about their hunt this year, their lease, the deer they are seeing on their cameras, maybe their season structures. P&Y (and state bowhunting organizations) hold little relevance to them unless they manage to kill something large enough to enter. The vast majority never do.

It's a sad situation. Most bowhunters whom I try to recruit into P&Y or state organizations don't see a direct link to what they value most. They just want to go hunting. They don't see the holistic, interconnected web that makes bowhunting possible, and possible for the future. I wish I had answers, but I don't. Great video, reinforces to us members why we value the Club. But it seems like it was made for the members, as in, preaching to the choir.

21-Jul-21
Lou, I agree 100%.

21-Jul-21
Well said Lou

From: SIP
21-Jul-21
Does the PnY website have a raffle from 2020 on the home page or am i looking at the wrong place?

From: mountainman
21-Jul-21

mountainman's Link
Here is the site SIP.

21-Jul-21
Awesome... thanks for sharing Roy. If that doesn't get you fired up for the upcoming season nothing will! I will always stand alongside this organization and what they do for our passion.

From: APauls
21-Jul-21
"...but if it takes a video that you must relate to in order for you to join, maybe supporting bowhunting as a whole isn't for you."

As true as that is, good luck building a membership drive on that premise. I loved the video. These people believe in what I believe in. The video alone has reminded me I should renew my membership I let lapse since the last time Ed Franchin made a drive on here that inspired me to join. I see literally nothing about P&Y in Canada. Zippo, nada in Manitoba. The only mentions I ever hear about P&Y are on bowsite. Most bowhunters in Manitoba don't even know what Pope and Young is.

If what Lou says is true, then there's $189 million of annual membership fees out there ripe for the picking on people that just may not feel like P&Y is relatable to them. Not including Canada. But hey, you can remarket to your current base so you don't lose them, or try and branch out. But they'll probably require different strategies.

I mean if all you focused on was whitetails, whitetails, whitetails and you got 1/2 the whitetail bowhunters to join, you'd probably have a bigger base than you do now, plus you don't need to worry about the non-whitetailers like Muche because he already gets it. The current members already know whats up. Just food for thought. Not saying that's what needs to happen.

From: LINK
21-Jul-21
I’m pretty average as far as income and wear Sitka. In the town I live in the average income college boy that hunts is sporting a piece or two of Sitka. I do however agree that showing a good bit of footage with people using more modest equipment could speak to some folks.

From: Dale06
21-Jul-21
Nice video. This may be a little askew from others thoughts, but having a decent place to hunt, or access to land to hunt is an issue. If people can not find a place to bow hunt, they sure won’t be joining P&Y. I’m fortunate that I have places to hunt. Many do not, and that in my view is a major deterrent to getting more into bow hunting and them P&Y.

From: SIP
21-Jul-21
Thanks for the link mountain man. So it’s the join page that has the raffle from 2020…

From: Owl
21-Jul-21
"Great video, reinforces to us members why we value the Club. But it seems like it was made for the members, as in, preaching to the choir."

Akin to my reaction. I thought it was excellent inreach. Outreach, not so much. Until the Club puts the record book in its place, the record book will keep the Club in its place. JMHO.

21-Jul-21
I do think it was a great video and hopefully it will retain all current members and trigger a few to join. I also agree that continuing to push and continuing looking for ways to trigger the non traditional members to join is important. Keep up the good work PY!!

The constructive criticism is helpful. To those providing it, what would trigger you to join?

Thanks Matt

Matt

From: Owl
22-Jul-21
Matt, I sent you a PM.

22-Jul-21
Thanks Randy...I got a little carried away with the word trigger on that post:)

Matt

From: Owl
22-Jul-21
No worries, Matt. No one was "triggered." ;)

From: Bou'bound
24-Jul-21
With 6000 members and about 4,000,000 bow hunters in the USA alone there are plenty of target candidates for the club to reach out to.

One in 700 are in the club.

27-Jul-21
Well said Nick Muche

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